Why should anyone take your advice? What's your credibility?

[Smith]

Altair,

Thought u were taking so much action you don't have time to post shit like this Kinda disappointed to see you making this post, because it's such a typical question you see a lot on PUA forums about guys trying to compare who's better at game, e.g. Tom Torero or Tyler?.
Just because a guy is getting laid left and right, it doesn't make him good with women if he's manipulative, doesn't respect other people and don't have his life under control. And just because you are getting laid more, it doesn't make you a real man. u know?
So look, if u only want advice from people with "credentials", then go buy Chase's products or pay someone like James Marshall for live coaching. I know the members on this forum always try to give their best advice (honestly who has time to write 500 words essay to help a stranger on an internet forum unless they genuinely want to help??), so I'm always thankful for that. Someone's advice may not resonate with you right now, but 1 year from now, it may start to make perfect sense. There's no way you can know what advice is right or wrong because "game" is chaotic. It's about finding your own pace and style and put your own little spin on it, and that's why it's fun.
For me, I tried everything I could get from the RSD videos and GC and I'm always thankful if one person replied my question. Not every advice will work for everyone. I found Tom Torero's advice helpful in theory, but whenever I tried it out, it doesn't seem to work for me. I don't doubt his "credentials", but simply because everyone has a different personality and style.
The question you should ask is "why should anyone give me any advice?" instead of coming from this value sucking place "why should I take anyone's advice?". You're not paying us to give you any advice and we're not trying to sell you anything. We simply tried out some of the stuff and we're telling you what has worked for us.
I got on the board because I was so tired of not going anywhere with my dating life, and when I saw the journal of people on this forum grinding hard it motivated me a lot. I remember Dern's and Casonava's journal used to be very motivational for me. Too bad Dern doesn't seem to be on the forum anymore. I used to write a post everyday in my journal when I was starting out, and I went out almost every single day for 3 months during my "immersion" period. I was willing to push my comfort zone, travel to another country, looking for part time work to support myself while doing game because the cities in my country just wasn't big enough for me to progress fast enough. It was one of the most fun period of my life, but I was also putting everything else in my life on hold. Funny that's also the period where I realized women won't ever make you feel satisfied and fulfilled. It's always chasing one lay after another. That was probably one of the biggest realization I ever have. As to my lay count...look man, sooner or later you'll start getting laid, and you'll realize it doesn't really matter, and you'll look back at this post and probably have a good laugh at how far you have come. Anyway, look forward to your next report!

 

[Indian Race Troll (IRT)]

Edit:

I could spend a post talking about Estate and FSC's rudeness but I just don't want their advice. I am doing my part to make it better for myself, for the rest of you who answered with humility I am grateful and look forward to having your help in my journey to bettering my life in regards to women and sex.

 

[Prehistoric]

I am not in the custom of giving advice assuming that I am some sort of universal truth carrier, even in those aspects of life/work where people consider me very experienced.

I am of the opinion that, unless you're dealing with health, money and very serious relationships (where of course you want to minimise the chance of failure), you can learn a lot from more experienced people, let's call them "teachers" but you can also learn by exchanging views, feedback and opinions with other "students", even from people who know less than you because they allow you to spot mistakes more clearly. It also helps a lot from a motivation point of view, knowing you're not alone in your journey, but there's many more who are struggling with the same things you are.

So if you are interested only in the masters' advices, then you can discard all of the things I post, because I am definitely no guru, nor is my ambition to be one, even the day I'll know a lot. Regarding your questions, I think I already answered the 3 and the 4 in some way. The other two:

1) I started taking the whole game/pick up thing seriously back in October/November 2014 and I have bedded 3 girls since. Before I had some long-term relationships and some other shorter stories. I'd say my entire-life lay count is around 12 or 13. By the way I am 28 years old.

2) 3 of the girls I have bedded in my life, including the last one two weeks ago, are undoubtedly what one would consider very hot. Ironically one white, one asian and one black: I always fantasise about a foursome with the three of them together One of them (I was in a relationship with) worked shortly as a model although she's into singing so she's pursuing another kind of career.

 

[Estate]

Here is a picture of toys being thrown out of a pram. That is all.

 

[trashKENNUT]

Altair,

Ask this in real life and not many people are gonna be so nice. Because to experts, you have nothing to offer. When you starting out and want to make friends with everyone even though it is obvious that you guys have no interest.

So yea, Life is difficult.

I think as Richard and Chase noted. You should basically go out and test (REal empiricist test) (Chase). Then you know how people know their stuff. (Richard). Listen to them.

Zac

 

[Byron]

If you don't trust people here enough to take their advice, why stay?
I think if this had been phrased as just curious and wanting to get to know the people on the boards, it'd have come across a lot more socially aware.

 

[Smurf]

I have no credibility. Don't listen to me.

That being said, stop looking for people that can tell you, "Yes, Altair, you can do this!" Just go try it. Stop basing your success off of the success of others and start making gains for yourself. We're not here to prove to you that we're readily able to give advice based on times that you GO OUT AND TEST/PRACTICE/EXPERIMENT with the material given here, we're just here to give it. Stop asking if it's possible and go make it happen, man.

It's something I'm struggling with now, because I just regressed a lot, and I've been struggling with comparing myself to my natural friends who are way better than me and it's demotivating. Stop comparing and race against yourself. Your'e only 21, as far as I can tell, and you have plenty of time to experiment, dawg.

Jake.

 

[Indian Race Troll (IRT)]

I don't get the deal with the hostility here at all so I will make it clear as I can. When I am asking for help in a difficult math class, I am going to ask for help from a guy that has done well in the class or has tutored it, not someone who has yet to take the class or is struggling in it. Now likewise, whenever I am asking for help in this stuff, I want to hear from guys who have gone out there, experienced success, and had a lot going for them in the game because it speeds up the process. I don't like the idea of the "blind leading the blind" because I joined this forum for a reason, Chase knew what he was talking about and some of his advice helped better my social life and even win me some dates and numbers.

Now I am not being unreasonable here at all and if some of you want to be sensitive about it, then that is your problem and not mines. I will say this though, the way I worded this question in the topic was rude. I should have asked something like how much experience have you had with the game but I made it clear that I was not trying to be a dick or calling someone out at all.

My social tact needs work but most people on this thread offered their credibility which I am grateful of. I see no reason for people to be so up in arms over my thread. Yes, the title was rude and I wish I could have worded it a lot better but I have my right to know the people I am getting advice from rather than just taking it from anybody. At that rate I might as well end up doing crazy RSD Nation shit in public and getting myself in a lot of trouble.

 

[trashKENNUT]

Altair,

My social tact needs work

You kind of answer your own question.

but I have my right to know the people I am getting advice from rather than just taking it from anybody

You might want to try taking the advice and report back, which actually i just notice, Chase responded and noted that it's a good start. Keep doing that. I will not like to point out the train of thought of thinking that "i have the right to know". While it is true that you know what you want, this does not mean that even you ask nicely, people are going to be fond of you/or respond back to you. Sometimes, it can be cultural differences and how you do your approach to things, on what environment you are in. This are also things to have in mind.

Zac

 

[HellAtlantic]

Chase and Franco need not answer this. I would also like it if guys took this thread seriously.

One of the main things I look for when I am getting advice from guys, especially online, is their credibility. For example, I would not take advice about women from a guy who is still a virgin because that guy has not experienced success in the game and I think that is fair. So I want to get to know some more of you guys on here, this isn't an insult by any means but I would love to learn more about the guys who will help in my journey to doing better with women.


I know Anatman, Ray Zorse, Mr. Rob, Franco (obviously), and Chase (duh!) are legitimate player on this forum though if they like they can offer their reasons for why someone should take their advice too. One user whose lay reports I love reading are Oh Pry but I don't even know if he posts anymore. So here are some things me, other forum members, and even the lurkers would like to know about you guys giving advice.

1. What is your lay count right now? If you do not remember the exact number then an estimate is great.

2. Have you had sex with girls that are objectively very attractive? What kind of hot girls? Models? What? Describe the best kinds of girls you have managed to land for sex and relationships.

3. Why did you join this forum to other guys if you are doing so well in the game?

4. Lastly, why should any newbie out there listen to your advice when it comes to their goal of obtaining sex with nice looking girls?

Altair, instead of responding to your demands here... since you probably would put me in the category of "middle of the road" to you or whatever, I'll just say this.

Man... GET OVER YOURSELF.

Why should you take our advice? Dude, don't, just go wallow in self pity and don't bother taking the advice that we come on here for FREE to do spending our OWN FREE TIME in order to TRY to give back to guy who are now in the same situation as when we started here and got the great advice back then to succeed.

Also, why do we need to prove our "credentials" to you? What do we owe you? Oh, wow, you came on a free forum and people tried to give you something for free? Wow, sorry for being a jerk!
Are you kidding here? Nobody owes you sh*t man. We offer help because we have recieved the same and want to give back.

Here's the difference. When I started here, I SUCKED with women and had limiting beliefs of my own. It took a LOT of time and patients and practice but I persevered and listened to what guys here were telling me and what Chases was writing in blog posts. And it gradually fell into place. I could have just said "Yeah I'm different and your free advice sucks Chase" but then I'd be an ignorant jerk, so I didn't

Seriously, this one just made me lose my cool. This used to be such an awesome place for learning and discussing game. If you don't like someone's advice, don't take it. Nobody here has to "prove" anything to you because we don't owe you anything, nobody owes you anything, the world doesn't owe you anything.

Sorry to break it to you.

So your're questions, sure, why don't I answer them for you:
- My lay count. More than yours, less than Chase. Besides that, who cares, who, when, what and where I sleep with someone is none of your business. I'm not here to brag and gets pats on the back.
- Have I had sex with very attractive girls? Well, again, why the hell would I detail such personal details on a public forum for you? But here's a simple overview. At first? No, I never had, never believed I could. 3 years, on... HELL. F*CKING. YES. Because I listened to Chase, Franco, Richard and many others I'm sorry I'm not mentioning and they know what the hell they are talking about.
- Why did I join? I joined for the same reason as 99% of guys. I sucked with women, I learned, now I don't. And despite the tone of this message, I do like to give back to guys who are in the same position I was in a few years ago and might benefit from some help. Am I always right? Nope, probably not, but I just speak from my experiences and hope it helps.
- Why should anyone listen to me? THEN DON'T! Don't like my advice? No worries, ignore it. Just don't try to put down myself or any other member of this forum who have busted their ass to get where they are in improving their live and take precious time out of their day to come and help you do the same for FREE.

To Altair... get a grip dude. Stop thinking the world owes you something. You want it, go get it. Otherwise, forget it.
To everyone else... sorry I lost my cool here, but it's a crying shame this is what we're discussing on here nowadays.

Ummmm I was gonna write something basically like this but I'll just sum it up and say "what Estate said".

Best of luck to you Altair. You'll get to the top eventually. At least you go out and try. The more you try the higher your odds of banging go. Keep at it.

 

[HellAtlantic]

Quite frankly if you're starting at ground zero taking advice from a high level expert might not do much for you. It's like golf lessons. So you wake up one day and decide you want to become a golfer. "I want to learn from the best", you say. You want lessons from Tiger Woods you decide cuz he's the best. But Tiger can't really help you. You need to take lessons from any person who plays golf who's willing to help you. That's where you start. You need to learn basics first. When you become adequate that's when a Tiger Woods can step in and help you because you have a base to work off of. Minor tweaks, that kind of stuff. But the point is when you start from zero you can't afford to be picky. Accept lessons from whoever is willing to give them to you. The fact that ppl care at all to even respond to your questions should make you feel appreciative.

I know Franco will chide me for insinuating high level experts can't help Altair. But that's not the point. Point is it's faulty logic to assume only experts can offer any useful advice. That's simply not true. Everyone has something to offer.

 

[Raqimus]

Everyone has something to offer.

Agreed

 

[Indian Race Troll (IRT)]

There is so much I can say about how Estate overreacted to this entire thread, this coming from a guy that has complimented him and thanked him on one of his own threads before but for now I will keep my opinions to myself. I am also a believer in credibility, why should I take advice from an inexperienced guy or someone that has had no success in the game? You're sitting at home watching porn rather than fucking girls for a reason, because you suck with women so why should you have any business giving a person advice?

As for why everyone, specifically the OP, should listen to my advice, it's quite simple. I have had those same feelings towards blonde women that OP has had and I ended up getting to the point where I was having sex with them. Throughout my life I have felt that pain of having immigrant parents that won't let you explore the social and sexual world, I know what Asian, Indian, and Arab boys raised in the USA go through. It is that very upbringing which creates the neurotic and sexless guys that run to scammer PUAs for help on their dating life only to come out as sexless losers. So a guy like me understands a guy like the OP because I have been through that same shit and come out better for it in the end.

Will my advice help a white guy? Probably not that much. If there is one thing I can do, it is share my experiences as an Indian dude who had his struggles and crawled out of the hole. My lay count is in the double digits and I have turned my life around from the very girls that hated the idea of being with me to some who want to now be with me.

It is amazing for me to see a guy I have helped doing well because that is something I can brag about. As for my advice:

1. Lift and get into bettering your looks, they matter a lot, no matter what anyone says.

2. Hang out with friends of various social circles, in your case, start hanging out with some of the more cool white guys.

3. Talk to girls everywhere and anywhere, don't go all PUA cold approachy on them but just make small talk. Get used to chatting them up and having a casual conversation with them outside of the bars.

4. Now is the time, live in the fucking moment. Forget about what happened a year ago or even months ago, live in the moment right now. Let go of your past, just do it. Like how athletes get over a bad play, you need to get over a bad past, it is how you win this shit. All of that shit your parents told you growing up or the shit racist guys said to you, it is shit and nothing else. Flush it down the toilet of your mind.

5. Remember that virginity can be lost at any time (after reading your FR which I will comment on). There is no set time or any shit like that you have to do. Losers get laid, morons get laid, shy guys get laid, and guys in the right place at the right time get laid. People call it "getting lucky" for a reason, because luck has a big say in it. Guys uglier, less charming, and having a lot less going for them in life have lost their virginity, you are not lesser for being one. Virginity can be lost at any given time, be open to it and react when the time comes.

6. Love the process. Love it when you have a hot blonde smile at you but learn to love it when she is being a total bitch as well, just fall in love with the process.

7. The anger and hatred you have towards these hot blondes, it is natural for any guy that has a rough time with them. Find that perfect medium, do not hate them entirely but don't pedestalize them either. You cannot control how you feel towards them but always remember, you come first they come second. If she rejects you, tell yourself that it is because she doesn't know what's the best for her and move on. I have often done this shit only to have a girl that initially rejected me come back to me again later on in the night.

8. Go out like you are about to meet the love of your life. Dress your best, get good sleep, lift, look your best, and put the best version of yourself out there whenever you leave your house. You never know, the next time go to a fast food joint or any random place, that hot girl can be there with you being the only guy in the room who is available to her.

 

[Estate]

I don't even know why I need to justify myself here but anyway....

Yup, Oh Pry, I did post a thanks or congratulations or whatever about a week ago. The OP wrote a post which sounded like he was getting over some issues he's addressed a lot here and seemed to have a better mindset, i was happy to see. I don't see why that's bad. I was glad to see his change.

Fast forward a week and he's back to square one, everyone is racist, all excuses, everyone is against him, etc, etc.

For the record, I didn't ask for the other thread to be deleted. I asked of it could be closed. It's 4 pages of the same debate over and over. Nothing new is being said, so hoping that would promote other topics getting more attention for the betterment of us all.

As far as all the comments about "neckbearded sex less virgins". I don't know if that was pointed at me or the forum in general but it's a hell of a way to try to get what you want.

Would you speak to your boss, a teacher, a professor, a co-worker, or anyone in real life? DEMAND they prove credentials before they have the privilege the spend their own valuable time helping you? I doubt you'd have the balls.

But the OP hasn't stepped down, even in reply here he's firm that he has every right to speak this way and the we'll still try help him. Notice how the more seasoned vets of this forum have not posted further help on this thread because quite frankly they are insulted and done with this. Those who've aligned with OP gave him the pat on the back he needs but that's about it. Right now, he's acting like an entitled jerk, nobody with any experience likes how he's spoken to them nor do they want to help him any longer.

The thing that rings out though is not race or anything else. It's OPs general attitude. He's talking down to those who know a little more than him and have worked for it. They are not obliged to take that on the chin (though one or two have been gracious enough to STILL do so). Look at his last FR. He calls the very women he wants "sluts" and talks about how he wants to "fuck them in the ass" and more. Look, I don't know about anyone else here, but I always thought guys here appreciated and loved women. His attitude sucks and he is argumentative with the very people he wants to like him, i.e. the guys here, or these women he obsessed over. That's not seeing the woods from the trees. The reason he's a virgin is his attitude.

As for the whole race and culture thing. I give up. You have your challenges, no doubt. But your using it as an excuse not to try.(Read his last FR, there was no trying, he walked around town, got drunk, and took no action, one girl told him go to another bar and he got up and left, haha, really?) I mean, it MIGHT be worth considering that to me, I'm ACTUALLY FOREIGN and from a DIFFERENT CULTURE. To me, you guys have it easy. You're already American! You ARE from the very country and culture you're trying to fit in to.

But the point is. To you, I'm white and privileged. But also despite going on at length that that entitles me to a free pass to pussy, you also called me a neck bearded keyboard jockey virgin. So which is it? Hmm?

Maybe, just maybe, while we have different backgrounds there MIGHT actually be a similar underlying problem we've both struggled with trying to assimilate into the same culture you guys talk about. But not to you, to you I'm white and privileged. Never had a bad day in my life, never had a problem, never needed help, had everything handed to me on a plate. It's insulting. Man, I've been here a while. I've had LOTS of stumbling blocks, problems, things I needed help with but you know, it eventually worked out pretty well, not without some pain and frustration alpine the way. But OP is a special snowflake who nobody can understand because NOBODY has had it as hard as him, ever. Really?

Hey, if it makes you happier to call me that neckbearded sex less virgin or whatever, go ahead, people in glass houses, etc... I don't need a dick measuring contest here. I'm quite happy in my life these days thanks in big part to the guys here. Want to proof, come hang with me. I don't personally love writing personal details in FRs but if that knocks my credibility then, sure, I don't care.

But hey, I mean, if you don't want my advice, don't take it. No worries. I mean, I've never given OP very specific advice. It was mainly, stop calling everyone racist, stop making excuses, stop using horrible language towards to women you want, treat them with a bit more respect and regardless of anything else you might see some of that good karma come back your way. That's not even PUA crap. That's good life advice. But anyway... I'll leave you all back to your discussion on neckbeards and sluts.

 

[Aquila]

If you've read OP's other threads since months ago, you would have noticed that it's the same thing over and over again, all the information that he requires has already been given, yet he refuses to take them, he just wants people to tell him what he wants to listen, so he can wallow in self pity.

Judging from the way he posts, OP seems to lack social calibration, perhaps he should work on being a socially friendly person before thinking about the blondes he's dreaming about. Hot blondes like that can smell his social awkwardness from miles away.

Of course, there's no need to take this advice. I have no credentials to prove whatsoever.

 

[Indian Race Troll (IRT)]

Estate, I do not recall anyone specifically calling you a neckbeard, he simply made the point that forums in general are loaded with guys who are so willing to give the world advice about women and dating while they have not had much success themselves. The whole neckbeard thing, he used as an example to make the point that he wants to know more about the people giving him advice. Credibility is everything, who would you rather have helping you get in shape, a fat guy or a fit guy with shredded abs? The problem is that the title of OP's post came off as very disrespectful which led to some backlash but outside of that, I don't really see what is wrong with the thread itself.

I never wanted to point this out but Estate, I think at times you are better off just staying out of things and admitting that you just don't get it. A while back I remember an argument involving you about college life in the USA. You had no fucking idea of what Greek Life was yet here you were attempting to sound like a figure of authority, it made you look stupid. If you have no idea of something, back off and don't voice your opinion on it.

You're white and foreign, well that's actually a great thing to most American women, they love those British, Aussie, and even Irish/Scottish accents. Are you guaranteed to drown in pussy? Hell no but the fact is that you're in a much better position than some guy who looks Indian or Arabic and has a lot of negative stereotypes going against him. I am not even going to make this thread about that but the fact is that you just don't get it and you never will, and THAT's OKAY but at least don't give advice if you don't have much relevant experience.


I still don't know your station in life but I know enough to the point that you might have a short temper which puts you in a bad situation to give OP advice.

As far as I see, this thread was poorly worded but OP is:

1. Actually going out and writing FRs rather than whining.
2. Actually approaching girls.
3. Actually asking for help on what he could have done differently.

Everyone is still attacking him despite him doing all of that, how does a guy who has taken the initiative to go out alone and make his own luck even carry on when people on here are even attacking him after all of the effort?

Indian, Muslim, and Arab men are raised in ways that have their strict parents stunt their social growth and harshly discipline them, it can hurt your social and love life. I have been through it myself, it is not an easy road to recovery.

 

[Estate]

Alright guys. You win. Whatever you say.

 

[Franco]

This thread is being locked.

Altair,

Regardless of how you feel about the way some of these people have attempted to address your issues, the fact of the matter is that you still have plenty of advice given that you have yet to test. You can choose to ignore some people's advice if that person doesn't sit right with you, but I know there are plenty of people who have contributed here that you like to listen to, so I would attempt to take their advice before you try anything else.

Make sure to spend ample time testing each person's advice you've been given. There should be at least 5 to 10 Field Reports from you attempting to use one person's advice before you move on to the next. If it feels like it's not working after that, move on to the next person's advice.

You are more than welcome to not take the advice of specific people here if you do not want to, but make sure you are taking the advice of the people you do want to take it from, and spend your extra time writing field reports rather than explaining to those other people why you don't like their advice.

- Franco