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What is Enlightenment: The Complete Guide

Hector Papi Castillo

Tribal Elder
Tribal Elder
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Dec 2, 2013
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I have been asked several times about enlightenment and my views on it. Here is a quick and dirty version of everything I've learned about Enlightenment (this will provide a good break from some article writing/my book. I've been wanting to write this for a while and need to get it out there. The desire to do this keeps bugging me, constantly).

Now before I say anything else, let me be clear about two things

1. I am not enlightened

2. There's no such thing as a "complete guide" to enlightenment

Not really selling myself very well, am I? Well, by the end of this post, I will show you how one of these two statements is a lie and why it's completely irrelevant if you buy into anything I say or not.


Prefatory Warning:

I will probably confuse you in this post. I will say things that might seem absurd and go against everything you believe. If so, I probably did my job. I will also go on side-tangents that might not seem to make sense or have a place, but they do and I'm over-explaining for a reason. Oh and if I seem angry during any of this, I assure you, it's just excitement (I smiled the entire time I wrote this). This shit gets me harder than a girl with fat ass in a mini skirt.

You have been warned.

For those who want to get into a massive debate with me, I'll be frank - I'm not interested. I haven't had a productive debate in pretty much ever.

A discussion, however, I am HIGHLY interested in and for those that are genuinely curious and want to know more, please feel free to ask anything you would like!! You are the ones I'm focused on.

To illustrate this, let me share a story from the Pali canon (something I will reference often in this post, since it is my academic background - this is from the Ayacana Sutta):

When the Buddha was newly awakened, he was chilling underneath a tree. He'd just finished his 6 year journey (read: countless aeons) in search of Truth. He'd gone through all sorts of trouble to get there - he'd left his princely life, given up family, spent years cutting himself, sitting in his own shit and vomit, ripping out his own hair, meditating for days on end, starving his body, and all other austerities in an effort to escape his ignorance. Now, while he realized that most, if not all of this, was unnecessary self-torture, he did realize that finding Nirvana is very, very hard. And so, he said to himself

Enough now with teaching
what
only with difficulty
I reached.
This Dhamma is not easily realized
by those overcome
with aversion & passion.

What is abstruse, subtle,
deep,
hard to see,
going against the flow —
those delighting in passion,
cloaked in the mass of darkness,
won't see.

In short, just like the journey get pussy, most guys aren't going to put in the work to find Truth. They're too lazy and, contrary to all of their bitching about suffering, they enjoy their lot in life.

So what did he decide to do? Just fucking chill and not teach anyone, because they wouldn't listen anyways.

When Brahma Sahampati, the highest of the Brahma gods, read the Buddha's mind and saw that he didn't want to teach anyone the Dhamma (way), he got hella sad and begged the Buddha to teach the world, because there did exist some who would listen.

And so the Buddha searched with his mind and found that there were some beings with little dust in their eyes. Acknowledging that these people might understand what he has to say, he decided to teach and responded to Braham Sahampati thus

Open are the doors to the Deathless
to those with ears.
Let them show their conviction.
Perceiving trouble, O Brahma,
I did not tell people the refined,
sublime Dhamma.

In other words, "whoever has ears to hear, let them hear" (Mark 4:9).

Alright, here we go.

What Is Enlightenment?

This is, actually, an impossible question to answer, for reasons that will be explained. In addition, it is much easier to explain Enlightenment via negation (i.e., what it is NOT). Then once we've established what Enlightenment is NOT, it becomes much easier to see what it IS.

But, let's start with a simple definition of what Enlightenment is just as a bench-mark.

Enlightenment = Truth Realization

You know the Truth (and the capitalized "T" is important here).

Now what is Truth? Well here's a property of Truth (and if you get this, you pretty much get everything).

The Truth must be True all the time and everywhere. This means the Truth is True no matter who believes it (or doesn't believe it), it is true in Dakota and in Tokyo, and it was true before the Big Bang, is true after the Big Crunch, and it doesn't matter how many licks it takes to get to the center of a pussy.

True is True is True is True.

A girl is a girl is a girl is a girl.

Alright, got that? Okay, cool. So anything that DOESN'T fit that can't possibly be true right? Well, unless you don't buy into the definition that the True is always True, but if you deny that, you're really stupid and buy into Relativism and I have no answer for you, because you have a tautology on your hands. No matter what I say, your retort can always be "well the truth is just relative!"

And if that's the case, then if I say "the truth isn't relative," then I'm equally right, aren't I? The Liar's Paradox ("this sentence is false") and Russell's paradox come upon the same problem.

So moving forward, if you accept that the Truth must be True always, forever, and everywhere, we'll have a much easier time with this.

But that doesn't tell you a lot does it? The Truth is True. It's reflexive (which is exactly the point). However, let's figure out what it's not first and then we'll be left with what MUST be.


What Is Enlightenment NOT?

Here's a quick list.

Enlightenment is NOT a Logical Assertion (i.e., why mathematicians and logicians are just jerking off)

- Argument from Authority (cuz an Enlightened guy said so): sutta 1 of the Dīgha Nikāya (Brahmajāla Sutta). The Buddha lists sixty wrong views about Nirvana. Four of these mistaken views are listed as being held by logicians (takki; btw, this language that I'll refer to with anything from the Pali Canon, or Theravada Buddhist scriptures, is called Pali). He criticizes them as thinking they can "hammer out [truth] with reasoning." What he says logicians are ACTUALLY doing, instead of finding truth, is that they are just obsessed with the pleasure that comes from a conceptual problem, its solution, and all of the fun that comes with arguing with yourself, other logicians, and thinking you're smarter than everyone because you know how to make a fucking syllogism.

- Cuz you Kant: In his Critique of Pure Reason, Kant demonstrates in a really absurd amount of detail why Pure Logic (deductive reasoning) cannot give Unconditional Truth (i.e., Truth that is always True, everywhere and always).

- Godel's Incompleteness Theorems: an axiomatic system (like Zermelo-Fraeknel set theory, the mainstream accepted foundation of all mathematics) cannot be both consistent and complete.

Completeness = all true statements expressible by the language are provable (and this theorem actually "solves" the Liar's paradox by demonstrating that it's neither true nor false, but unprovable, which is exactly the point).

Consistency = "For any formal effectively generated system T including basic arithmetical truths and also certain truths about formal provability, if T includes a statement of its own consistency then T is inconsistent."

In other words, it's like trusting a dude because he says "trust me," but you know that no one is really trustworthy until someone else can confirm it (or you confirm it yourself), but if you can't believe someone says they're trustworthy, then they really aren't trustworthy, are they? Ad infinitum. You go in circles.

Or here's another way (this is called a syllogism):

I am a Man (this is a premise)
Men are Mortal (another premise)
Therefore, I am Mortal (the conclusion)

Where did you get the "I," the "am," the "a," and the "man" from? You got them from somewhere, but you definitely didn't get them from logic. You either got them from experience or they just came to your mind. Logic can't answer where you got these from.

And here is the kicker: if formal mathematics or basic deductive logic cannot be demonstrated as completely true, all the time, everywhere, and always, then it isn't True (with a capital T). And if deductive logic, which actually ENTAILS its own truth, is not True, then you can be damn sure that Inductive Logic is about to suck a big fat fucking dick, too.

Enlightenment is NOT an Intuitive Leap (i.e., why Stephen Hawking will never find the Theory of Everything)

My example earlier just a moment ago of the "I am a Man" thing pointed out the weakness of premises - you gotta get them from somewhere, right? I'd have to be crazy to tell you that you're not allowed to use a simple observation, like that you're a human, to start off a logical syllogism. But here's the problem.

Inductive reasoning does not have the strength of deductive reasoning. You can't connect the dots like you can with

I am X -> X are Y...I am Y!

That's called entailment. Well, as we showed with pure logic, deduction, it's ultimately not True (by our definition of Truth always being True everywhere and always). So if inductive reasoning doesn't even have that which made deductive reasoning pretty damn strong, then inductive reasoning is HELLA in trouble. For this reason especially

- The Problem of Induction: This dude name David Hume saw that we connect events (like the sun rising) with causes (another day!) and these observations (every day the sun rises) leads us to an inference (the sun will rise tomorrow). The problem with this is, you're never 100% sure. I mean, the sun will continue to burn tomorrow, right? That'd be STUPID for me not to think that. Well, the sun will keep burning...until it doesn't. Just like you THINK you'll be alive tomorrow...until you're not;)

Modern science got really smart with its ability to counteract this uncertainty. It learned how to isolate variables and do experiments until just a few causes could be explained as the efficient cause (the thing that makes X -> Y). But here's the problem with that -

1. Lurking variables; you will never have a true vacuum, a situation where only the variables you know of or want to be in play will be the only ones in play. There will always be the possibility that there is something ELSE causing the events (like dark matter or intergalactic dildos).

2. Uncertainty; you can make mistakes in measurements. Maybe the time it took for that neutrino was really .000000000000001 seconds faster than you recorded it. So we established uncertainty (Physics uses the Sigma system), to account for those possible mistakes. Unfortunately, 99.99999999999999% correct or 0.0000000000000001% wrong is still WRONG and NOT COMPLETELY CORRECT. Are we assholes if we're this hardcore about Truth? Well yeah, that's the point.

Observations of cause and effect, are, ultimately wrong.

We want to be 100%, super duper uber pooper certain that the Truth is the Truth, because it has to be the Truth all the time, everywhere, NO MATTER WUT.

What Else Is TRUTH Not?

Alright, so science and logic will never bring us unerring certainty. We're kinda fucked aren't we?

Just to make this seem even more dire, let me go over a few other possibilities for what truth isn't

- Truth is NOT a sensory experience; you cannot see it, taste it, feel it, hear it, smell it (or think it; the Indians view thought as just another sense)

- It is not a state of mind, like being high, happy, sad, bored, curious, ecstatic, anxious, etc

It's NONE of these things, because, remember the Truth has to be True always, forever, and everywhere.

In other words, it has to be Unconditioned. This means it cannot have a beginning, because forever doesn't have a beginning. It also can't have an end; it is Deathless.

So if it's not a thought, an experience, a feeling, a mood, a state of mind, a logical assertion, or anything that we would consider ANYTHING, then what is it...NOTHING?

Clickity click boom.

Nothing.

It's nothing.

Game over, go home, GG.





But not really.




The only reason it is Nothing, is because to us the only thing that can be Unconditioned is Nothingness, or at least intuitively seems like Nothingness, because every THING that we think of as existing doesn't have this quality. Everything that we know of, all states of mind, all thoughts, all feelings, and even our life, is impermanent. ALL is, according to our definition of Truth always being True, simply not true.

It's all rubbish, bullshit, makyo, vikulpa.

But, somehow, there have been people in history (and now) who say "I got it, bro."

And by our greatest arguments and our grandest hopes, there MUST be Truth. I mean, even if we think reality is a LIE or an ILLUSION, the fact that it IS a lie or IS an illusion is still an AFFIRMATIVE STATEMENT OF EXISTENCE.

This is why nihilism is silly goose business (kind of). The Universe IS. Reality IS. Because Realty can't NOT be. Even if we're brains in vats being fed this universe through bits of data like in the Matrix, there still must be that world which is feeding this Untrue world. At some point, there must be a IT that is real, even if you keep going infinitely outwards. Even if the chain of being does't have a beginning, the fact that there IS a chain means that the CHAIN itself is the Truth, since that "chain" exists forever and always everywhere.

If you're still with me, then this is what we have -

The Truth is beyond logic, words, or even experience. It just IS. And somehow, there have been those who have "seen" it. But how come they can't just SHOW me THAT which they "saw"?

For the exact fucking reason that the Truth IS True everywhere, always, and everywhere.


Since everything that we know of as a sensible or conceivable THING (thoughts, feelings, or sensory data) is impermanent or localized on a certain spot (at your house or in my head), it is therefore NOT the truth.

So if you expect to scratch and smell the truth, you've already missed the point. You haven't listened to a word that's been said.

You cannot HAVE it, because there is no "IT."

And herein lies the answer to the whole problem. Are you ready? Cuz if you understand this, your brain might explode.

If, as we established, the Truth is always, everywhere, and forever, what does the mean EVERYTHING IS, ALWAYS, and FOREVER?????????????????????????????

The Truth.

That keyboard, that girl across the street, the roof above your head, those thoughts in your mind, THAT is the Truth, because the Truth is EVERYTHING and ALWAYS.

It is complete and consistent and cannot be contradictory to itself and no argument or phenomenal event can harm it, because it doesn't have any of the properties that make things like logic, mathematics, inductive reasoning, or sensory experience fallible

This means YOU are It.

No, not this "you" that you think you are - these thoughts, experiences, and feelings or SENSE of "I" that you know you have but can't quite explain how you have it - I mean THAT which underlies all of it.

Those appearances - the girls' skirt, her skin, her smile, her eyes - those are just the mask of THAT which IS, because as I've said way too many times but cannot say enough, ALL THAT IS MUST BE ALL THAT IS.

X is X.

This is the truest thing that can ever be said, so long as you realize that X is just a token (a term from philosophy of mathematics). It's what that token, the "X" that you SEE, is pointing towards that is important. That is called its TYPE in philosophy of mathematics. Except, whether you write

X

1

GIBBLKEJKLWTD

It doesn't matter, all of those tokens represent the same TYPE - Truth. They are all bullshit in that they are not in and of themselves the truth, but just markers, pointers, signposts. Since they are in and of themselves impermanent (this forum will eventually be destroyed or erased, whether by choice or because the servers are blown up in a nuclear holocaust), they are not the TRUTH, but THAT which holds them up and THAT which they signify or represent IS the TRUTH.

Therefore, the Truth is the Truth, always and forever, and you are THAT which is TRUE. You are TRUTH.

What's that mean? That means that when this body dies, when your head slams into your steering wheel or when your brain fires its last neuron after your heart stops beating, THAT which you truly are will REMAIN and only your body/mind will transition (the atoms remain and are just moved to another geographical location...instead of the brain atoms that were in your head, they're now on the floor, if you were just decapitated).

Death isn't real, because that which you ARE, which is EVERYTHING, always has been and always will be. You are immortal, so long as you realize that when I say "you" I don't mean you, I mean YOU.

GET IT?

Enlightenment Then Is...

Perfect knowledge.

It is KNOWN by identity. You ARE IT.

Knowledge and Existence are ONE.

This is why Enlightened beings cannot be persuaded or argued with - they KNOW, not by any conditional method (thought, feeling, experience, etc), but by direct knowledge.

With the same certainty that you think you exist, they KNOW they exist.

It is self-consistent and complete.



Wait...how do I get it?


Good question.

How do you "get" something that is already there? Well, since it's not something you can "get," because anything that is "gettable" is by definition NOT Truth (you can't put Truth in your pocket, hide it in a vault, or write an IOU for it), are you fucked?

Nope, just remove the mask.

And what is that mask?

Everything that is a THING.

Thought, feelings, sensory data, emotions? They are the enemy. They are that which stands in the way of you seeing THAT which is.

Well how the FUCK do you do that?


Throw away everything.


If you truly, truly are convinced that what I'm saying is true, then you can find the Truth by just throwing away everything. And in return, you get EVERYTHING, because EVERYTHING that IS is exactly what is left when you get rid of everything that ISN'T.

What isn't?

Your hopes, your dreams, your lusts, your fears, your anxieties, your notions of truth, of friendship, of morality, of love....

Everything that you consider "you."

There Is No You

We have established many times over that all experiences, all thoughts, and all feelings, or anything that exists within the conceptual, perceptual, or emotive fabric that we call existence is actually NOT REAL (by our definition of Truth).

Therefore, if I ask you

"Who are you?"

You will very soon realize that you are NOT any of those, because anything that IS, IS NOT that which you think you are.

Your skin? That's a sensory object. Not the truth, just a skin-mask of the Truth.

Your fat? That's a sensory object. Not the truth, just a fart-mask of the Truth.

Your anxieties? That's a feeling. Not the Truth, just an anxiety-mask of the Truth.

Your desires? That's an affection. Not the Truth, just a desire-mask of the Truth.

Your knowledge of 2+2 = 4? That's a concept. Not the Truth, just a conceptuality-of-2+2=4-mask of the Truth.

Your conceptual conclusion that the Truth is always the Truth everywhere and forever? Not the Truth, just a really fluffy and paradoxical mask of the Truth.

All of it is not YOU. What YOU are is what EVERYTHING IS. That means there is no YOU or ME - there is only THAT.

Self does not exist. Only Not-Self exists (and in Sanskrit, the word for "not-self" is Anatman. Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahah).

True Self is No-Self.

So here is the next paradox that will fuck your brain -

If you are already the Truth, and that which you think you are is NOT the Truth, how do you Realize THAT which you already are?

You can shout at the top of your lungs that you want to wake up to THAT which you are, but that's just a shout, a sensory object, and a desire, an affection.

Ready for it?

Self cannot get rid of Self. It's like trying to think away thinking. By thinking "I want to stop thinking," you are perpetuating the problem.

Don't think about pink elephants!!!!!!

You have the key, but you can't remember which pocket you put it in, and the Self that you are currently inhabiting (this body and mind) is making sure you don't find that fucking key, because as soon as you do, you're outta here (in theory).

So Self does everything it can to keep you locked up.

This includes materialism (believing that the world is just matter), rationalism (thinking that thinking is the chief solution to all problems), atheism (believing that there is no ultimate), agnosticism (believing that whether or not there is an ultimate, you can't know it), and religion (that a system of beliefs and rituals will bring you closer to the Ultimate).

All of it, is bullshit. The atheist, agnostic, and devout Christian are all equally skullfucking retarded, because they are attached to their dogmas of Untruth.

The atheist thinks that because there is no evidence for God that there is no God and instead adheres to logic, because he's smart like that (when in fact, the belief that something doesn't exist because there is no evidence for it is actually TERRIBLE logic and anyone who takes an elementary class in logic and learns about a logical fallacy like the appeal to ignorance should immediately realize how stupid he is for thinking such a thing).

The devout Christian thinks he's right because his parents said so, he read this book that has some crazy cool shit in it that says he will have eternal life if he accepts Christ as his savior, etc. Well, problem is, he's not focusing on THAT which the religion is pointing to and he's just making a non-sensical leap. He focuses on morality, on ritual, on belief, and on custom to secure his eternal life, when instead, as I've demonstrated, he should be focusing on THAT which the signposts of words like "God" are pointing to). He is attached to words, beliefs, and concepts...in other words NOT god, and in other words, idolatry ;)

And the agnostic...well he think he's special because he's taken the middle road and doesn't know the answer! However, unless he's actively doing something to remedy that ignorance, then he is an agnostic not in the sense of "I don't know," but in the sense of "I CAN'T know," both of which are possible translations of "a" (not) "gnostic" (gnosis is Greek for knowledge). It's like a man sitting in his room, wondering if he can go out, meet girls, and get pussy. You don't know until you try and sitting in your room saying "I don't know!" isn't very admirable (and before you quote Socrates to me, "I know nothing," just stop; knowing NOTHING (hint hint hint hint) is a universe away from not knowing the answer or admitting that one cannot know the answer).

You Still Haven't Answered My Question - How Do I Get Enlightenment?


Remove ignorance and Enlightenment is the only thing that will be left.

Except for food, shelter, and water, abandon everything you have, dismiss any thought, feeling, and experience as Untruth, and in time, you will see THAT which IS.

Unfortunately, "you" (this body and mind) has no control over WHEN and HOW that happens, because YOU are not "you" (this body and mind), and "you" (this body and mind) is a conditioned phenomena.

In other words, "you" (this body and mind) has no free will.

How so?

Because absolute freedom implies a lack of conditioning.

There are two forks in the road; chooses one.

This is free will yes?

No.

Free will would mean not having any forks or any roads, or anyone to "choose" a direction. Why?

Because the fact that there is a fork in the road, means you are being FORCED into a decision. You are given two options (or three; do nothing). In all three choices, you were still hoisted that choice by the conditions existing in the first place.

Put another way, you didn't choose your face, your parents, or your place of birth, did you?

All of history, in its infinity, has led up to this very moment and made "you" who "you" are. You had no choice in any of it, because all that "you" consider as "you" never was your choice.

Please, try and prove me wrong. Don't go to sleep for 10 years. Think about one thing for 24 hours straight. Stay hard for 7 days straight.

Let me know how that goes;)

Like I said, true free will ABSOLUTE freedom. In order to have absolute freedom, you must be able to do ALL, ANYTIME, ANYWHERE (you should be connecting two very big dots right now...)

And since "you" have no freedom, "you" (this body and mind) does not CHOOSE Enlightenment, because "you" cannot desire the destruction of "you" (I will show later on how suicide is a noble thought, but ultimately futile).

Truth Realization, then, must come from outside the Self.

In other words, it must be an act of Grace.

"AH," you say, "but I am THAT which is ALWAYS, therefore I am ULTIMATELY FREE and CAN GRANT "ME" (this body and mind) THAT knowledge whenever the TRUE ME wishes."

And you would be correct in saying that. 100%.

So do it:)

Can't?

Ah, well then this must all be a farce, a big hoax.

And you would be correct in saying that. 100%.

Why?

Remember, all intention, all desire, all thought, all hope, all EVERY thing that is a THING is NOT THAT. Only THAT is THAT, and THAT is EVERYTHING.

Alright, even I'm annoying myself now, but here's what I'm trying to tell you -

It will happen when it happens and you have absolutely no say in it.

"Okay, fine!" you say. "I'm gonna go back to sitting alone in my room playing video games and not doing anything, since I don't have any free will! Fuck you, Hector!"

I only have one response to that -

Is that True?

There was a funny comic posted on the door of one of my philosophy professors. It showed a guy reading a "choose your own adventure" book and the page he was reading said something like this -

"If you don't have any free will, turn to page 35. If you have free will, turn to page 35."

Get it?

Alright, sooo what now?

If you do nothing, everything will go on as it always has been, because everything will be as it always was.

If you do anything, everything will go on as it always has been, because everything will be as it always was.

No matter what you do, EVERYTHING IS AS IT IS.

Boom. There you go.

Do what you want.

And even if you can't choose what you want or ACTUALLY choose to DO what you want, but you still WANT to get Enlightenment, what should you do?

Well, when you wanna learn how to get pussy, who do you go to?

People who get pussy;)

Who Has Been Enlightened?

Well other than the very true statement that everyone is already Enlightened, they just don't realize it yet, here's a list of people that, in my research, seemed to have found THAT which is True

Moses
Siddartha Gotama (the Buddha - along with his attendant Ananda, after the Buddha's death, his main two followers, Moggallana and Sariputta, along with anyone in the Pali canon who is identified as an "arhat" or "arahant.")
Jesus
St. Paul (the guy who wrote half the new testament)
Angelus Silesius
Meister Eckhart
Giardano Bruno
Franklin Merrell Wolff (see this book)
Adi Shankara (see this bookor any others by him)
Lao Tzu (founder of Daoism)
Herman Melville (Didn't think you'd see this one, huh!? Go read Moby Dick for Melville's journey Enlightenment and Bartleby the Scrivener for what it's like to be Enlightened)
Walt Whitman (see Leaves of Grass)
Eckhart Tolle
U.G. Krishnamurti
Mohammad (an Enlightened pedophile, lol)
Plato (another Enlightened pedophile, lulz)
Nagarjuna
Nisagadatta
Socrates (here's the kicker: I know nothing is his claim to Enlightenment; remember that THAT which is TRUE is NOTHING, when compared to what we think of as everything?)
Plotinus
Dogen
Bodhidarma
Ramana Maharshi
Baal Shem Tov
Rumi
St. John of the Cross
Bernadette Roberts
Heraclitus
Parmenides

Woah, there's Buddhists, Advaita Vedantist, Christian mystics, Ancient Greek philosophers, and even modern literary figures in this list.

Yep, that's the point.

And there are dozens upon dozens more that I haven't done personal research on, but have certainly attained Enlightenment. And there are probably MANY more who attained it, but didn't tell anyone, because nobody wants to hear the Truth, since it means losing everything that you are and have ;)

I'm quite tired after writing all of this, but the next time I take a break from writing articles and my book on college game, I'll show you what the benefits of Enlightenment are (i.e., WHY get enlightened), and how there is no fundamental distinction between the teachings of Buddhism, Judaism, Christianity, Hinduism, or any secular path towards Truth. They are different in name and form, but not in essence.

Until then.

Love ya,

Hector

p.s. this is all speculation since I have not had Truth Realization, so everything I've said is double-not true ;)

p.p.s Oh and none of this should have any bearing on how I teach you to fuck bitches; I by no means advocate celibacy as a path to enlightenment and will explain in the next post why celibacy is irrelevant to enlightenment
 

Ken

Tool-Bearing Hominid
Tool-Bearing Hominid
Joined
Jul 13, 2015
Messages
240
X is X, or how Objectivism puts it, A is A. By the way, how does concepts like Objectivism relate to this whole "everyone religion is the same" that you talked about?
 

Hector Papi Castillo

Tribal Elder
Tribal Elder
Joined
Dec 2, 2013
Messages
2,592
By Objectivism, you mean Ayn Rand's Objectivism and Leonard Peikoff's extension of her teachings, right? (I don't want to misunderstand you:D)

If so, then the statement A is A is correct, so long as it's coming from the perspective that "A" <- (the token itself) is not what exists, but that which A is pointing to, since "A" (the token itself) is -Truth (the "-" means "not" for any reading who don't know that). Oh and it must be clear this assertion also assumes "A" is not pointing to the concept of "A" or the concept of anything, because a word pointing to a concept is the same as a signpost pointing to a signpost. The signpost, or token, "A" must point to an ineffable Ultimate.

How does it relate to the fact that all religion is the same? Well, my argument for how all religions are the same will simply come from the assertion that all religions are just creative twists of the same Ultimate reality that were adapted to the culture they came from (i.e., when Buddha attained Enlightenment, he did so relative to the dominant thought at the time, pre-Vedic Brahamnism [sorta like Hinduism]; when Jesus attained Enlightenment, he did so relative to the dominant thought of the Pharisees/Sadducees/Essenes [sects of Judaism back in the day, since Judaism didn't have a central core until Rabbinic Judaism formed]).

So, if Ayn Rand HAD attained Enlightenment, then her philosophy of Objectivism would be in reaction to the religions (or lack thereof) around her. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem that her system passes the test of asserting some Ultimate that transcends the conceptual or sensible world.

If I'm correct (and correct me if I'm not), Ayn Rand thought that reality exists independently of consciousness and that human beings can find "objective" knowledge through sense perception, right?

Well, if those are her tenets, here is the problem

1. Ultimate reality must BE Consciousness itself (was trying to save this one for my next posts, but gotta throw it out here). And by consciousness, I don't mean what we think of as consciousness, I mean simply Bare Awareness, or what some call Primordial Consciousness, a simply awareness of "I Am That I Am" or "I Am" (kinda like Descarte's Cogito Ergo Sum!). In other words "X -> X!" or "A is A!" except there must be THAT which IS it. I'm tempted to use the word "Alive," but i don't mean organic life, I mean "Active," like a light that never turns off, because it was never turned on (by definition) and it's not a light, but just a "THAT." So if she asserts that reality is NOT consciousness, meaning it is "dead," then that can't be right, because reality is very much Active, as we can see or as we've concluded (I know that it seems strange of me to condemn logic/intuitive perception as ultimately truth-giving and then use it to reinforce my ideas, but I hope I've made it clear they're just signposts and if you want to discard them entirely and have a discussion of pure silence, then that's okay! that would mean we both "get it"! :p)

2. There's no such thing as objective knowledge or knowledge that can be gained through perception. Gaining knowledge through perception or thought is like pointing at a finger and forgetting that it's important what that second finger is pointing at...okay, let me try this a different way, because I probably don't make sense

If I do think that perception, like seeing an apple, is truth, then this is what happens.

My perception of that apple is direct reality = what I see is what IS.

Except, if you argue that, then what is actually direct reality, the perception of the apple or the apple itself? Well, you can't really distinguish the difference can you? I mean, you can say you are, but then when you do this mental experiment, you're not actually distinguishing between the perception of the apple and the apple itself, since both are perceptually identical, you are distinguishing between the perception of the apple and your THOUGHT ABOUT distinguishing between the perception of the apple and the apple itself.

Because why do you see the apple itself as True, but not the perception of the apple (i.e., its color, how it makes you feel, how it reminds you of picking apples from a tree as a child, etc)?

Furthermore, what is the apple "in and of itself" (Kant called this the Ding an Sich)? Well, you can't "see" that, because your ability to know cannot extend by your consciousness.

Your perceptions of the apple and your thoughts about the apple are ALL happening within your consciousness (red fish and blue fish, but still fish in the same fish tank!)

Therefore, there is no objective reality, because you can't "see it" objectively (without consciousness), thus it is completely subjective, no matter how hard you try, because you're already interpreting reality through the lens of "you" (your brain and perceptual apparatus)...but as we demonstrated, perception and thought (or "you) cannot be trusted as a vehicle of Ultimate Truth!

Objectivity and subjectivity, therefore, are equally wrong, because they're both taking place in the same thing (your consciousness).

That means there is no distinction between whether you call that apple an apple or if you call that apple God, because all identifiers (names) are equally fallacious and NOT Truth.

And this is the answer to your question - every religion is the same, because they are all pointing towards the same Ultimate, they just use different identifiers (names).

The only question is what flavor of signpost you like :D Any of them will work, so long as you constantly push forward, knowing that the signpost itself (e.g., your prayers to Allah or your non-theistic Buddhist meditation) is just a bridge.

Once the bridge gets you to "THERE," you no longer need the bridge.

But if Ayn Rand's Objectivism is coming from the false premise that reality can be ascertained via perception, then it will probably lead to more bridges, ad infinitum. It's not a good bridge, cuz it's just bringing you to more bridges. You want, instead, to find a bridge that brings you to "THAT."

I'm not even Enlightened, so you can imagine how frustrating it is for an actually Enlightened guy to explain what IT IS, when all he has to explain what IS is that which ISN'T IT (and you can see why they might kill people who say shit like this...it's quite the party-pooper!)

Don't think about pink dildos.


Hector
 

Richard

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Ken said:
X is X, or how Objectivism puts it, A is A. By the way, how does concepts like Objectivism relate to this whole "everyone religion is the same" that you talked about?

I'm sure Hector will reply to this as well but I'd like to offer my input on your particular question.

Objectivism posits that the highest goal a man should have is attaining happiness. Without going much farther than that, Ayn Rand has discussed the means a man should take to attain happiness and they parallel the teachings of different religions. All religions are the same in that they outline the same "ways to live your life" and offer the same "knowledge" on how to basically achieve "happiness."

Buddhists call it Nirvana, Christians call it Heaven, Indians call it moksha, etc.

The problem is that people start to identify too strongly with the religion/the path instead of the point or destination. The Zen phrase "The finger that points to the moon is not the moon" may be the best way to explain it in that all religions are just the fingers that point you in the direction; they're hints about reaching Nirvana/Heaven/Moksha/Pure Happiness; whatever you want to call it.

So, what happens is people start to fight over which "path" is the best one. The "path" of Christianity is the best! No, the "path" of Buddhism is the best! and fighting ensues. Meanwhile, everybody who's reached the point/destination understands that all religions get you to the same place.

That's just my point of view on your question, Ken. I'm curious to see what Hector says here! ;)

-Richard
 

Richard

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Annnddddd.... Hector beat me to it.
 

Richard

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Anatman said:
Richard,

You fucking nailed it. And you were much clearer about it, too;)

My man!

Hector

We seem to have read the same material and reached the same conclusions ;)

I spent a lot of time reading and studying the Ego and by extension the pure consciousness or mindfulness that you brought up and I reached another question; should Enlightenment actually be your end goal? I'll bring in Alchemy as well; not for the physicality of turning lead into goal but for the metaphor that it is. That, of course, being personal growth by turning negativity into dreams, etc.

Anyway, from what I've gathered, those who seek Enlightenment only ever dwell in stage 1 of Alchemy which is removing impurities from lead (nigredo) and turning it into white light (albedo). It seems that all the person is doing is asking "WHY?" and never doing anything with the answers similar to daydreamers who always have good ideas but never turn them into reality. The questions daydreamers hate to be asked are "When" and "Where?" That's to say, they hate questions that force them to take action.

I may be wrong here, but, Objectivism also posits that invention of some sorts is a means to reach that elevated state of consciousness. Something like bettering humanity with your "talent" (I think is how it was described) or "skills" is what you should do.

Anyway, my question up for discussion is "How important is Enlightenment and Truth if the person who has it does nothing beneficial with it?" To me, it's akin to having all of the answers but doing nothing with them; as Mark Twain said "The man who does not read has no advantage over the man who cannot." What thinks you Hector?

-Richard
 

RAFox

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This is a very interesting topic. I've also been thinking about Truth, the Universe, and All That Is. It started with the writings of Musashi. Below, I've tried to put my thoughts into understandable sentences, but I'm not quite sure I've done such a good job of it, haha :)

Anyway, allow me to share my ideas about everything.

There is truth, and there is illusion. Everything you see, everything that is, is true (The birds, the trees, the cars, simply the world, everything). I'm not trying to say, that which you don't see, doesn't exist, though.

One of these illusions is time. Time is a concept that humans made up. They made up the numbers, the calendars, et cetera. Time does not exist. The universe does not know time, just like the earth doesn't actually have borders.

In essence, everything is meaningless. It is us humans that give things meaning, and value.

Also, we truly are one with the universe. We are connected to it, enveloped by it, and it's even inside us. So essentially, everything is one.

On a different note, I find it fascinating that we can influence the outer world with the creative aspect of our souls. For instance, you think of an image, a form, or a tune, and when you draw it, sculpt it, or play it, you essentially bring something into existence, make it more than just a thought. Very fascinating.

Let me know what you guys think.
 

Drck

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For most people, the problem with Enlightenment is that they think it is something to reach, some another level of happiness to achieve which is much better than this Life, this current state of mind. They think that Enlightenment is just another sensation to chase after, some sort of nirvana, perhaps endless state of orgasm....

But that is not truth. A person seeking such Enligmtment can never reach it, he can never reach it if keeps hoping for better life. He needs to drop the hope for better life and better future first, he needs to realize that there are no better tomorrow's, there are no better lives in heaven... He needs to realize that there is no other time, except the moment in which he lives right Now... He needs to realize that the only reality is the moment Now...

From this point of view, Enlightment is not another sensation to achieve. In contrary, for person with normal mindset true Enlightenment is actually quite boring... It is just sort of stillness in which nothing exciting is happening. The reason is, that normal person has constantly moving mind, his mind always jumps from one thing to another to get more excitement... Ten thousands of thoughts run through normal person's mind in one day... His mind always chases after some excitement - more girls, more money, better social status, better retirement, better life on the other side, better tomorrows... Normal person always lives for better future in his mind, he is a dreamer, chaser - but he never lives in the moment Now...

So if he want Enlightment, he has to drop all desires for better future, he needs to stop dreaming about better life, he needs to stop chasing excitements in life... And that is boring, it is lifeless, and that's why he can't reach the Enlightenment...

Enlightment can come suddenly, or it can come gradually, just piece by piece, usually by studing other (enlighted) people's thoughts and ideas, learning till one comes to realization...

Enlightment itself cannot really be reached in a sense that we reach our goals (such as earn 1 million dollars, sleep with X girls, become famous, ...). Enlightment is sort of realizing that it is actually the DESIRE to reach the Enlightenment that stoping the individual from reaching it...

See, Buddha was also a seducer, he was a great chaser too. He would be chasing all the girls because of the great desire he had for them. But the more he chased, the further they ran away. So one day he was so tired of the chasing, that he just dropped the desire for them. And that's when they came...

Buddha was chasing Enlightenment, but then he realized that the chasing itself was the problem. The more he chased it the further it ran, just like those girls. So one day he stopped chasing it, and that's when it came, that's when he realized that was the desire to reach it that kept him away...

But this also can be quite confusing, because if one doesn't have desire to reach Enlightenment, if one doesn't chase it - how can he or she reach it? So Enlightment is a concept we sort of have to understand first. First the person has to have desire to reach Enlightenment (or girls), the Enlightenment is a goal. However, as the time goes and the person accumulates more knowledge about Enlightenment, he starts to recognize that it is the DESIRE itself that is stopping him from reaching the Enlightenment itself. Once he realizes it and once he is able to stop the desire to ACHIEVE anything - money, great life, Enlightenment itself - that's when the Enlightenment comes...

A person truly interested in reaching Enlightenment usually practices some form of yoga, buddhism, zen, or follows some of the eastern philosophies...


Mahayana, one of the branches of Buddhism teaches that Observation is a key to Enlightenment. A person gives out ideas to become anything or be anyone, he only becomes an Observer of Reality (which others call Truth). He observes external world like everybody else (objects, people, things, knowledge) as well as internal world (his own feelings, moods, thoughts, believes, desires, attachments to different things,...). He becomes an Observer of the external as well as internal worlds, and by observing he dissociates himsel from those worlds....

That is the teaching of Mahayana, but there are also other ways to reach Enlightment, for example Bhakti yoga (yoga of devotion, love) or Radja yoga (sort of manipulation of mind by focusing on different objects). A person simply observes, or better, is aware of different objects. These 'objects' include external world but also his own body, his thoughts, his desires, his feelings.... Yoga can be actually considered as science, and among others it also teaches to eliminate thoughts... true yoga is cessation of mind (or more acceptably for western readers, cessation of thousands of useless thoughts)...

As the time goes and he becomes better Observer, he realizes that no longer he can associate himself with different things or names. He can no longer say "I am rich", "I am a man", "I am a human". He cannot say "This is my body" or "I have great feelings" because he only observes these 'things'... He can say: "there is a male body", "the body has feelings", "the body has attachments to outer world through feelings and desires", and perhaps "the money belongs to that male body". We don't have to go crazy with calling ourselves "that male body", but hopefully it makes sense what I mean...

See the difference? It is no longer "me" or "mine" or "I", now the body became a simple object of observation; it is being observed like an external object... It is no longer "I am", rather it becomes "It is"... It is no longer an attempt to become someone or something in life, it is rather just being in the moment...

Now, what happens if you observe yourself as if you (your body, feelings, desires, thoughts,...) were external object for long periods of time? Very significant thing will happen. You will begin to realize that there are actually two very different things - one is the observed (the body with all its feelings and desires), and the other is the Observer itself... In other words, you've dissociated your consciousness from your body, you split them apart, those are now two very different things...

The differences will become quite clear with practicing (and I don't mean 1/2 hour daily for the next 4 weeks), you will simply recognize that you are not your body, you are not your feelings, you are not your desires or thoughts in exactly the same way in which you are not your clothes or your job title... All these are just external things, you will see them as external things... But if you are not your body, your feelings and your thoughts - what are you then?

You may ask, who am I if I'm not my body? Is there actually such thing that we call "I" ? And indeed, by further analyzing the "I" you'll actually realize that there is no such thing as "I"... The "I" just belongs to the body, but you no longer associate yourself with the body... You'll recognize that you (the way you perceive yoursel today) actually don't exist, and that everything that is happening is sort of happening only in consciousness, in awareness... The body is there, thoughts and feelings are there, the rest of the world including your job is still there - but it is no longer you, there is no "I"...

Perhaps you'll go even further and asks - who observes the observer? And then, maybe only then you come to understanding that there is 'something' that constantly observes, and that you - as a person - is only a tiny little part of this big 'thing' that keeps observing...

The physical reality will be the same, however, it will not disappear. You will not move to another planet, you will not wake up in another worlds, you will still be here and Now...

And if somebody drops heavy stone on your foot, you will still be screaming as you'd feel exactly the same pain... The difference is, that you will perceive the reality in much different way - what you've perceived as reality and truth before will have much different meaning Now... you will see how people are chasing pointlessly many useless things, you will see that most people are just dreaming and living with their minds in the future and fantasy, you will see that for most it is just impossible to reach that everlasting moment called Now...
 

thedude

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I am flabbergasted at what I've just read.

I'll admit, perhaps years ago I branded philosophy as "useless" since it wouldn't help me in my business goals, which were in turn to help me get other stuff.

Also on agnostics, moments before reading this I would have called myself an agnostic(a step up from when I considered myself to be an ATHEIST.

There is so much I haven't put thought into understanding, instead I've been chasing the money with Affiliate Marketing or whatever entrepreneurial adventure I thought would bring me riches and therefore freedom.

Of course the fact that I'm thinking about these things proves that I'm unenlightened. Perhaps I should of said "The body has desires for money, which will in turn fulfill the other desires it has"

Richard said:
Anyway, my question up for discussion is "How important is Enlightenment and Truth if the person who has it does nothing beneficial with it?" To me, it's akin to having all of the answers but doing nothing with them; as Mark Twain said "The man who does not read has no advantage over the man who cannot." What thinks you Hector?

-Richard
[/quote]

How does one "use" enlightenment? If it is merely an understand of how everything is, that you are truth and all that.

I fail to see how it drives action, or maybe it's not a driver at all? It just allows you to go forth on your day and make the lows high, the highs higher?
 

Richard

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CollegeSenior said:
I am flabbergasted at what I've just read.

I'll admit, perhaps years ago I branded philosophy as "useless" since it wouldn't help me in my business goals, which were in turn to help me get other stuff.

Also on agnostics, moments before reading this I would have called myself an agnostic(a step up from when I considered myself to be an ATHEIST.

There is so much I haven't put thought into understanding, instead I've been chasing the money with Affiliate Marketing or whatever entrepreneurial adventure I thought would bring me riches and therefore freedom.

Of course the fact that I'm thinking about these things proves that I'm unenlightened. Perhaps I should of said "The body has desires for money, which will in turn fulfill the other desires it has"

Richard said:
Anyway, my question up for discussion is "How important is Enlightenment and Truth if the person who has it does nothing beneficial with it?" To me, it's akin to having all of the answers but doing nothing with them; as Mark Twain said "The man who does not read has no advantage over the man who cannot." What thinks you Hector?

-Richard

How does one "use" enlightenment? If it is merely an understand of how everything is, that you are truth and all that.

I fail to see how it drives action, or maybe it's not a driver at all? It just allows you to go forth on your day and make the lows high, the highs higher?[/quote]

If we're speaking in Alchemic terms then the purpose of Enlightenment would be personal clarity and removing the mental barriers that stop you from fulfilling your life purpose. Maintaining a conscious mind gives you alot of clarity regarding the content of your "soul" or whatever you'd like to call it. Once you understand your soul then you understand lifes mission and you no longer have to "self-motivate" because you'll be taking action from a place of immense "passion."

Basically, I'd say, you use Enlightenment (I prefer the terms mindfulness/consciousness because I don't believe in full Enlightenment) as a means to understand your "true self" and by extension your "life purpose."

Like I said, what's the point of understanding anything if you don't apply that knowledge? A 40 year old virgin who reads and memorizes all of the content on GirlsChase but does not use it and apply it is no different than an ignorant 40 year old virgin. Knowledge is only dormant power - it means nothing until it's applied.

I'd also argue that persons like Buddha or Jesus had a life purpose of teaching and awakening others. Enlightenment wasn't their goal but was something achieved on the way.

This is why I'm such a big proponent of consciousness and mindfulness and include it in my coaching sessions. Using consciousness allows you to understand "true self" and that understanding allows you to act with "passion" which is the highest driving force there is. Anything you do for the pure pleasure of just doing it (for me, pool is a great example) gives you peaks into where your passion lies and that's what "drives" you; the pure pleasure of just doing it.

-Richard
 

OldSelf

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I just experienced an insane toke session with a friend of mine and I entered it. I FUCKING KNOW I DID.

I'm going to share what happened and see if it helps.

The "." will be the beginning.

.
. . . . . .
.
. .
.
. . . . . .
.

These are all just things that are going on in our reality, thoughts. "Man that was a fucking lame ass example, go kill yourself." Or, "Ohhhh myy gooddddddd, that was so deeep yet soooo simple" or the other TRILLIONS of THOUGHTS that can be made, but even though these are all just thoughts, they still are aren't they. HENCE, if you SEE that there is a difference in YOU and you, you can entirely separate yourself form any THING you THINK you are! The world reality and the ME that thinks it can define reality is just further down the rabbit hole.

Define reality. You can, but you can't.

You can define it with your sensory and thoughts and feelings, but what is it really. There's only one thing that's TRUE. IT IS. I have mastered the art of "Mind fucking" - I hope I didn't just get anyone worked up, either. If you have a fear (unconscious, meaning you didn't say "I'm gonna fear this... yeah, that's what I'm going to do") you can just as easily (you did nothing but feel a fear) CONSCIOUSLY see that there is a YOU that is fearful and a YOU that can see that that YOU is fearful. Hence! You can form yourself into whatever you ARE NOT, by living consciously.

Reality is you and you are reality, whatever that reality it is.

To me, mixing GC.com and Enlightenment don't go together. But then again, that's just another THOUGHT of mine.

To ME (the guy with thoughts, feelings, dreams, hopes) I'd rather get good with girls than enter enlightenment. Why? The people who have reached enlightenment have done nothing to get their and they certainly didn't go to Costco for a 12.99 Wholesale bargain deal on enlightenment pills - which FYI also are a great source of fiber. for They have only influenced the worlds THOUGHTS AND FEELINGS AND IDENTITIES because of their detached, enlightened self. Enlightenment is you, and you are it. How can you describe enlightenment. You don't. Right? Then why, if you're still with this, do you understand it. BECAUSE IT'S IT damn it! Just when you think you get it, YOU LOST IT. Describing it is just further down how on this forum, and my words, each letter, each thought that comes from the letter, and every thought that comes after is just more "me" thinking - which leads to my conclusion, you cannot forever be enlightened. It is just another IDEA.

This is why I personally think enlightenment is just bologna. Jesus, Buddha, name whichever 'enlightened' person you want; they didn't enter a new realm. They still thought and spoke and felt and saw and breathed after their enlightenment. Unless they just poof, dissipated into 900 trillion atoms.

I was told by someone who mediates habitually, (you've gotta respect someone who can just sit their and do nothing. That takes control, poise, and discipline - all traits in admirable people.) that "You are enlightened and that enlightenment isn't a way of thinking, a way of perceiving, or anything tangible, it's already you." He pointed out that when you zone out and literally forget the world as a whole - I mean HARDCORE zoning out, you've become a vegetable type-shit, and you are just BEING. You are in nirvana. Because nirvana is always there, and so is YOU and you. They are all one and none at the same time. Hence, it's infinite yet through whatever-fucking-word-you-can-describe-this-to-be, it's finite - because as you read this and Anatman's OP, you get it. But getting it isn't T. Knowing what T is, isn't T. T is T.

This is the exactly how I came to understand that this world is just a stage. We are all being what we think we are, but we are also already it.

NOW

Riddle me this, explain the change you see in your life. You are literally morphing yourself (physical self) into ways and because of that are manipulating the external environment. Why? Because like I said, it's all just mindless chatter when you try to describe it. IT DEFEATS WHAT IT IS. IT IS ALREADY IT!

My last point - in my honest to god opinion, this is all just pointless. You are trying to define that, in which, is already there and is.

Fuck n A. Gonna go be productive. Great post!

Go shag some ladies!

Sorry for the bad grammar. I hear you Anatman... the excited-state I enter when I hit this topic is truly just incredible to experience.
 
you miss 100% of the shots you don't take

Hector Papi Castillo

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Ken

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Hector, I totally meant Ayn Rand Objectivism.
 

BallIsLife

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Why is suicide a noble thought but ultimately futile? I was interested to hearing what you had to say about that, maybe in your next post? Can't wait for your college book bro.
 
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