Tons of resistance and shit testing outside club

[orkie123]

This girl was visiting her friend who is part of this social group. We all went out last night. First at a chill bar than to a club.

As soon as we met, we had the typical British style banter and she was loving it and very playful.

She was doing social touches back, interrupting others to go back to speaking to me etc all night.

At the bar, I told her to come with me outside and she did so we spoke in private for a bit.

Then me, her and her friend started planning which club to go to and I pushed to go asap to try and reduce the group size which worked.

At the club, again she was very hands on and flirty so I asked her to go outside again. She didnt take her jacket though.

Outside is when the resistance/shit tests started.

Bit of chit chat...
Her: i know what you are going to do,
Me: what?
Her: kiss me
Me: Sorry I dont kiss outside clubs
Her: bullshit
Me: besides, I think you want me to kiss you
Her: i dont know what I want
Her: I'm conflicted. (She starts talking about life)..
Me: look me in the eyes (disrupting her monologue)
I pretend to kiss her but move down her neck and out with the slightest contact
Me: Lets go back inside, there is no pressure to do anything. We are just having fun.
Her: (doesnt want to move)
Her: its just I know we would have a great time and have good sex but Im not sure what I want in life.
Me: hey who said anything about sex. We are not having sex tonight. Im actually an innocent virgin.
Her: thats obviously not true. And if it was i wouldnt want to do anything with you because you would be shocked with my experience (Goes back to repeating same points about not being sure about what she wants)
Me (I try to get her back in the club again, the vibe has become too logical and she doesnt have her jacket)

Her: its just that I dont know if I want kids. There is a guy im kind of seeing back home and I dont know if I want to be more serious.
Me: (tried to reframe) Almost everyone doesnt know what they want. I dont know what I want long-term either but I do know that I'll keep trying new stuff while making sure that I have incredible experiences meeting new people, forming fun memories and not getting too worried on every possible outcome.

Her: yeah but its easy for you to say. Guys dont have biological clocks.

At this point I thought this is going absolutely nowhere. So I grabbed her hand and led her back to the club.

I went to dance with some of my other friends, and every once in a while she would pivot herself to dance with me. Later she had her jacket and bag so I tried one last "lets go for a walk" but she said no.

She did invite me to go to another social event that the grp is going for but I dont think I can make it.

I dont think I did that bad going thru her shit tests but let me know if you think I should have done something else.

My thoughts are that either the guy she is kind of seeing given her some kind of ultimatum (lets form a family or we break up) or she has been sleeping around for a while and is feeling unfulfilled.

 

[rockstar]

Her: i know what you are going to do,
Me: what?
Her: kiss me
Me: Sorry I dont kiss outside clubs

This is a good response!

Her: bullshit
Me: besides, I think you want me to kiss you

This is a little bit too prize-frame-y. You don't want to be too obvious about setting frames like this and put yourself over the girl. This can trigger girls and make them combative if they don't want to accept the frame at that time.

Her: i dont know what I want
Her: I'm conflicted. (She starts talking about life)..
Me: look me in the eyes (disrupting her monologue)
I pretend to kiss her but move down her neck and out with the slightest contact
Me: Lets go back inside, there is no pressure to do anything. We are just having fun.

Why are you trying to interrupt this and get her back inside? Because this sounds like a great spot to let her invest and to qualify her. There's nothing in the club that's going to help you along with the seduction unless you need to sort logistics with her friend or something.

Her: (doesnt want to move)
Her: its just I know we would have a great time and have good sex but Im not sure what I want in life.
Me: hey who said anything about sex. We are not having sex tonight. Im actually an innocent virgin.

Not sure why you're disqualifying sex here either. You want to sleep with her right? Then why are you telling her that's not going to happen? This is useful sometimes, but not like this.

Her: thats obviously not true. And if it was i wouldnt want to do anything with you because you would be shocked with my experience (Goes back to repeating same points about not being sure about what she wants)
Me (I try to get her back in the club again, the vibe has become too logical and she doesnt have her jacket)

Her: its just that I dont know if I want kids. There is a guy im kind of seeing back home and I dont know if I want to be more serious.
Me: (tried to reframe) Almost everyone doesnt know what they want. I dont know what I want long-term either but I do know that I'll keep trying new stuff while making sure that I have incredible experiences meeting new people, forming fun memories and not getting too worried on every possible outcome.

This is not a bad kind of frame to set, but just stating it like that isn't very meaningful. You need to get her sharing her perspectives, ask her questions, and lead the conversation. Instead it reads like you're shutting down her attempts at connecting with you

Her: yeah but its easy for you to say. Guys dont have biological clocks.

At this point I thought this is going absolutely nowhere. So I grabbed her hand and led her back to the club.

You have to take it somewhere. You seem like you're afraid of having serious conversations like it will ruin the vibe or something. You're right that talking about this girl's plans for kids in the future is not a helpful topic, but there are so many ways to change directions. You can even joke about giving her a baby tonight there.


This girl was definitely into you. I would have gotten her to invest a lot, qualified her, let her feel like she's "winning me over" with the existentialist soul-searching that she seemed to be in the mood for, and started feeling out the pull to go somewhere more chill if I were you. You might have been able to have been more convincing about the walk to, especially if that was your last chance with her and you liked her.

 

[orkie123]

This is a good response!

This is a little bit too prize-frame-y. You don't want to be too obvious about setting frames like this and put yourself over the girl. This can trigger girls and make them combative if they don't want to accept the frame at that time.


Why are you trying to interrupt this and get her back inside? Because this sounds like a great spot to let her invest and to qualify her. There's nothing in the club that's going to help you along with the seduction unless you need to sort logistics with her friend or something.

Not sure why you're disqualifying sex here either. You want to sleep with her right? Then why are you telling her that's not going to happen? This is useful sometimes, but not like this.

This is not a bad kind of frame to set, but just stating it like that isn't very meaningful. You need to get her sharing her perspectives, ask her questions, and lead the conversation. Instead it reads like you're shutting down her attempts at connecting with you

You have to take it somewhere. You seem like you're afraid of having serious conversations like it will ruin the vibe or something. You're right that talking about this girl's plans for kids in the future is not a helpful topic, but there are so many ways to change directions. You can even joke about giving her a baby tonight there.


This girl was definitely into you. I would have gotten her to invest a lot, qualified her, let her feel like she's "winning me over" with the existentialist soul-searching that she seemed to be in the mood for, and started feeling out the pull to go somewhere more chill if I were you. You might have been able to have been more convincing about the walk to, especially if that was your last chance with her and you liked her.

Thanks for this breakdown, it's really helpful.

The kiss remark wasnt ideal but at that point, the whole interaction was still mostly playful.

The rest, based on how well you read the situation and looking back on it, I think I was impatient. I was indeed a little harsh on her trying to connect and was thinking of rushing to more chilled topics.

I do have some calibration to do here because sometimes I do the opposite where i become a girl's psychotherapist. I went too far the other way. I think the best way would have been to let her speak more, asking questions and then adding some light humour once in a while as you suggested.

Then to say something along the lines of "I like having deep convos with you. Lets continue somewhere more chilled. Grab your jacket and I'll take you"