Am I still being a coward or is this the right thing to do

[BigPapa]

From experience , this does not mean anything at all .

if you are at least somehow sure that she indeed auto rejected , and is not only in your head , you should back off a little and try to game her once school starts and can talk with her face 2 face . Then you will know for sure .

I agree with the other guys said , that is a good step forward that you took the balls in your hand and did something about it , though I would not have asked her directly to meet , until some rapport Was there

 

[Lossanzo]

Alright, I think it's time to wrap this thread up.

I directly asked her if she really had a boyfriend this morning. I know that I should probably have made more conversation/rapport but I wasn't confident in my abilities to make that conversation that much more interesting than what it already was. And I don't feel like sending texts to this girl while she's getting fucked by some dude.

Ana:
- I really have a boyfriend!!

This was the answer I was looking for to end this. I think having made more conversation with her would've been a waste of time.

To my mind:
- She was interested in me in October/November 2019.
- I didn't take action so she auto-rejects.
- Gets boyfriend by the end of 2019.
- Forgets every attraction she had for me.
- Group work I had with her march 2020 she was already indifferent towards me.
- And now is the same.

The main lesson I take from this is that I have to have the guts to approach the girls I like rushlessly the moment I think they might be interested in me if I want to have a chance with them. I didn't take action, some other dude did, he gets the girl. Good for him.

 

[BigPapa]

The lessons learned are really good , and for sure they will help you out in the future . Good one

in regards to the itself situation , even though you will think that I am a dick , I have to tell you that you are auto rejecting yourself .

her reply was quite warm , and from the back and forth , I think that she has an idea who you are , just that she does not want to admit it .

if she has a boyfriend what ? Field experience tell us that girls with boyfriends are easier to game , than those who do not , because well , you do not have the same amount of competition . So on your end this is just a silly excuse .

try to game her when you can face 2 face , while also gaming other girls , and you might be amazed on the outcome

Best of luck !

 

[Lossanzo]

The lessons learned are really good , and for sure they will help you out in the future . Good one

in regards to the itself situation , even though you will think that I am a dick , I have to tell you that you are auto rejecting yourself .

her reply was quite warm , and from the back and forth , I think that she has an idea who you are , just that she does not want to admit it .

if she has a boyfriend what ? Field experience tell us that girls with boyfriends are easier to game , than those who do not , because well , you do not have the same amount of competition . So on your end this is just a silly excuse .

try to game her when you can face 2 face , while also gaming other girls , and you might be amazed on the outcome

Best of luck !

The problem is that I cannot meet her at the university anytime soon, maybe ever. As I said in a previous post, my class is split in 2. One group has classes at the university and the other online. Every week the groups swap places. She's on the other group so she's not at the university while I'm there. That's why I pushed for a meet up through texting. My class would only be together again whenever the pandemic ends, so the earliest I'd meet her would be September 2021, if it's safe by then to put 30-40 people in a classroom, which I'm not sure.

In relation to your previous post, I don't know if she was on auto-rejection or not. I didn't talk to her at that time. I think she was, at least for a time. She went from initiating eye contact so that I would "notice" her to actively avoiding me. In fact, if I remember correctly, I only got some certainty that she had been interested in me when she started avoiding me, because she was hurt that I didn't reciprocate.

For example, it was probably mid November 2019, we were in a class and I was sitting directly behind her. There was a paper going around class to people to sign so that the school would know who was in class and who was not. The paper was on her. I hadn't sign it yet. Everyone in her row had already signed. The person that would make the most sense in a "law of least effort" way her giving the paper to would be me. What does she do? She very briefly looks at me, notices that I'm there, looks away really fast, stands up from her chair and goes to give the paper to the other guy sitting much further away.

I don't know if this was auto-rejection or not, but she seemed to have a problem with me at that time. And this wasn't the only thing that I noticed. Her whole body language whenever I was close was just uncomfortable. I could "smell" something was wrong. I was at the time trying to open her, but she seemed to try, consciously or unconsciously, make things difficult.

I do think that me thinking that she was in auto-rejection after 2019 Christmas school break was just in my head. I think she got over me by that time. Probably that's when she had gotten her boyfriend too.

Anyway, I'll just leave here the rest of the conversation I had with her through texting. I'll put the times too.

Ana:
(00:04) (quotes me:"You seem to be a studious girl :smile:") And I happen to be ahahah
(00:04) I now spent all day doing the marketing work :sleepy_face:
(00:04) I'm tired of it
(00:04) (quotes me:"Are you enjoying the management course?") Yes I am! And you?
Lossanzo:
(10:37) (I quote her"And I happen to be ahahah") And I highly approve that
(10:37) By the way
(10:38) Is it true about what you said about having a boyfriend?
(10:38) You could have said that because you didn't know who you were talking to or that I was too direct
Ana:
(11:04) I really have a boyfriend!!
Lossanzo:
(11:28) Okay understood
Ana:
(19:24) Maybe you know him!
Lossanzo:
(21:23) Maybe

Not sure why she texted me that maybe I know her boyfriend. Maybe she wants to soften the blow to telling me that she really has a boyfriend, or that isn't sure that I believe her that she really has a boyfriend or she just wants to keep texting me and that's what came to her mind or whatever else.

That also tells me that he probably is from our university and that is one year senior because I told her that I repeated the 1st year. Either way, I don't want to talk with her about her boyfriend. I don't think that will send her any more messages to be honest. I stated my intentions to meet up with her and she rejected them. And I don't want to be her texting buddy.

 

[BigPapa]

I do not know why you are so stubborn in shooting yourself in the foot all the time .

let”s try to put yourself in her shoes .

you give a lot of approach invitations to a guy , but he does not reciprocate anything . You think that he thinks that you are ugly , so you become cold towards him .

then out of nowhere , this guy approaches you online and asks your directly to go out . You brush him off easily by saying that you have a bf but still very warm towards him , because most likely you want to know him better before you decide if you will go out with him or just tell him to go fuck himself .

so what the guy does ? He asked if you were serious about having a bf


What the girl understands from all this interaction ? Most likely she thinks that you think that she is not good looking enough to have a bf , and most likely you are talking to her only because you think she is desparetate to find someone to sleep with her .

chill down if you want to have even a remotely shot with her . You waited 1 year to talk with her , where are you rushing now with this crazy speed ?

 

[Lossanzo]

I do not know why you are so stubborn in shooting yourself in the foot all the time .

let”s try to put yourself in her shoes .

you give a lot of approach invitations to a guy , but he does not reciprocate anything . You think that he thinks that you are ugly , so you become cold towards him .

then out of nowhere , this guy approaches you online and asks your directly to go out . You brush him off easily by saying that you have a bf but still very warm towards him , because most likely you want to know him better before you decide if you will go out with him or just tell him to go fuck himself .

so what the guy does ? He asked if you were serious about having a bf


What the girl understands from all this interaction ? Most likely she thinks that you think that she is not good looking enough to have a bf , and most likely you are talking to her only because you think she is desparetate to find someone to sleep with her .

chill down if you want to have even a remotely shot with her . You waited 1 year to talk with her , where are you rushing now with this crazy speed ?

I see. Thank you for this post.

I think the reason is that I'm being too emotional about this. And wanted to "be done with it". I spent a whole year thinking about this girl, about how amazing she is, how I fucked it up, how I didn't show any sign of approval to her, yet what I actually think is that she is the cutest and sweetest thing I've seen in a very long time. This was no chick to just get some pussy, improve my skills and move on. I actually thought this could be the mother of my children type thing.

So I can't control myself. I have no calibration. I am too emotional and wanted it to end. It felt like every time I was writing her a response I had my heart jumping out of my mouth. In a way I was weak again because I was going the quickest route to solve this. Doing it quick instead of doing it right. Couple that with the whole idea of mainly using texting to set up logistics I read in some GC articles, instead of listening the advice given here and make more conversation first, made me do what I did. The situation referenced in those articles is different anyway. Here I am trying to connect for the first time with this girl. In those articles you already have that established.

The thing that bothered me the most in your post was that there is a possibility that I am hurting her. Again. This was NOT my intention, at all. Double that with the fact that she is being so warm with me with her texting. If that's the case, hopefully I can engage her again in a conversation. I do not want to hurt this girl again. She has done nothing wrong.

I guess that I overreacted to whole boyfriend thing too. I guess the whole thing of "I'm not going to text her because she's with her boyfriend" is me trying to protect my ego again. It would make me "inferior" to her boyfriend somehow. Here I am just getting warm texts from her while some other dude is having sex with her. I need to get over it.

So my current plan is to start a conversation with her again. I regret derailing the conversation I had going with her with the boyfriend question, but what's done is done. It doesn't matter if I get her or not. I don't want her to think that I don't value her. Even though my texts may suggest otherwise.

 

[BigPapa]

Well mate , if you want to go on the shortcut , then go straight to the problem , not act like a pshiho

rather than asking her about if she has a bf for real or not , just go on and tell her , that you feel super bad and awkward for not being warm towards her at school when she was super warm towards you , and that you felt afterwards that she is super cold towards you , and you feel super bad for this , as this was not your intention .

then you tell her that you were going through the motions , as you just came from a really bad breakup and that this affected you then , and did not feel like socializing for a while with anyone , as this is your way with dealing with problems .

and you wanted to say this to her face , but due to this virus thing , you can not do it , so unfortunelly this is the only place where You could talk with her .

then you say , can we start all over again ? , and continue with “hey you , my name is X , what is yours ? “ with a grin laughing emoticon

 

[Lossanzo]

Well mate , if you want to go on the shortcut , then go straight to the problem , not act like a pshiho

rather than asking her about if she has a bf for real or not , just go on and tell her , that you feel super bad and awkward for not being warm towards her at school when she was super warm towards you , and that you felt afterwards that she is super cold towards you , and you feel super bad for this , as this was not your intention .

then you tell her that you were going through the motions , as you just came from a really bad breakup and that this affected you then , and did not feel like socializing for a while with anyone , as this is your way with dealing with problems .

and you wanted to say this to her face , but due to this virus thing , you can not do it , so unfortunelly this is the only place where You could talk with her .

then you say , can we start all over again ? , and continue with “hey you , my name is X , what is yours ? “ with a grin laughing emoticon

I asked her for notes and she's still fucking warm. Is this just a farce and she's hurt or she took my comments like nothing happened?

I took this idea from this post from Chase:

Openers - "Hey, I need your help with something... you mind giving me an assist?"

I don't just use this as an opener, but it can be great for that too. This is a surprisingly high percentage opener you can use for all kinds of situations. The psychological basis behind it is that people do not like to say no to requests for help (it makes them look anti-social). There is...

www.skilledseducer.com

Lossanzo:
(12:38) Ana
(12:38) I need your help with something
(12:38) Could you give me an assist?
Ana:
(13:50) Say it!
Lossanzo:
(14:01) I didn't attend the statistics class today
(14:01) Would you mind to send me a photo with the notes you took from that class?
Ana:
(14:27) Sure!
(14:27) Give me a minute
(14:29) [Sends photos]

She seems the same as ever. My plan was she gives me (or don't) her notes and then I give her something like this message:

Lossanzo:
- Thank you
- Another thing
- I don't know how you interpreted me when I asked you if you really had a boyfriend
- I don't want you to think that I have a problem with that or that I doubt what you said is true
- I suppose I just wish you were still single
- And to be honest I would have prefered to have spoken to you in person and earlier but I can't change the past
- You are a fun and intelligent girl and I enjoyed talking to you here
- Friends?

And this is from this article from Chase again

Tactics Tuesdays: How to Turn Around a Girl in Auto-Rejection

A girl who’s in auto-rejection gets cold and snubs you. To turn it around and effect a recovery, you must use this 4-step formula. This is a firefighting post. I say that because if you do things right you won’t have to fix anything. But we all make mistakes. On my article about screening girls...

www.girlschase.com

But now I'm having second thoughts. This seems overkill when she is still complying. I think i'll just make a bit of conversation with her to see what's up with her.

 

[BigPapa]

If you want to be friend zoned sure , your plan is the shortcut towards that direction

those kind of things are intended to be used when you do something that really pisses her off , like making too much fun of her or whatever , not for your kind of situation .

the only way to have a chance is either to wait and game her at school , either to send a text like I explained you above .

the text explained above is not really what people will advise you to do , because it is playing more the Russian roulette than seducing girls , but I think that in your situation is the only thing that you can do to move on .

if I were you I would try it , you might get lucky

 

[Lossanzo]

If you want to be friend zoned sure , your plan is the shortcut towards that direction

those kind of things are intended to be used when you do something that really pisses her off , like making too much fun of her or whatever , not for your kind of situation .

the only way to have a chance is either to wait and game her at school , either to send a text like I explained you above .

the text explained above is not really what people will advise you to do , because it is playing more the Russian roulette than seducing girls , but I think that in your situation is the only thing that you can do to move on .

if I were you I would try it , you might get lucky

Too late! I'm friend zoned.

Lossanzo:
(14:52) Thank you! :slightly_smiling_face:
(14:52) Where are you from?
(14:52) You seem to have origins outside Portugal
Ana:
(15:01)I was born in Mozambique, I have a mix of indian, mozambican and portuguese origins (note: I actually was pretty sure that she had indian origins by her looks but I didn't say anything. Maybe in the future I should be more bold with my cold reads if I have a feeling that they might be true)
Lossanzo:
(15:13) Makes sense!
(15:15) Another thing
(15:16) I don't know how you interpreted me when I asked you if you really had a boyfriend
(15:16) I don't want you to think that I have a problem with that or that I doubt what you said is true
(15:16) I suppose I just wish you were still single
(15:17) And to be honest I would have prefered to have spoken to you in person and earlier but I can't change the past
(15:17) You are a fun and intelligent girl and I enjoyed talking to you here
(15:18) Friends? :slightly_smiling_face:
Ana:
(15:19)(quotes me:"I don't know how you interpreted me when I asked you if you really had a boyfriend") I did not interpret anything :laughtingface: I am very chill. I just told you that I had a boyfriend because, at all, I don't want you to get hurt, it's better being straightforward at the beginning than letting you feel more and then hurt you at the end, right?
Lossanzo:
(15:19) Haha understood
Ana:
(15:19)(quotes me:"And to be honest I would have prefered to have spoken to you in person and earlier but I can't change the past") Ahahah maybe, do you know when you wanted to talk to me?
(15:20)(quotes me:"You are a fun and intelligent girl and I enjoyed talking to you here") Thank you!
(15:20)(quotes me:"Friends? :slightly_smiling_face: ") Sure :smiling_face_with_smiling_eyes:
Lossanzo:
(15:20)(quote her"Ahahah maybe, do you know when you wanted to talk to me?")Around in the 1st semester of last academic year
(15:21) I wasn't going through a good phase
(15:21)And the way to deal with it was not to socialize so much I suppose
Ana:
(15:22)I understand :sad_face:
(15:22) By chance at that time I was also not in a good phase :sweat_smile:
Lossanzo:
(15:22) You are better now right?
Ana:
(15:24) Yes!
(15:24) Much better
(15:24) And you?
Lossanzo:
(15:25)(quote her: "Much better") Good!
(15:25)(quote her:"And you?")Better but this covid thing is boring :sweat_smile:
Ana:
(15:27)A little, but we have to go on and adapt to the situations
(15:27)This in an instant passes
Lossanzo:
(15:28)(quote her:"A little, but we have to go on and adapt to the situations")No doubt
Ana:
(15:30)I sincerely, being more selfish, I really like being at home, so COVID doesn't bother me
Lossanzo:
(15:31)I also happen to typically like to stay at home
(15:31)But sometimes I have limits
(15:31)What do you like to do at home?
Ana
(15:32)Well, listening to music, watching series, reading, dancing... but what I do most at home is not even enjoy, is to study :face_with_tears_of_joy:
(15:32)And you?
Lossanzo:
(15:33)(quote her:"Well, listening to music, watching series, reading, dancing... but what I do most at home is not even enjoy, is to study :face_with_tears_of_joy:")What do you read?
(15:33)(quote her:"And you?")Nothing out there
(15:34)I spend too much time on Youtube :sweat_smile:
(15:34)I have also taken an online programming course
Ana:
(15:38)(quotes me:"What do you read?")Now i'm reading management and economics books: Zero to One and Rockonomics
(15:38)(quotes me:"I spend too much time on Youtube :sweat_smile:") And me who used to spend my life :laughtingface:
(15:38)(quotes me:"I have also taken an online programming course)You do well! I'm also trying at an online programming college
(15:39)But I think I will give up
Lossanzo:
(15:46)(quote her:"You do well! I'm also trying at an online programming college")I was learning at codecademy
(15:46)Search it on Google if you're interested
(15:47)(quote her:"But I think I will give up")Little time for that?
Ana:
(16:21)(quotes me:"Search it on Google if you're interested")Uuuh, thank you so much!
(16:22)(quotes me:"Little time for that?")Yes, I have to apply to enter and it is at the end of November - beginning of December
(16:22)I can't, because I have to go 40 hours a week
(16:23)Impossible if I want to study and have a life
Lossanzo:
(17:01)I see

So there it is. I really went straight to platonic zone. To be honest, I don't think I could have gone any other way through texting. I still don't have game.

In the end, I think this is for the best. I very likely won't be thinking about this girl a whole lot. The "mystery" is gone, both for me and for her. Maybe in person if I have a good vibe and be able to act a bit sexual around her, but to me at this time I don't think she has any "fascination" left for me. Likely didn't even before.

At least I won't be thinking that I hurt this girl. She knows what my deal is/was now. From me there is nothing left hiding.

 

[BigPapa]

I could lie to you , and tell you that this would have happened no matter what you would have done , but instead I will be frank with you even though you will hate me for this .

in reality you were so focused and absorbed on whining and feeling super anxious towards yourself that you shot yourself in the foot multiple times .

if you would have been focused on actually getting the girl , rather than whining , I am quite sure now that you would have had quite a high chance of turning around the girl

best of luck with the next one senor !

 

[Lossanzo]

I could lie to you , and tell you that this would have happened no matter what you would have done , but instead I will be frank with you even though you will hate me for this .

in reality you were so focused and absorbed on whining and feeling super anxious towards yourself that you shot yourself in the foot multiple times .

if you would have been focused on actually getting the girl , rather than whining , I am quite sure now that you would have had quite a high chance of turning around the girl

best of luck with the next one senor !

I see.

I don't hate you dude

I want to improve.

Can you make a quick list of bulletpoints of mistakes that I made through this whole thing?

Edit:

So let me understand your point of view on what I should have done:
- Have a better mentality. Don't get self absorbed on whining and focus on getting the girl
- Build rapport before asking her out
- Don't ask if her boyfriend is "real"
- Don't go admit your mistakes to her

 

[BigPapa]

The most important take is not to let your insecurities take control of you , otherwise you will shoot yourself in the foot

let me share with you a short story .

I was talking with this girl , and at some point she got really pissed on me because she was giving me a shitload of signs to come and talk with her , and I just ignored her because I felt like playing with her .

Then after a while , I approached her out of the sudden, and she panicked and blushed .

I tried to make some jokes so she can relax for a little bit , but for some reason she thought that I was making fun of her . Needles to say , she went very emotional and started being a bitch .

i left , because it was super difficult to talk with her with all this rollexoaster of emotions she went through .

so I added her on fb or Instagram , do not remember exactly where and started talking with her . She was still a bitch , but I was curious if I could pull something out of the whole situation .

she was super mean , and emotional and all the time she tried to show me how cool she is , trying to put me down etc . For me she was just a woman being a woman , and found her cute .

after a while , of this back and forth , after she saw that I am genuinely interested in her and did not loose my temper and was stubborn to get her , she started being girly and giggly . But it took a while till she got to that point .

to be frank I was thinking from time to time that this is not going anywhere , and that maybe she does not like me that much , but then I would just test the waters saying things like “ I know that you are bitchy , but I am sure that you are smiling all the time when I am writing you “ . She would just go very emotional when I was saying this kind of things and I knew that the game is still on .

moral of the story , always assume attraction and always lead . Women expect and want this from a guy

 

[ulrich]

It’s OK. You did good. Got out of your comfort zone and reached a new high.

There are tons of things you could have done better but the most important one would be taking the opportunity to talk her in person a long time ago.

So I would say don’t stress too much on what wasn’t perfect this time, focus on moving fast the next one.

 

[ulrich]

Iwhat I should have done:
- Have a better mentality. Don't get self absorbed on whining and focus on getting the girl
- Build rapport before asking her out
- Don't ask if her boyfriend is "real"
- Don't go admit your mistakes to her

Agree in #1 and #2.

#3 is a high risk-high reward move, it’s not good or bad, it’s just risky.
I would have waited for a high point before asking but it wasn’t terrible in my opinion.
Next time ask if her boyfriend is “serious” not “real”.

#4, most times (98%) you don’t want to admit your mistakes but there are situations where you should (heavy auto rejection). This probably wasn’t one of those.

 

[Tony D]

Is it okay if I write an article based on this? Thanks. It may not be totally relevant to you but will definitely help others.

My advice anyway, is good for you for asking her out. Even if it took too long, and it was sloppy, it's better she knows you like her and get rejected. I've asked lots of women out rather sloppily, been rejected, and then six months later they're messaging me asking ME out for coffee. Just don't get butthurt or act weird around her. Be cool, and she might start to dig you eventually. Women like this have dozens of men orbiting them and acting weird. Watch There's Something About Mary.

 

[Lossanzo]

Is it okay if I write an article based on this? Thanks. It may not be totally relevant to you but will definitely help others.

My advice anyway, is good for you for asking her out. Even if it took too long, and it was sloppy, it's better she knows you like her and get rejected. I've asked lots of women out rather sloppily, been rejected, and then six months later they're messaging me asking ME out for coffee. Just don't get butthurt or act weird around her. Be cool, and she might start to dig you eventually. Women like this have dozens of men orbiting them and acting weird. Watch There's Something About Mary.

Go ahead.

Thank you for the advice.