Can You Teach an Old Dog New Tricks?

PrancingRabbit

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
64
One More Desired Breakthrough: Listing

Listing, described below and discussed a lot on Girls Chase, is one of the areas that really puts a foil behind my uneasiness and panic or alarm state that I move into internally when I am diliberating on, contemplating or in an approach due to the simple fact that it is something I simply can't do in the "alarm" mind-state and, as the last post written last night explains, I am still struggling with this sate of affairs in my practice of seduction, which for the moment is confined to visualizations and nerveous glances toward attractive younger women in public spaces.

Listing is a very "simpatico" tool with NVC (nonviolent communication, mentioned several times above), something I've noticed a "natural" I'm friends with, a married guy, use to put people at ease in just about every situation imaginable. He's a pastor and chaplin, and people are always opening up to him about their lives and spiritual practices, myself included, and he almost never gives a direct response, and usually seems to elide the topic the sharer adresses completely, which I find fascinating. It's a facet of his personality that creates allure, as well as something I found empowerment through exposure to many years ago after getting out of a cult. (Yep, a new facit of my story emerges...) I think it is almost identical to reflective listening in effect, though with more of a self-preservative (ego-wise) characteristic. Which of course makes sense in seduction. Listing enables people to draw random ideas out of the ether, as it were, and posit them as truths existing between two or more individuals. Getting serious dejavu, haver I written that before here?

And listing is non-threatening due to softening anything offensive by virtue of being in a list. What I noticed with my friend is that he has an uncanny ability to draw random things from his mind and make them seem connected to what is happening. I believe for him, they are, and that for him everything is essentially connected, making him a truly gifted individual indeed. One example of this is his response to a request he intends to deny. He does not answer directly but no one ever asks him to, and feels as if their need to be seen, at least, is met-- something I have almost no idea how to do as someone seeking intense connection above all else, among other traits that sideline other less confrontational features of my personality-- and they feel no rejection except in a paripheral, indirect, much-softened way. I am positive he is listing, and I am positive he derives satisfaction on a primal level through applying it.

In seduction, listing has been shared as a way to essentially hypnotise, and is applied, in my recollection, in the lead up to the "pull" phase. List thins to do together, list things you enjoy, things you have, features of your logistics, things you like about her, ways you know to be discreat, past experiences... Always list rather than stating one thing such as, "Let's go to my place so that I can molest you some." As I say, I am not finding this to be easy or even possible to pull off, even though I have good examples of "listers" in my life and a decent enough understanding of how to apply the practice in a variety of situations; and I seem to be encountering a barrier to accessing any lists, or list items, in the form of a psychic alarm-state contemplating approach triggers inside me.

What the Alarm State, the outermost circle in a representation of the psyche consisting of three concentric circles, Safety and Challenge, respectively, being the inner two in-to-out, consists of precisely and all-inclusively, is almost entirely unknown to me. I have a working theory, however, that it consists of a sort of myopia entailing an interplay between unresolved emotional experiences (emotions), and thoughts about the past, present or future. My working theory has it that thoughts about the past have the strongest emotional impact on me and other types of thoughts are derived from the same. Interrupting this process, whatever it is, i.e., whatever the interplay just described consists of, can't be done directly, I am at this time convinced.

I do have two indirect "fixes" to share at this time, however. One is actually a little mini-breakthrough on the topic at hand, listing, I just had while walking to and from the bathroom to relieve my a) bladder; b) bowels; or c) both bladder and bowels in the public facility at which I am stationed for the day. I started listing all the people I knew to be present in the building in a wrote, pithy manner. "Woman over there, middle aged, mousy; dude downstairs, the janetor, probablby standing around; et al." The result was an expansion of my awareness to include consideration of the non-sexual, i.e., making non-seduction-based thought processes accessable where non-seduction-based content in the environment appear. The list I created got me outside of the seduction pattern nexus, e.g., outside the pretty girl camped out a few feet from where I am; the other several biddies I've seen here today; and also the ugly chich I keep disqualifying sitting near me as well. It's not that the emphasis of every thought is not on my ego-drive-for-sex as a result, but that another, Nuetral category is opened up in my psyche and remains open for as long as its impression or channel within my mind remains open in the present moment. As such I am not faking disinterest in, absence of repulsion, envy, hated, etc., regarding whomever based on the myopic apprehensions and drives of my Seducer Drive, but constructively and consciously defining my attention to include what other parts of me see, feel, do in addition to it. The mind is evaluating and interacting with something broader and, perhaps, more attractive to an outside viewer than "drive-to-sex," due to the fact that the drive is corrupted by emotional bagage of the past, in my case, and unable to regulate itself. In other words, listing has kept open the channels of regulation, enabled me to access a variety of emotional modalities beyond the one presently scarred by past trauma, humiliation, etc., and knowledgeable of things constituting facets of opproach such as sexual prizing, social frame, etc., it is not particularly adroit in. Listing to list; how meta.

Fix two is more of an ongoing practice of "mindfulness" with regards to emotions. There are times when this is a survival tactic, times when it seems impossible due to psychic enertia, and times when I've been doing it just to get the practice moments in. The practice is providing some insights I don't feel like going into here much. Suffice it to say that I think an evening out of my emotional wavelenght, connecting from the moment of birth an infinite numer of lifetimes ago to the moment of death in adfinitum lifetimes in the future, will help in approach and elsewhere in life, and seems to be happening.

More on these themes to come, I hope.

Peace out.
 
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PrancingRabbit

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
64
Depression Follows Me Wherever I Go-- For Now

I could have the insight of insights on Tuesday but on Wednesday I will be depressed again. The second clause of this sentence applies to these propositions as well:
I could...
bang the hottest chick I see on Tuesday
fuck four girls on Tuesday
approach ten women on Tuesday

Complete the phrases above please. ...I am looking for the insight that will deliver me from my Wednesday fate, and it isn't proving to be easy. I get thoughts such as, Why did I have to choose seduction as my primary life pursuit? Why did I have to have all of those spiritual revelations beginning in my early twenties, which tint reality for a time, but make the rest of existence seem "black and white"? Why did my dad stop helping me achieve my dream of professional athletics and otherwise abandon my to my mom all those many years ago now?

Why am I such a Narcissist? Why am I borderline schizophrenic? Why am I so worried about what other people think about me? Why can't I just let go, allow vulnerability, openness, inspiration in every waking moment?

Why, then again, all the black and white thinking? Why make extremes out of every moment? "I have it all figured out." No, I don't; I will not figure it out for another thirty years. "I am ready to approach." No, I am not; last night's performance at Christmas dinner proved to me that it is not smooth sailing here-on-out.

I got back to my apartment last night thinking the just-mentioned performance proves the just-stated postulate. I was despondent for a few hours, then I snapped out of it. I was able to think about the breakthroughs of the past month. They are legion. They are not meaningless. I am, furthermore, not the center of the universe, and I am not being evaluated in God's ledger as I binge on whole milk. At least, it doesn't help any to think about the ledger every moment of every day. A bad coach commits himself to criticism of a promising prospect more than praise. I had nothing but bad coaches growing up. I internalized the negativity. The negativity is a process curtailed only by another process, namely positivity.

But before I recentered and went to sleep last night, I milled around the apartment for a bit, found my way onto internet porn, and then binged on HBO-Go for three hours while housing a family size bag of blue chips, can of pears in pear juice, and half a pound of dark chocolate covered almonds. The negative thoughts were relentless. I am binge eating sugar and smoking cigarettes and pot again. I will contract lung cancer, diabetes or both any moment, and I can't save money if I consume like this. Dinner tonight was a flop. I'm going to die early and alone having never made anything of myself.

Last night I was dropped off at my apartment by a couple who came over to my parents for the dinner. The ride home consisted of me making garbage statements about how my parents "buy a lot of gifts at Christmas." What the fuck was I talking about? Then again, why should I be so hard on myself ? Because in three years I'm going to be too hideous to approach anyone, and time is of the essence, that's why. Will surely feel better about all this after five hours of internet consumption.

There was something on top of the impending diabetes and ugliness and the soreness in my right arm and my back resulting from prolonged use of my left arm for masturbation-- hours and hours and hours nearly every day since I was 13 years young ("But I can't stop")-- on top of the usual, in other words, last night. I was also realing from an increased and now-constant perception that my parents have given up on my ever being anything, making anything of myself. I sense that I am dead to them, even though they continue to pay my rent and invite me over for holidays and welcome me at the house otherwise.

As I binged on porn and crackers, though they were relentless, I worked through all these and many, many other negative thoughts, constructing realistic, authentic antidotes to each. I have left them hanging with the garden project; I didn't bother saving money and buying them Christmas gifts; I got high Wednesday and ignored my moms for a full three days latter part of the week as a result: in other words, there are reasons we are emotionally cut-off that are of my own making, and I can identify means of ammending this.

Have had these thoughts a zillion occossions and drowned them all in my addictions every single time. "This year will be no different."

No it won't, partner!

Reflections of parental derision toward self weigh heavily on me. The forms it takes are so convoluded, almost impossible to detect. Sometimes, my moms has a way she can dismiss me after I've push her buttons and she's twisted herself into a know, dismissal which is a relatively new phenomenon. She is emotionally engaged-- until she's not, anymore. She has given up on me, on herself, or has given up on both. Whichever, it's all so depressing, all so horrible. The family isn't mine anymore. I am an emotional pariah, destined to reincarnate alone unless I'm destined to cease existing except for in the state of hell I've created-- meticulously and devotedly produced over many, many years of ill-advised toil and pursuit of distractions, I have. When I woke up this morning, I had an insight.

The background: my moms gave me all of herself-- too much of herself, perhaps. I am an only child, the center of attention always, and often a foil for the conflict held between my mom and my father, or else the object of contention. Moms is a woman who has rejected many of the trappings of her identity while living others out; and in front of me and through me, despite me, as it were, this tension played out-- always, always invisible to me. Whatever she does, she does most intensely with me. Only child or not, I am her best audience member. My dad, I finally see, is detatched and disinterested in me, and has been since we stopped going to the park to kick around the soccer ball or toss the baseball and he had something to teach me. When I stopped listening to him, in other words. That was a long time ago, and all these years he has welcomed me like a half-breed suiter of his wife. Who for her part, insists on performing the ritual of devoted mother/affectionate son day in and day out for the last 41 years. In sum, with Mom, I am sychophant; with Mom, Dad is husband. With Dad, I am intruder.

Obviously, there have been long periods of separation, me outside the house, the state, or the country. I go weeks without calling or writing, even months. Then when I come back Mom and I are this duo-- benign to my dad, rapturous and intense in zeal with Mom and me. Before long, we will all croak and Moms and I can eliminate Dad in the reincarnation shuffle, finding another, more suitable Third Wheel. Thank goodness when I am gone, they are perfect, my dads being a powerful, intelligent and extremely funny and intense man in his own right. I have no idea what he gets out of this dynamic Mom and I have, but it doesn't have to be anything if he is as withdrawn as I have finally come to realize he must be.

How do you cope with this type of situation? Withdrawn father shells out every month for years and years (well mom earned more); overzealous mom hones in on secondary male entanglement whenever it's around, otherwise surrounds self with gay or otherwise emasculated men? The answer is obviously in the riddle itself as it's been laid out herein. To wit, I do not have to overcome anything, addictions or otherwise, to "get right" with myself. I am not the boy-toy of my mom. She is withdrawing because I am seeing through all of this, and am therefore no longer availabble to be manipulated through her ego-manifestation of self-hood upon mine, not because she has given up on me.

That's the answer, folks. I can go on indulging in porn and binge eating and other addictions as long as I wander the earth, never overcoming a single impulse from this day forward, and it will have no bearing on my parents. My parents, who entagle themselves in their own egos in their own ways-- ways they don't care to share with me and probably never will, though at times they reveal things I should not see. My dad's disinterest in me, for instance. Losing out on connection with them through authentic self, in any case, which is hidden beneath a pile of addictions so high it will never see the light of day, and therefore an unattainable goal, is no different from losing out on connection through achievement of the material and therefore fleeting, ephermoral variety. Each has its upside; each has a glaring pitfall self-evidently situated within. My dad stopped caring when I stopped listening and my moms stopped engaging when I stopped being "suiter number two." Or three, or five hundred-- who knows? (She's popular, not a whore, ok folks?)

That's the answer holding my head above water, but what is the insight that will get me to shore? The insight is that I don't have to do to others what my moms unconsciously does to me and everyone else who will allow her to. This breakthrough awareness is the product of many months of assertiveness victories at home, comprising a tenuous at first, now more solid and permenant-seeming dam between the low-grounds of my personhood and the pressing waters of my mom's personality, high above. The damn stably in place, though, for better or worse, I am utterly alone, fed not and poisoned not by Mom's personality. Alone, again-- so alone-feeling! But I'm not just binging through life as a complacent spectral visage to all around me. I can figure it out. I can work through the insanity of my mom's conditioning, communicated to my personality, in the fashion I describe above, and leave her alone. She and I can communicate over the damn, and this is the way it has to be and should be. If I can leave my mom alone while she rages like a white-water rapid up above, I can leave anyone alone. Should I go out and practice seduction now or what?

A friend stopped by on his way out of town this afternoon, got me out of bed, and then we went to a head shop and bought some tobacco, and he dropped me off at the mall. Here I sit, in a department store foodcourt, typing up this journal entry. I, or this man-- who stands up for himself, who is not as easily manipulated and who, when manipulated, recovers swiftly or hides it altogether. He, who above all else leaves other people alone and does not fuck with them for his own pleasure and fulfillment, consciously, has engaged with two people verbally and another six-to-ten individuals through body language, since arrival at this two-person table. Each person has felt neutral or positive toward him (unless they are psychopaths); no one has felt judged, dismissed or accosted by him. At the end of the verbal interactions, both persons interacted with recieved a smile and a nod authentically derived from a sense of self-acceptance and contentedness with the present moment, and with no strings attached. The women at the food court were curious about him at first and remained so, and the men wanted him to notice the women they were with. All because of how he or I, sit here, openly, queitly and confidently.

The present moment is a total dumpster fire of a life for me. That's no excuse not to approach. Didn't happen so far today or all month or all of 2022 for that matter, but let's see what happens in January.
 
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PrancingRabbit

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
64
More Needed Breakthroughs

It seems to me, at this point, that seduction is a very, very, profound thing to be able to do, constructively and consciously, but that, as implied in the first clause of this sentence, it is in fact quite spiritual. Those who seduce when and how they like are doing something in between the place thought occurs, thought being a bucket of water on a ferris wheel that unloads when it reaches the bottom or end of each turn of the wheel. To be seduced, one must feel something, and the feeling must be detatched from the buckets of water coming down into the place where the feeling must occur. Furthermore, since this feeling is produced in most people without volition and without another person's ever intending to conjur this feeling-- feeling and instinct, which is an intuitive urge, actually-- when we are talking about conjuring intentionally feeling and urges of a romantic or sexual nature, we are high-level indeed.

It's sales, though. That's why I'm beginning to think that sales is high level. Bar tenders, the sellers to many all at once, have many fundamentals in place and keep many relationships with many different types of people, all with different beliefs, fetishes and customs going at once. They manage to not offend when a compliment to one customer is a betrayal to another. They cut through all of the conditioning, moods, assumptions each customer makes, often in opposite fashion from one to the next. They must focus on people and the job of retrieving, mixing and delivering drinks and cleaning up after themselves and the customer to boot. They must be happy or seem happy.

Where does all of this get me? A few things.

One. I need to stop thinking of women as objects and potential romantic partners, and act on a higher level-- the level of service, like a bartender. I focus on my own fantasy, and it's an old one. It's high level to switch up one's views of life, to not judge the person beside oneself through a inary lense. It's hard for me because it seems as if, if I seduce someone, I am committing to allowing them to be my friend or my lover-- but that is putting the cart in front of the horse. This is a major sticking point for me, this selfishness that causes me to have tunnel vision. Tunnel vision is not allowed in bartending because it is a turn off to the customer. Bartenders need to be open and emotionally connected, with themselves and with others. Emotional connection does not involve judgment, and unless I can let go of my assumptions and pride, which causes me to steer clear of beneficial interactions, interactions where seduction is possible and desireable except to this shallow, judging part of myself, I cannot get any momentum going. I need momentum at this point. I am trying to open to the possibility.

Two. I need to stop thinking about getting laid, and start engaging on the level others are on. This is the grist of seduction. It is where the water of one's thoughts is dumped, how to get into that space between the thoughts, where the person is having them, now.

Three. I need to get over my fear of drawing attention to myself. It's counerintuitive, because I want to be a low-key seducer. But I am so paranoid that I can't imagine talking to a girl without being the center of attention. I've had improvement in this area and the sport I play, where I am able to focus on the game without ruminating over who is watching me play. A hundred people could be watching or none could, but neither will influence my play. I've played in front of paying audiences so I know. What is affected, though, is me. I feel anxious, paranoid, out of control. I am stiff and boring. I just play the game and allow no emotion to come through. This is what I feel like when I interact with people in a public setting. I'm convinced everyone is watching me. It's performative for me rather than intimate. Perhaps this connection is the beginning of a new type of focus on what I am doing, even if it's attempting to seduce somebody. Focusing on what I am doing rather than who is watching. But again, the difficulty is that I want to be the center of the universe, I equate achievement with self-worth. So, I get off on the idea of being seen hitting it out of the park, and it isn't enough for me to just perform just for the sake of performing. Need to get over myself that way.

Four. I need to come up with some material and prepare myself to use it. The two problems I have with this are sloth and performance anxiety. Luckily, I think I am getting over the fear of delivering a line and standing there with a sly, concerned, intense or whatever look on my face, and think that if I could perform the memorization of a few gambits, perhaps I would allow myself to deliver them. But since I was a little kid and the abandonment issues started to take hold, I've had a hell of a time memorizing and learning. Any wrote tasks are extremely difficult for me. I check out emotionally and have no access to my heart-- and the heart is what does the learning for me, it seems. I am sort of untangling a mess internally, and performance of learning has never seemed separate from application of learning. It's all tied up with the narcisism. That's why this is so slow going. I always feel inadequate and castrated around men using "hip lingo," but perhaps I can just learn some and see if it comes out naturally ever. I think I have to literally memorize one thing at a time. I think I should start keeping a notebook for this purpose and write down things I hear that I like. "Hip lingo" can set a sexual frame like nothing else, I am convinced.

Five. I need to get some openers. Opening is still somewhat muddy for me. I still get caught up in other thoughts about the process. That's why this seems so high level for me. The opener lays the foundation for the entire seduction. It needs to be on point, inasmuch as it can't detract from the frame one plans to set. This is high level, folks. I begin an interaction without selling myself out, throwing myself under the bus. No cheesy laughter, no obsequiesce head-bobbing, no turning away too soon, no over-sharing or over-asking. This requires a lot of me. I can't seem to get this one right. I get nervous, concerned she is not interested in me sexually or romantically, concerned about who else she likes or is seeing, concerned about what others will think if I break the touch barrier, concerned some one I know will see me and gossip about it. I am thinking about having to explain myself to security guards or fathers or male friends or mothers, all who don't approve. And I am thinking about ruining a woman's reputation. How would I do this? I don't know, but I project slut defense hard. And I come off as girlfriend seeking, a-romantic, or self-obsessed. I have a closed heart.

Six. I need to let go of the past. Stop thinking about my age, the whole time scarcity thing. Stop comparing myself to others. Performance anxiety and a closed heart are the results of these thought patterns. They are really difficult for me to curb.
 

PrancingRabbit

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
64
Developing A Personality

Furthermore, I had the realization just now that I should develop a personality. A personality? What is that?

A personality is a) a means for self-expression; b) giving people what they want; and c) the means whereby one can achieve small and great things in this plane of existence. Let's parse these out.

Self expression occuring through something other than a personality is a nonsensical idea. So a personality "being a means of self-expression" is tautological to a high degree. But it's not a no-brainer for anyone who has encountered a high enough level of push-back from the external world to reap traumatic experience of a high order. A high order: being booed at a middle school assembly; being hazed on the high school athletics squad; being rejected wholesale by Mom before one has had the realization that one is separate from one's mom; etc. Without a realization these events, traumas, in other words, are commonplace and not the fault of the individual garnering them, and under the direction of such traumas, especially if they have posed hardship to the forming personality of a high order. Aside from the interference of trauma in the formation and actuation of personality, we all have to implement in a world full of others who are traumatized, and whenever we express ourselves, we risk retraumatizing others. Everyone, in other words, faces adversity of one kind or another-- so traumatic experience is not an excuse but one of many types of hurdles for this type of personality, one formed through trauma, to overcome. Inversely, only through self-expression, by having a personality in other words, can one who has been formed of trauma as much or more than anything else, overcome his or her trauma. Personality is the means for self-expression and more for some, then.

Personality is a means for giving people what they want. It's impossible to know what people want, though, so there is a calculation required to apply personality appropriately toward this end. That calculation, it seems to me, is not difficult, though. It can be complex, but the complexity does not mean "difficulty." What is difficult is resolving to exhibit what one wants to exhibit, moment to moment, and on the whole. One must callibrate one's goals of self expression, however, based on this calculus above all else. That is, the application of personality must represent authentic aspects of the individual in question, and as such, cannot be overly laden with concerns about how others will be affected by theirself. That's what Holden Caulfield, the highly disturbed post-adolescent protagonist of The Catcher In The Rye fails to see, and it drives him mad. He is unwilling to come to terms with the reality of being a human in this world. Humans have to do something to represent themselves, risk injuring others, and will not know whether they have succeeded or failed until they try. I, like Holden, have been unwilling or unable to try, due to this hang-up, the hang-up that they exist and can't get around actuating somethng.

What I have realized, just now, is that, firstly, there is this fusion that can occur when one acts as one desires to act and behaves in accordance with one's primal and often unsophisticated urges, with the demands of the present moment no matter how perverse or silly (such as going to a job or interacting with "Aunt Suzie,"to list two examples), with the formulation of the most skillful means of protecting oneself from further traumatization (because you can't remain nuetral on a moving train, thank you Howard Zinn), that is wholesome and good-- good for soul of self, good for other, good for the universe perhaps. And I have realized, secondly, that how I want to act, what I want my personality to be, is varied and somewhat perverse much of the time. Well, isn't it perverse to want to meet a girl who will take off all of her clothes and masturbate in front of me and subsequently ram my cock up her asshole? Isn't it perverse to want to get into arguments for no reason? And isn't it perverse to wish to indoctrinate complete strangers with my radical and eccentric view of the world (I'm a pacifist, so don't get too concerned about my views because they all result in non-aggression)? But what is aggressive about these perverse desires can be handled only by embracing and thereby regulating them. One cannot regulate a spiggot that is completely turned off, though, can one? So I will endevor to let all of these parts of myself run through my personality, self-regulation and all. This is bound to be more fun than having no personality, in spite of the risks involved. (Thank you Holden Caulfield for the cautionary example through which I have finally come to see my fatal mistake in life: narcisism.)

What it means that personality is a means to an end, is that to get into the stream of life, to gain access to the passenger car of the train of life, the life preserver or the ticket, respective of chosen metaphor, is a personality. How the trip plays out is then also dependent upon personality. My personality has been surpressed by traumatic ghosts, but then again they are my personality. That's shitty isn't it? I have also supresssed my personality on account of being risk averse when it comes to harming others-- an aversion far outstripping its intended or appropriate application due to the events of my early childhood and subsiquent experiences involving inadvertantly injuring others. My personality has always served an avoident reflex, and overcoming that reflex is basically what this post is about.

I crave attention and connection, yet I produce emotions that require me to refrain from exhibbiting these desires, so my personality has been curtailed indeed. Perhaps the profound insight that personality is not an end in itself, but a means to something beyond, something unkown and indeed unknowable, due to the nature of our rigid placement in the here and now, which we cannot wriggle out of no matter how badly we want to or try to, but which nevertheless beckons us like the pied piper or the winning lottery number (you decide), and which I badly want to experience. Because I've been experiencing lonelyness, isolation, despair of having any life whatsoever. I mean, life has not completely caved in on me yet, though at times it could be said I've been pretty much dead to myself and everyone who knows me or considers me a friend, but it definitely has vacuum-like features.

I am not interested in having past trauma and self-doubt and self-hate dictate what is put into this vessel of a soul and what it puts into other vessels of souls. I'd rather work with what I have, and I can see that I am not doing nearly enough to make the working nature of my personality bring me control over choice in relational ends of being here. This means I am going to begin to consider applying my Shadow in everyday circumstances, make arbitrary assessments, and do with what I've got to overcome disconnect between self and other. I'm going to act deranged when I'm in public just because it's fun. I'm going to be argumentative or contrary, intentionally, and risk making enemies (rivalries?) out of at least some of the folks I encounter. And I'm going to exert will upon women I wish to seduce even though it seems counter to my femenism training and risky socially. I am going to apply this new mathematics, if for no other reason, because it is a wedge between my personality and my trauma, which wants me to remain small and has gotten me nowhere.

Summing this post up, personality is present in every choice, and logic gets applied to it by means of the elimination of every choice except that which personality goes ahead and achieves. I am hoping to be conscious of the choices I'm making as I make them, and to be constructive with regard to an accumulation of choices. I am hoping to make some big adjustments, both in the choices I make while I am alone (less porn, for one), as well as in relational situations. Concerning the latter, I hope to keep in mind that personality is the only option I have for self-expression, a means to give others, cute women included, what they want, and the vessel that contains my hopes and aspirations for getting the life I want to have.
 
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PrancingRabbit

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
64
Last Minute Insights

These may or not be breakthroughs, haven't decided yet.

I'm sitting at the public library and two freshman in college aged chicas who are camped out at the table immediately behind the one I am at are talking in hushed voices about their sex lives. This may or may not really be happening, as far as you are concerned-- but I am an honest narrator so I am telling you that it really is. I'm here working on my laptop, and I'm sitting in the spot I always sit at, every time I come to this library.

I've been here for about two hours, and I've ignored these two girls completely. I've gotten up and down from my seat a few times to use the bathroom and make a phone call. I've been texting, typing and doing research on the laptop. I've avoided eye contact and directed my gaze away from them, though I have also made a few glances in their direction. Insight one: I am not invisible to them, and they do not think they are invisible to me.

For their part, the girls have been talking about this and that, mostly inaudible to me, and doing no work that I can tell, though they have laptops and school supplies out. They disappeared for a few minutes just before I started writing this, and started talking about their sex lives when they returned to their seats. I think I've acted neutral to their presence, and am dressed well, is why they are behaving this way now-- putting off indicators of interest.

I think that I have created an alluring dimeanor based on all of the above, and the meaning of this post is to explore how to continue to maintain that while interacting with them. "I think guys [inaudable]," is what one of them just said. "Is that necessarily bad? No, I think it's just [inaudible]," is what the other just said. See, this is real, folks!

Insight two: these girls want me to approach them and have already set a sexual frame for this approach, as a result of my being well-behaved/calm and otherwise having good fundamentals. They feel comfortable.

Insight three: if I approach them, I will creep them out unless I pick up the sexual frame thier hushed conversation and continued presence-- hey, they could have chosen to relocate at any point after I sat at the table next to theirs, allusion to the fact that I they were already here when I arrived finally made just now-- has created. Doing so will be meeting them where they are at. Right now, they are exactly where I want them to be, chasing me.

Insight four: this dynamic has an expiration date or can be destroyed by anone of the three of us at any time. I will destroy it out of desperation, due to anxiety over revealing sexual interest, or lacking personality. This is perhaps the best place to think about...

Insight five: how I could apply Cody Lyons' three seduction states, sporty, sexy and happy. This is a breakthrough idea, one I would not have had without writing this shit out for this post, by the way! The fact that there is not a direct solution to the issue of approach anxiety, which has risen to the level of phobia for me in terms of its intensity, but which I have plowed through in often unfortunate ways in the past, is spotlighted in this tool of seduction. Can I see myself combining the right wors and phrases with the right body mechanics and touch-tactics at the right moments toward seducing these two girls? (Well, I could express sexual interest directly but would definitely blow a fuse if I were to do so. I will return to this concept in insight six and its already been mentioned in insight three.) No, absolutely not. But I can see myself approximating these states to the best of my ability, while focusing on the indicators of progress or regression toward a stated goal, seducing these to college chicks in this case.

Insight Six: I could relax after communicating sexual interest, rather than prepare emotionally for armigedden. Because once that's done armigedden has already taken place if it's going to happen at all. But this requires all of the above, much of which is purely aspirational at this point, to be in place in order for the communication of the sexual desire to come off completely to begin with. Doing that communicating seems akin to jumping off a ledge over a deep resiorvior of water. One can stand above the resiorvior without jumping and wind up being pushed.

Insight seven: Focus on them, authentically so. If I did this, I would know whether or not we are compatable even as friends. These girls, now that I thinnk abobut it, seem pretty materialistic. I could play on that though, looking at it as a thing to create useful tension over. Can only get there by looking through the lense of interest, compassion, service. That's useful.

Conclussory remarks- again, the girls seated behind me at this library are hot, my type, and as said, extremely young but not "illegally" so. I have yet to come up with an appropriate excuse to approach them, a way to "open", so I will refrain from doing so and simply wander home to get my tobacco now.
 

PrancingRabbit

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
64
Developing A Personality Part Two

I was reflecting on my last entry and feel it is well-rounded but incomplete. And I realize I am getting ahead of myself in terms of the overall project.

What i mean is that I am encountering resistance to approaching, something I believe there will be infinite opportunities for once I am ready, whether that's in a year or a few weeks, and that while it is prudent to study tactics and theory, I have to stay with the resistence, otherwise I won't get to the promised land of stress-free, anxiety-free approaching.

I think, also, that I want to have a strong sense of self-acceptance with regards to what a meaningful seduction attempt requires and that this is an acheivable goal worth striving for and, in my case, worth waiting to acheive before approaching any more. I think the two things I wanted to get out of this post were sharing that I continue to believe in self-acceptance as the key to becoming comfortable in any social situation, approach included; and that this involves dealing with often hidden aspects of the psyche, and as such that I: a) have to rely upon my instinct when it comes to determining readiness to approach (as defined specifically for myself alone); and b) have to do a fair amount of work when it comes to uncovering these hidden sticking points to begin with.

The formula for staying with the anxiety is related in several posts above, but I want to return to a couple key features. I remarked in my last post that at the library where a couple hot girls were nearby and showing IOI's a) that I was contemplating a direct opener but that felt too "scary" and b) that I couldn't come up with an indirect opener and did not approach as a result. The issue, I think, is that some aspect of the task of approach is still predomenantly placed in the "alarm" zone of my psyche. Expanding my comfort and challenge zones to include the different aspects of approach taken over by phobias may be aided by the following analysis (I sure hope it is because I'm taking the time to produce it).

Here are the rocks I think I need to be looking beneith, in other words, what aspects of approaching women may cause undue/extreme anxiety for me:
  • placing and holding my face close to another person's
  • touching strangers on the shoulders, butt, stomach, arms, thighs
  • scowling, grinning, winking, and making other "funny faces"
  • hugging friends, family and acquaintances in greeting
  • kissing friends, family and acquaintances on both or one cheek in greeting
  • standing with my feet splayed out and with my pelvis thrust forward
  • being seen in a state of physcial intimacy with more than one woman by the same set of people, due to wanting to approach multiple people close to home and in the
  • being viewed as a "flirt" and/or sexually prococious by friends and family
  • being prepared to get told off by a random man, friend of a seduction target, or boyfriend of a seduction target
  • Talking about my sexuality with strangers, friends, and family members, including
    • admitting that I masturbate
    • sharing about fetishes and/or explaining my fantasies
    • telling stories about past sexual encounters
    • asking for sexual advice
  • Asking others abbout their sexuality
  • Asking others personal questions
  • Talking about male/female dynamics in society, at home, and in the bedroom
  • Asking for and giving fashon and dating advice
  • Telling women I think they are sexual and giving examples of what is sexy or sexual about them
  • Disqualifying for relationship, including
    • telling people I am not into dating
    • telling people I am only interested in sex
    • telling people I never want to have kids
    • telling people I don't have any money to spend on them
    • telling people I hate spending money on other people
    • telling people I think marriage is a sham
    • telling people I can't be faithful to one partner
    • telling people I hate the feeling of being in love
  • Complimenting other people on their personality, virtues, appearance and lifestyle
  • Issuing commands to people (e.g., "Come sit next to me and put your hand on my leg right here.")
  • Listing positive attributes about myself including
    • my ability to tie women up
    • my gentle heart
    • my off-beat sense of humor
  • Asking people to keep secrets for me
  • learning a name/forgetting a name
  • spilling a drink or getting food on my shirt
  • farting or peeing in my pants
  • Asking women to make the "first move"
  • being asked by other men for favors, e.g., "hooking them up with" a women I know
  • being told that I am a pimp, man-whore, creep, pervert, rapist, etc.
  • being told that I am unattractive, too old, too poor, too boring
  • being told "I am not into random sex" or "I do not hook up with strangers"
  • being told I need to leave women alone
  • being told I am a creep for hitting on women half my age
  • being asked by a woman I find unattractive to have a physcial relationship
  • being slapped, kicked, punched, tripped or shoved
  • adlibbing silly concepts aloud and doing silly impersinations
  • making obsene gestures, such as scrunching fingers with hands outreached, like I'm squeezing boobs
  • making out in public
  • having two girls on my side at once
  • inviting a girl to take part in a spontenious activity
  • listing activity ideas, four or more (let's see, watch music videos on youtube, watch an avant gard film on my laptop, preparing a snack of rice pudding, walking to my apartment, playing gin rummy, playing sharades, looking at my high school photos, looking at my coffee table book collection, trying to swing dance, smoking weed)

What I've intentionally left off due to either not wanting to have anything to do with these behaviors or believing they are not part of seduction to begin with, are: having sex in a public place, spending money, setting up dates, going on dates, dancing in public, singing in public, shouting in public, running or skipping in public, bragging, and getting undressed in public.

I'm not sure where to go from here, other than to coninue to reflect on the nature and causes of my phobia-- the body sensations, emotions, belief-sets, etc., that they involve-- and stick with the visualizations, i.e., visualizing myself engaging in one or more of these behaviors and getting rejected.

Something still seems missing. There's a general anxiety about all of this. When I think of approach, I feel anxious and afraid, feel a sense that doom is impending. Is it in how I say goodbye (could put hugging and kissing goodbye on the list)? Is it just that I have to actually do some more visualizations, memorize one or two gambits, go out and practice? Or am I missing some critical elememt of all of this? I'm still stumbling on expressing my sexuality, I think. Saying sexual things, being specific-- talking about girls bodies, my body, talking about the sex act, etc. Am afraid of going "too far" or offending somebody-- as if sexuality should be offensive to people. I am obsessed with "performance" and appearing "cool" and "kind", etc. Maybe I'm still dealing with an anger issue or two. What else could be missing?

There's nothing specific about the list, I suppose. No specific tactics, just general things that could happen. Maybe I should put "employing gambits" on the list?

I was afraid of approaching the girls at the library and some of the behaviors and scenarios listed above cause me pretty high anxiety, at the level of phobia. I also know that I am skeptical about my own abilities, and that I am reticent to let go of my now comfortable beliefs that I am clueless when it comes to women. In spite of being a pretty decent lover. Actually, I'm not so convinced of that any more. I certainly don't get all the things I want out of women.

The end. Peace.
 
Last edited:

PrancingRabbit

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
64
Entries In Several Catefories

One. Putting self in others shoes, specifically female ones. Today when I woke up, I found myself in posession of the power to imagine what it must feel like to be a hot 21 year-old female ordering a drink next to a dude like me at a bar (but not to keep my pinky relaxed when pressing delete on this keyboard), and I sat in that for a few minutes. She is wearing tight beige pants, a skimpy tank top, and victoria's secret lingerie. She is thinking, "The man who approaches me will like what he sees, but will see more than my physical beauty. He will say something endearing but provocative, and he will take me home and screw the shit out of me." I ask myself now, am I prepared to meet and exceed her expectations, or not?

Two. Emotional regulation (part one). With regards to "negative emotions." For me, this is about the Enneagram personality classification system these days, which is synonemous with "personality discovery" to me. A few notes on the Enneagram. I believe it is a peculiar set of ideas, but that it is completely tautological. In otherwords, I can place myself somewhere on the outer circle of the Enneagram symbol, I can relate to the Type designated to that spot on the circle, and if I follow the lines of connection through the circle to the other two points they connect to-- for me as a Three, a triangle is joining my Type to two others, Six and Nine specifically-- I will relate the results to some aspects of my experience and personality with relation to the lines connecting me to Six and Nine further below-- and I think you will be able to do the same vis a vis whichever Type you identify with. The "Wisdom of the Enneagram" is a meaningful pursuit with profound implications for how one relates to the various aspects of one's personality, and if you can't place yourself on the Enneagram Circle, and transfer yourself accross it following the lines carved through by either a triangle, as in my case, or by the hexad, for Four, Five, Seven, Eight, One and Two, and land somewhere you would also place yourself dependent upon internal conditions you experience on an ongoing basis, you are not human indeed.

The Enneagram says that the Three type, along with Four (my Secondary Type), and Two, primarily filters experience through emotions, rather than thoughts or intuition, the alternate dominions of the other six Types. Several weeks back, I was riding this concept like a knight on his loyal steed, ready to take on all comers; but for the past few weeks, it has been barely a blip on my raidar. Today, the meaning seems important again, and there are a few points I wanted to journal about with regards to it.

First, am I connected to my emotions? I would say that this question tantelizes for Threes based on what I read and experience, due to the strength with which Threes experience all emotions and their insistance that emotions indicating poor performance in one or more aspects of life be ignored, due to flying in the face of their primary ego coping mechanism, performing or, alternatively expressed, "acheiving." The manner with which one must overcome this "shortcoming" tantalizes me because the movement of Ego away from (or avoidance of) negative emotions has a negetive impact on my performance in many situations, one which cannot be dealt with directly, but which gets resolved by switching up the response and curbing the reflex to ignore or surpress negative emotions. This is obviously going to be useful in any social connexion, seduction being high on the list of possible scenerios for me.

To accept a negative emotion is to let go, letting go being a non-doing. If I don't want to experience any pain I can avoid the emotion, but avoiding the negative emotion means inability to deal with the problem. The crazy thing is that, in my experience, as soon as the problem is delt with, the emotion becomes nonsensical. So there is a forging with the fire of emotion and the tool of the intellect of a relationship, a business, whatever pursuit at hand, that comes about when the thing creating the negative emotion is delt with, and the only way to face it is to deal with the emotions present-- all of them. Often this takes the form of an aplogy, an odieous explanation of behavior or meaning, or a favor asked, where the negative/unwanted emotion acts like a snake with poisonous venom and ten inch fangs but can only bite me if I run away from it and refuse to pick it up in my hands and say, in effect, "There, there little snake with ten-inch fangs. Either you will bite me or you won't, but I have to pick you up or else I don't want to bother going on as a human."

Another example of looking at emotions as pathways to liberation follows. I want to type faster, which will help me make more money, enable me to feel potent, and enable me to brag about my above-average typing rate-- but I can't get myself to do any typing exercises or slow down, as it were, to speed it up. If I wasn't a Three, I would be more adept at processing my emotions, which, if I weren't in the Emotions Triad, would be less severe and destabalizing to begin with. If I am connected to my emotional states, I have overcome or transcended the primary characteristic of typing, and am resting in the Six position of the Enneagram, the Six, the Loyalst expressing ego through thought and as a conduit to connection, or so the tautology (Enneagram System) states. If I make a practice of checking in with my emotional state, which is what I was doing regularly several weeks ago for a week or two, I will be interacting with all of my emotions, the negative ones included, more. I will wind up across the Circle at Six. I will improve my typing at Six, seduce as a Six, and cease being a Three. The way of the Three is so "yesterday's news" for me. One step at a time grasshopper!

Thusly described, the regulation of my emotions is a very complex affair with profound implications for me, but one that involves simple enough practices, one of which I have identified and alluded to using already, namely checking in with the emotional state, or mindfulness of emotion practice. If you haven't already guessed it, when I do a successful check in, I first feel relief, release, that is; and second, I immediately feel exhilaration. This is what catches me up. I can't escape this dialectical trap with my emotional response to life, which is strong and always-impending-- urgent in other words, by participating in it. I am looking for ways I can indirectly change, by escaping the dialectic. I am finding some, but I need to either continue and take the practices that seem to be working momentarily to a deeper level or find some other way of transcending my "Threeness." The three being the personality type that is most pompus, narcissistic and cocky. To drop these unatractive qualities, there must be something else that is solid that I can reach for and hold on to, until it holds on to me. I guess I will keep practicing to find out what being a Six is all about (and read up on Six; Nine, the Peacemaker, which is where ego goes to die rather than be transcended for Threes, is a familiar old trope, so I don't need to read up on it). I am guessing the shortcut has to do with thinking less of myself, comparing my achievements to others' less, and accepting myself more intensely (intentionallly?) from moment to moment. Because emotional ping pong is the grist in my personhood that gets stuck in the Mill of Life and clogs it beyond repair.

Three. Emotional regulation (part two). Anger, rage and condemnation. I have discussed this already in some detail in this thread, but since I am devoting part of this post to emotional regulation, these three aspects of emotional life, all of which I have made serious progress in this year, get mensions. Basically, I have discovered within myself a primary cause of depression in anger, and that frequent anger leads to rage, rage being a tirtiary emotion, and anger of course being secondary (fear being a primary emotion, one of two, along with love). I emeliorated anger on a large scale in late summer when I got arrested after doing something silly but not exactly criminal. Encountering my least favorite people in society in such an intimate way somehow seems to have enabled me to let go of my anger to them, and consequently, to become free from anger toward aspects in society I deem to be dangerous with regards to values I hold dearly, including much of what humanity came up with by way of the Magna Carta and found its way into the U.S. constitution. Then, I began to notice the upcropping of rage in my psyche, which made no sense in a less angry mileau I was creating for myself internally.

Subsequently, I have noticed a second tertiary emotion, which operates similar to rage in that it is a "preparitory state" for another, more volitile state, and as such sort of just moves in without doing anything other than clouding thoughts towards the condition it "seeks." That second tertiary emotion is condemnation. I experience it in social situations, and it obviously gains entry through the conditions set up by the presence of too many individual judgements. If I come up with three or four things about you that are shit, I become a judge of you, capable of offering my bitter condemnation, just like when I am angry about a multitude of things, rage gains entry, putting me in a position to destroy the object of my rage. Like rage, condemnation is utterly arbitrary in what it latches onto; and like rage, it is nothing more than an energy state that blocks out other energy states, enabling its ends to come to fruition. I blame my parents and the schooling system aka child slavery in the United States for both my rage and condemnation tendencies, but they are mentioned here in the light of a breakthrough, so I am not bitter as I write.

What I am hoping will be the upshot of realizing how these tertiary emotional states depend on the interplay of other factors, noticing their presence at least some of the time they crop up, and experiencing them less, is a more productive mode of life. In the case of rage, I hope to destroy less private property, lose my bearings on reality less, to be able to meditate without rage attacks. In the case of condemnation, I hope to see myself more fully reflected in others, such that I can see the beauty in myself rather than just the shitiness, to make more friends more readily, and to enjoy the presence of all the "shit people" in the world more than I have up to now.

A second hope, I suppose, is to discover more secondary and tertiary emotions. Tertiary emotions are so rewarding, even exilirating to discover, because they are like third wheels. When you find a third wheel, the discovery is accompanied by instant access to the means to drop it. You say to your partner, "Have you noticed that we don't really need Jake? Shall we ditch his as?" and your partner says, "Yes lets," or "No," and you ditch them both. With secondary emotions, on the other hand, they can't really be dealt with directly. But figuring out what goes on with any of the secondary emotions, anger, judgementality, procrastination, compulsive eating included, there's a real serious release, like when you ditch the partner. Ditching the partner, the third wheel makes no sense if you didn't want it to begin with, but with secondary emotions, when I have seen through them, there's an actual breakup occuring there, and that is so much more releif-producing than ditching the third wheel emotions. The intensity level i different, the change is more far-reaching and immediate. I just hope I am broken up with anger permanently, because I find its bras and shit lying around the crib a bit too often...

Four. Approaching A Group. The "group dynamic" became the "Nightmare on Elmstreet" (The Shining?) dynamic for me in sixth grade. In sixth grade, I was booed by a few of the cool kids, previously my friends, currently (to this day) my sworn enemies. At the time, I was a happy-go-lucky kid who was happy to punch you in the arm or ask you what your favorite ice cream was if you were sitting beside me in a group of kids. There was no limit to the type of interaction we could have. But then I got booed while on stage having been picked to "conduct" a string and wind quintet after volunteering with an up-streching open-palmed hand, I speculate, due to offending two members of the clique by asking an inappropriate question, in one case, and snubbing out of a birthday party invitation on the other. So, two boys booed as I conducted, and their voices were unidentifiable to me due to distance and the number of bodies they could have bolonged to, that number being about 650. But I was able to create a whole host of "core beliefs" about myself and society writ large. Respectively, these are, that I am undesireable, socially castrated, and damaged/bad; and that groups are dangerous, unpredictable, and mean. This was the beginning of cynisism, and I only had to wait four more years for my "Cynic's Bible," in the form of Catcher In They Rye to find its way into my hands. (Two asides: would anyone be surprised to find out that I never had a conversation with a single adult about the booing incident, even though it destroyed my life?) Would anyone be surprised to know that I blamed myself for the incident? Self-blame is the cornerstone of my phobia of ineracting with groups or members of groups.

I found that Zoloft takes the edge off of this phobia of groups, and have been on and off it since I was 20. I finally, in the past two years or so, embraced the idea that Zoloft is a) not evil and b) is not going to solve all of my problems, and that I need to engage in therapy. This being said, I was on the internet yesterday and watched this vid of a group of girls going down a big-ass waterslide on a gigantic inertube. (Of course the video was taken by some creep wearing those new Rayban camera shades, his legs and feet visible within the frame.) Zoloft isn't sufficiently getting the job done, so I persist in my analysis of this innertube full of hot girls (more on my relationship with Zoloft in item five). I pictured myself on the raft, and felt the old familiar dread with regards to wheeling and dealing in the group setting. Any interaction with one could result in social ruin. Meanwhile, I have a hard time exploiting my Social Instinct and Self-preservation Instinct, which get overtaken by my percieved need to have intense interactions, i.e., my Sexual Instinct (this is Enneagram lingo-- in addition to the Instinctual Triad, presently being discussed, and the already mentioned Central Triad, there are a number of other facets of the Enneagram I will perhaps take up after more study of them in other posts, including Levels of Wellbeing; the Hornevian Groups, i.e., social styles; and Harmonic Pattern, i.e., modes of outlook on life). And I feel a powerful sense of internal and external pressure to "hit on" one of the girls or seduce the entire group, pressure which is paralizing. Noted.

Perhaps a clue as to my Harmonic Pattern, now to be discussed sooner than thought. Let's see, Threes are part of the Competency Group. Specifically, according to a table in The Wisdom of The Enneagram: The Complete Guide To Psychological and Spritual Growth For The Nine Personality Types by Don Richard Riso and Russ Hudson, we place most emphasis on "Being efficient, capable, and outstanding. The focus on goals, being pragmatic, and knowing how to present self." We manage feelings, "By repression and keeping attention on tasks, staying active. Achievement offsets painful feelings. They look to others for feeling cues." And in relation to systems, "Threes want to work with the system. But they also like being outside of it-- bending the rules and finding shortcuts." Sweet.

Four. The difficulty with routine. I exist in a world devoid of responsibility, spend my time writing in my journal, toying with other writing projects, and surfing the internet and consuming cinema. Very little reading, memorization, practice. Practice mainly involves athletic pursuits I am already proficient in. I would like to practice meditation, memorize more English and Non-English vocubulary, and read more. I would also like to go to sleep and wake up at the same time most days, preferably being awake during business hours, and otherwise follow daily, weekly and monthly routines. And I would like to engage less in mass consumption of sugar and porn.

Five. I have a tenuated heart. This is basically an expansion or continuation of "Emotional Regulation" above, and will circle back to the Enneagram eventually. Anyone who has been keeping up with this thread is probably thoroughly mystified by me by now. Don't worry, you are not alone; I mystify everyone I come into contact with sooner or later. I am all over the place: can't keep a resolution, go back on/reverse breakthroughs, have a new sad story to tell every week, etc. As a kid, I experienced a handful of traumas and supreme alienation of family and peers, none of whom made the necessary efforts to understand or correct my increasing disalusionments and suffering. Ultimately, as a late- and post-adolescent, I came to oporate with a heart chakra/energy center that was tennuated in the extreme. And, whether I've come out and said it or not, multiple times in the last 20 years, I have been utterly and completely broken five or six times by a psycho-emotional ailment that protrudes unless I take a medication to which I am dependent, sadly.

The nature of this ailment is heavy and I believe it is lethal to many at this intensity level, and nearly so to me. I get sinus pain of an extreme intensity level in every sinus in the body, inlcuding behind my sternum, that is invariably accompanied by utterly dark and abismal recollections. Recollection: a memory or flashback that persists in the psyche for a moment or more. Recollections that are dark in nature like these only began appearing for me when I got the sinus pain, and I got the sinus pain the first time I withdrew from Zoloft; then it went away promptly when I got back on the Zoloft; and it has come and gone as I've gone off and on Zoloft ever since. I've heard that people go crazy in some cases when they contract Tinnitus, or ringing in the ears, and that there is a neural component of Tinnitus that amounts to the diagnosis of "phantom pain with accompanying, potentially lethal mental illness." This is exactly what happens with me with the sinus pain-- though I know nothing of the neurological implications of being on or off Zoloft for me, other than that it is supposed to increase seretonin levels in the brain. My own neuroses become so intense that I spend all my time ruminating on what is wrong with me and the world and have strong urges, constant in nature, to end my life. These symptoms increase in severity as the sinus pain increases, which does gradually after withdrawal, per doctor's schedule of course, from the SSRI medication. At the apex, which is a chronic condition and in my experience has no bottom, they traumotize me both cognitively and emotionally. As I write, due to my bouts of chronic internal psycho-emotional traumatization, five or six of them in the last 20 years, I have been incapable of holding down a job for more than a few months at a time for almost eight years now.

There are undoubtadly a cognitive and social component to this disease, which I am calling "SSRI Dependence" and "SSRI Withdrawal Syndrome" but which little has been written about that I have seen. (This, in spite of the fact that untreated SSRI dependence is likely the cause of at least some of the mass shootings and many, many suicides in American society over the course of the last 30 years, I'd be willing to bet.) Basically, I have lost some of my short-term memory capacity, due to an inability to focus on anything at a high enough level to retain it, and have sustained damage to my higher intellectual functioning. The latter means that I struggle to hold complex thoughts, such as turning a three dementional object or walking around a three dementional object in my mind. Anything 3-D, meaning much of the math and science you encounter after 8th grade, is beyond me, as of my first bout of psychosis I've just described. (There was always a glass ceiling but it was lowered drastically.)

The social component of course affects seduction. Only those who have known me my entire life are not phased by my anti-social tendancies, developed through the trauma of the encounters with whatever it is that goes on in my physiology, some of which I can pinpoint, others perhaps not. I seem to operate on a different set of assumptions from everyone else, which leads me to say and do antisocial things. It's antisocial if someone finds it offensive or hurtful, and every 9th grader has learned the difference between statements that are "safe" to make and those that are not safe, depending on the audience or target. What happens with me, is that I don't filter offending statements either due to a lack of recignition that they will offend, or a lack of recognition of the sensitivities of my audience. THere's a difference between having an abrasive personality and being antisocial, and since I do have an abbrasive personality, and due to the other emotional features of my severely traumatized psyche, I have had a hell of a time curbing this antisocial behavior. I'm actually somewhat reminded of the protagonist of American Psycho (2000), Patrick Bateman, who proclaims early in the story, "There is an idea of a Patrick Batemen-- some kind of abstraction. But there is no real me-- only an entity something illusory. And though I can hide my cold gaze, and you can shake my hand and feel flesh gripping yours, and maybe you can even sense our lifestyles are probably comprable, I simply am not there."

The differences between me and Pat Batemen (and if you haven't watched the film, it's worth it for the scene I just quoted from alone!) are that I am not a sociopath or psychopath; and, ironically, he has more self-control, at least during the first two acts of the film, than I do. What we have in common is that "we are not all there," or put another way, "we have tennuated hearts." My energy structure, through chronic trauma of an internally manufactured and external sources, has been so damaged that I struggle with antisocial tendancies and a sense of emptiness inside that is akin to being souless, but I have no doubt can be repaired, bringing the soul back to life, if in a different form. It's a weird thing to admit, but even weirder to experience, and I am sure most people never do experience it. Just me and good ol Pat Bateman and every other sociopath on the planet, it would seem.

A tennuated heart is the condition in the Fifth Chakra and results in an inability to learn, an inability to generate ideas sponteniously, and a something-else I am not remembering at the moment (inability to be socially vulnerable?). You can experience "movement" in the Heart Chakra yourself by looking at or imagining an object that is the color green and "breathing it into" your chest cavity right behind your sternum, or by recalling a time you felt expansive openness, such as the first time you fell in love, or by accepting a feature of yourself or someone or something else or the world that you have never-- not once-- accepted fully before. When the energy field in there meets with one of these three experiences, there is a resonence with its primary identity, which most closely resembles a phrase, specifically the phrase "This can be" or "This can exist too." Anyway, according to Walter McKichen, a tennuated heart chakra comes about through extreme levels of self-hate, extremely low self-esteem, and extreme trauma, all of which I have experienced in abundance. To me, what having a tenuated heart primarily means is an inability to learn new things that are not easy. If it’s not facile, I’m not learning it. Secondly, it means not having access to major parts of my personality, including parts associated with athletics and seduction. I’m going to return to the idea of approaching with an open heart (nope, will do this in another post hopefully), but want to conclude talking about having a tenuated heart, which is connected to the difficulties I am having in accepting myself as I am, and therefore practicing and learning seduction, to say that the heart chakra is such an extremely powerful force within us, that has the capacity to shut down our emotions, will and intellect, or bring them back to life or into fuller states of thriving.

Six. Emotional regulation (part three). I am convinced that through therapy-- which as alluded to I have resisted due to pride though have paid lipservice in the form of engaging in counseling, AA and other spiritual schemes but am now really getting into— I can counteract the cognitive and emotional symptoms of my malady, which if not already mentioned, has only been slightly remediated with nearly four years of being on Zoloft again. The study of the Enneagram is hot for me right now, though. Thought patterns for me are centered around the past, which indicates that I funnel experience through emotions before they enter cognition or intuition. Emotions overtake me and have made for pivitol moments in my life— mostly for the bad. At a certain point, every single emotion seems to ping me back to square one, as if I’m a ball inside a pin ball machine and the player keeps letting me fall right down the trap, no matter how far I get across the board to begin with. Thoughts, generally comparison-rendering judgments, feed right into this— they are like the bumpers and walls in the pinball machine.

Therefore, examining emotional content of my life directly through contemplative reflection is making a lot of sense to me. Ignore the bumpers and the trap, focus on the pinball. ("Make it float, kimosabe!") When I muster the willingness to concentrate enough to authentically examine the emotions I'm having from moment to moment or have had at different junctures in the past, doing so has been extremely liberating, keeping me in play in the game of pinbball that is my life. One practice that helps with this is identifying a salient thought and addressing it, or the "deliverer" of it, an "aspect of the Ego," and say, "Is that so?" then, "Thank you," and then, "I love you," to it, placing the full thought verbatum at the end of each phrase before going on to the next or the next thing. Believe it or not, the Thing addressed, which I do think is ego-manifestation of personality and not real in the ordinary sense of the word, dematerializes in the psyche, or at least quiets down, when this is done. That's my experience, folks! (Practice taught me by Cheri Hubor and modified by myself.)

I still get few “crumbs” from life to snack on while I chew on all of this stuff, and masticating my emotions is a gradual process with much saliva expended. It seems helpful to think of the person coming into being within me, who won’t need any crumbs and will blaze his own trail through seduction and life in general; and I have to remind myself over and over— and don’t do enough— that the process is the goal, that the gift life is offering me is right here, right now. It seems like something you tell yourself to “make yourself feel better,” but this is a concept that only makes sense to an open heart, and transcends the need to think about it-- it comes as an insight but this doesn't occur until one has surpassed a certain threshhold of reflection on it (maybe three hours total). Thinking leads to emotion, emotion leads to bad emotion, leads to more shit thinking. It's a miserable cycle, and I want this process to speed up so my heart will just remain open! That being said, the process is what focusing on seems to be most helpful, and it does make sense that it should be arduous, since breaking habits, no matter how detrmintal or injurious, always feels "wrong," and is uncomfortable, causing us to immediately reach back to the habit just-broken.

Seven. Getting a tiny bit better at memorization. I guess I will actually close by saying that open-heartedness seems to preclude the need to study anything, but enables me to learn difficult things which otherwise seems impossible. I have struggled so much with memorization that I’ve lasted as many as five months— and then gotten fired from— front of house service industry positions due to failing to memorize the menu. “What are the ingredients of this dish,” I’ll be asked by a patron three months in, and have to respond, “I’m not sure. Let me go check in with the cook.” The cook, meantime, has already begun to wish I had never set foot in his kitchen. Another illustration. When I look up a word in the dictionary because I come across it in something I am reading or in conversation with another person (never my alternate personalities, we all have an identical vocabulary), I wish to remember the definision for the rest of my life. But unless I come across it and look it up several-to-many more times, I won’t remember it. This is where I will pick up the next post, where a seeming learning disability, but something I know to be connected to emotional trauma, comes into play in seduction and elsewhere in my life.
 
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PrancingRabbit

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
64
On Stagnation Leading To Innovation

Sexuality seems paramount and primary at times for me. I've written about this already, about cutting through or transcending the ego-centered thoughts about clothes, looks, mannerisms, and having primal awareness I have a dick and other men have dicks, and women have pussies. All men, all women. Building on this, with good fundamentals, which is how you present when absolutely nothing is happening, it's possibly to "spy on" people in the presence of them. If I process my own thoughts and remain in control of my facial expressions, body language, etc., to a high degree, it's easy to maintain focused on others. Through so doing, I am ably to spec women checking me out without getting caught up in any thoughts about what this means. This is how to stay centered-- until something happens. Staying centered at this point is a different matter all together, and it isn't really happening for me.

Therefore, I present a new concept (for me at least): a "seduction readiness" stage schedule/model.

The model, which I swear I am going to come up with right now, has two divisions of behavior: commitment oriented and non-commitment oriented, and contains both content and process achievements. Other models can employ a physical/nonphysical division, but that is not acheivable by me and I do not see the use/application for myself of such a division at this period in time. Physical/nonphysical division is also counter-indicated by the nature of female sexuality according to the metaphor for female sexuality being a moving automobile. A car in first gear can't go past 15 mph, 40 mph in third, and so on. Bottom line is women need to be in fifth gear to go over 50 mph, to fuck and suck in other words. For point of reference, in a relationship, women should run in third or fourth gear at all times, at the ready for spontenious kissing and groping, and capable of carrying out other functions, just as men can.

The model has five stages and is further divided into Three Phases, a-committed; one-time committed; and indefinite, continuous commitment. If I do expand, I will expand the process oriented aspects of the stages I developed in the initial penning of this post, while keeping these stages tightly oriented to achievement/content. I will also name the stagest-- done just now but not necessarily satisfied with them. And lastly, I will consider applying more than just a single frame, that of sexuallity, to the act of seduction. This will require some thought because seduction can be employed to get just about everything.

Without further ado, I give you the DR (Dancing Rabit) Seduction Readiness Model (SRM) or Sexual Discovery Development Model.

The Three Phases and Five Stages of Readiness To Seduce

Phase One- A-Committed

Stage One-
Sexuality 1/4 Actualized. Maintaining neutrality Toward Others Regardless of Subjective Attraction, With Regards to Body Language and Facial Expression Without Personal Contact. This includes two modalities: sexual; and a-sexual, both being required for completion of the stage. There is an initial moment in the meeting of a new man for a women when she can shift through the five or six gears in her sexuality when she becomes attracted. Stage One completion requires knowing how to make this happen with and without a specific target in mind, as well as how to avoid it. Avoidance is a practical matter because of the emotions involved in romantic and sexual interactions, but I admit I am not convinced of the necessity of the a-sexual component of this stage.

I was blessed to have at least ten women take themselves up to gear eight without any interaction whatsoever yesterday at ballet class. Went with a gay pal, practiced high level fundamentals, participated fully and watched a whole bunch of the women there develop crushes. I obviously was aware of being in the presence of 25 mostly fine females in leatards for one and a half hours. Furthermore, I was aware of at least five of them get into a pretty high sexual gear in the midst of prolonged gazing in my direction. The story illustrates completion of Phase One of my "Seduction Readiness Model," in which you need to be able to attract the female gaze and hold it long enough for women to develop a crush without doing anything overt to get their attention or speaking directly to them.

Last night, could I have prevented any woman present from developing a crush? I don't know, or at least I don't know a harm-free way; and therefore the formulation of the kernel of this stage is not complete yet.

Stage Two-
Sexuality 1/3 Actualized. Maintaining Neutrality Toward Others Regardless of Subjective Attraction While Having a full/complete convesation. In Phase Two, sexual component is also not assumed but required for completion. You engage directly with a female you believe to have a crush on you and/or toward whom you are attracted, in an ambiguous manner, long enough to a) find out something you could not know without her telling you, and b) share something about yourself she would not otherwise know. This is self-evidently not possible for all men, as they avoid and sabatoge conversations with women in both categories, i.e., those who have a crush on them, and those who they find top-notch attractiveness-wise.

I could have done this with any of the ten or so chicks checking me out at ballet yesterday. The rest of the story from last night illustrates an attempt and failure at prophiciency in Phase Two. In fact, one of these women addressed me by my first name and said, "good job today," to me as she walked by me out of the studio; 9t so happens she was my favorite out of the entire class. How'd I do? I successfully pulled off a necessary step of completion of the second phase of my SRM by asking her what her name was. But that is as far as I got in SRM Phase Two. I am not proficient in Phase Two, which only requires achieving ambiguity, and is not a sexual frame.

Skipping this phase is not possible, and pointing out the pitfalls of attempting to continue in the Model without completing Stage Two completes overview of it. Seduction requires concealment of defects, and top among these is the judging machine that motivates seduction to begin with. Seduction is necessary with everyone to a certain level, including those with whom one has no ambition, sexual, status, or otherwise, because all interactions are contributing to the wholistic reality we present the world in direct and indirect ways. There is a karmik aspect that affects us at the unconscious level, and seeming attracted regardless of actual attraction has two benefits. One, it is the best way to practice seduction, because it creates the most opportunities. And two, it permits us to short circuit the "inverse" of the features of our anxiety that interfers with behaving calmly around those we do wish to seduce for gain, i.e., it allows us to play in the sandbox of seduction unhindered by judgementality.

Stage two does not require a commitment to interact beyond the current interaction on anybody's part.

Stage Three-
Sexuality 1/2 Actualized. Willingness To Apply Direct Flirtation of a sexual and non-sexual nature Regardless of Projected Outcome. Phase Three of DR SRM is defined as directly or indirectly setting a sexual frame (SF) in the first two thirds of an interaction. It is the first phase of the model employing sexual frame, which points to the need to have an open heart for seduction. Phase Two Success in Phase Three requires direct awareness on the part of the woman that you are ready to have sex with her while you have yet to reach the final third of your interaction's duration, and of course that you want to either have sex with her or view you in a sexual light and consider her subjectively attractive enough to date, which means to marry. Splitting hairs on the attractiveness levels is necessary and progress in the stage can be broken down by attraction level, rendering an upside down bell-shaped curve. The Y axis, which represents willingness to approach over attraction level is decreasing in the middle of the X axis, wich represents quantity of approaches. This is a fancy way of saying you flirt with everybody.

You will know when you have accomplished communication of actual or symbolic sexual intent, and doing so requrires doing one or more of the following: a) telling her you are interested in engaging in physical intimacy with her (it is not enough to tell her that you find her attractive); b)kissing her, asking her to kiss you on the cheek or lips, or putting your arm around her or otherwise touching her provocatively; and/or c) asking her to engage in some other sexual activity with you, including but not limited to viewing pornography together, having sex, or having oral sex.

I am not including an example because I usually skip this phase altogether.

Stage Three does not require a commitment to interact beyond the current interaction on anybody's part.

Phase Two- One-Time Committed

Phase Four- Sexuality 3/4 Actualized. Willingness To Engage In Long-Form Sexual and Romantic Encounters, accompanied by frequent requests from women for dates and sex. DR SRM Stage Four, which is the second-to final stage, is having a date or sexual encounter with a woman followed by a statement of intent with regards to future engagement with the same woman. A date is a structured, prolonged encounter with someone you have completed the first three stages with. A structured hang-out with someone who does not have direct knowledge of your readiness to have sex with them does not count as a date. And the stage requires that you provide closure for the experience in the form of stating whether you wish to see the person again or not, and if so, in what form. You must tell her either that you want to go on another date, have sex but not date, see her platonically, or not see her at all. As in all the stages, proficiency involves full completion without undue anxiety, complete absence of coercive or otherwise toxic behavior, and a mutual sense of goodwill from start to finish, which will result in a sense of safety, complete absence of tension, and optimism with regards to the future on her part, and yours as well.

Stage Four does require a commitment to interact beyond the current interaction one time only.

I am not including an example because I have had so few good dates as defined by this Stage.

Phase Three- Possibility of Indefinite, Continuous Commitment Is Involved

Five-
Fully Sexually Actualized. Ability To Bring Most Encounters with person of complimentary sexuality To Consensual Sexual Conduct Or Equivelent When Desired. DR SRM Stage Five is completed upon entering the Matrix, with plenty of gray area sprinkled into the cracks. In other words, the previous stages constitute steady approach to the features listed in this phase of devlopment, and Phase Five has so many contributing factors it's almost impossible to adequately describe, but has to be determined on the basis of personal experience alone.

Most if not all of the guests on the GC Podcast say things indicating they have reached this stage, and these statements take on qualitative and qualitative meanings. I'm having a hard time defining Stage Five, but think it in part involves the following: 1- surpassing a threshhold with regards to ease of applying skillsets related to the previous four Stages; 2- having little to no interruptions in one's seduction practice over a long timespan (at least five years); 3- being externally evaluated by a diverse group or population along highly complimentary lines, and/or being described as a seducer, pimp or player by non-biased observers (not one's childhood homies, in other words); 4- applying seduction practice to, subjectively-speaking, unattractive individuals; 5- applying seduction in a highly visible manner without individual or group exception both in terms of who is witnessing and who it is you are seducing; 6- Needing no "internal pep talk" to approach and being able to effectively seduce regardless of mood; 7- Never being hampored by poor mental health.

Stage Five, furthermore, of the DR SRM requires successfully completing the first four stages in several or many different settings on a multitude of occassions on a schedule, i.e., over a discrete and reasonable period of time, probalby three months or less. The primary settings I have come up with are 1- public, structured formal (e.g., cooking class, university class, workplace); 2- social group; 3- party/bar/entertainment venue; 4- pubblic, unstructured random (e.g., mall, student center or library, on the street). Each setting has different dynamics, therefore, each provides unique oppertunities and challenges when it comes to engaging with the first five stages.

Stage Five does not require a commitment to interact beyond the current interaction one time only, and I hate implying that doing so should be necessary to having sex with an appropriate partner 365 days per year for the entire duration of one's sexual discovery phase.

I am not including an example because I have yet to undergo a period of stress free approaching.

Bonus Section: The 45 Physical Stages of Readiness For Seduction (An Abandoned Project)

Preface: These stages have been developed through many, many years of solitary masturbation, about 40 to 45 discrete sex partners, and more monogomous and non-monogomus romantic relationships than the authors care to count (all 60 of them). With regard to physcial readiness to seduce, the bar is quite low, and it is by all means secondary. We are hopfully all equipped with little probing implements that dangle from the bottom of our abdomen and expand and stiffen when arousal occurs (which of course is confined to statutory, heteronormative interactions); hands that can grope and probe as well; and shins and knees that should be protected at all times lest anyone get a nasty case of bruising due to low-aiming kicks (they do happen in consensual sex, folks) and rug-burn, respectively. Due to its promiximity to the proboscis, which it is advised to keep clean and moderately-to fully-shined at all times, the author panel never use its tongues for any sexual purpose, and think those who do are freaks; and as a result, the stages are excluding oral sex completely. Women should be fully clothed during sex, and men should have special garments on hand that cover the entire body, head and face included, and open around the vagina for probing it with one of the aformentioned anatomical parts, but never the tongue or any inanimate, especially vibrating objects. Finally, prefatory to getting into the forty-five stages of Physical Readiness to Seduce, mutual masturbation is something confined to porn actors and politicians, and is highly looked down upon.

Introduction: There are 45 stages in the Physical Readiness To Seduce Model because cats have nine lives, and 45 is divisible by five, present author's favorite number. It is useful to keep a written journal when practicing each stage, but espacially the last three, stages 43, 44 and 45, respectively, which actually involve vaginal copulation. The first 42 stages are fairly straight forward, and no intoductory remarks need be made about them, other than you will not need a actual female adult until you get to stage 33 (for Scottie Pippen). Only the very last stage, stage 45, involves penile copulation. As I think you will all see, penile copulation is the most fun part of this model. Please do proceed with absolute care and utmost caution!

Stages One Through Forty Five-

(Coming soon to a forum near you)

Thanks for reading, Peace
 
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PrancingRabbit

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
64
On Objectifying Women and Internet Porn

We are in an interesting phase of development in society. Women realize they have been objectified, and embracing this, are exposing themselves through the channels available to them in a sexually objectifiable manner. But in light of the circumstances, what are men who wish to express themselves sexually, but do not wish to objectify other sensient beings, to do? I suggest embracing the sensation of envy as if it holds the answer to the riddle of existence itself and clinging tightly to one's internet porn habit. Allow me to explain.

I like having skinny, pelvically formed women on my hip in public. I like them to be dressed in such a way that anyone in our presence can get a taste of their figure without any use of the imagination. They can picture what she must look like naked, because I can. She, in turn, expresses her sexual side openly, as she should, and in fact as women in tribal society see no problem doing, exposing their nipples at all times. Yet, I do not want my woman to expose her nipples to other men.

Yet, many, many girls choose to do so, in privat and in public. I should feel no envy, ele I am not only bound to experience a fair amount of suffering through simple employment of my imaginition, but a hypocrite. These conjectures are made plane by a spiritual guru I am fond of who pointed out the intellectual nature of envy. Why, he asks, should love preclude a partner's finding happiness in a particular way, a sexual one not involving oneself? Why indeed.

Seduction involves a dismissal of the conditioning men recieve in modern society, which has been passed down through a perverse disruption of the natural human drive for sex begotten by a ploy to render one sex powerless to the whims of others. In this perversity, I see the hand of the conservative mind. Such a mind believes in the right of some to obtain power by rendering others powerless. Men who do not necessarily buy into this idea went along because they did not overcome their sexual drives. If I am to have any sexual gratification, I must fit into this mold, in which property supports objectification of women and superiority of men.

When the error in this logic becomes clear, confusion sets in. Where does one draw the line, in terms of viewing non-other as object and not? When it concerns another man? Another man of the same social status? Another man not having blood relation to himself? What about a woman, an animal or an idea, such as monopoly-issued tokens, also known as specie and also taking the form of credit and paper currency in modern society? One's idea of a "productive state of society" or "modern infrastructure" may be compelled to say that paying taxes is a social duty-- but is it anymore a duty compelled by nature than committing another human being to monogomy with him or herself?

In this way, the battle for liberty has come to trancend gender and indeed any other social construct, due to the awakening of the different socially constructed groups, females included. So the modern man must be rational where he has not, lest he fall by the wayside of human development. This rationality is required in the arena of seduction, which requires at least lipservice to an equal playing field, in which pursued and pursuer stand on equal ground-- equal ground being the essential condition of concent, the essential condition of arousal.

This is why I like seduction. It applies to any scenario in which I want to open my heart and expand my mind. Expansion of this sort, in turn, transcends social constructs. Where there is no social construct, there is space for the expression of sexuality. Expressing my sexuality has proven extremely difficult for me, and I pretend I am enlightened, but cling to the phobias inhibiting my growth in the area of seduction. Internet porn is a good substitute, though.
 
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PrancingRabbit

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
64
On Breakthroughs of A Decisive And Final Nature

Introductory note: I think I'm done with the phase I was stuck in for the longest time there, a phase in which I couldn't approach without high anxiety levels and undue stress. I think much of what I've accomplished has already been expressed in this thread, and that the cornerstone achievement is to be found in the creation of a "Readiness To Approach Model", a continuum of stages within phases of development along physical and social or non-physical lines of one's mature sexuality. (That and all the boning I'm gonna do of course.) I wrote a draft of a social model already and am working on a physical one now. A couple new breakthroughs have arrived since I wrote the post with the social "readiness to approach" model, and noting that I don't expect these to be the last, but that they do represent a near or complete readiness to approach, I want to go ahead and list them here.

One. Readiness to articulate readiness to have sex. This is in the model I came up with. The model is based on things I have learned here and need to continue working on. The model represents my understanding that seduction is a social activity, and that it is harmless and involves no committment of any kind by either of the parties involved. It is just as likely to happen unintentionally as intentionally, is often spontenious, and is built upon non-sexual or at least sexually ambiguous social behaviors. If one can articulate a rediness to have sex in this context, one is not focused on the outcome of sex.

This is the key-- focussing on process rather than outcome. The articulation of sexual desire is part of a process that involves social context, which viewing as a process with stages allows clearsightedness in the present moment in two ways. First, the anxiety of myself and I'm guessing others who are afraid of approaching, convinces people they have nothing interesting or constructive to say, among other things. This is tragic and couldn't be further from the truth. Expressing sexual interest neither takes away from the rest of the social connection one develops on the path to expressing sexual interest, and the intent to do so does not either-- neither do they obscure commonality and possibility for connection.

Second, a process orientation helps me stay present in the current moment because it enables me to know what to focus on at any given time. One outcome of this is that I can eventually focus on many things at one time, enabling me to at times skip one or more stage or complete many at one time, whichever way you want to look at it. A second outcome is that I don't confuse myself by skipping around from idea to idea, tactic to tactic. When I am in one stage, I will choose when to leave it for the next, and I will focus on one behavior or statement at a time when that moment or those moments come. A third outcome is that I will not get stuck in one part of the process due to a failure to comprehend my position with regards to the complete model.

The process orientation is a bit different from the content-oriented "stages of a seduction model" I learned here. In that model, the focus is specific outcomes, whereas in the process orientation (two posts above this one is my first draft of a model I came up with), the female's response to you and your interactions with her is the focus. This model makes you the composer, the miastro and the half the orchestra of your own seduction attempts.

Two. Appropriate discernment when it comes to approach targets. Three-parter, this one. First, focus on self and process. In the past I have told myself I should stick to girls I'd marry, and as recently as a few days ago was stuck in the quandry of what to say to chicks I'm not into on a dating level but would fuck, and how this lack of understanding is evidence that I have a ways to go in developing as a seducer. I'm sure I still have a ways to go, but I'm not asking myself this question because I'm not focused on my own insecurities nearly as much. If you keep your eye on the ball and the opponent, neither is going to get you-- and if you get creamed by an unexpected bouncing ball or oponents elbow-- well, it's just a game anyone and bruising is a part of every sport.

Second, letting go of my need to be perfect and never emote in public. It's implied in what was just said but a bit different. That meant that I am focused on the person and the present moment, which is relaxed, because I'm not fretting over what's coming next. This means that I don't care if people know I'm a fuckboy, and beyond that, I see how if I'm not always having my guard up trying to hide who I'm checking out and with whom I'm flirting, I'm likely to be more alluring. Beyond this, I see how the game of attraction involves chasing, and impelling a girl to chase me by turning away from her, ignoring her, or even checking out or flirting with someone else can always be construed as an attempt at seducing the one I'm ignoring-- thus creating the conditions for her to chase me!

Third, surveying the scene without anxiety. This of course, means seeing men as nonthreatening and women as potential friends too, to begin with. Amongst all the women, I can develop a few categories based on a) my attraction level; and b) their frame of mind. It's easy to read people, unless you are like I've always been and are completely stressed out about your own problems and anxious about incurring social wrath and condemnation for blinking at the wrong moment or something ridiculous of the sort. Today, at the library, I saw a variety of ways of breaking the women there into category. There were: sexual accustomization, or what they want to be looked at as sexually; professionalism, or how status-seeking they are; mood, or how needy they are for sex and emotionally vulnerable they are in the present moment. Of course, the super attractive women I saw who were alone, fell into a range of classifications with regards to these three categories; and the one woman who presented as a sheer and total whore was not sitting close enough to me to talk to (haha- that's a bold-faced lie, an excuse, and complete and utter bullshit, and I'm sorry for wasting GC Forum space stating it). These frames are all able to manipulated by more skilled seducers than myself.

Note that for me it is a breakthrough without thinking that one of the categories' membership "aught to contain a person I will marry." We aren't thinking about that. We, or I, am thinking more about having fun in the moment, and if that enters the equation, I'm backing the fuck out, because it's counterproductive to learning seduction. I'm learning this skill and I'm not buying into the idea that I need to sleep next to or have breakfast with the same fucking person every day, no matter how stunning, rich or intelligent they are. Plus, I want to fuck multiple people all the time. I'm a real renegade.

Three. Readiness to flirt with anybody by letting go of need to outperform everybody. I got lucky this week, and I observed myself throwing out three hand signals that respectively mean "I have a woman," "I am the king," and "I am innocent of betraying our contract," all falsehoods of course. What does this have to do with flirting? Well, by showing me how adament my subconscious is about portraying me in a mendacious manner to the external world, I became disgusted with it enough to overcome certain aspects of it, at least for the time being. What are the and signals and what was the context? The latter is none of your business, and the former you can figure out for yourself if you want to know badly enough. And there are resources on the topic to boot. I highly recommend Desmond Morris's Bodytalk: The Meaning of Human Gestures which can be obtained in free PDF form online as a starting point.

Completing this point, and somewhat connected to all the previous ones, I think that flirting is an all or nothing kinda thing when it comes to the group or community. It's not that you can't control when and how you flirt, it's that you are either capable of and willing to flirt with everybody, or you cannot flirt with anybody. Flirting is a fundamental skill of seduction, and it means making another person feel good as well as making everyone present feel good. Envy is a secondary emotion that could develop in some people, but the primary emotion in even these people will be delight. Therefore, a skilled seducer is color-blind, age-blind, attractiveness-level blind. He is not concerned about exclusion nor avoidance, because he is connected to something that enables him to express sexuality with anyone no matter who is present, and because he does not see doing so as anything other than a social gesture that doesn't have to leave the public, and therefore nonsexual domain.

Four. Engaging with the sexual frame. It seems easier than in the past, due to the realization that there is a physical continuum connected to sexual assertiveness. If I say, I want to kiss you, it can mean anything from "I want to kiss you," up to "I want to tie you up in my bedroom and stick my penis in your vagina, a big rubber dildo in your asshole, a coke bottle in your mouth, and then come on and subsequently pee on your face." And inversely, if I don't say "I want to kiss you," at the moment when something must be said, then nothing can happen whatsoever. Kissing is not any different than playing tennis or duets on accordian and harp with another person, and neither is anything else I've just mentioned, really. So why should these words or others like them be so hard to utter. If a girl tells you, "that was nothing like shakespear, I don't your dick anywhere near my vagina," then she probably wasn't interested to begin with. One girl did tell me that in a visualization, but never had one say it in real life, but it could always happen. Either way, it's not focusing on the desire to get to a place where it's appropriate to say to a girl, "I want to kiss you" that leads to it; it's everything around the setting of a sexual frame that makes it possible. Same goes for saying less subtle or more clever things in advancement of communication of sexual interest, all of which can be learned or invented with time and effort and practiced subsiquently. For me, that has been self-acceptance and learning to objectify women less, as well as a whole host of other things. When I put it all together, it won't be luck or fluke that I get laid a lot. It'll be because I know what I'm doing and am applying it to get what I want. It's one day at a time, but I think I'm getting closer and closer to achieving all of my goals here.

Five. Public Flirting. Ok, this one falls short of an actual full-fledged breakthrough, but I am flirting with it. There are a few behaviors I've either not been taught or have up to now viewed as socially objectifying of women, that I want to be able to do nevertheless. With so much of this stuff, I see how hating is a human trait that can be avoided by learning to do the hated thing. In this case, the two-cheek-kiss greeting is impossible for me to initiate, but others have initiated it with me. It is NOT common in my culture and in the area of the world I live in, but foreigners and a few special people employ it. Why not me? I've reflected on this off and on over the years, and really trying to get a breakthrough in this area lately. The last time I hugged my mom goodbye-- also the last time I interacted directly with any woman-- as I was doing so, I was thinking, "Now, I could kiss her on one or both cheeks, and she'd let me and wouldn't mind either, though she might make a sarcastic, fun-natured comment about it." (My dad doesn't do it. He also doesn't dance, crack sexual jokes, or hold my mom's hand in public or even at home in front of me. That's always one of my last-defense excuses to avoid a desired but feared behavior change.) So I didn't do it, but I think that I could have, and with work, I think I will greet women this way if I choose to do so. There's also a version with men that involves getting down on your knees, unzipping their fly-- oh, shit, I just outed myself as homosexual!

Come on guys, you know I'm just joking. "Oh, sure," my harshest homophobic critics are going, "only guys who want to fuck other guys crack that kind of joke." There is, in all seriousness, a version of a more enthusiastic, flamboyant greeting with other men, that again I don't ever initiate but do use with some of my closest long-time friends due to the environment we grew up in and the presence within it of a lot of dudes using it and mutual comfort with it as a result. It's just like a street handshake, that involves a fist-bump and perhaps short embrace with a pat on the shoulderblade as well. My comfort level with this is limited to men I think prefer this kind of greeting. Of course, there is also the man-hug. I like hugging men, not opposed to it, and have one or two male friends who employ it every single time we greet. These things, like everything else, can't be forced. They are both signs of strength and respect posessed by the people employing them. I see myself being of this level of strength and respect eventually, but for now, I'm putting this in the "future-breakthrough" category and wishfully tacking it onto the end of this "Breakthroughs" post.

Six. Approaching sexuality with an open heart. I am catching glimpses of this. The idea has transfered from the athletics arena to this self-help arena and beyond. I was a natural at a team sport, and by the time I was 14 years old, I was declining due to an attenuated heart. It's not an excuse, it's the reality. Early coaching led me to try to fit my performance into unnatural frameworks, I developed habits that worked against my natural gifts, and little by little my heart shut down, resulting in a decline in many aspects of performance even as I improved in others (through the Division 1 and semiprofessional levels in case anyone was wondering) . Lately, I've been exploring ways of opening to the orriginal gifts in the team sport I always loved and the other things I pursue once more. At 41, it's too late to reach my full potential as an athlete, but by focusing on letting go of preconcieved notions of how I should perform, I'm finding that I'm less constricted and more fluid in my play. There's no forcing these things, but there's also no need to get anything out of it. In learning any skillset, there's a time for study and a time to let loose. By transferring this idea to this arena, I'm finally finding the middle ground in my study and practice of seduction, and I'm doing it by focusing on myself rather than what others think of me. I'll learn at my own pace, practice at my own pace, and pick and choose what I try, keeping in mind that there is a sweet spot where I'm challenged but not too challenged. Kids find this sweet spot automatically, and it's a shame when they are coached out of it, because when it happens in one area, it fucks everything up else as well. This is a big breakthrough, and fitting way to close this post.
 
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PrancingRabbit

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
64
On How Things Are Going In General

First off, I wanted to take a moment to express gratitude for this website. Journaling is a practice I believe in and it had gotten stale for me. This forum has re-invigerated my practice, so thanks to the "void" that is cyberspace for providing it and to those keeping it going.

I'm kinda amazed at how much I've shared, and while I have had a bunch of breakthroughs, and I probably could go out and get dates without that much stress, I still have a lot of work ahead of me, because I'm still out of work, indulging in a couple key addictions way too much, and not regulating sleep/wake whatsoever or eating well. I share this because it doesn't matter what the void thinks, so I might as well be honest with it and not give up midway through the process.

Does it authentically feel like I am midway through? I want to try to answer that question in this post. I think doing that will put me back in the drivers seat after a full week of serious debauchery characterized by acute isolation and utter neglect of all responsibilities to self and others. Here are key areas of evaluation.

Visualization Practice
I want to do more work with visualizations of rejections. They have helped me find an internal resiorvior of creativity, inginuity when it comes to responding to a rejection or dismissal. They are also a fine method to objectively evaluate my skills without actually going out into the field, which I was not ready for and still don't quite feel ready to do. (Hey, it's not a race and nobody is quitting here.) What I think I'm finally coming around to, is that we can have a quite significant impact on the attidudes and perceptions of others by controlling our own frame on reality.

More social situation visualizations- I am going to keep going with these visualizations, and I am going to come up with some new scenerios other than seduction to work with. They will be: a discussion with someone I want something from; an interaction with someone who thinks I have wronged them; an interaction with someone who I think is trying to take advantage of me; singing in public; and dancing in public. I'm already toying with all of these, but this makes it official; and I will do one of these every day for the next three months.

On addictions- I see nothing wrong with discreat binging episodes, but I need permission to abstain completely from some things the vast majority of the time due to the need they have to become "friends forever" every time they visit regardless of my mood. Need to with sugary foods, breads, pornography (shouldn't be that hard if seduction is panning out), cannabus, and streaming movies on the internet. My assignment to myself is to do a "practice resisting visualization" every day for the next three months. I'll imagine myself being tempted and caving, being tempted and not caving, and then call it a session.

On taking care of business around the house- What is the point of cleaning? What is the point of bathing? I get clipping your nails because they tear and rip clothes, but the rest of hygiene is a total mystery to me. But I get doing the dishes and cooking so that the kitchen is clean to cook in and there is food to eat all the time. And I get doing laundry and sorting it into (unfolded) piles. And I get having a file system and calendar, paying bills and shit like that, but I'll be damned if I can get myself to do any of these things on the regular-- and I don't even have a job or any responsibilities. And you can't ignore these things forever. What I really fucking hate is how good it feels to do the dishes. What do I need a rush of "positive sensation" through my spine just for doing some fucking dishes? Why should my head race otherwise the entire time I am doing them? Or anything else for that matter? What is life but an endless moment of mundane bullshit, sex included, with emotions thrown in to clogg up the works? That is a direct quote from Schopenhaur. So I am going to do a visualization every day for the next three months with this one too. I'm going to imagine myself doing them and being done with them, and being tempted to procrastinate and caving to that temptation, and then be done with that one as well.


Apply safety/challenge/alarm zones to habitual avoidance of responsibility?
Before getting into the topics in the heading, I hereby re-up on my commitment to honor my phobias and not force myself to interact with them. This is not "living small," this is admitting that I have some issues, and opening to the possibility of change through an idea or behavior I have not yet thought of by letting go of my desire to live out certain fantasies.

I think I really valued the sense that I could walk away from any situation that becomes so uncomfortable that it was causing me extreme emotional distress, and that by giving myself permision to let go, I was beginning to re-set my alarm triggers to more reasonable perameters. I don't know how many times I will need to come back to this "reset" mode, but I do realize that this idea only carries me so far, due to my not being able to "trade myself in" for a new human experience; and that makes me somewhat upset.

On work/vocation- I think I need to remediate my current approach using this outlook. Bottom line is that I have a lot of anxiety over social situations. I should avoid two primary things in a work setting: group encounters (unless I am leading the group lol); discussing personal matters; and discussing the performance of others. I'm going to rant about one of these now so skip the remainder of this paragraph unless keenly interested in my rant. I can show up at a job and tell people I don't like talking about myself (because talking about myself is what always gets me into trouble) and use an escalation technique from NVC (nonviolent communication) to maintain the boundary, which terminates in termination of the interaction by requesting that the other person go away or stop talking. I could begin by saying, "I don't want to talk about myself/I don't like answering personal questions/I don't see how that is related to the job/I'm focused on the job and don't want to talk right now/I'm not into sharing that much, maybe another time/I'm a bore, what causes you to ask me personal questions anyway/that's personal and you're making me feel uncomfortable/I'm not a very interesting person, you are wasting your time asking such questions/I'm not open to sharing personal things with co-workers." In order to pull this off, I would just need to be ok with not making any friends at work-- which would be fine, right? Plus, I could point out that they can share whatever they want with me, I just don't want to share with them about myself. What sports I like, what my politics are, whether I'm married, what I do outside of work, where I live. People will probably give up on getting to know me and just leave me alone, as long as I leave them alone. And those who share will probably stop sharing when I refuse to opine and either keep my mouth shut or reflect what they say back to them, refusing to agree or disagree. Every morning I wil need to repeat to myself that talking about myself is what gets me into trouble, and that no topic is unpersonal enough, and that I can't even engage in conversations about sports, tv shows, or the weather. Can't tell anyone my life story, can't get to know any of my colleagues. Don't need to be friends with coworkers and students. Just do the job, cooperate, compliment people when they diserve it, take on the persona required of the group dynamic,and go the fuck home. Level one is telling people I don't share personal shit and defining that. Level two is pointing out that they are repeating a behavior that isn't going to go anywhere because I don't share personal shit. Level three is repeating level two and adding a request that the person decist from engaging in the behavior of asking me personal questions. Level four is repeating level three and adding an altimatum, for example telling the supervisor that I have asked a coworker not to ask me personal questions and they continue doing so and asking them to talk to them about it or do something to get them to stop, or telling them you are not going to continue talking to them if they ask any more personal questions. I may need to add a couple other behaviors to the "abstain" category. If people insist on talking about themselves and sharing what they did over the weekend and shit, I have no fucking idea what to say to them, other than, "Wow, that sounds very interesting, I could care less about your personal life."

On expressing myself sponteniously- I can only do this alone, and when in the presence of others, I sensor myself. I freek out when I think about dancing, humping the air, impersinating others, improv acting, singing and freestyling (rhyming). I am going to do visualizations for these behaviors, but I am also putting them in the "do not attempt until you feel more self-confident" category. I think about how I don't express myself freely all the time, but not once have I given myself permission to not perform. It's a really novel idea for me! Let's see how that, along with the visualizations, goes for a while.

On writing a book- Same story, really. It's gotta be put into this post because I want this post to touch on every category so I can't make escuses later when I need something to hold myself accountable with. Everything fits, it's just a matter of figuring out where; and writing a book, my big life-long ambition, is no different. I'm so stressed about it and the slowness of progress on it that I think this is where it goes. I need an escape hatch and this is it. I don't have to publish to have self-worth. It's not worth going crazy over. I'm avoiding certain aspects of the process and these need to be reckoned with one by one. Forcing it is not the way to do that. I need permission to step back and look at those things without internal pressure. And I need, again, to remind myself that I am going forward whether I like it or not, and that I prefer to try it the anxiety-free way. So this is a goal, and I a acknowledge that I'm not making good headway, and saying that's ok. Ok? Okay.

Studying Seduction Tactics

This gets its own section, but is really just like doing the dishes and all those other responsibilities. I will figure out how to fit this into one of the two sections above, along with French practice, swing dance practice, thank you letter writing practice, and every other god damned thing I am avoiding. The list is unimaginably long and I am feeling negative so I'm admitting as much. This area gets its own heading and section though because it is after all the topic of this self-help forum, and a huge motivator in working on all of the above for me. The tactical stuff is not going to invent itself, though it is going to be aided by keeping my heart open.

Progress Summary

The good- The idea of keeping an open heart and applying my own creativity to seduction scenarios are the biggest two breakthroughs I've had, perhaps in addition to the practices I'm developing as I persist in developing a seduction practice baseline comfort level, this journal thread included. I am also thrilled with coming up with a readiness to seduce model, and think it is unique. I think it's worthy of being made into an article for this or another venue at the very least. I am happy to report these two changes: 1) when I think about approaching in an abstract way (meaning, not while in the field) I don't bounce from idea to idea but instead focus on each part of the interaction, instead trying to visualize a natural introduction of the sex frame; and 2) I initiated contact with an old "flame" and feel in control of the frame in text.

Specifically, I'm communicating intent only along sexual lines and I am not engaging in long drawn out text exchanges in the hopes that something sexual will pop up. Basically, I'm telling her I see us engaging in sexual acts and asking her about her body and not evading those direct observations and questions. She deflects and I persist. Last night she said "I'm getting horny and am not going to be able to sleep now," and I told her I did it on purpose. It's fun, and hanging out in person will be the same.

The bad- I am depressed and have low activity levels and don't feel ready to approach. I think I am erring on the side of caution, but I need to put a bit more work in to get myself prepared mentally and emotionally. Women seem to be so sensative these days, and I hate the idea of spooking someone out of going to their regular study spot or even just going out in public in general. These concerns hold me back. They are valid, but need to be reckoned with. Otherwise, I am not prepared to use a gambit or set on escalation or escape/withdrawal maneuvors and need to get these things sorted.

The ugly- It's all laid out for anyone who cares to know, above.

Thanks for reading, I'll be back soon. I made some big committments in this post but they are not radical, and are just challenges I am up for taking on, in no small part thanks to this forum. So thanks again.
 

PrancingRabbit

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
64
An unposted response to another contributor's post

I just came across a post seeking advice on approaching in a country where thugs routinely attack seducers, or anyway one risks attack for approaching. I wrote the following in response, which I am sharing here for two reasons: 1- it is an expansion of a theme I've been working on here; and 2- I don't know if this is constructive feedback or not. This seems like a safe place to ask for feedback on my feedback, since I'm not actually addressing another person with it. The feedback provides context, but beyond that, what I am wondering is if it is too self-absorbed, too long, or too something. I felt inspired to write it but feel like it's too much to post, even though it does directly address the question/issue being raised by the contributor. Here's the response, then.

I've got this visualization practice going based on advice of one of the Chase Podcast guests. It started out visualizing approaching and getting rejected (per guest's instructions, you gotta include the rejection or dismissal in your visualization), and it has expanded to some other things, including conflict scenarios. As a result of sticking with this over a couple months (doing it ocassionally when I think of it and have the willingness) I think I am developing a) on a meta level, an "intangible" sense of self-esteem that is chipping away at a anxious, dismissive and avoidant attachment pattern; and b) a basic skill-set for dealing with conflict, which I think seduction in a way is a form of. Of course, conflict is what you are talking about in your post as well, and the approach BB above mentions is kinda the essence of the whole thing for me too. What it comes down to is keeping a loose grip with your mind (the open heart thing, basically), and identifying the most skillful path through the situation based on informed hypotheses of what is motivating everyone present, yourself included. And of course, you won't willingly enter every situation no matter how "full of love" you are, I'm guessing. Anyway, what these "worst-case-scenario" visualizations help produce skillful means through a sort of imaginitive conjjuring, though of course they can't ultimately replace actual field practice. For me, as I practice, I am finding that I have an insecurity reflex occuring way before or quite seperate from an actual encounter with another human being, and within an encounter, way before the presence of any actual conflict. Noticing the reflex is about as far as I've gotten at this point, though I hasten to add that I feel more "in the drivers seat" socially due to simply gaining awareness of the presence of a habitual fear pattern, aided by the creative forces I am gaining access to during the visualizations-- nothing other than applying my intellect in a simulated experience I am in complete control over-- and the awareness of their presence within me subsiquent to the same. Back to the idea of skillful means- I guess I would be ok with characterizing such means as "the way of love," as BB does. Having eight women like that all the time appeals to me as well.
 

PrancingRabbit

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
64
Stage One of My Reorganization Is Complete

In this post:
  • Gratitude for Girls Chase and SSF
  • Completion of seduction learning model concept
  • Growth projection in seduction practice going forward
  • Identity concept here going forward

Gratitude for Girls Chase and Skilled Seducer Forum
I'm both a lone wolf and have an Assertive social style. When I engage, unless I'm really on my game, the Assertive trait-set sometimes puts or scares others off (temporarily, seldomly in the case of inner circle members), and when I'm withdrawn I'm choosing my own isolation. Therefore, having a keyboard to "turn to" at all times, that neither bites back nor runs away when I abuse it, has been pretty integral to the growth I've managed to do. This growth has been along both theraputic, self-development lines and talking-to-girls lines, and participating on this Forum has been way more than just typing on a keyboard in-between masturbation sessions. I'm getting the benefit of the illusion of being heard by others, and periodic affirmation that I am in fact being listened to in the form of feedback that is always delivered in the most respectful, compassionate manner. As for the feedback itself, it is always on-point. I consider myself vastly fortunate to have had access to the vast resource that is skilledseducer.com for the past several years. I've gotten so much out of being here that I am actually wondering if I could have gotten to the point I have without Girls Chase.

Completion of A Seduction Learning Model Concept
What I've gotten out of my attendance on Skilled Seducer Forums is quantifyable, and though the math involved in doing so is above my pay grade, I'm intersted in examining the "exponential growth" phase I'm entering, the "spinning wheels" phase that has led to it, and the "stagnation" phase that is eventually going to occur through the lense of mathematics. My reason for wanting to do so is that the "S Shaped Curve", I believe, is the meta-model serving as umbrella to two other models I created since getting into the growth phase of the Curve-- only very recently by the way-- namely the social model of seduction readiness and the physical model of seduction readiness, respectively. These two models (a rough sketch of the former is published above; the latter is projected to be on the way) are themselves incomplete as far as describing the pattern of development involved in learning how to seduce women with which I am engaged on this Forum. I have superficially digested the following exerpts from two Wikipedia articles on this math and, notwithstanding what is to follow in "Growth Projection In Seduction Practice Going Forward" below, I offer them as conclusory remarks on the concept of S-shaped curve as Meta Model for growth in seduction skills and potential development of this aspect of what now seems to be a threefold model of suduction readiness.

From <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sigmoid_function>
A sigmoid function is a mathematical function having a characteristic "S"-shaped curve or sigmoid curve.

A common example of a sigmoid function is the logistic function shown in the first figure and defined by the formula:[1]

�(�)=11+�−�=����+1=1−�(−�).
{\displaystyle S(x)={\frac {1}{1+e^{-x}}}={\frac {e^{x}}{e^{x}+1}}=1-S(-x).}

Other standard sigmoid functions are given in the Examples section. In some fields, most notably in the context of artificial neural networks, the term "sigmoid function" is used as an alias for the logistic function.

Special cases of the sigmoid function include the Gompertz curve (used in modeling systems that saturate at large values of x) and the ogee curve (used in the spillway of some dams). Sigmoid functions have domain of all real numbers, with return (response) value commonly monotonically increasing but could be decreasing. Sigmoid functions most often show a return value (y axis) in the range 0 to 1. Another commonly used range is from −1 to 1.

A wide variety of sigmoid functions including the logistic and hyperbolic tangent functions have been used as the activation function of artificial neurons. Sigmoid curves are also common in statistics as cumulative distribution functions (which go from 0 to 1), such as the integrals of the logistic density, the normal density, and Student's t probability density functions. The logistic sigmoid function is invertible, and its inverse is the logit function.

From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logistic_function
The logistic function finds applications in a range of fields, including biology (especially ecology), biomathematics, chemistry, demography, economics, geoscience, mathematical psychology, probability, sociology, political science, linguistics, statistics, and artificial neural networks. A generalization of the logistic function is the hyperbolastic function of type I.

The standard logistic function, where �=1,�=1,�0=0
{\displaystyle L=1,k=1,x_{0}=0}
, is sometimes simply called the sigmoid.[2] It is also sometimes called the expit, being the inverse of the logit.[3][4]

Growth Projection In My Seduction Practice Going Forward
I basically think I will be a low-performer, due to the the extremele length of time its taken to get into a growth phase, the shortness of the remainder of my time on earth and difficulty breaking out of some long-entrenched habits of personality, and not necessarily because I think I have any real limitation in terms of talent or abilities related to seduction. My growth curve, therefore, could be described as having a long trailing tail, and short or small upward curve of exponential degree leading to a flatline top out front that terminates when I stop practicing seduction.

I'm optomistic that I'll be making a respectable percentage of my shots in whatever turns out to be the equivalent of the intermediate pickup (hoops) league in seduction. It'll probably be middle-aged divorced women with occassional scoops of younger gals; it probably won't be a higher percentage than "respectable"; and I probably won't be having loads of "long-range conversions" like threesomes, orgies, married women, sisters, nuns, etc.

And I want to mention my X-factor. My X-factor is development of my personality, more aptly completing restoration of it. Two of the several defining traumas of my life were being booed in a school assembly in sixth grade (don't laugh or make light of this please; it really, really fucked me up), and being recipient of constant, continual bullying in middle school and high school; and my personality really shrivled as a result of these experiences in particular. The big things I am still somewhat struggling with-- which have both been complicated by the sophistication that comes with being a student of social sciences, by the way-- are making funny faces involving strong eye-contact and engaging in role-plays. I mention the roleplays thing a lot, but it's really important to me because I think I am missing out on some of my natural gifts, and being cut off from these particular gifts is extremely painful. I am catching glimpses of restoration of these personality traits, and once I get straight on the most skillful way to re-incorporate them (skillfulness in deployment being something I admit to having struggled with prior to trauma-induced relinquishment), I think I might be hitting a lot of home runs, er, making a lot of long range shots.


Identity Concept Here Going Forward
I've taken my presence here seriously, both because it ingratiates my ego and is helping me destroy my ego one key stroke at a time. I've spent a lot of time writing, much more than actually putting in actual work, but that's because I enjoy writing and want to maybe publish some of what I'm coming up with. Maybe my experience can help others in a forum other than this one. Maybe not. Either way, I think this is a fun activity, and I don't want to lose access to it or plan to stop participating any time soon.

That being said, I want to a) continue posting for my own edification; b) read more of what others write for enjoyment and edification; and c) interact directly more with others in attendance by replying to others' posts and contributing messages to the Chat area. Of these three areas, "C" is the most fraught for me, due to having a dysfunctional communication style. It's not fair to work through these types of issues on other people's dimes, so there is a bit of tension between what I aspire to do and what I think are very real limiting factors in my abilities and personality affecting the reality of what I can occomplish. I hope to reflect more on this and may be exploring this theme, how I can directly interact on the Forum in a constructive, beneficial way for both myself and others, and whether that's something I would actually enjoy or not, in future posts in this Thread. One thing that occurs to me at the moment, which I think I will close with, is that the skillset one can learn hear does lend itself to being deeply accepted in any community, and as I believe I am growing in many aspects of this skillset, perhaps I will succeed in becoming a valued, "senior" member of this Forum. Time shall tell!
 

PrancingRabbit

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
64
New Insight Set: Been Working Hard

I have been working on my physical readiness to seduce model and am ready to share an outline of it with some connected insights.

Seduction is a social and physical pursuit involving navigating external and internal realities that involves continuous, ongoing homeostasis throughout, but seems to change everything at the same time, regardelss of outcome. Dealing with this paradox has lead me to produce a model of seduction readiness represented by two or more concentric circles. Below are the rationalles for and description of the concentric circle model of "seduction practice" as I have formulated it.

Seduction is unique among pursuits in how it is exhilirating regardless of outcome, yet completely and utterly unproductive. When one begins to practice seduction, one always stands at square one with regards to the factors that motivate oneself. I think these factors tend to be gaining something physiologically, economically and/or socially. These three factors are at play and very much comprise the mise en scène, so to speak, of practicing seduction, above and beyond any oher factors. But, paradoxically, they are not affected in any tangible or direct way by it.

Like a movie or a play, where the setting or container of the action are largely secondary but also the reason for the story to begin with, physiology, economic conditions and social circumstance both preceed and follow whatever you do, like an anavoidable but unnecessary companion. In the narrative arts, in one type of story arch, the protagonist always winds up right where he or she began, yet in the end nothing is the same. This describes seduction to a "T". The main elements of any and every seduction are physiology and economic and social conditions. (Social conditions takes into account location, political conditions, age, looks, etc.)

Physiologically, seduction involves at least one other person, who cannot and will not be controlled, and the sexual need is ever-present, never deminishing as the seduction proceeds along its path but always increasing that desire for orgasm. Regardless of success or failure, seduction is indeed a loop or circle, not a straight line, physiologically speeking. At the same time, if you fail in a seduction attempt, you are more likely to engage in masturbation than had you made no attempt to begin with. But even though this is an undesireable behavior compared to obtaining a sexual partner, it isn't consideing all possible outcomes, which include sickness, destitution and death.

Economically, taking time to pursue seduction, both in terms of the learning required and time it takes to seduce, involves an analysis of "opportunity cost" and "cost/benefit." It has nothing to offer in terms of an economic payout (unless you are stealing from those you seduce), and the benifits are intangible, but never economic in nature. Yet there is very little risk aside from the time sacrifice, if done right. Therefore, considering opportunity cost and risk/reward payoffff reveal that there is a mostly even calculus involved, and seduction can be seen as somewhat of a wash. As such, economically speaking, you end where you begin, regardless of outcome-- it's a circle. Socially, the same. At the end of the day, your friends are your friends, family your family, community your community; so after a seduction attempt, regardless of outcome, socially, you end where you begin.

These introductory thoughts provideI the gist of the reason I think it desireable to conceptualize a model of seduction readiness that capitalizes on the sex drive, economic conditions and social circumstances of a person wishing to practice seduction without negating the slippery nature of it with regard to each. The upshot of these insights, for me, is that seduction exists in a circular continuum rather than a linear one. As such, in seduction, one is benefited by seeing oneself as engaging two or more circles, a sex-, economic- or social-driven loop (depending on the protagonists in your story) and a set of "training loops" fitting concentrically together.

From this point on, I am going to focus on copulation as opposed to economic and social conditions. If copulation is not the main motivator, please switch it out with what is with relation to the following as I have described them above.

The "physical readiness to seduce model" I have come up with begins with a circle with copulation both at the beginning and the end and the phases of a seduction in between. (These are, open, hook, move, isolate, close, respectively.) The beginning is a state of zero progress, and it exists, so to speak, behind us. The end is the realization of the desire to copulate at the end of a progression, and is, for those interested in seduction, quite robust, though this may not be readilly obvious to the beginner. Since the beginning and end are the same, but one represents progression through a path, the framework we are working within can be represented in a circle. On one hand, you go nowhere, or "backwards," which means you masturbate or force sexuality on someone else through rape or coercion into sex. (Obviously, the latter is not OK; and hopefully no one reading this has ever felt urged to force another person into a sexual act and never has.)

Without seduction skills, masturbation is the only option open to you physically speaking. (Aside: there is an ongoing conversation over the difference between "pick-up" and seduction and I admit to a more nuanced view than this statement allows for being possible.) You do not advance through the model but achieve your ends as a sexual being nevertheless. This is a less-than-satisfactory state of affairs, even for those of us who are not in committed relationships in light of the fact that we are all capable of learning to seduce. In this case we have either begun without seduction skills or regressed to a state of having none or too little to travel the circle. With seduction skills, we have the opportunity to travel the circle, getting all the way around which we will realize the orriginal sexual goal-- only with another human being. The difference is simply in one case we have exercised our will to construct, or will to power, and in the other, we have not.

Using this model it can be seen that there is much to be said for both solo acts-- much sexuality that can be articulated and explored, especially now that one can literally endlessly gain exposure to others' sexuality through the internet-- and partner or even group sex acts, and both have their place and are valid and even vital at times. Introduction of seduction practice exists separately from the existence of the primary urge regardless of its essence, which does not alter. What practicing seduction skills alters is the social dynamic, one's ability to combine social essence with sexual essence. Learning how to combine these two facets of our nature takes time, even if we are "naturals," though the learning curve for naturals is clearly going to be much less steap and much smaller. The size and steapness off the learning curve determine change and satisfaction, but the limit of sexual-social satisfaction is the same for naturals and those with lesser or more eroded gifts in seduction. A sports anaglogy works well here. Lebron James and Joe Schmoe may be playing at different levels, but they both count one-pointers, two's and three's, and are both playing basketball, once Joe Schmoe can dribble, hold, pass and shoot the ball.

To continue with this metaphor, in order for Joe Schmoe to play, enabling him to travel around the ring (to clarify- in basketball, you do not need a circular model and I will explain why it's being used in a minute), rather than sitting at home at square one, watching others play or merely listening while friends discuss their pickup game, he or she has to want to play, to overcome his/her fear of performing poorly, and become open to the various roles, measured by performance and skill-set. Then s/he can learn the basics, and start to practice alone and with others. Ultimately, depending on talent and circumstance, s/he will become a participant in a basketball game.

Desire is not a given in basketball or sexuality. In the former, there are plenty of pursuits that could be equally rewarding and plenty of pressing needs that take presedence-- plus you don't have to play to be a superb analyst and fan. With sexuality, there's always the possibility of masturbating, and sharing with friends about fantasies and preferences without having actually experienced them. In both basketball, or other pursuits, and seduction, there is a "non-participant" version.

Another similarity between seduction and, for example, basketball, is that the roles in basketball and sexuality are defined by talent level and skill-set. In basketball, you have bench warmer, non-starter, and starter; forward, guard and point guard, respectively. In sexuality, you have pimp, player and monogomist; homosexual, heterosexual and queer, respectively. If you don't consider all of the options on the talent and disposition spectrums equally valid and appropriate, developing an identity in both an athletic pursuit and seduction will be difficult. It's difficult to be open when there is social stigma around one or another set of behaviors

The metaphor only goes far. The main differences between a hobby-- such as basketball-- and seduction are the social and economic risks, and the physiological processes involved in the pursuit of them. First, the social, political and economic conditions of the world today make learning seduction fraught with danger and risk that does not exist in most other areas of life. Accepting one's sexuality involves accepting the risks of expression created by these conditions, which means realizing what they are and where they originate. External ffactors create a percieved need to repress sexual expression, but repression comes from within.

Seond, sexuality, and of necessity seduction, involve an open ffeedback loop physiologically speaking, whereas no other social pursuit does. Athletics does not result in an orgasm, for example, but results in physcial fatigue resulting in the need for rest from it. Your on a closed feedback loop but the activity therefore exists on a straight line, in that once you begin the activity, you are guaranteed to make it to the end of the process, i.e., to feel tired and want to stop. But with seduction, you are engaging the copulation drive, and once you set out on it, you are not guaranteed to find a mate. This means that a self-defeating behavior is often inevitable, due to the need to experience the release of orgasm. (Orgasm is an open-feedback loop, one that involves release rather than homeostasis, as in, e.g., temperature regulation, muscle construction, etc.) Masturbation is self-defeating because it erodes one's drive to practice seduction, and it is as unavoidable in the pursuit of seduction as ffatigue is in basketball.

Seduction, therefore, is a pursuit that involves two opposing outcomes that are physiologically identical !). The physical readiness model must take this into account. How can it? It seems that the model could be broken into or partitioned into two or more concentric circles. The biggest, or outer circle, has room for all outcomes, and starts, ends, and ends with copulation. And the inner circles involve any behavior related to seduction except copulation. Perhaps this makes two categories, physiological and social, or perhaps outcome and process, or content and process. Whereas in basketball, where you have practice and competition, and skills and team, in seduction physical readiness, I have come up with copulation and non-copulation.

What I like about this is that it describes a path to sex with one or more other human beings that exists outside of the physiological reality seduction exists within, taking into account the following:
  • the verbal and physical skills happen concentrically, or alongside one another, and are infinitely various
  • the verbal and physical skills need to be practice independent of the pressure to gain the end of sex, else they don't capitalize on the capacity of creativity and open-heartedness we all have and are more likely than not not to come off well
  • additionally, the behaviors involved in seduction are almost universally percieved to be risky socially and otherwise and deserve and require focused, unffrayed attention-- which separation from the physiological process conceptually necessitates
  • the behaviors off seduction are themselves ciclicle, requiring delivery "in a loop," in repetition and alonside other loops-- which a circle does justice to
  • New verbal and physical skills do not seem to be related to the outcome, but one feels one is going around in circles until correctly applying them and doing so with proficiency, evoking the circular motion of a dog chasing its tail-- which a circle does justice to
  • a circle feels safe-- you can't fall off it, but just keep going around until you choose to switch circles or do something else entirely
  • additionally, a circle indicates a zone within the psyche one can approach, enter, or distance oneself from, alternately-- enabling an approach to seduction involving clarity rather than haziness produced by society's stigmas and standards
  • concentric cirles enable an escape from the copulation loop that seems, but is not, inseperable from seduction
  • at the same time, placing masturbation in the model is necessary because this is a physical model and it preceeds and often follows seduction attempts
  • at the same time, placing sex on the model obviously is required
  • concentric circles allows for a comprehensive view of seduction, one that embraces the sex drive without requiring one to "overcome" it, which is something that gets posited as advice from time to time

This model can be used to conceptualize the practice of seduction as a whole; alongside the social rediness to seduce model I came up with a few weeks back; and in a "break-apart" fashion, wherein, every aspect of seduction can be represented by one of the concentric circles, and each can be separated from the model to be considered in isolation for one purpose or another. With regards to the last, I envision a nifty application of a vin diagram with this "physical readiness to approach" model and the "safety/challenge/alarm zone" diagram. If a behavior you want to encorporate into your sexual repiortior is, or speaking about it with another human being, is not overlapping with your challenge zone, the vin diagram is inviting you to meditate on that behavior and invite it to move closer to your comfort zone.

Why is this a "physical" and not a social model? As I conceptualize it, the social model is about identifying a wholeistic approach to talking to women that may or may not include seduction, which is useful in and of itself. A physical model goes beyond the social model, and is about understanding how to set up and carry out physical behaviors, which is essential to being a skilled seducer. Though they technically fit into the social model, it isn't designed to cover these, so a separate, unique model dedicated solely to learniing about sex is, with space for all the variations within that idea possible (many of which are discussed in great depth on Girls Chase and the Skilled Seducer Forums), seems like it could be helpful. A physical readiness to approach model is about having sex in one's mind and emphasizing the skill-sets involved with that within the physiological and social, political, etc. frameworkds in which these exist. The key elements on the outer ring of the model are the phases of seduction (open, hook, move, isolate, close, I believe). While the model acknowledges that you begin where you end, and visa versa-- meaning sexuality does not have to involve a partner but is enhanced by one-- the model delivers a frame for learning how to set up and perform even the most intricate and delecate of sexual behaviors, from "open with a wink and a smile," to "close with--." (You fill in the blank!)
 
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PrancingRabbit

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
64
Reposts of Replies I Wrote On Another Thread of Mine

Below are several posts I have requested GC Moderator to remove from another thread. If anyone cares to check, it will be obvious what reply catalyzed these, but that post is not included. In a nutshell, I responded with off-topic content in a passive agressive manner to a post I did not fully understand in a rather hostile manner. Maybe now that I've republished here, GC will be willing to take down the original posts. I doubt they are gonna do it and I understand why, but this won't take up too many bits of data and fits just fine into this thread anyway because it's an example of me being crazy.


January 23, 2023

#27

Third Attempt To Apologize For Passive Aggressiveness

This is stemming from the post quoted in truncated form immediately below:
PrancingRabbit said:

Women...

...publish it.

The passive agressive post post is still up, and I'm getting active on this Thread again and am not satisfied with my previous two attempts to apologize for it. Whether or not GC removes this post, as well as the one it directly preceeds, I owe the user toward whom I issued the abusive language a complete apology where the wrong was committed (here). I am writing to do so now. I hope that this apology will be meaningful to anyone who reads this.

To begin a complete apology, by which I hope to make amends "in the 12-Step spirit of the term," I would like to state that I am now aware that I attempted but failed to apologize for my passive aggressive behavior in an older post, which is quoted below, and in the post immediately preceeding this one. In both cases, I failed to adequately address my problem behavior due to inability to grasp the nature of my tresspasses.

Chase Amente, founder of this Forum, wrote on the topic of avoiding passive aggressive behavior back in 2014. The post he devotes to passive aggression can be found here: <https://www.skilledseducer.com/threads/are-you-acting-passive-aggressive-time-to-knock-it-off….7170/>. In this post, Chase says that to close the loop when you have recieved a suggestion after you have asked for help, you must reply and limit your words to expressions of gratitude. He verbartum describes my behavior in the post and says it is, "Not the kind of passive aggression the term is used for colloquially, but REAL passive aggression - where someone asks for something, and then denies all efforts of others to provide what’s asked for, leading to maddening frustration on the part of the givers and continued dissatisfaction on the part of the asker."

For me, it's upsetting to see this description of my own behavior and the rest of the commentary Chase provides on passive-aggression, which I have been routinely guilty of in various settings for years, and which includes a spot-on explanation of where I'm coming from in this statement: "In truth, the behavior isn’t adopted because it’s 'useful' in achieving any real change in a person’s life… instead, it seems to be extreme indecisiveness about whether to hack it on your own or rely on others’ suggestions."

Part of why I'm rewriting my apology is to reverse engineer Chase's research as a cautionary tale to others who happen to stumble upon this post. It's also why I want to take the further step of asking the Forum Moderator to remove the two posts quoted in this one, which I know frustrated the person toward whom they were directed, which I am doing now.

The explanation of what caused my failure to refrain from passive aggression here in the past is that I carry anger inside me that has historically found its way out of me in the form of hostility toward others. Due to a belief that I have no innate self-worth and must attain worth through performing and achievement, when I think others are impinging on my attempts to "stand out," I become hostile.

I see curbing hostility as a necessary requirement of my participating in any community, online forums such as this one included, and I have found pretty damning evidence of my failure to do so not only in my ungrateful, contrary reaction to the reply in question, but in a failed apology-attempt soon after the initial delivery of passive-aggression, as well, quoted here:

I feel a bit like Walter in the Big Lebowski in the bowling alley parking lot with the Dude after he pulled a gun on ol' boy for not marking his bowl a scratch after his foot goes half an inch over the line and the Dude is like, "What the fuck Walter!" and Walter is like, "Am I wrong? Am I wrong?" over and over, and the Dude goes, "No Walter, you're not wrong. You're just a fucking asshole!" Unlike Walter, I'm not angry here.

I'm sure everyone but me knew I was full of s--- when I wrote that. If I wasn't angry, I wouldn't have posted the original rant to to begin with, and then I wouldn't have gone on to masquarade my open hostility in the form of this faux-apology. I was angry, and specifically angry that someone had a differing view from my own and had "the audacity" to state it in a reply on "my" thread. I hope the user I attacked can see that it was not personal. I regret my behavior and hope, again, that GC can remove the two posts quoted from above.

Once more, I am sorry, and I will refrain from all argumentative behavior in the future regardless of whether I've requested help or not. I understand that my ego is constantly deluding me into feeling wronged when I am not; I believe that I do not need to resolve my questions of whether I can hack it on my own or should rely on others' suggestions, being convinced that such questions also are based in illusions of ego; and I realize that I as an indiviudal am less important than the community as a whole, which depends upon an environment free of passive-agression to sustain itself. As such, if I do indeed continue to contribute to this community, I will either completely keep my contrary thoughts to myself, or express them elsewhere on the Forum in such a way that they couldn't possibly be construed as argumentative.


Jun 7, 2021

#26

User X I think I responded to you from "small mind" before, so I am sorry for that. You were just trying to be helpful and I shut you down. My goal will be to express my beliefs without hurling insults or otherwise escalating the emotions connected to the topic.


Sep 10, 2020

#22

I feel a bit like Walter in the Big Lebowski in the bowling alley parking lot with the Dude after he pulled a gun on ol' boy for not marking his bowl a scratch after his foot goes half an inch over the line and the Dude is like, "What the fuck Walter!" and Walter is like, "Am I wrong? Am I wrong?" over and over, and the Dude goes, "No Walter, you're not wrong. You're just a fucking asshole!" Unlike Walter, I'm not angry here. I mean, I realize that about half of America is openly hostile to the idea of women and men being equals and that this community represents a decent cross section of the country-- and that as such misogynistic views are going to be expressed in this community especially because the whole point is to talk about how men and women should relate to each other. I also get it that this community is like the bowling league, and there's no need to use the rhetorical equivalent of a glock to express descent. Which I hope I did not do and was not my intention with my last post.

Again, I have no beef with anyone here. I hope my views don't offend anyone and expressing my views is all I wanted to do in my last post and want to do in this one, not put anyone down. My assumption is that people are saying what they mean, and that unless there's indication to the contrary, people are not writing "in code." Because, if I was a random person with no skin in the game re: pick up-- just for kicks lets say a college-educated 63 year-old mother of two from Des Moines, Iowa-- stumbling upon this thread, I would say, "These people are misogynists;" I wouldn't say, "Oh, yeah, see this is just pick up slang and what they are really saying is that, you know, when men are courting women, it can help to frame social relations with women as 'helpless' and 'childish' and men as 'powerful' and 'mature,' but it's just a frame and these young men are just using hyperbole to make their points when they say stuff like 'women should never be put in charge of making decisions.' But they don't actually believe women are incapable of making decisions when it comes to their personal lives, and they certainly don't think that all women care about is makeup and hair and pleasing their male counterparts."

And if you believe that stuff, that's ok. And if you don't think it's misogynistic, I respect that too. I have stated that I think it is, and I hope you can respect that in return. In sum, I'm all about playing the role of the powerful, dominant dude when that's what's called for-- and that feels natural for me when I'm in a good place mentally-- but I just don't think it's appropriate to view my role as dominant all the time, and I think that I am well served in pick up if I view women as autonomous, willful, indeed powerful in their own rights. All of the social constructs that create the illusion of half of the earth's humans as helpless and unstable are just that, constructs, imo. They are arbitrary and the enlightened man sees through these constructs without throwing out his masculinity in the process. My question to anyone who thinks women can't organize their own personal lives and "shouldn't be allowed to make any decisions," is, do you expect those views to be perceived as women hating or is this interpretation off? The hypothetical Des Moines woman will probably find herself thinking about fucking one of these young dudes talking about the economy of "dick in pussy," and shit too when she reads this thread. But not while reading that she is incapable of organizing her own personal life, imo.

I'm going to let this go now (if Walter could do it I certainly can!) and meander through other parts of the Forum, as I said I would a couple posts back.


Sep 8, 2020

#21

Women
Can
Lead
Their
Own
Personal
Lives

My last OLTR, which ended about 12 months ago, was with a chica 11 years younger than I and lasted two years. She is a rich small-town kid with limited access to big city dudes like me, and she wanted badly for me to commit to her. While we were together, her fashion, locution and repertoire in the bedroom all improved, though I never fell in love with her. But she usually picked what we streamed, where we hung out, and what we listened to in the car. Why? Because she had an agenda with all of those things and I didn't. (Mostly her agenda was connected to my tastes being outdated due to our age difference.) So I let her "be in charge" of all of this stuff. What I got in return was a good grounding in pop culture, wide exposure to a new part of the continent and daily sex.

When I click with someone, guy or girl, sex or no sex, I don't try to establish that I'm "in charge" unless I'm feeling insecure for some reason, though I do enjoy power-dynamic role plays. In a relationship, I have no interest in being in charge of the calendar, itinerary or anything other than my own body, really. When I want to go somewhere or do something I say so and if doesn't happen I don't "double down," I let it go. When a chick wants something I'm all for it because I like having new experiences. When I don't feel like coming up with something, she had better be able to. I ended a three-month relationship with a chick who couldn't articulate an original plan let alone execute one because I resented always being the brains of the operation. She was a popular, intelligent and extremely beautiful woman, but for some reason I couldn't get her to ever take the lead. I just couldn't see her as a partner, so I broke up with her. (Side-note: I think if I knew what I know now, I might have been able to accept her as she was and love her in spite of her insecurities. She was so fucking perfect, it would have been worth it.)

USER X said:
Once they have a real man in their lives, they say "thank god", seat back, start to do very feminine shit they didn't have time to do before and let you take charge of those things.
What??! Women are more than being all about their makeup and hair and nails, and they find time for these things whether a "real man" is around or not!

I think there's a problem with conflating aspects of seduction fundamentals such as having a concept for dates, being able to break rapport, taking it if we want it, etc. with male monopoly on assertiveness and willpower in error. And now I will go on my soapbox.

F. W. Nietzsche, a notoriously bad seducer but equally brilliant observer of all phenomena human, embodies male confusion on the question of how men and women differ impeccably. His starting point might have been Arthur Schopenhauer, who famously says, “One need only look at a woman’s shape to discover that she is not intended for either too much mental or too much physical work.She pays the debt of life not by what she does but by what she suffers—by the pains of child-bearing, care for the child, and by subjection to man, to whom she should be a patient and cheerful companion.” Yikes! Nietzsche himself says, “Woman wants to be independent[…]this is one of the worst developments in the general uglification of Europe. Woman has so much reason for shame; in woman there is concealed so much superficiality, petty presumption and petty immodesty – one needs only to study her behavior with children!” Is someone bitter about his own childhood? This one from Nietzsche betrays his status as an AFC: “What is truth to a woman! From the very first nothing has been more alien, repugnant, inimical to woman than truth – her great art is the lie, her supreme concern is appearance and beauty.” Lmao. What a cynical dude!

In spite of his bitterness, Nietzsche has some pretty good insights about the nature and personalities of men and women as well. His assertion that, "Where men lack manliness, women will become manly," makes clear that women have a will and that at times all men lapse in willfulness. He's perhaps speaking of women in a pejorative manner, but he's absolutely grappling with the fact that women "win" power-struggles between women and men at least as often as men do. This isn't a shock, as having a will to power is a part of being human regardless of sex, and as the Schopenhauer trope above is patently wrong, regardless of what gets espoused as truth in popular culture, places of worship, and elsewhere. I think men should respect women's willpower and make room for it in seduction. Nietzsche also says, "The happiness of men is: I will. The happiness of women is: He wills.” This statement, which reveals a paradox that is easily explainable (read on please), typifies a false mindset that leads to horrible advice imo in the pick-up community, precisely because it contains a kernel of truth. While it's simply not the case, even in the context of relationships with men, that women categorically abhor leading, it is true that in some situations it is natural for men to be dominant, and that in those situations both men and women relish the dynamic that is created. But that doesn't mean that women don't relish leading nor that men do not enjoy following. My own experience abundantly demonstrates there are no fundamental differences between our nature, and I'm quite sure that my perception is not due to an "uglification" of culture. Men and women, again, both have a will to power, and we both naturally acquiesce to others' preferences almost constantly in just about every area of life. Men and women both find it empowering to make decisions (and that feeling doesn’t inexplicably apply to every area of life except one's "personal life" for one of the two sexes; that doesn't make any sense).

In seduction, as far as I'm concerned, men sabotage themselves if they act rigidly as if they are in charge, or as if they can exert will upon women. And yet, part of seduction does involve overcoming women physically and that overcoming usually begins with non-physical signaling, including demonstrations of brute power and aggression. That's because self-expression is attractive, even when barbaric, and men have quite a bit more of a chemical that makes them bigger and more aggressive (testosterone) than women. For me, the essential truth hiding in the statement, "The happiness of men is: I will. The happiness of women is: He wills," is the ingenuous observation that it is at once fun and an ego-trip to be thrown around, in the literal sense, by a bigger body. Fun because it's like being on a rollercoaster; and an ego-trip because the larger body demonstrates a will to protect the smaller body from harm during the dangerous maneuver, implying its (the smaller body's) importance and value. The advice that it helps with getting women to understand this natural dynamic if you are a laconic or reserved guy is well-taken. But in dispensing it one shouldn't lose sight of the fact that though the roles in this role-play are assigned by sex, the emotions involved are not unique to women. In other words, our biological dissimilarity does not mean that guys and girls have different natures.

From all of the above I form an attitude that sometimes I will need to showcase my manliness in seduction, and otherwise I need to be a good citizen and treat women as the equals I believe they are. I'm curious why folks think girls can't make their own decisions or men should dominate all parts of a relationship, but maybe the conditioning of Western culture causes us to. Either way, it does certainly explain why someone can refer to women as "children who should not be put in charge of anything" (c.f. above). Once more: all humans enjoy making decisions regardless of gender or context. Making decisions is empowering. This idea that women can't or don't want to take charge of their personal lives is pure fantasy, in my opinion. Where's the evidence or biological basis for this assertion?

User X said:
Also, your text needs improvement.

Agreed! And I look forward to reading the writeup you produce on texting when you publish it.

End Republished Posts
 

PrancingRabbit

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
64
New Insight Set: Been Working Hard

I have been working on my physical readiness to seduce model and am ready to share an outline of it with some connected insights.

Seduction is a social and physical pursuit involving navigating external and internal realities that involves continuous, ongoing homeostasis throughout, but seems to change everything at the same time, regardelss of outcome. Dealing with this paradox has lead me to produce a model of seduction readiness represented by two or more concentric circles. Below are the rationalles for and description of the concentric circle model of "seduction practice" as I have formulated it.

Seduction is unique among pursuits in how it is exhilirating regardless of outcome, yet completely and utterly unproductive. When one begins to practice seduction, one always stands at square one with regards to the factors that motivate oneself. I think these factors tend to be gaining something physiologically, economically and/or socially. These three factors are at play and very much comprise the mise en scène, so to speak, of practicing seduction, above and beyond any oher factors. But, paradoxically, they are not affected in any tangible or direct way by it.

Like a movie or a play, where the setting or container of the action are largely secondary but also the reason for the story to begin with, physiology, economic conditions and social circumstance both preceed and follow whatever you do, like an anavoidable but unnecessary companion. In the narrative arts, in one type of story arch, the protagonist always winds up right where he or she began, yet in the end nothing is the same. This describes seduction to a "T". The main elements of any and every seduction are physiology and economic and social conditions. (Social conditions takes into account location, political conditions, age, looks, etc.)

Physiologically, seduction involves at least one other person, who cannot and will not be controlled, and the sexual need is ever-present, never deminishing as the seduction proceeds along its path but always increasing that desire for orgasm. Regardless of success or failure, seduction is indeed a loop or circle, not a straight line, physiologically speeking. At the same time, if you fail in a seduction attempt, you are more likely to engage in masturbation than had you made no attempt to begin with. But even though this is an undesireable behavior compared to obtaining a sexual partner, it isn't consideing all possible outcomes, which include sickness, destitution and death.

Economically, taking time to pursue seduction, both in terms of the learning required and time it takes to seduce, involves an analysis of "opportunity cost" and "cost/benefit." It has nothing to offer in terms of an economic payout (unless you are stealing from those you seduce), and the benifits are intangible, but never economic in nature. Yet there is very little risk aside from the time sacrifice, if done right. Therefore, considering opportunity cost and risk/reward payoffff reveal that there is a mostly even calculus involved, and seduction can be seen as somewhat of a wash. As such, economically speaking, you end where you begin, regardless of outcome-- it's a circle. Socially, the same. At the end of the day, your friends are your friends, family your family, community your community; so after a seduction attempt, regardless of outcome, socially, you end where you begin.

These introductory thoughts provideI the gist of the reason I think it desireable to conceptualize a model of seduction readiness that capitalizes on the sex drive, economic conditions and social circumstances of a person wishing to practice seduction without negating the slippery nature of it with regard to each. The upshot of these insights, for me, is that seduction exists in a circular continuum rather than a linear one. As such, in seduction, one is benefited by seeing oneself as engaging two or more circles, a sex-, economic- or social-driven loop (depending on the protagonists in your story) and a set of "training loops" fitting concentrically together.

From this point on, I am going to focus on copulation as opposed to economic and social conditions. If copulation is not the main motivator, please switch it out with what is with relation to the following as I have described them above.

The "physical readiness to seduce model" I have come up with begins with a circle with copulation both at the beginning and the end and the phases of a seduction in between. (These are, open, hook, move, isolate, close, respectively.) The beginning is a state of zero progress, and it exists, so to speak, behind us. The end is the realization of the desire to copulate at the end of a progression, and is, for those interested in seduction, quite robust, though this may not be readilly obvious to the beginner. Since the beginning and end are the same, but one represents progression through a path, the framework we are working within can be represented in a circle. On one hand, you go nowhere, or "backwards," which means you masturbate or force sexuality on someone else through rape or coercion into sex. (Obviously, the latter is not OK; and hopefully no one reading this has ever felt urged to force another person into a sexual act and never has.)

Without seduction skills, masturbation is the only option open to you physically speaking. (Aside: there is an ongoing conversation over the difference between "pick-up" and seduction and I admit to a more nuanced view than this statement allows for being possible.) You do not advance through the model but achieve your ends as a sexual being nevertheless. This is a less-than-satisfactory state of affairs, even for those of us who are not in committed relationships in light of the fact that we are all capable of learning to seduce. In this case we have either begun without seduction skills or regressed to a state of having none or too little to travel the circle. With seduction skills, we have the opportunity to travel the circle, getting all the way around which we will realize the orriginal sexual goal-- only with another human being. The difference is simply in one case we have exercised our will to construct, or will to power, and in the other, we have not.

Using this model it can be seen that there is much to be said for both solo acts-- much sexuality that can be articulated and explored, especially now that one can literally endlessly gain exposure to others' sexuality through the internet-- and partner or even group sex acts, and both have their place and are valid and even vital at times. Introduction of seduction practice exists separately from the existence of the primary urge regardless of its essence, which does not alter. What practicing seduction skills alters is the social dynamic, one's ability to combine social essence with sexual essence. Learning how to combine these two facets of our nature takes time, even if we are "naturals," though the learning curve for naturals is clearly going to be much less steap and much smaller. The size and steapness off the learning curve determine change and satisfaction, but the limit of sexual-social satisfaction is the same for naturals and those with lesser or more eroded gifts in seduction. A sports anaglogy works well here. Lebron James and Joe Schmoe may be playing at different levels, but they both count one-pointers, two's and three's, and are both playing basketball, once Joe Schmoe can dribble, hold, pass and shoot the ball.

To continue with this metaphor, in order for Joe Schmoe to play, enabling him to travel around the ring (to clarify- in basketball, you do not need a circular model and I will explain why it's being used in a minute), rather than sitting at home at square one, watching others play or merely listening while friends discuss their pickup game, he or she has to want to play, to overcome his/her fear of performing poorly, and become open to the various roles, measured by performance and skill-set. Then s/he can learn the basics, and start to practice alone and with others. Ultimately, depending on talent and circumstance, s/he will become a participant in a basketball game.

Desire is not a given in basketball or sexuality. In the former, there are plenty of pursuits that could be equally rewarding and plenty of pressing needs that take presedence-- plus you don't have to play to be a superb analyst and fan. With sexuality, there's always the possibility of masturbating, and sharing with friends about fantasies and preferences without having actually experienced them. In both basketball, or other pursuits, and seduction, there is a "non-participant" version.

Another similarity between seduction and, for example, basketball, is that the roles in basketball and sexuality are defined by talent level and skill-set. In basketball, you have bench warmer, non-starter, and starter; forward, guard and point guard, respectively. In sexuality, you have pimp, player and monogomist; homosexual, heterosexual and queer, respectively. If you don't consider all of the options on the talent and disposition spectrums equally valid and appropriate, developing an identity in both an athletic pursuit and seduction will be difficult. It's difficult to be open when there is social stigma around one or another set of behaviors

The metaphor only goes far. The main differences between a hobby-- such as basketball-- and seduction are the social and economic risks, and the physiological processes involved in the pursuit of them. First, the social, political and economic conditions of the world today make learning seduction fraught with danger and risk that does not exist in most other areas of life. Accepting one's sexuality involves accepting the risks of expression created by these conditions, which means realizing what they are and where they originate. External ffactors create a percieved need to repress sexual expression, but repression comes from within.

Seond, sexuality, and of necessity seduction, involve an open ffeedback loop physiologically speaking, whereas no other social pursuit does. Athletics does not result in an orgasm, for example, but results in physcial fatigue resulting in the need for rest from it. Your on a closed feedback loop but the activity therefore exists on a straight line, in that once you begin the activity, you are guaranteed to make it to the end of the process, i.e., to feel tired and want to stop. But with seduction, you are engaging the copulation drive, and once you set out on it, you are not guaranteed to find a mate. This means that a self-defeating behavior is often inevitable, due to the need to experience the release of orgasm. (Orgasm is an open-feedback loop, one that involves release rather than homeostasis, as in, e.g., temperature regulation, muscle construction, etc.) Masturbation is self-defeating because it erodes one's drive to practice seduction, and it is as unavoidable in the pursuit of seduction as ffatigue is in basketball.

Seduction, therefore, is a pursuit that involves two opposing outcomes that are physiologically identical !). The physical readiness model must take this into account. How can it? It seems that the model could be broken into or partitioned into two or more concentric circles. The biggest, or outer circle, has room for all outcomes, and starts, ends, and ends with copulation. And the inner circles involve any behavior related to seduction except copulation. Perhaps this makes two categories, physiological and social, or perhaps outcome and process, or content and process. Whereas in basketball, where you have practice and competition, and skills and team, in seduction physical readiness, I have come up with copulation and non-copulation.

What I like about this is that it describes a path to sex with one or more other human beings that exists outside of the physiological reality seduction exists within, taking into account the following:
  • the verbal and physical skills happen concentrically, or alongside one another, and are infinitely various
  • the verbal and physical skills need to be practice independent of the pressure to gain the end of sex, else they don't capitalize on the capacity of creativity and open-heartedness we all have and are more likely than not not to come off well
  • additionally, the behaviors involved in seduction are almost universally percieved to be risky socially and otherwise and deserve and require focused, unffrayed attention-- which separation from the physiological process conceptually necessitates
  • the behaviors off seduction are themselves ciclicle, requiring delivery "in a loop," in repetition and alonside other loops-- which a circle does justice to
  • New verbal and physical skills do not seem to be related to the outcome, but one feels one is going around in circles until correctly applying them and doing so with proficiency, evoking the circular motion of a dog chasing its tail-- which a circle does justice to
  • a circle feels safe-- you can't fall off it, but just keep going around until you choose to switch circles or do something else entirely
  • additionally, a circle indicates a zone within the psyche one can approach, enter, or distance oneself from, alternately-- enabling an approach to seduction involving clarity rather than haziness produced by society's stigmas and standards
  • concentric cirles enable an escape from the copulation loop that seems, but is not, inseperable from seduction
  • at the same time, placing masturbation in the model is necessary because this is a physical model and it preceeds and often follows seduction attempts
  • at the same time, placing sex on the model obviously is required
  • concentric circles allows for a comprehensive view of seduction, one that embraces the sex drive without requiring one to "overcome" it, which is something that gets posited as advice from time to time

This model can be used to conceptualize the practice of seduction as a whole; alongside the social rediness to seduce model I came up with a few weeks back; and in a "break-apart" fashion, wherein, every aspect of seduction can be represented by one of the concentric circles, and each can be separated from the model to be considered in isolation for one purpose or another. With regards to the last, I envision a nifty application of a vin diagram with this "physical readiness to approach" model and the "safety/challenge/alarm zone" diagram. If a behavior you want to encorporate into your sexual repiortior is, or speaking about it with another human being, is not overlapping with your challenge zone, the vin diagram is inviting you to meditate on that behavior and invite it to move closer to your comfort zone.

Why is this a "physical" and not a social model? As I conceptualize it, the social model is about identifying a wholeistic approach to talking to women that may or may not include seduction, which is useful in and of itself. A physical model goes beyond the social model, and is about understanding how to set up and carry out physical behaviors, which is essential to being a skilled seducer. Though they technically fit into the social model, it isn't designed to cover these, so a separate, unique model dedicated solely to learniing about sex is, with space for all the variations within that idea possible (many of which are discussed in great depth on Girls Chase and the Skilled Seducer Forums), seems like it could be helpful. A physical readiness to approach model is about having sex in one's mind and emphasizing the skill-sets involved with that within the physiological and social, political, etc. frameworkds in which these exist. The key elements on the outer ring of the model are the phases of seduction (open, hook, move, isolate, close, I believe). While the model acknowledges that you begin where you end, and visa versa-- meaning sexuality does not have to involve a partner but is enhanced by one-- the model delivers a frame for learning how to set up and perform even the most intricate and delecate of sexual behaviors, from "open with a wink and a smile," to "close with--." (You fill in the blank!)
This is undergoing major changes and is so laden with problems I recommend not reading. I was just coming on to delete it but the window for doing so seems to have closed : (
 

PrancingRabbit

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
64
Check In

I'm reporting setbacks, seduction breakthroughs, mental-health breakthroughs and desired breakthroughs .

Overview.

I have been experiencing little to no despair (details below in the breakthroughs) and think that I am on the right track re: re-engaging in the labor force with the concept of using social ques and silence to protect my private life absolutely within a structured work environment. But I am not confident in my ability to practice these strategies effectively, and I am not keeping up with the visualizations. I am, additionally, all over the place in terms of my interests, and finding it difficult to stick with any one thing, which I think is necessary for growth. Finally, I am still not comfortable being myself and expressing my sexuality and silly side around others.

I will do an accountability check-in on my visualizations practice below in the setbacks.

Setbacks.

One. I'm not functioning well. In bed a lot, masturbating a lot, smoking cigarettes a lot and a bit of weed. I'm not working, don't want to work, spending very little time on my creative projects and think they are going nowhere, but unable to let them go in favor of something more constructive.

Two. I am not practicing my visualizations every day. I committed to do so in a post above, in which I said I would do visualizations pertaining to my food, porn and television addictions, sleep/bed seeking behavior, and social situations, especially approach scenerios and conflict scenarios.

Three. I have not been reading self-help articles. I really need to read now that I am convinced that seduction is something I can do, because I don't have any good material or much in the way of barings when it comes to evaluating the phase of seduction I am in in the course of an interaction. As a result, I am not approaching, and in social interactions, I encounter stagnation partway through most encounters. The exception to that rule seems to be when someone else already sees me as high-value and is offering something themselves to the exchange. This feels good, but is not enough. I want to get inside people, create a sense of vulnerability, and reward those who are receptive to me.


Mental Health Breakthroughs.

One. I did a six day no-fap challenge with a friend and at the end I felt I had overcome urges with a mixture of will-power and will. Will power means I really want to do it but fight and successfully overcome the cravings. Will means I don't want to and choose something constructive instead. Choosing something constructive means engaging with my productive, creative side. I think the way I was finding a will to engage with constructive activities is very much connected to the practices of acceptance and conflict visualization. There is a exponential effect of ithe self-acceptance practice that seems to be having a "branching-out" effect on my psyche overall, and revitalization of my will is just one facet of it.

Two. In spite of the setbacks above, I honestly think I am on the cuspous of regaining my old functionality back. The reading I did on the Enneagram, which I need to re-up on, helped me come to terms with a seductive but ultimately dysfunctional habit of "confiding in" trusted friends and family that I am "really suffering." According to the Enneagram System, my Subtype, Four/The Individualist, copes by telling themselves that they are different and others cannot understand their experience. The upshot is a closed-loop cycle, wherein any attempts to connect on the basis of confiding about unpleasent emotions just reinforces self-defeating attitudes. At the same time, I experience despair, an emotion that lies at the end of a very dark path, and leads only to isolating, self-sabotage, etc.; and I have been getting the upper hand on that. As a result of this breakthrough and the insight that sharing how emotionally broken I am with others is an insidious psychic trap, I committed to myself recently that I would stop giving negetive reports, no matter how dysfunctional and desperate-feeling I continue to be. This has been working out for me, as it seems to be forcing me to accept that I can't share something unique or special every time I interact with people-- which is the motive behind these shares-- and to instead come up with constructive things to share or share nothing at all, regardless of how uncomfortable those two behaviors feel due to my ego-based mindset that I am special. I think the fact that I am thinking of things to share and ways to interact with others besides and beyond my (often self-pitty-based) uniqueness is an indication that I am close to being ready or ready to take on responsibilities associated with self-sufficiency.

Three. More on despair. One, those who have been follwoing along may be interested to know that I am still experiencing wide-spread sinus pain that is often quite intense, and that I think I am overcoming the reflexive psychic pattern that has resulted in these pains precipitating the dark and painful emotion-sets associated with despair and self-hate. I think I have earned this after 20 years of dealing with this symptom set. I don't know if it will last, but I do know that I have "seen through" despair before, have done so once recently, in the presence of severe sinus pain, and have been free of despair, which as you may or may not know comes in waves and at the most inopportune times (any time is inopportune, really), and have been free of it since. I also had a day in there with a few hours of relief from the sinus pain and am trying to figure out what precipitated it. This came before the despair/dropping despair awareness and may have been a helping event.
Second, being less affected by or prone to despair seems to be associated with the self-esteem building I've been doing through the visualizations and radical acceptance practice, and to be influencing my social demeanor positively. Socially, I am calm for the most part, not worrying and wondering what and if people are thinking about me, not constantly monitering my own behavior by evaluating it in terms of productiveness and altruism, less assumptive of condemning thoughts in others. As a result, find it fairly easy to look at people and catch myself in the habit of avoiding others gazes, which I then correct.
Less despair, two, means I am also more present in the moment, and in the most odd and fantastic ways. Two examples will suffice to explain this. One was going on a date with an ex of mine. She is no longer interested in me, it turns out, but she did get flustered a couple times during the date, and I was present enough to be aware of it and realize it had nothing to do with me. This is very liberating but also fascinating because it's not something I was trying to do, but instead seemss to have happened simply because I am more present some way. Two, time is elapsing differently of late. I noticed this for the first time on a long walk to my parents house a couple weeks back. Halfway there, I was not anxious about having the journey come to an end, and I realized that I was equally aware of the walking behind me as the walking in front of me, which lead to the realization that I was more present with the steps I was taking in that very moment. I seem to be able to rely on this now. When I take the train somewhere, I'm not affected by the amount of time the sign says the train is going to take to arrive; I don't get hot and bothered when I miss my stop (this happened earlier today in fact); and I just sit and relax between getting on and getting off. I'm not aware that I am having higher quality thoughts or less thoughts, but I do feel as if I am more emotionally boyant, and that as a result of that I am taking in more information generally. This seems to be a beneficial thing, illustrated in the two examples just given. In one, I had more social cues to work with which compounded my sense of self-ease and centeredness in the midst of an itneraction; in the other, I was more open to being where I was in the present moment, less eager to get out of it, somewhere else and some other time.
Third, I am more compassionate toward myself, less insistent that I should not have a emotional response to my sinus pain. Again, for anyone curious, there are two comparisons that I'd like to share in this connexion. One is that those with tinnitus, which is a fantem ringing in the ears and seems to me to be similar in many ways to sinus pain (which is different than congestion-- very different), become psychotic in response to the development of it. The second is something pretty much everyone can relate to, the common headache. I recently had a horrible headache that lasted perhaps ten hours, and I was miserable. I am convinced that if it did not go away, I would become despondent and unable to funciton. It's just a headache, but its debilitating to a certain degree even if it only lasts a few hours. Imagine the psycho-emotional train of events that could happen-- and this is just theorizing here, I don't know what would actually happen with a permanent headache-- with a permanent headache. I suppose some are more succeptable to being negetively emotionally impacted than others, but this is my lot, and I am less "disappointed" in myself for being succeptable-- as I could no more have prevented the traumatic experiences and unhealthy social conditioning that lead me to be vulnerable in the first place than I could have prevented the onset of sinus pain, which itself remains a total puzzle to me to this day.

Four. Expanding somewhat on the last breakthrough listed, I think I am re-tooling my self-image with a less fatalistic, brutelistic mind-set. This is having an inward and outward effect as follows. Inwardly, I am experiencing less in the way of projections of judgment and condemnation. This is the radical acceptance practice and visualizations at work. I said I was not doing well with the visualizations, but I can share that it has evolved somewhat into something that includes the externals of the interactions I am visualizing, which is proving to be extremely helpful. I think blind-spot number one in visualization prior to this practice was including rejection. Rejection is part and parsal of a successful seduction, as it is not just an indication of one's own performance, but the substance of the other person's ego-- which is what one is trying to seduce, after all! A seducer works with resistence and captures it for his own ends like a sailure captures wind in a sail. It's more than something to "get past," its the element that makes seduction necessary and possible.
Blind-spot number two has turned out to be the externals. My mind is not just projecting negative emotions and thoughts onto the person I am interacting with directly, but onto everyone present as well. If someone walks away from an interaction, and you are around other people, you are still in an interaction, only now your interacting with people you never set out to interact with to begin with. These people are turning out to be a potent force in my projections, projections which are negative and self-condemning. Beyond this, the pressure of the social miluea, gestalt or tabluae, influences non-verbal aspects of behavior that can only be enacted in a calm state of mind-- non-verbals being associated with direct seduction as well as, critically, with the three mindstates of a seducer, namely sporty, sexy and happy. So I'm doing visualizations in which those external to the primary interaction are rejecting me in their minds, of myself doing silly things, including dancing, making loud exclamations, and touching and getting close to people.
As a result of opening up the visualization practice to non-verbals and the view-points of bystanders, three things are happening. Frst, I think I am expanding my social repiortior, at least in terms of approaching in my mind what has long been the unapproachable for me. Second, I am mining my psyche more comprehensively for self-hate, and self-condemning thoughts. Some of these thoughts may be hiding behind logic and reason I can't unlock otherwise. For example, those who "draw attention to themselves" e.g., by dancing in public, are uncouth. Well, uncouth people also do things that really are unskillful, such as taking their pants off and touching themselves in crowded places. Insights such as this are showing me that there are fears hiding behind fears, so to speak, and it's a relief to be seeing behind the elaborate curtain my psyche has erected to protect me from future traumas. Third, I am tending to be less selective in who I will interact with, and realizing as a result that my comfort zone was very restrive indeed. I think I'm looking at people as trapped in something that results in suffering unless they are applying conscious, constructive effort to their internal realities-- and as a result, I am seeing through surface features and find all souls to be more inviting, intellectually speaking. On one hand, I can eleviate suffering by smiling and interacting. On the other, I can learn how to deal with my own crap. This is extremely liberating.


Seduction Breakthroughs.

One. I'm in a stage of feeling confident in my ability to hide dissatisfaction and "act confident" around others, which I see as a primary stage in inffinite growth. I am seeing that there is a junction within that place of "calm and collected" that leads to a) passivity, which leads to avoidance or dismissal of others-- the avoidant-dismissive attachment style I have come to see myself as having-- or b) assertiveness through a sense of progressive security, and playful openness. In the latter place, there is a skill-set developing that is, shall we say, less than reliable. It's a moving juncture, meaning at every point in the progression of an interaction, insecurity is present, and can take me down at any moment.

Two. I think that what I am seeing is that to the part or parts of me that are traumatized, the only assurance that they are secure is total assurance-- or that there are multiple traumatized parts, and each one represents an offramp into passivity and retreat from the seduction. Also, every encounter is dangerous in the sense that all people want to be seen and seduced, and if they see you as someone who can perform, they either despise you, in which case they lash out or retreat, socially speaking, or they feel compassion and reject you, or me; and if they see you as someone who can't perform, they dismiss you. This is black and white thinking, but it's also healthier than thinking, "Some interactions don't count."


Desired Breakthroughs

One. I am not realizing my potential for spontenious and complete self-expression. I want to frame this needed breakthrough two ways. First, I am making progress on some of these assertiveness skills, many of which seem to provide excellent stopgaps when you have nothing to go on. Saying "I'd rather not" should be something I practice whether necessary or not on a regular basis, just to strengthen that muscle. I also am learning how to use breaking rapport in a constructive way, but need to gain in confidence in this. I find that one cannot do this or will not think to do it when it would be helpful when one is attached to an outcome. If you just don't give a shit, however, you can break rapport at any time in just about any way. You can ignore people, you can argue when you have nothing to stand on, or you can simply parrot what they say in a sarcastic manner. Hell, you can even come up with something mean to say and offer that. It's powerful stuff that is more than a survival strategy, it's a tactic. It's a comedic tactic, one used by, to give two popular examples, Mindhorn and Inspector Clussoau; and it's a way to put people off-balance to create a wedge in their ego-defenses.
Second way I want to frame increasing ability to be myself is the realization that the best way to get people to accept you is to express authentic afffection and approaval. This is harder than it seems, but I am convinced that once I get on the "Affection Highway," I am going to find it easier and easier to do, and that finding people more receptive to me will in turn make it easier for me to be vulnurable and express myself authentically as a result. I will report back on this and the rest.

Fin

Thanks for reading!
 

PrancingRabbit

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
64
Housekeeping

Once again, I am here because I think I can get myself out of a long-standing slump of highly dysfunctional behavior through willingness to put myself out there more gained by the development of social skills I failed to learn before and/or lost through traumatic experiencein during and after early adolescence. The following are random observations from the past week or so since my last post.

One. As at least alluded to if not outright stated, my pathology rises to the level of disability and has for many years. There is something really wrong.

Two. There's been a ruminating habit and cognition depletion that precludes executive level work. I tell myself I don't fit in with the riff-raff, but I am stuck in meneal level work-life and am resisting that big time. I beat myself up for resisting. I psyche myself out of showing up and doing my best (either/or). It's an insidious cycle.

Two. One of the most common things I think is "I don't care" or some variation of the phrase. "It doesn't matter," "There's no point," etc. Seems relevant because I have no self-discipline.

Three. I am actually trying to unravel the tangled mess that is my life. There are so many seemingly conflicting ideas that I feel bewildered. At times I think I'm making progress, at other times I believe-- or am identified with something that believes-- I'd be better off dead. I've never admitted this, and admitting it is not a cry for help. I'm not the type to try to harm myself-- and I'd know it if I was by now.

Four. There is a ruminating habit. I need to admit that because it's not going away on its own and I don't know where the willingness, courage, etc. to break it is going to come from at this moment in time. It mostly makes it very hard to create and access long-term memories. When I look up a word in the dictionary, for example, I find the word, read the definition, but the whole time I'm thinking how it's impossible for me to retain new information-- and then I can't remember the word after 48 hours. If I can, I often will forget it after not using it for three months. (Jesus that's depressing.)

Five. There is cognition depletion. I have difficulty rotating objects in my mind not present before onset of extreme depression. There's a shot in 2001: A Space Odessy in which a character views a planet from inside a compartment in a vessel that is rotating around an axis. I can't visualize the perspectives of an object on the planet and an object in the vessel at the same time, enabling me to chart in my mind the spacial relationship between the two over time. It's the same operation as turning a map around in your head to place a destination in front and origin behind as you navigate turns. That also requires a level of complexity I simply am not capable of anymore. I really want to get my higher level cognitive functioning back!

Six. A second reason I am having the hardest time submitting to wage work is that I am fixated on the ideas that: I must be involved in large scale social change ventures; internal combustion engines are evil; and working 40-plus hours is beneath me. My ideas are becoming more and more radical as time goes on, and I equate violating my values with something akin to death, internally. For example, I won't commit to a job that involves use of a car or the potential for air travel, due to the belief that burning the fuel for such journeys is tantamount to environmental murder. No one else seems to care as much as I do, or to survive carrying this much. The kicker, though, is that I am not capable of arguing my points without relying on inventing facts-- not because the facts aren't available, but because I don't retain them. Or haven't figured out how to retain enough to convey a preponderence.

Seven. I am concerned that my behavior has been eratic on the forum. I've confronted people on chat, for example asking one member what his race was after they said "black dudes will like [xyz]" or something similar. Why did I feel I needed to confront this person, asking if they were black themselves, to begin with; and why did I need to do it in such a weird way (instead of just saying, "are you black?" I said, "are you sub saharan african?"). I also think that I write such heavy things that perhaps until I'm writing something uplifting, by interacting, I'm just harming or potentially harming those with whom I interact. I'm getting a little tired of my own voice, metaphorically speaking. What I don't like is that I engage "just for the sake of engaging," and it occurs to me that I seem like a pest or freeloader to those contributing constructively here.
 

PrancingRabbit

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
64
In this thread, @King said,

"The more I play this game I'm realizing its all about being non-needy and not giving a f*ck and making your moves properly. The more emotional you get or needy you get it completely ruins the whole thing. But this can't be the true nature of it? F*ck man this realization actually made me somewhat miserable. I already knew girls don't give a f*ck about men or their "feelings" but seriously? Feels like the less f*cks I give the better I can play the game and the more women will get attracted. The less shits I give the more responsive the girl is. The more emotional/ falling for the girl I get the more it pushes them away ugh... But this realization is kind of killing that good guy in me who wanted to fall for the awesome girlfriend and its all good. I'm sure many of you had realizations of women that killed your old beliefs and perhaps a part of you as well....... How'd you guys get over it or grow or get to a higher place?​
I'm tired of being in my feels and I just don't know or care anymore, but this feeling is f*cked up. I guess I have to fully kill the nice guy in me that wanted to fall in love. Cold hearted it is? Be the man be the player and don't fall in love at all? What another cold hard truth of life."​

Thanks to this contributer. I am quoting basically the whole post because of how much I got out of it. I have struggled with these exact thoughts for the longest. Have never tried to really overcome, but reading this really inspired me to do so now. I will check in on progress!

Along with Madonna/Whore complex, man, it's a rough road for those who want to overcome their conditioning and become seducers. One sentence, "Girls don't give a f*ck about men or their feelings," really hit home, in that it actually resonates. Really fits into the Madonna part of the Madonna/Whore idea. On the one hand, why do I need to protect women from exposure to ludeness and stuff-- just because they are female and I think they are therefore above sexual desire? Please!

On the other, should I think women actually want to avoid sex or are capable of it? No!-- so why should they get the "whore" label when they partake? I am being shot back and forth between two beliefs that are equally damaging, but not just in seduction.

Also at stake is secure attachment. It's bullshit unless the seduction ability is there, because one can't be secure by saying "I don't care if I have acess to women for sex," but must actually have the ability to gain access. Am I 100 percent able to release all jealousy issues? No, but I'm not a proficient seducer yet either. I am pretty sure that a man who is secure in his ability to seduce won't care all that much if they get cheated on. F it- on to the next one, or forgive it if I'm comfortable with the person.
 

PrancingRabbit

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jul 30, 2020
Messages
64
Update

Did some reading today! Yay!!! Included was a Forum thread on SOT’s (sexual oriented topics), an article on mirror nuerons (thank god I finally got that concept down) and a few pages of a Gunwich SMMA manual.

Also, I transcribed the most recent chat exhchange I was involved in here on the boards. Here it is:

PrancingRabbit: sorry for butting in, but can anyone explain the difference between open and hook? I think I am missing the essance of "hook" tbh
Reply: open is just speaking to her. Some r just duds, and they just dont wanna talk. hook is when she laughs at something you said that isn't funny. my main thing I watch for. Thas a high note too right. why I advocate not trying to be funny to open and hook. cause it takes away looking for that. can dancing monkey an half hour and shes laughing and not hooked. She laughs, i go for the compliance move. Dancin monkey theme versus seduction theme. comes a high point though shes giggling at nothing is good time to move her. get compliance. cause shes hooked.
PrancingRabbit: So laughing is a sign of nervous anticipation?
Reply: not sure exactly with all chicks personality styles. So open, then you gotta get her open-opened lol but its a definite high point to ask her to sit down. Cause they usually dont giggle at nothing unless fairly "immersed”. I try to mask my face when I hear her laugh at something that isn't funny. yeah can start compliance ladder from there well. moving her, making her ask name, what you do etc, so she feels like shes doing the chump talk work. I mean she aint a pua Haha so she doesnt have trained small talk shit. gotta leave all the basics for her vs offer name, ask what she does etc. then awkward silence and eject lol . need other shit to talk about.
PrancingRabbit: If I'm talking to her she's a sex worker
Reply: hey you see lottery was up to 780- million, what would you do with that? after she says he asks your name leaves her typical bullshit outs conversationally unused by time shes asked you evertything about self and volunteered everything about self she "feels as if" she is helping it happen and you different cause you talked some chick crack: lottery, vacations
and ideally are projecting behind it well: eye contact, tonality, use of distance between each other, touching her if its appropriate. basic GWM1 shit. biggest with projection is making her look away first on first eye contact guys shit on it but it is tech one. first eye contact so many even tough guys, hard workers etc masculine guys watch em and they look down on first eye contact with a chick sets frame. guys 6'5 25o lbs of muscle, works 60 hours a week hard labor cant hold first eye contact with a 5'2'' little girl lol flip side are average guy and make a 10 look away first sets a frame of "hmm this guy is different than most" again gets ignored but id say it is technique one of all. changes everything. why I like hey you know who you remind me of?" nah I dont wanna say you might hate her, then be mad at me" make her beg to know who she looks like, reminds you of etc: I try to project a lil of a surprised look, when i say u look like my ex lol then say who and "except there is something different about your energy, behind your eyes" gives reason to be looking in her eyes til she looks away first and can ruse from there on the energy, cold read etc. usually good hook sequence. yeah the eye contact is magic alone simple as it is. primal shit thats been lost
PrancingRabbit: And the approach is before the open even.
Response: hovered pretending to be on phone etc. she "noticed me" then I pretended to notice her and opened and she will insist "thats stupid, I seen you" when I seen her from across store and went over and did the approach induction lol so theyll be that far head in sand. The biggest thing for me where is she and what does she need to get alone with me is maybe game rule 1 other than eye contact vs all these guys "try to be this or that”. they have lot of different personality styles. way more information in a y chromosome get nerdy on it lol are like 5 types of men, 50 types on women, so trying to be anything is lame. need to be reading what she needs: arousal, emotions, social frame. thats the game. Of the three keys, Sexual Arousal, Emotional Stimulation, and Social Frame: Which is she lacking right now?Use Tech to give it. Basics— she’s turned on a touch and you aren’t in friend-zone.” You aren’t boring. And she thinks you’re “Ok to fuck” on intellectual level. All three keys are in place.
Reply 2: "Hey man it's Gunny here with my girl Preggy Peggy. Today let's talk about social frame and how to not waste time being alpha and instead just get pussy”…..
 
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