Calls & Texts Text pacing—eager girls

[Marty]

Here's an issue I've been having a little difficulty with recently.

After a daytime cold approach where I am enthusiastically received, I follow the guidance set out in How to Text Girls: 20 More Tips and Techniques: send an icebreaker text within a few hours, then a day or two later follow up with a reminder of my date proposal and inquiry as to the girl's calendar.

The issue is, with these eager girls I am getting a response to my icebreaker very soon, often within a couple minutes. I'm wondering if waiting till next day to text again is wise in this circumstance, or whether it risks mood change, allowing me to drop out of mind, or causing the girl annoyance by not acknowledging her quick initial response.

Three times in the past five days I've gone down this path and not heard back after the date inquiry. The first girl was 24, blond and very pretty, the second was okay and I'm not too fussed, but the third was a very high-value woman: a 26-year-old budding actress who has had numerous TV appearances and actually has a Facebook fan-page full of fawning comments from beta males who have seen her in a show and tell her how beautiful she is and how they pine for her. No shit. Here's how the texting went on that one, starting about an hour after I met her (she had just gotten off of work at a restaurant):

• Mon 3:09 PM—Marty: Happy to meet you, ScreenDamsel! Have a restful afternoon Marty
  
  Mon 3:11 PM—ScreenDamsel: Thank you! I hope I have a restful afternoon as well.
  
  Tue 11:11 AM—Marty: Shall we grab that coffee this week... how's your schedule looking?

Is that overnight wait a liability? In hindsight, would you have counseled pressing on with the text conversation immediately at 3:15 PM Monday?

Thanks!
-Marty

 

[Franco]

Marty,

Is that overnight wait a liability? In hindsight, would you have counseled pressing on with the text conversation immediately at 3:15 PM Monday?

Nope. As a matter of fact, I don't see anything wrong here. What I do see though is that it's only been a few hours since you shot off that text. Be patient! I always give girls up to 48 hours to respond before I assume they aren't going to (although I've had cases where girls will text me back up to 7 days later... which is likely just her wondering why you aren't chasing her).

You could try again in a couple of days, or you could wait until next week to try again (and in the meantime, you give her a full week to respond and wonder why you didn't text her again, which is actually a very good thing -- most guys are chumps and fire off texts constantly until a girl regrets giving the guy her number).

Patience is a virtue when it comes to texting. If you find yourself ever waiting for a text, then it might be an indicator that you need to keep yourself busy with work/hobbies/other women a bit more!

- Franco

 

[Marty]

Franco:

As usual, your wisdom puts me at ease

You could try again in a couple of days, or you could wait until next week to try again (and in the meantime, you give her a full week to respond and wonder why you didn't text her again, which is actually a very good thing -- most guys are chumps and fire off texts constantly until a girl regrets giving the guy her number).

I like your 48-hour rule of thumb in terms of expectation of a response, but as concerns actually reengaging, the 2-day option seems a cop-out, I'll opt for the full week. Quite possibly, she is mirroring my own 20-hour interval so as not to give off an impression of excessive zeal herself, which would be excellent.

Can you give me guidance as to how to reengage once a week has passed? How would you make it sound assertive, confident and relaxed—can you give me a sample text please? I'm quite happy to wait longer still if you think that makes sense, but it would be great to have wording prepared in advance, if you're kindly willing to help.

If you find yourself ever waiting for a text, then it might be an indicator that you need to keep yourself busy with work/hobbies/other women a bit more!

I appreciate your concern, Franco, but I'll handle that side of things! In the first three days of March I opened 7 women. And went on 2 dates. I know I'm not as prolific as some of the folks here, but it's a transformation from where I was a year ago.

Thanks as always, Franco

-Marty

 

[Marty]

Okay, as concerns picking up after a week's silence (or more): I'm thinking about what I might send to this TV actress some time mid-next week. I met her near her home, as it happens, and the vibe was extremely casual (she was dressed lazily, smoking, and physically touchy with me) so I'm wondering if I should go with something like this:

• Hey ScreenDamsel! We should totally meet in the next few days. If you don't feel like going out, we can keep it low-key. Let me know. -Marty

Thoughts?

On a more general note, there's another cute girl I met a few days before that, who also texted me back immediately to my icebreaker and then went silent when I tried to schedule the date. In her case, more than a week has already passed. I can't use the above, as I met her near her place of work (although she is buying a condo in the business district soon). Also the vibe was different: she was in her business suit and warm but a little more distant, I feel, than the actress girl. What about this?

• Hey {Cutie}, I totally didn't get in touch... my bad. How's your calendar looking for a drink/bite in the next day or two? -Marty

Any input will be appreciated

-Marty

 

[Franco]

• Hey ScreenDamsel! We should totally meet in the next few days. If you don't feel like going out, we can keep it low-key. Let me know. -Marty

Thoughts?

The one trick I always use to re-engage women is to re-frame the situation to make it sound like YOU were the one who has been busy, and it's your fault that you haven't gotten together because of your busy schedule. For example, something like this would be better:

Marty: Hey ScreenDamsel, sorry I've been really busy over the past week and haven't gotten back to you. I think I might have some free time this week to grab that [coffee/drink/tea/yogurt/ice cream]. Are you game? =)

Nothing ever always works, but it helps to dump the blame on yourself as well as make it look like you should have been texting her, but you had other things to do (and maybe other "women" to do?)

This is usually my go-to text line when I have to re-engage a girl after a week or so of no contact and a failed date attempt the first time around.

- Franco

 

[Marty]

Hey Franco,

Good suggestion. I did use almost that exact "sorry I've been so busy" wording with "BaywatchBabe", and it worked (although as you know I messed up the date itself). But I was wondering about whether to do it again, because I remember Chase wrote an article somewhere that says apologizing to a girl is a little bit like wheedling out of something you should take responsibility for, which isn't very masculine behavior.

Is it okay in this case though? Thanks.

-Marty

 

[Light]

I hope majority of the newbies out there will actually read this, because they tend to have the same problem.

I'm going to give you the secrets to text / online / virtual messaging a girl you just met.

You must state your intention early.
You must demonstrate / give value! - Before asking her out.

You must remind her WHY she should come out for that coffee with you.
Either that or You must remind her of that feeling she had felt for you upon first encounter, if you did a good job in the first impression.

When you are starting out, its good practice to do your best in "What not to say" - avoiding mistakes and not appearing needy or desperate.
But as you move on to the intermediate level of the game, you must do your best in knowing "What to say and WHEN to say something".

There is nothing wrong with any of your messages Marty, but there is nothing special about it either.
I don't want you to feel like I'm picking on you, but with your permission, I would like to use your text messages as examples:

Hey {Cutie}, I totally didn't get in touch... my bad. How's your calendar looking for a drink/bite in the next day or two? -Marty

-Firstly, you have forgotten one of the fundamentals of not being apologetic. By saying "... my bad." you have already placed yourself under her and praying for her forgiveness.
-Secondly, you didn't give her a reason why she should even bother looking at her calendar for you... let alone schedule a date.

Hey ScreenDamsel! We should totally meet in the next few days. If you don't feel like going out, we can keep it low-key. Let me know. -Marty

- If I was her, here is how I would think:
"We should totally meet... really? Why? You sound more excited than I actually do. What is your intention? If I don't feel like going out? Well since you put it that way, then I don't feel like going out. Isn't it your job to MAKE ME FEEL like going out?

Tue 11:11 AM—Marty: Shall we grab that coffee this week... how's your schedule looking?

- "Shall we?"... "To be or not to be? That is the question"!

So are you getting the picture?

What you need to do is entice these women by giving them a reason why coming out will be worth their time, AND what she will miss out on if they decide to not come out.
In order to make her decision easier, you should also come up with a ready made "Excuse" for her to give to herself as well, so that she won't give herself an excuse to not come out.
You do this by giving her Commandments.
You never give them a choice.
You tell them "Hey, I'll be out tomorrow for some high quality caffeine, and I'm looking for someone awesome to spend my quality time with. You in? Or do I need to go find someone better?"
Thats the kind of mindset and message you want to portrait.

 

[Marty]

I don't want you to feel like I'm picking on you, but with your permission, I would like to use your text messages as examples:

Au contraire, Light, I am happy to be "picked on", because it's like getting a masterclass. Thank you.

-Firstly, you have forgotten one of the fundamentals of not being apologetic. By saying "... my bad." you have already placed yourself under her and praying for her forgiveness.

I accept this. Thank you.

-Secondly, you didn't give her a reason why she should even bother looking at her calendar for you... let alone schedule a date.

This is the bit I'm not sure I understand. You mean your proposal should be backed up with reasons, like argumentation? Isn't that overexerting effort a little... surely I should display confidence that my persona by itself is reason enough—why on Earth would I feel the need to try to convince her, if I'm sure of myself?

Isn't it your job to MAKE ME FEEL like going out?

Again, I am struggling to follow. If you're advocating that I should be catering to her every whim in order to persuade her, I'm willing to take your word for it and try it on the strength of your superior experience, Light, but I have to admit I'm skeptical. This would seem almost like pedestalization. I'm confused.

- "Shall we?"... "To be or not to be? That is the question"!

Now I'm utterly baffled. What do you mean?

You tell them "Hey, I'll be out tomorrow for some high quality caffeine, and I'm looking for someone awesome to spend my quality time with. You in? Or do I need to go find someone better?"

Now Light, I don't want to seem like a petulant pupil. I really am very accepting of the lessons I learn here, and I spend countless hours in the field putting them into practice.

But do people really do this? I mean, go out for coffee alone—or at least plan to do it, whether or not their latest girl will join them? And are you actually suggesting backing it up with an unveiled threat to ruthlessly replace her with another female, spelled out in so many words in a text message? Is that alternative the "ready-made excuse" you speak about?

You get good results, so I can't help being inclined to trust you. But I just want to confirm that you really mean what you seem to be saying.

Thank you.

-Marty

 

[Light]

Hey Marty,

There isn't any specific way to structure your text, because they will all vary depending on how/where you met them, what you talked about, who they are as a person.

What I want to illustrate is this:

- You should have done all the hard work at the beginning when you did the approach and pick up.
- You should have escalated, and grabbed her number at the highest point of the conversation where you have hooked her.
- You should have agreed on a date beforehand, and getting her number is just a by-product of that.
- You should have already demonstrated value and make her not just interested, but excited to see you again.
- This is also the reason why Chase stresses so much about moving faster, and aim to sleep with her on the first date, or if possible, on that very day!

Now if you followed the above advise, then the next time you send her a a simple text is more than enough to get her out. She wouldn't have to think about it. Because you have already given her that reason (you guys connected and she can't wait to see you), and excuse to come out (her excuse would be - I can't miss this opportunity see this awesome guy!).

But from what I've read so far, it seems very likely that most of your encounters never went that far. Which reduces the chance of them wanting to come out because you have not given them a reason or excuse to.
In which case, you actually would have to do all that through the text. You would have to do the hard work of demonstrating value over a short text conversation with her, to remind her of who you are, and build some rapport before inviting her out.
You would have to play the "Online Dating / Virtual Conversation" game from scratch.

To cut to the chase, the best way to demonstrate value and build rapport quickly enough through texting is to make her laugh!
Start a short conversation with her by asking how she is, or pick up from the conversation where you left off with her - whatever you may have talked about.
Say if you guys was talking about bakery, and she told you that she was learning bakery, then you would ask her "How's the cake coming along? "
Get it?
This shows that not only did you remember, but its something she wants to talk about. She may even giggle with the response "I haven't had time lol"
The moment you see a "lol" response - bingo! There is rapport.
It is from there on you can move to the next stage of scheduling a date with her, because now you've reminded her that you're fun to be with. - Thats an example of demonstrating value.

There are many ways to demonstrate value:
1) Show her that you are fun to be with
2) Show her you're a sexy man
3) Show her you have a hidden dark / adventurous side
4) Show her you're a reliable gentleman whom she can trust
5) Show her your creative side

... etc etc.

The only reason why women flake is due to the reasons above - they simply don't remember who you are because you haven't made any big impact on them.

In regards to this question:

But do people really do this? I mean, go out for coffee alone—or at least plan to do it, whether or not their latest girl will join them? And are you actually suggesting backing it up with an unveiled threat to ruthlessly replace her with another female, spelled out in so many words in a text message? Is that alternative the "ready-made excuse" you speak about?

- No. This is a Mindset you need to have. Not an actual threat. Of course you wouldn't go for coffee on your own. You just need to show her that you're a busy person who has a life and is a desirable man who has OPTIONS in his life.
I always invite girls out even when I don't have anything fun to do, it can be as simple as hanging out with my friends at a certain location, and I would just invite her out. If she doesn't come out you are still having funs with your friends as originally planned. If she comes out, you can simply change to a plan B. That is all.


Hope this clarifies things more for you.

 

[NarrowJ]

Hey Marty!

Specifically on the issue of her response to your icebreaker, I tend to gauge my promptness to respond based on how quickly and enthusiastic she is in her response.

If she responds to my icebreaker,

1: Very promptly, and enthusiastically: I tend to burn these down pretty quick. I'd exchange 2-4 warm, flirty messages and then schedule the date.

2: If she waits a couple hours or several hours, I typically wait until the next day to hit her up for her schedule.

3: If she responds a day later, I'll wait a couple days and just hit her up with a simple "hey there " and see how much she's willing to invest in it.

4: When I get no response at all, I usually wait 2-3 days.

Basically, just try to match her level of engagement. And actually, as a rule of thumb I usually will wait about twice as long to respond to her as she did to me. So if she took an hour to respond, I'd wait two hours. If she took several hours, I'd wait until the next day, or if she takes a day then I'll wait two days. If she doesn't respond at all, I generally wait 2-3 days.

So yeah, I don't use a set formula. I just do my best to match her enthusiasm/investment. If you come across too eager or too aloof, then you're not managing your attainability well enough. Don't miss out on that whirlwind romance if she's responding very enthusiastically to you and sounds excited!

NJ

 

[Marty]

Thanks so much, NarrowJ.

You confirmed my suspicion, which is that I was too aloof by not following on from her first reply, which came within two minutes, until next day.

It's also an eye-opener to hear that you exchange 2-4 warm, flirty messages before getting down to business. I remember reading stuff about how text is useless for building comfort (because of lack of body language and vocal tonality) and that you may as well get straight to the point—and I think I took it too literally.

Someone reminded me today of a great trendy bakery in our city that is nice and casual in terms of atmosphere, but has tasty cakes and stuff. I might fire off something like "Thinking of going to A's in VH neighborhood some time this week... care to join me? -M" I'm under no illusion though, I think I've missed the escalation window here (just as I did here) so am not too hopeful of a response. She works two restaurant jobs to support her acting aspirations; she's had several TV appearances, so maybe I could pick up on that for 2-4 messages first and then push for a date.

And Light: thank you for your suggestions. I do of course always have multiple conversational threads after an approach that I could easily pick back up over text. It's just that as I wrote to NJ above, I took too literally the injunction not to try to build rapport. For example, I could follow-up from that other recent FR by writing: "Hey A! Did you decide what color your parachute is? And are you going to tell me?" But I figured that was not moving me forward toward a date. It's not as if I have no connection whatever with these girls, like with these pointless online dating apps. I opened them in person in the street or park, and got into deep, meaningful conversation. I just figured it was better to pick up those threads again when I see the girls in person, but I guess that process was too inflexible.

-Marty