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- Feb 23, 2022
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what's up with this obsession with receipts? the proof should be in the pudding. as in is the technique working for YOU in field. I don't give a fuck about some random girl a random dude is banging. And honestly hella sleezy sharing pics without a girls consent.
- Joined
- Dec 13, 2021
- Messages
- 782
Yeah if you have a good IG it's way better than getting a number
Because they can see how you live and build comfort without you having to text them much
Can revive leads or stay top of mind for girls you working on when you post stories or photos. When they want to engage you they will often leave comments and you can use that as a green light to get into banter and pitch a meet if the vibe is there
Or you can ping them super easy when they post a story
You honestly don't even need to have a Baller IG or go Andrew Tate level to make it work
Would recommend more guys up their social media if they dealing with a lot of volume because it's great for leads that are warm not hot
If you have a strong lead and can tell she is dying to go out on a date with you soon. Then giving her your IG is a bit unnecessary and you can just go for the number since it's more direct
But if the lead is wishy washy or you don't think you can setup a date in a timely manner then IG will definitely be better
Looking at this discussion I can see a lot guys are skeptical of the Bayne dude, but honestly his approach can work
Sure he may not be super charming up front or whateva, but if he truly knows how to display a good image online girls will feel more comfortable with him after following him on IG an getting to know him there
You don't need social media to get laid, but having one will help you keep more girls in your pipeline if you are able keep up with the maintenance of it
- Joined
- Nov 11, 2019
- Messages
- 5,697
i said this a million times, you sound like me...
- Joined
- Feb 23, 2022
- Messages
- 888
I think what @TomInHo said makes sense. Could be a good strategy for managing volume. If you're game is more touch and go. Or even if you have more sustainatial interactions, and you wanna stay on luke warm leads mind, in a more low effort manner. (I personally don't have socials, but have definitely considered developing it more).
But In terms of generating strong leads right then and there, this guys game is not it.
-His opens are direct but lack substance. Compliments the girl in a very impersonal manner. (I like your style). Okay so what...
Sometimes you gotta open with whatever and roll with it. but the better the open the easier to build some momentum.
if you're gonna open with a compliment make it more genuine, specific, and personal
"woah, you that fit is super creative. I bet you put a lot of thought into it"
or say something that builds similarities between you two. like if you both have red shoes on be like "yo, red shoes crew in the house" (first bump)
Or inquire into something fun she can comment on "what would you call this shade of blue you're wearing, it's got serious summer vibes"
I could go on and on with opens and have dozens for any situation.
give yourself an opportunity to stand out
"I like your style" is boring as fuck and also kind of unearned (makes you look too easily impressed). What do you like about her style?
- His transitions after the open are boring and do absolutely nothing to build genuine rapport. He just goes into boring interview mode. Firing off one question after another about pointless things that don't really give him any insight into he this girl is as a person. Just one boring question after the next.
He doesn't offer anything back that allows her to get a genuine sense of who he is, and highlight where they overlap as people.
There is no conversational momentum that builds to a reasonable sense that they should get together and do something fun.
He doesn't tease her, or flirt with her.
Just interview mode.
-His body language is all off. pretty much turns right in towards the girls once he opens them. Which prompts them to try to make space from him. They are practically running away every time he attempts to get closer. Probably just hanging around out of politeness.
When you open you have to convey a body language that isn't exactly invested in the conversation until it feels appropriate to turn in more. This gives her an opportunity to get a sense of you. If you turn in and she takes a step back, you make space again in a way that allows her to invest more in the conversation. You keep doing this until there is momentum, and that's when you really close the gap between you two.
This guy is just conveyed that he is overly invested in a girl who hasn't earned his attention, or conversely that he hasn't earned the attention of.
-He asks her name before there is any real reason to know it about her, which comes across again as being overly invested right away.
Sometimes ask her name off the bat can be an okay way of just let things moving. But I personally like to wait until I have a reason to convey that I want to get to know her more personally
"hey, that's an interesting perspective. My names Stray, by the way. what's yours?"
-He closes her without any real reason to keep in touch. Going for low hanging fruit of insta. If he went for #, or date would almost certainly get shot down 99% of the time with the technique he has on display.
You gotta build momentum and propose a date on the crescendo. Have a good reason to be in touch.
Then, you don't ask for her # or insta or whatever this guy does. You propose that you take her number, or better yet put your number in her phone and send yourself the "hey cutie
Sarah" text (shout out @Skills for this close technique).
so you are like "well hey, Imma grab your number real quick so we can work out some details" (handing her phone after talking about meeting up)
or
"well here, you got your phone. Imma put my number in " (chatting her up while you put your number in the ) "Imma send a quick text so I got you"
That's how you generate strong leads. Doesn't guarantee you get them out. But definitely ups the odds. You have the right precedent going. Makes things much simpler.
Also, I would be surprised if this guy is pulling off instant dates, as these girls are basically itching to get out of the interaction and give instagram as a quick and easy out.
You want an instant date, you basically do everything I outlined, but your are fractionating questions into the convo to get logistics. You start moving the interaction, getting little compliances here and there (have her show you pics of her dog, or her ring, or come over to this shirt rack and tell you her fave shirt, and so on). About 15-20 minutes, if things are going strong momentum, and logistics line up, you instant date (go to near by coffee shop, or move to another store at the other end of the shopping center, or anything that significantly moves the interaction forward).
That's what day game looks like that isn't just touch and go Instagram (or even number) farming.
Baynes techniques aren't going to have you meeting a girl, and fucking her in the parking lot an hour and a half later.
this guy is just pan handling for Instagrams. Honestly once you have a number of same days lays, and see how simple it can be, it seems silly to aim for such low hanging fruit. Sure insta as a back up plan. But aim for the stars man, life's too short not too.
But In terms of generating strong leads right then and there, this guys game is not it.
-His opens are direct but lack substance. Compliments the girl in a very impersonal manner. (I like your style). Okay so what...
Sometimes you gotta open with whatever and roll with it. but the better the open the easier to build some momentum.
if you're gonna open with a compliment make it more genuine, specific, and personal
"woah, you that fit is super creative. I bet you put a lot of thought into it"
or say something that builds similarities between you two. like if you both have red shoes on be like "yo, red shoes crew in the house" (first bump)
Or inquire into something fun she can comment on "what would you call this shade of blue you're wearing, it's got serious summer vibes"
I could go on and on with opens and have dozens for any situation.
give yourself an opportunity to stand out
"I like your style" is boring as fuck and also kind of unearned (makes you look too easily impressed). What do you like about her style?
- His transitions after the open are boring and do absolutely nothing to build genuine rapport. He just goes into boring interview mode. Firing off one question after another about pointless things that don't really give him any insight into he this girl is as a person. Just one boring question after the next.
He doesn't offer anything back that allows her to get a genuine sense of who he is, and highlight where they overlap as people.
There is no conversational momentum that builds to a reasonable sense that they should get together and do something fun.
He doesn't tease her, or flirt with her.
Just interview mode.
-His body language is all off. pretty much turns right in towards the girls once he opens them. Which prompts them to try to make space from him. They are practically running away every time he attempts to get closer. Probably just hanging around out of politeness.
When you open you have to convey a body language that isn't exactly invested in the conversation until it feels appropriate to turn in more. This gives her an opportunity to get a sense of you. If you turn in and she takes a step back, you make space again in a way that allows her to invest more in the conversation. You keep doing this until there is momentum, and that's when you really close the gap between you two.
This guy is just conveyed that he is overly invested in a girl who hasn't earned his attention, or conversely that he hasn't earned the attention of.
-He asks her name before there is any real reason to know it about her, which comes across again as being overly invested right away.
Sometimes ask her name off the bat can be an okay way of just let things moving. But I personally like to wait until I have a reason to convey that I want to get to know her more personally
"hey, that's an interesting perspective. My names Stray, by the way. what's yours?"
-He closes her without any real reason to keep in touch. Going for low hanging fruit of insta. If he went for #, or date would almost certainly get shot down 99% of the time with the technique he has on display.
You gotta build momentum and propose a date on the crescendo. Have a good reason to be in touch.
Then, you don't ask for her # or insta or whatever this guy does. You propose that you take her number, or better yet put your number in her phone and send yourself the "hey cutie
Sarah" text (shout out @Skills for this close technique).so you are like "well hey, Imma grab your number real quick so we can work out some details" (handing her phone after talking about meeting up)
or
"well here, you got your phone. Imma put my number in " (chatting her up while you put your number in the ) "Imma send a quick text so I got you"
That's how you generate strong leads. Doesn't guarantee you get them out. But definitely ups the odds. You have the right precedent going. Makes things much simpler.
Also, I would be surprised if this guy is pulling off instant dates, as these girls are basically itching to get out of the interaction and give instagram as a quick and easy out.
You want an instant date, you basically do everything I outlined, but your are fractionating questions into the convo to get logistics. You start moving the interaction, getting little compliances here and there (have her show you pics of her dog, or her ring, or come over to this shirt rack and tell you her fave shirt, and so on). About 15-20 minutes, if things are going strong momentum, and logistics line up, you instant date (go to near by coffee shop, or move to another store at the other end of the shopping center, or anything that significantly moves the interaction forward).
That's what day game looks like that isn't just touch and go Instagram (or even number) farming.
Baynes techniques aren't going to have you meeting a girl, and fucking her in the parking lot an hour and a half later.
this guy is just pan handling for Instagrams. Honestly once you have a number of same days lays, and see how simple it can be, it seems silly to aim for such low hanging fruit. Sure insta as a back up plan. But aim for the stars man, life's too short not too.
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- Joined
- Mar 2, 2022
- Messages
- 313
There's no "obsession" with receipts. If a guy comes out and says "I have the best girls than n
- Joined
- Mar 2, 2022
- Messages
- 313
There's no "obsession" with receipts. If a guy comes out and says "I pull the best girls than anyone in the game" then proceeds to trash talk every single pua from mystery to Kyle to ump.... People would want to know what those girls look like.
When marketing pick up you really have a few angles that guys care about:
- Receipts. How hot are the girls you fùck. It's one thing to have a lay cout of 100 and 95 of those girls are just whales. It's valid to want to know about receipts. Or you claim to fuck 9s when the girls are at best 4s
- Techniques that work for them. This could be from testing what you write in articles, courses etc TO watching infields
- speed. Some guys care about how fast they can fuck girls. Some don't
- meet to lay ratio. Some girls love to have a high meet to lay ratio. Some don't believe it's possible if you're going for only 9s and 10s. Bayne and his followers are some of them
- Getting the girls you actually want. This about having more control over the girls you fuck
Bayne picked the first one "receipts" and ran with it. It's literally one of the biggest proofs marketing wise etc to show people you know what you're doing. He then posts his students receipts as well.
If he has an IG or text tech that works great then it's worth checking out. His infield game is totally shit btw
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- Oct 9, 2012
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- 6,376
It's mostly coming from new guys who are not in-field / do not pull.
Once a guy has a little game, he starts hitting the "game recognizes game" level where he can just look at a guy's advice and be like, "This guy sounds like he knows his shit. Let me go try it out."
When a guy is new, he has no idea what works or doesn't. "Be her friend first" and "Treat her to dinner, girls love to be pampered" sounds equally valid to him as "cold read her and use push-pull to spike her interest while escalating touch." If anything the latter stuff sounds suspicious because he doesn't understand it / it doesn't fit his worldview. Liking someone more over time through friendship and girls saying they like to be pampered does much more.
Anyway, for a guy who isn't able to compare advice on its own merit, and isn't in-field enough (or at all) to just test the advice, he looks for other markers of success.
It's why Dan Blizerian blew up so big. It doesn't matter if the girls are escorts and strippers and whatnot that he is paying. Guys see "man surrounded by babes in bikinis" and their lizard brains go "sexually successful man" and they want to learn from him.
Generally an easy way for guys who don't have rep yet to build up rep among a mass audience: "check out my receipts." Pics of them with girls, etc.
(Of course then you get "receipt escalation" where the guy is accused of "well you approached her but there's no evidence it went anywhere", so then he tries to prove it with text convos, pics of girls in his bed, can even escalate to sex videos. Then you are still running into the issue of "how do I know that's not just an escort you paid? These are probably all escorts" -- which at least it sometimes is; there are some dudes who post a lot of "sex receipts" that I have had guys pointing out to me some or most of the girls are almost certainly paid; some of the girls have accounts on escort websites; etc.)
This was a whole rabbit hole I went down brainstorming the original format for One Date. At first I was like, "Guys will believe it much more if they watch me approach girls, pick them up, and shag them in one date." Then I was like, "All right, how do we handle the filming for that so that there are clear cameras in all the venues showing both our faces for a premium product?" I was l like "Sheesh, this is going to be logistically difficult and quite expensive if we're doing an even halfway quality film shoot." Then I was like, "Are we going to film the sex too? With hidden cameras in the apartment? Or do we do a fade to black thing? Maybe let them hear some of the sex audio, then see the aftermath with no nudity?" Then I was like, "And how do I do this ethically with girls. Do I just hit them with it after the lay, like, 'Hey btw, we kinda filmed this thing, but it's for a really good cause, helping out guys who are clueless. You'd be doing an amazing thing if you'd be down to sign this quick form so we can use this experience for the greater good to help guys out. None of this means any of this was anything other than me being totally into you, btw, because I definitely totally am. Sign here?' Or do I hit them with it right after the approach then hope they get into me enough to forget about the contract they signed 2 minutes in and we just bang and it's already covered and never comes up again?" (I was leaning toward the latter option)
Finally I was like, "Fuck that. Let's just do an interview format in a cool apartment with Hector asking questions and a couple of hot girls."
But yeah, generally, guys who are new do not know who's a scammer (and there are a lot of them) vs. who is legit and cannot tell good advice than bad. So they look for other trust signals.
When we had a survey on Girls Chase a few years back asking guys "What is the #1 thing we could add to the site that would help you trust the site & material more?" far and away the top response was "in-field videos" and "pics of the coaches with girls."
(I'd like to do that at some point, but the question of "do you just use models & actresses?" or "do you film actual approaches then hit the girls with the 'sign this contract' afterwards?" thing is really annoying. Especially for a business our size/position, where it's not some random Telegram channel, and we don't want to be either doing ethically shady shit or putting ourselves in legal jeopardy)
Chase
- Joined
- Mar 2, 2022
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- 313
This is true for the most part. But Bayne trajectory didn't quite follow this way.
This is his timeline
He didn't start of with any strategy or formula or tech to test. He started his brand trashing courses, books and mostly infields. He would say "no touching during CA. no fancy pua gamey tactics" Then repeat that on every video.... When he's done, he'd direct guys to see his receipts
Everyone was like who is this guy criticising every infield without really teaching anything. That's how people went out to check his receipts cause to him "I have the best receipts than anyone"
At some point, that got him followers. After all, there's real women that he's fucking. Recently, he got attacked: "if you're going to criticise people's infields, might as well do yours " Now he's on 100 day approach marathon. And they've been disappointing.
Which just means he uses IG to do the heavy lifting. He has said in the past that actual approach is only 10% of the process. Lol.
So he might be good to check out regarding IG but clearly not for the actual approach
- Joined
- May 21, 2023
- Messages
- 502
@StrayDog keeps coming in and dropping absolute value bombs.
What he outlined above is basically the blueprint for cold approach instadate same day lays.
This reflects a trend I've noticed with the new generation of "PUAs". Being social media natives, there is less focus on good approach skills and more on converting leads through social media.
The young guys I gamed with in China had ONE priority, and that was to add her on social media. Having a solid interaction was secondary and honestly optional - the MOST important thing was that you got her WeChat.
Their strategy was literally to go out and spam approach, grab as many WeChats as possible, then close them later over texting. In one day they would get 20-30 girls contacts.
Sounded like a stupid strategy to me, yet it worked for them. And in retrospect, now I understand it.
This new generation does not see social media the same way we do. To them, social media not just a means of communication, it is an extension of the self through which the world judges you.
Gen Z lives through their phones, which is an advantage if you know how to optimize your online presence.
It also takes a lot less effort to do that than to work on yourself and learn the real skills of seduction (let's be real... we are like the 0.01% here)
In that sense, it is natural that many of these newer guys are focusing 99% of their effort on the online component and really don't see the value in improving their approach skills/fundamentals.
I guess the odds are slightly more in their favor with even shitty spam approach because at least it involved a real life interaction, but once social media details are exchanged, it is essentially a converged pipeline.
And for a generation that grew up with Tinder and Instagram, it makes sense because that's all they know.
What he outlined above is basically the blueprint for cold approach instadate same day lays.
This reflects a trend I've noticed with the new generation of "PUAs". Being social media natives, there is less focus on good approach skills and more on converting leads through social media.
The young guys I gamed with in China had ONE priority, and that was to add her on social media. Having a solid interaction was secondary and honestly optional - the MOST important thing was that you got her WeChat.
Their strategy was literally to go out and spam approach, grab as many WeChats as possible, then close them later over texting. In one day they would get 20-30 girls contacts.
Sounded like a stupid strategy to me, yet it worked for them. And in retrospect, now I understand it.
This new generation does not see social media the same way we do. To them, social media not just a means of communication, it is an extension of the self through which the world judges you.
Gen Z lives through their phones, which is an advantage if you know how to optimize your online presence.
It also takes a lot less effort to do that than to work on yourself and learn the real skills of seduction (let's be real... we are like the 0.01% here)
In that sense, it is natural that many of these newer guys are focusing 99% of their effort on the online component and really don't see the value in improving their approach skills/fundamentals.
Yes, it is a stone throw away from swiping on Tinder or cold DMing on Instagram.
I guess the odds are slightly more in their favor with even shitty spam approach because at least it involved a real life interaction, but once social media details are exchanged, it is essentially a converged pipeline.
And for a generation that grew up with Tinder and Instagram, it makes sense because that's all they know.
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- Joined
- Oct 21, 2023
- Messages
- 401
Hit the nail on the head. I am no veteran. Did cold approach pre-covid and now one and a half years of consistent approaching and you can suss out the garbage claims and bullshit marketing. There is no way anyone actually doing this shit regularly will fall for the scam artists that are around now making ridiculous claims.
that's actually quite a good point! haha. I hadn't thought of that.
Only thing I agree with him about (and why I was expecting more from his infields) is about how so much stuff you see and read in terms of pickup material is just cringy and doesn't do anything to help in my experience. His idea seems to be to just 'be normal' but then I at lest expected just a touch of 'charisma' but nope!
I think his idea is right in terms of dress good (his clothes don't look good although he comments all the time to any dissing hit outfit that it costs more than the commenters monthly wage!) and look good, don't be too 'wierd' (negs, cold reads, nlp etc) and then see if you're her type of not.
But yes, his infields are worse than I was expecting. I think just DMin'g girls if you are relying on your social media to do the heavy lifting certainly makes sense in his case, as he seems to kind of weird the girls out a bit in person lol
- Joined
- Nov 11, 2019
- Messages
- 5,697
no is not the same, i seen this approach, i have a natural friend that does bayne style, but it was 3 years ago.... The thing is the dude i know natural has way better fundamentals...
ig dming even if strong ig super low odds vs just doing apps..
- Joined
- Feb 23, 2022
- Messages
- 888
dude, some (not all) of these girls Bayne is calling 9s are in my taste mid AF, and I don't really want to get into the #'s debate because #'s be highly subjective. Obviously there's a line that can be drawn, but the debates go nowhere.
Are you happy with the girls you're pulling, and what techniques are working to do it for ya?
That's how you know if those techniques are gonna work in your game.
you're right though, it's literally just for marketing to guys who are either not in field enough, or are infield and suck. Those are the guys that care.
Also, some snippets of text exchanges is plenty for me to get a sense of how real the dude is being about closing. I don't need to see candid pictures that she entrusted me with. I'd rather be secret society to the core. Violations of trust like that can really fuck with women. Also, illegal.
So what you're telling me is that dude sharing candid pictures girls trust him with so he can bolster his ego and also make money off of the intimacy they shared, without their consent. Sounds like a great lover to have, and a real stand up human.
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- Joined
- Feb 23, 2022
- Messages
- 888
that's what I mean. I am specifically speaking about Baynes game.
Your friend, it sounds like, actually made a strong first impression. And while even a strong first impression doesn't guarantee close, it still ups the odds.
Like I say, better to shoot for the stars and land on the moon. Because all the steps are the same.
Go for the SDL, if you can't land that land the instant date and end in a high note, if you can't land the instant date make a strong impression and set up a date right then and there, if you can't land that make strong impression and end with the intention to go on a date but not fixed time yet and grab number, if you can't land that then number or insta is probably equal or as @TomInHo says a good Instagram works in your favor.
But don't dress like you're two steps away from homelessness, pan handling for Instagrams. Sure it can work, but you are ultimately going to have better odds of that first impression is on point. Not to mention all the missed opportunities to seal the deal right then and there. Baynes approach is limited to the # of girls he can convert over Instagram. Which will always be less girls that does Instagram game, and has pick up skills.
Honestly though, I gotta get my instagram game going. The city I'm in doesn't have the best meet market, and I think Instagram would definitely boost my reach. Makes a lot of sense for when you're in a city where you can't just find a 9 every day. Good strategy for staying on girls radar if you didn't land the approach
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- Feb 23, 2022
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- 888
unless you know how to use these things to spike attraction, which can help lead to SDL and not just Instagram close.
Yes can be weird. Especially when you are first starting and don't know how to apply properly. But you also can't learn these things if you don't experiment with them and take some L's in the process.
So yeah definitely great advice if you want to stay comfortable and limit your tool kit.
This isn't to say that those things defacto will land Everytime (even if you are more experienced with using them), but they definitely broaden your game and can be extremely helpful when applied well.
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- Joined
- Feb 23, 2022
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- 888
that's the other thing. if you can't be smooth when first approaching a girl, how you gonna be smooth on a date and closing?
This guys advice only covers the very first basic step of meeting a girl. Zero anything about how to conduct yourself throughout the entire seduction.