How hard is it for an average guy to get laid and/or get a girlfriend in this day and age?

Shake&Bake

Tool-Bearing Hominid
Tool-Bearing Hominid
Joined
Mar 4, 2015
Messages
239
I think you need to read my posts again.
'Looking bored' is ONLY what I do when she says something impressive, like 'I'm an architect', so it doesn't become a case of me competing with her status. But it is subtle not insulting and I am still pushing forward.

I can't believe you asked me if I flirt. Its basically one big flirt from front to back. Like I said I use strong eye contact when talking about sensual things like nature, meditation etc. Probably way more than most guys ever do. If you're standing three feet from a girl, looking deep in her eyes with a slight smile and slightly dilated eyes, and telling her with a deep slow voice that meditating is possible anywhere, you better believe it's flirting.

Flirting is not what you say, it's your fundamentals (eye contact, voice, posture, bodily distance) while you are saying it. You could talk about anything vaguely pleasurable (daydreaming, eating, meditating, being surrounded by nature) and make it sexual just with a change in your voice. Remember that any interaction with a woman who's not your mom or sister is implicitly sexual, in that you might end up fucking her and in the back of her mind she knows this possibility. So you don't have to go overboard and get explicit. Strong eye contact is the basis, slow voice etc builds on it.

Think of some food or drink you really like. Now imagine you were a hostage somewhere and the only way you could escape was to get in front of a woman and communicate to her 'I want to fuck you' but you could not explicitly refer to sex or any sexual acts whatsoever. All you could talk about was your favorite food or drink, and use your fundamentals to help you get the message across.
How would you do it?
So basically bringing up the topic of sex is a no go I presume? Especially if you're not a super attractive guy?

It didnt strike me flirting but I'm not the best I identifying that type of game. What about jokes and funny banter? Do you keep those to a minimum?
 

Beck Bass

Cro-Magnon Man
Cro-Magnon Man
Joined
Mar 9, 2020
Messages
635
So basically bringing up the topic of sex is a no go I presume? Especially if you're not a super attractive guy?

It didnt strike me flirting but I'm not the best I identifying that type of game. What about jokes and funny banter? Do you keep those to a minimum?
Depends a lot on your game and vibe. Bringing up sex before the girl is really confortable with you can fuck you up super hard.
There's a reason a lot of guys are more successful using innuendo and more indirect forms of sex talk.
Girls have a lot of reservations, weird shame that's been pushed on them by society, not to mention the facade the must maintain for their friends, for generic people out there, and even themselves, sometimes, because of slut shaming.

All of this makes it tough to talk about sex with them, at least at first. Even with girls you slept before you can come off the wrong way and creep them out if you come at it from the wrong angle, or she misunderstands you. That said, sex talk can be powerful if done right, and it's a lot of fun (for me, sex is one of the most fun topics to talk about, specially with girls).
It does take a lot of calibration and you can only get how far you can push it, and in what situations, with experience.

Also, this whole "super attractive guy" is bs, you might be "super attractive" to one girl, and be just meh for another. You might be a fucking loser to most girls, but maybe some cute girl is really into you. It all depends on the attraction the girl has for you, and you might only find out pushing your limits and leading her (paying attention to her signals, of course, not steamrolling over her will).

All that said, there's a lot of truth to what @Will_V wrote, you can take the most innocuous subject and make it sexy and flirty between you and the girl. I myself mostly hate boring ass conversation, so when the girl starts drifting into it, I just kinda dumb it down, go a bit more stoic and start talking about reaaally boring mundane stuff her in a really sexual way (voice, body language). I was on a date with a girl today and she would ask me to stop (while smiling, she was clearly enjoying it) when I was looking at her and mostly not talking. I was like "stop what? lol" and she would tell me "stop staring at me! stop seducing me!".

Getting your sexual vibe down and conveying your desire to a girl in an attractive way is one of the most powerful things you can learn to do in game, and it's vital you get this skill down. So I would suggest for now, stop trying to sexualize with words, and start sexualizing with actions (your posture, voice, body movement/language, don't just put your D out lmao)
 
Last edited:

Will_V

Chieftan
Staff member
tribal-elder
Joined
Jan 24, 2021
Messages
1,539
So basically bringing up the topic of sex is a no go I presume? Especially if you're not a super attractive guy?

It didnt strike me flirting but I'm not the best I identifying that type of game. What about jokes and funny banter? Do you keep those to a minimum?
The way I see it, bringing up the topic of sex in a way that involves her is a complete no go. It destroys tension irreversibly.

You can talk about sex in a general way, but you have to be very careful. I'd say it's pretty much a no go in the first interaction - I may mention it very briefly and immediately move on, if she's really into me, but it's a potential landmine.

On a first date, it's not a bad topic imo but must be handled with absolute care. I was on a date recently and talked about how dancing is a much better way to get to know someone, they can say anything but the body doesn't lie, kind of like sex, you can feel how she moves and responds to how you move .. I basically hopped between dancing and sex while making my point, depending on how she was reacting. In the end she agreed "I can understand that!" - but honestly I only did it because the conversation was too dry, and I can read women well. It is 100% unnecessary and easily backfires.

Can I ask something of you? Will you write down your ideal first conversation, like I did for you, even if you have never had it yet. It must be a successful one, where you get the number of a girl you like, and like I did write a few sentences at the end about why it worked. This would help us pinpoint maybe a sticking point in an otherwise solid interaction, and iron things out for you.
 
Last edited:

Shake&Bake

Tool-Bearing Hominid
Tool-Bearing Hominid
Joined
Mar 4, 2015
Messages
239
The way I see it, bringing up the topic of sex in a way that involves her is a complete no go. It destroys tension irreversibly.

You can talk about sex in a general way, but you have to be very careful. I'd say it's pretty much a no go in the first interaction - I may mention it very briefly and immediately move on, if she's really into me, but it's a potential landmine.

On a first date, it's not a bad topic imo but must be handled with absolute care. I was on a date recently and talked about how dancing is a much better way to get to know someone, they can say anything but the body doesn't lie, kind of like sex, you can feel how she moves and responds to how you move .. I basically hopped between dancing and sex while making my point, depending on how she was reacting. In the end she agreed "I can understand that!" - but honestly I only did it because the conversation was too dry, and I can read women well. It is 100% unnecessary and easily backfires.

Can I ask something of you? Will you write down your ideal first conversation, like I did for you, even if you have never had it yet. It must be a successful one, where you get the number of a girl you like, and like I did write a few sentences at the end about why it worked. This would help us pinpoint maybe a sticking point in an otherwise solid interaction, and iron things out for you.
Yeah I would be pretty hard for me to know how conversations would work because I suck at conversations
 

Shake&Bake

Tool-Bearing Hominid
Tool-Bearing Hominid
Joined
Mar 4, 2015
Messages
239
Depends a lot on your game and vibe. Bringing up sex before the girl is really confortable with you can fuck you up super hard.
There's a reason a lot of guys are more successful using innuendo and more indirect forms of sex talk.
Girls have a lot of reservations, weird shame that's been pushed on them by society, not to mention the facade the must maintain for their friends, for generic people out there, and even themselves, sometimes, because of slut shaming.

All of this makes it tough to talk about sex with them, at least at first. Even with girls you slept before you can come off the wrong way and creep them out if you come at it from the wrong angle, or she misunderstands you. That said, sex talk can be powerful if done right, and it's a lot of fun (for me, sex is one of the most fun topics to talk about, specially with girls).
It does take a lot of calibration and you can only get how far you can push it, and in what situations, with experience.

Also, this whole "super attractive guy" is bs, you might be "super attractive" to one girl, and be just meh for another. You might be a fucking loser to most girls, but maybe some cute girl is really into you. It all depends on the attraction the girl has for you, and you might only find out pushing your limits and leading her (paying attention to her signals, of course, not steamrolling over her will).

All that said, there's a lot of truth to what @Will_V wrote, you can take the most innocuous subject and make it sexy and flirty between you and the girl. I myself mostly hate boring ass conversation, so when the girl starts drifting into it, I just kinda dumb it down, go a bit more stoic and start talking about reaaally boring mundane stuff her in a really sexual way (voice, body language). I was on a date with a girl today and she would ask me to stop (while smiling, she was clearly enjoying it) when I was looking at her and mostly not talking. I was like "stop what? lol" and she would tell me "stop staring at me! stop seducing me!".

Getting your sexual vibe down and conveying your desire to a girl in an attractive way is one of the most powerful things you can learn to do in game, and it's vital you get this skill down. So I would suggest for now, stop trying to sexualize with words, and start sexualizing with actions (your posture, voice, body movement/language, don't just put your D out lmao)

Oh ok makes sense. Where do I ask her to go on a date
 

punishedsnake

Rookie
Rookie
Joined
Feb 5, 2021
Messages
8
I am having the same trouble as the OP. I concluded that it was due to my looks. Fundamentals, as described on GC, seems to have a large looks component. Chase talked about how he scopes out spots to meet girls by counting the number of approach invitations he gets. Hector talks about how he had so many opportunities with women back before he learned any seduction or became hip. Their good looks are the only thing that can explain this. A guy who isn't good looking isn't going to get approach invitations, so all approach invitation game is off the cards. I love GC and the material that Chase posts but I just feel like maybe it's not appropriate for every single guy. Chase talks about how attraction is there or it isn't, from the very start, and that women who want to make love to you know it right away. Well, by what mechanism can this occur besides via the guy's looks? I'm not here to have an argument just to state the way that I see things.
 

ulrich

Cro-Magnon Man
Cro-Magnon Man
Joined
Oct 21, 2019
Messages
1,651
. Well, by what mechanism can this occur besides via the guy's looks? I'm not here to have an argument just to state the way that I see things.

Yes and no.
It can happen for several reason (looks being one of them) but it will not happen consistently if you don’t get looks handled.

The thing most newbies struggle to understand is that 80% of looks are under your control.
Yes, you can’t control your height but you can clean your acne, get a tan, stand straight and talk deeply.

If you are stuck thinking that your looks are “unimprovable”, it will always hinder you.
 

Will_V

Chieftan
Staff member
tribal-elder
Joined
Jan 24, 2021
Messages
1,539
I am having the same trouble as the OP. I concluded that it was due to my looks. Fundamentals, as described on GC, seems to have a large looks component. Chase talked about how he scopes out spots to meet girls by counting the number of approach invitations he gets. Hector talks about how he had so many opportunities with women back before he learned any seduction or became hip. Their good looks are the only thing that can explain this. A guy who isn't good looking isn't going to get approach invitations, so all approach invitation game is off the cards. I love GC and the material that Chase posts but I just feel like maybe it's not appropriate for every single guy. Chase talks about how attraction is there or it isn't, from the very start, and that women who want to make love to you know it right away. Well, by what mechanism can this occur besides via the guy's looks? I'm not here to have an argument just to state the way that I see things.
You're falling into the trap of thinking that you're a walking tinder profile.

Ever heard of strong/seductive body language? Eye contact? Presence?Charisma?

Even if you just focus on the face, most of what constitutes attractiveness is determined by the flow of facial expressions. Desperation or certainty? Fear or self belief? Submissivess or pride? Defensiveness or playfulness?

Have you never seen a person who has decent or good looks made ugly by depression, anxiety or fear? I have. Both men and women.

I have gone out to approach while my mood is extremely low and I'm feeling desperate, and I can't even get a woman to look at me, its like I'm a leper. And other times I am high on some kind of success in my life, I feel like a winner, and I catch women staring, or swerving toward me, playing with their hair or walking past with that bobbing/weaving gait women get when they are aroused.

So you know what I do? Act like I'm a winner no matter what. And make sure I AM one in all areas, not just women.

In truth, what you're doing is making excuses for all the things you don't understand or wish to learn how to control. I control my state and my presence through meditation, I cultivate dominant and sexy body language, eye contact, voice etc deliberately, and have done so for years.

And you know what? I'm not doing it for women, but for myself. I want to BE the best, I want to wake up every day and be a winner in every little thing that I do. I want to face down challenges and difficulties like they are nothing, and i work on those qualities that enable me to do it. And it just so happens that seeing a guy like that turns some women on and opens up the possibility for me to get in and make something happen.
 

dark hawk

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Dec 29, 2020
Messages
52
@Shake&Bake
Dude people here have given some great advise which would help, and to me it seems your problem goes a little bit deeper(your basics, and fundamentals). While replying to @uriel, you said you do not have many friends right now and that usually people do not get you and stuff, Without Improving upon your fundamental social skills, to attempt gaming girls and expecting results is sheer madness, Dude you can't expect to run before you learn how to walk, so my genuine and simple advise is work on being social and not just gaming women, and while you talk to women, talk to all types of women and not only the women that you're interested in. Start from the basics. This will give you ample experience which you can then use in your interaction with people you're interested in. Do borrow Dale Carnegie timeless words....Be interested in others.

Keep trying man
Cheers
 

Shake&Bake

Tool-Bearing Hominid
Tool-Bearing Hominid
Joined
Mar 4, 2015
Messages
239
@Shake&Bake
Dude people here have given some great advise which would help, and to me it seems your problem goes a little bit deeper(your basics, and fundamentals). While replying to @uriel, you said you do not have many friends right now and that usually people do not get you and stuff, Without Improving upon your fundamental social skills, to attempt gaming girls and expecting results is sheer madness, Dude you can't expect to run before you learn how to walk, so my genuine and simple advise is work on being social and not just gaming women, and while you talk to women, talk to all types of women and not only the women that you're interested in. Start from the basics. This will give you ample experience which you can then use in your interaction with people you're interested in. Do borrow Dale Carnegie timeless words....Be interested in others.

Keep trying man
Cheers
I've been locked at beginner stage for so unbelievably long that the last thing I want to do is spend more years on it
 

Beck Bass

Cro-Magnon Man
Cro-Magnon Man
Joined
Mar 9, 2020
Messages
635
Where do I ask her to go on a date
You mean what places you should take girls? What types of dates you should have?
There's some great articles in Girls Chase about that, but in general you wanna keep it really casual, like "hangouts". Taking a girl for a coffee, icecream or some drinks, for example. If she drinks, alcohol can help her feels less nervous in a first date (and help you too, just don't get drunk! lol), but icecream and coffee can be great for dates during the day. Grabbing a bite too.

I've been locked at beginner stage for so unbelievably long that the last thing I want to do is spend more years on it
I know man, it sucks, but improving takes time. The important part is to keep a good atitude and keep on trying to improve every day, in no time you'll be much better, trust me.
Game can also be a really snowball thing, average guys have sometimes really bad results, but once they get a bit good, they can start having sex and relationships with many cute girls (I have a friend that was stuck in a bad relationship for 5 years, than it took a year of him doing really bad, and sudenlly he was having great results, he can barely manage the girls in his life atm).

About the whole looks and fundamentals thing, you can improve you "looks" in pretty much every aspect. Many guys think that because they are shorter or have a big nose or whatever they can't get girls, but there's so much stuff you can do to make yourself more attractive. In my opinion, dressing well can be a night and day difference, see if you can improve on that, and then try to improve your posture and body language at the same time. Those are simple things to do (they can take some time, you won't have a killer fashion sense and dress like a boss in like a day lol, also posture takes some time for your body to "learn" it), but just those two already can flip the table for you.
But the beginning is the most painful part, for sure.
 

Shake&Bake

Tool-Bearing Hominid
Tool-Bearing Hominid
Joined
Mar 4, 2015
Messages
239
You mean what places you should take girls? What types of dates you should have?
There's some great articles in Girls Chase about that, but in general you wanna keep it really casual, like "hangouts". Taking a girl for a coffee, icecream or some drinks, for example. If she drinks, alcohol can help her feels less nervous in a first date (and help you too, just don't get drunk! lol), but icecream and coffee can be great for dates during the day. Grabbing a bite too.


I know man, it sucks, but improving takes time. The important part is to keep a good atitude and keep on trying to improve every day, in no time you'll be much better, trust me.
Game can also be a really snowball thing, average guys have sometimes really bad results, but once they get a bit good, they can start having sex and relationships with many cute girls (I have a friend that was stuck in a bad relationship for 5 years, than it took a year of him doing really bad, and sudenlly he was having great results, he can barely manage the girls in his life atm).

About the whole looks and fundamentals thing, you can improve you "looks" in pretty much every aspect. Many guys think that because they are shorter or have a big nose or whatever they can't get girls, but there's so much stuff you can do to make yourself more attractive. In my opinion, dressing well can be a night and day difference, see if you can improve on that, and then try to improve your posture and body language at the same time. Those are simple things to do (they can take some time, you won't have a killer fashion sense and dress like a boss in like a day lol, also posture takes some time for your body to "learn" it), but just those two already can flip the table for you.
But the beginning is the most painful part, for sure.
I mean I always somewhat knew how to dress from a young age. I didnt have closet full of Jordan's, or Abercrombie shirts like alot of the popular kids where but I could hold my own.

Even when I dressed really nice it didnt help all that much. It didn't really matter unless I could talk a good game if you know what I mean
 

Shake&Bake

Tool-Bearing Hominid
Tool-Bearing Hominid
Joined
Mar 4, 2015
Messages
239
So is that all for this post. Did anyone have anything to chime In with for tips on getting a gf or getting laid?
 

Rain

Tool-Bearing Hominid
Tool-Bearing Hominid
Joined
Jun 13, 2016
Messages
534
There might be some articles on the main website, with links inside them eg 'how to get girls the last post you'll ever need' something like that might have some links inside it to different possible processes to follow on different ways of opening or talking or standing.

Thread below has daygame footage, the guy gets rejected a few times but then meets a woman and they get on well.
The youtube link is in the thread.
 

Will_V

Chieftan
Staff member
tribal-elder
Joined
Jan 24, 2021
Messages
1,539
So is that all for this post. Did anyone have anything to chime In with for tips on getting a gf or getting laid?

What do you want to hear? I asked you to write down an example of a conversation you'd like to have with a girl, and this was your reply:

Yeah I would be pretty hard for me to know how conversations would work because I suck at conversations

If you can't at least try to improve your conversation to the point where you don't 'suck', you won't get laid, my man. Even nice guys and friendzoners can have a conversation, it's only the beginning. And it's a basic skill that you can easily fix by talking to random people (men and women, friends and family and strangers).

I think there's a misconception among some guys on this board about the whole art of seduction. It's not an average thing for average guys. Hooking up and having sex with women hours or days after you meet them on the street is out of most people's realm of thinking for a reason. It's a skill that you need to train (on top of having the basic people skills) with immense amounts of hard work, discipline, an energetic interest in women, and an overwhelming drive to be the better man in the room.

Let's say you were average though, and happy to stay that way, and just wanted an average, slightly overweight, not too ugly and not too annoying woman to marry. Even then, if you can't hold a conversation for thirty seconds, you don't have a chance! Having a conversation is like tying your shoes, it's just the beginning of being a put together person that other people like.

Just accept that you are where you are, and put your nose to the grindstone. Buy new clothes, try a new haircut, work that posture and walk. Start off just being nice to everyone, waving, saying hello and giving them some positivity. Talk to the clerk and the checkout girl about the weather. Learn to hold a conversation for ten seconds, then twenty, then thirty, then a minute. Learn how to be a nice guy who can make a woman smile and give a compliment without any expectations. Learn how to ask questions that tell you what she likes, and then talk to her about what she likes! You won't believe how quickly your fear and insecurity vanishes when you go out just to make someone else feel good, without asking anything in return.

And above all, work on yourself as a man, apart from women. If you are not feeling great about yourself, enjoying every minute of your life, and developing your potential so that you are exceptional and not average, then where are your priorities? A woman won't fix life's problems, she will highlight them. She's not a bandaid fix, she's a dose of salt. A man's purpose in life is to be better, to strive to be great and not average, and this is the least of what she expects from him (and should). When you are on the right path, and have advanced along it far enough, then she will turn into sugar.

Stop trying to find quick fixes. Tell us what you want to get better at, what you have tried, show effort and ask for feedback. Talk to a girl for as long as you can, post the conversation here and ask where it went wrong. Show us pictures of your fashion. Converse with people you meet in the course of your day. Start with small tasks and become great at them before trying to close a million dollar deal.
 

Will_V

Chieftan
Staff member
tribal-elder
Joined
Jan 24, 2021
Messages
1,539
Let's put things in perspective.

Let's say you want a woman in her 20s, not overweight and at least average looks. Let's assume for the sake of argument that every characteristic is evenly distributed.

According to the stats for my country, 60% of women are overweight. That leaves us with 40%.

Let's say women live on average 60 years, then the women in their 20s is 1/6. That leaves us with 7%.

Now you want a woman with above average looks, that goes down to 3.5%.

Now ask yourself, what kind of man would it take take to get a woman that is better than 97% of the women out there, let alone sleep with 1000 of them?

It sounds like a bitter pill, until you realize that unlike women, guys are not evaluated much on looks but on things they can control, and most guys won't lift a finger to improve themselves from their allotted trajectory in life, even when they are told exactly what to do.

So you can either accept the average woman (who is not as hot as you think she is) or lift a finger, which will it be?
 

Shake&Bake

Tool-Bearing Hominid
Tool-Bearing Hominid
Joined
Mar 4, 2015
Messages
239
Let's put things in perspective.

Let's say you want a woman in her 20s, not overweight and at least average looks. Let's assume for the sake of argument that every characteristic is evenly distributed.

According to the stats for my country, 60% of women are overweight. That leaves us with 40%.

Let's say women live on average 60 years, then the women in their 20s is 1/6. That leaves us with 7%.

Now you want a woman with above average looks, that goes down to 3.5%.

Now ask yourself, what kind of man would it take take to get a woman that is better than 97% of the women out there, let alone sleep with 1000 of them?

It sounds like a bitter pill, until you realize that unlike women, guys are not evaluated much on looks but on things they can control, and most guys won't lift a finger to improve themselves from their allotted trajectory in life, even when they are told exactly what to do.

So you can either accept the average woman (who is not as hot as you think she is) or lift a finger, which will it be?
This is mistake I feel that I made in highschool and alot of guys make as well when it comes to other guys.

I grew up a long time thinking that most men didnt get women because they didnt try. But I find out through time how unbelievably untrue it was. Guys do try alot!Its just that their efforts most of the time are futile because most male dating advice in the general public is extremely confusing and cliche
 

ulrich

Cro-Magnon Man
Cro-Magnon Man
Joined
Oct 21, 2019
Messages
1,651
This is mistake I feel that I made in highschool and alot of guys make as well when it comes to other guys.

I grew up a long time thinking that most men didnt get women because they didnt try. But I find out through time how unbelievably untrue it was. Guys do try alot!Its just that their efforts most of the time are futile because most male dating advice in the general public is extremely confusing and cliche

I would say that most men try a lot and don’t get results because many elements of seduction are counterintuitive (feels confusing) and counter to culture (feels risky).
 

Shake&Bake

Tool-Bearing Hominid
Tool-Bearing Hominid
Joined
Mar 4, 2015
Messages
239
I would say that most men try a lot and don’t get results because many elements of seduction are counterintuitive (feels confusing) and counter to culture (feels risky).
I mean yes you put it in better words than I could. Thats why I try to get as much info I can on seduction and socializing with women so I can learn of course and filter out all the BS when it comes to male dating.

And this is why I just wanted most of the commenters to share some insight so I can get out of this massive plateau I gave been stuck in for years
 
Top
>