Is Dating Business Not So Lucrative Or Lack Marketing Skillsets?

trashKENNUT

Cro-Magnon Man
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Hello Everyone,

i feel like the dating business has a lot of potential as in that so many problems that you can use as content gateway. But i do not run a dating business,

i am super curious

Zac
 

West_Indian_Archie

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Had a buddy in NYC that ran a PUA business. He said when it was taught properly, there was no repeat business. Guys never came back to learn relationship management, how to get threesomes, bag strippers, or all the stuff that pickup allows you to do.

Get the guy through approach anxiety and give him the basic guidelines, and most of the rest will come naturally. He won't be a master but he'll have more girls than he can service., I can tell you from personal experience that consistently going out and being purposefully social sets you apart from 999/1000 guys out of a 1000. When I first started getting good, juggling 6 girls was unbearable. Successfully banging chicks can push you into a mono LTR real quick. Too much of a "good" thing is more like too much stress.

As you can see, the most financially successful companies have grafted onto the Tony Robbins business model
- free/cheap lead in product (youtube content, book)
- free in person meeting (Free RSD)
- paid group training (hot seats)
- pricey one-on-one/small group training over a weekend (boot camps)
- one week boot camps (Natural lifestyles)
- longer term boot camps aka immersion (rsd)
(The hot seats were the most profitable of the in person products. 100 guys paying 300 a pop is better than 3 guys paying 2-3,000.)

Throw in the interns that do a lot of the behind the scenes, logistical, filming, online moderation, and editing FOR FREE training.

The real money makers in this industry are guys like Tai Lopez and Grant Cardone, Gary Vaynerchuk. They can charge more because guys and girls want money, whereas only guys want sex. Social Skills sells too though. Charisma on Command is PUA lite, and he doesn't have the sleazy seducer baggage.

The new wrinkle in our corner is incomplete products + rolling out more content as time goes on + monthly fee for access to a private FB/Social Media group where the instructor and his mods/aides can answer questions. RSD Derek and Jeffy are doing this now. The days of "10 dvd set" that explains pickup from A to Z are gone.

Recurring money is the real key to making money, as most of the economy is moving to SAAS (Software as a service).

Now that Youtube has cracked down on infield videos and seduction in general, they have all pivoted to self development and less practical stuff. RSD really dialed back the good stuff when Julien had his CNN issues. The BBC expose then changed up a lot of guys too. I think only James Tusk/Fluid Social/French Andy and those guys are doing infield videos still.

And given that the most effective PUA stuff was offline, adapting the elements to online seems to be an issue for older gurus. Now it's guys like Playing with Fire and Based Zeus and David Bond selling instagram/tinder/text hacks but not solid game.

WIA
 

ulrich

Cro-Magnon Man
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Hi Zac,

Not an actual expert but I am considering entering the business in the Spanish market.
There are two key challenges that I see:

1) Facebook/Instagram and most other social networks are too politically correct and will shut down your pages and ads if you talk openly about dating from a pick-up perspective.
2) Feminists and other groups are actively on the hunt. If they catch you, they will try to shame you for your whole life.

I think there is a huge opportunity here but you have to play it discreet.

My plan is to lure men with a single piece of free content focusing on beginner/watered down/non-polemic topics like self respect or masculinity and then promoting dating advice/services only AFTER I have direct line with the customers.
That way I can keep polemic content out of the radad.

Also, I will most definitely use a pen name and a confidential company name.
 

trashKENNUT

Cro-Magnon Man
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there was no repeat busines

That's unfortunate. Deinitely I think that most men just want a girlfriend. Nothing crazy or outlandish.

When I first started getting good, juggling 6 girls was unbearable. Successfully banging chicks can push you into a mono LTR real quick. Too much of a "good" thing is more like too much

Juggling 6 girls without proper management system is more of an annoyance.

Hahaha YEEEESSSSS.


The real money makers in this industry are guys like Tai Lopez and Grant Cardone, Gary Vaynerchuk. They can charge more because guys and girls want money, whereas only guys want sex. Social Skills sells too though. Charisma on Command is PUA lite, and he doesn't have the sleazy seducer baggage.

The new wrinkle in our corner is incomplete products + rolling out more content as time goes on + monthly fee for access to a private FB/Social Media group where the instructor and his mods/aides can answer questions. RSD Derek and Jeffy are doing this now. The days of "10 dvd set" that explains pickup from A to Z are gone.

Old pickup way of doing business is gone. It's like DVDs. Man, everything just gone like that.

Recurring money is the real key to making money, as most of the economy is moving to SAAS (Software as a service).

I think all in all, everything is heading to self help. But the good part is that Girlschase is well equipped to pivot to that.

Given how high level the information here is.


1) Facebook/Instagram and most other social networks are too politically correct and will shut down your pages and ads if you talk openly about dating from a pick-up perspective.
2) Feminists and other groups are actively on the hunt. If they catch you, they will try to shame you for your whole life.

I think there is a huge opportunity here but you have to play it discreet.

I recommend going self help. Because that's how the world is and where is going. You can always do pickup on your own.

My plan is to lure men with a single piece of free content focusing on beginner/watered down/non-polemic topics like self respect or masculinity and then promoting dating advice/services only AFTER I have direct line with the customers.
That way I can keep polemic content out of the radad

I don't know man. It's a fun gig given how RSD was selling like crazy before but it's just end there.
 

Tony D

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I've been a dating coach for ten years. I'm not rich, but could be if I worked harder. You can do anything you want. You just have to do it. Fuck the market. Less research, more action.

Start a blog and write an article a day, seo optimized, for year.
Make a Youtube or Bitchute, lbry, or any video channel and create content.
Write a book for social proof. (Like mine below)
Offer free coaching online and off
Hold live seminars
Do webinars

Social media is another option. But personally, I don't know anyone who really makes much money from Instagram. I know a guy, Bradicus who told me he got biz from there before they banned him. I don't like social media and use it as little as possible. If I was more savy I could do better with it. But I'm a writer. I like making writing. Though, video is the easiest way to reach a mass audience.

Before you know it, you'll be in business.

Products come later.

Dating, sex advice/guidance will always be in demand. As will losing weight, gaining muscle, and money creation/management.
 
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Mr STIF

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I've been a dating coach for ten years. I'm not rich, but could be if I worked harder. You can do anything you want. You just have to do it. Fuck the market. Less research, more action.

Start a blog and write an article a day, seo optimized, for year.
Make a Youtube or Bitchute, lbry, or any video channel and create content.
Write a book for social proof. (Like mine below)
Offer free coaching online and off
Hold live seminars
Do webinars

Social media is another option. But personally, I don't know anyone who really makes much money from Instagram. I know a guy, Bradicus who told me he got biz from there before they banned him. I don't like social media and use it as little as possible. If I was more savy I could do better with it. But I'm a writer. I like making writing. Though, video is the easiest way to reach a mass audience.

Before you know it, you'll be in business.

Products come later.

Dating, sex advice/guidance will always be in demand. As will losing weight, gaining muscle, and money creation/management.
Thanks Man for the encouragement. I'm planning on having a website on PUA, next year. Hopefully I'll need your guidance.
 

Toby2030

Cro-Magnon Man
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You can without a doubt create a strong business with good facebook and instagram advertising. Hell, that's what my business is all about. I have no clients in the dating area myself but I could imagine there might be problems with facebook's ad policy. It would still be worth a shot though. The worst thing that can happen is a banned facebook ad account.

However, it would require a lot of work on dedicated PPC landing pages. Without knowing much about the numbers behind the front page on girlschase, I couldn't imagine that it's converting that well
 
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trashKENNUT

Cro-Magnon Man
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Bradicus who told me he got biz from there before they banned him.

So far, he is still there. He sell it via Insta stories. He is fucking girls from Mexico, France, Spain, all over the place. One of the Spain chick is super beautiful.

Before you know it, you'll be in business.

Products come later.

Yea man, most of us don't test hard enough on ad creatives, angles, copy. This is why i ask this question. I find the dating market quite intriguing.

But whether the market have a lot of money, is another thing altogether.
 

Tony D

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So far, he is still there. He sell it via Insta stories. He is fucking girls from Mexico, France, Spain, all over the place. One of the Spain chick is super beautiful.



Yea man, most of us don't test hard enough on ad creatives, angles, copy. This is why i ask this question. I find the dating market quite intriguing.

But whether the market have a lot of money, is another thing altogether.

I know lots of people who have made a fortune in the dating niche, and a lot more who make about 30k a year.
 

trashKENNUT

Cro-Magnon Man
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I know lots of people who have made a fortune in the dating niche, and a lot more who make about 30k a year.

30K a year is enough for most people, even myself. Let me rephrased it. I am coming from a place of David Deangelo. The potential to earn 'fuck you money'.

I think he was the only one, who made millions, based on what i have read, an old article.
 

Chase

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The dating niche is like a pyramid: there are (or were) a few whales at the top of the pyramid, some guys beneath that doing pretty well, a few more guys below doing kind of okay, and then a whole bunch at the bottom fighting for scraps.

The niche itself has been in decline since 2014. There was a big drop-off that year that everybody felt, and we all talked about it in 2015. It never really recovered, and has continued to decline since then. Of the three biggest players in the space, who were at the absolute top of the industry, one had handed off his business to a management team and had retired to be an angel investor last I heard, one just sold his business last year after reaching the point where advertising was getting increasingly hard and his newsletter list had become completely unresponsive to email marketing and he saw the writing on the wall, and a third -- the guy who ran the biggest pickup business in the world in terms of revenue for many years -- shut his doors in 2018 (he'd made enough money and didn't want to deal with the problems he was having keeping the business running at that point).

You also had RSD, which got reasonably big, though was not the biggest in terms of revenue. They have shed most of their old stuff and have been working to completely rebrand, getting out of the dating niche entirely. No one has replaced the whales who left the business. A lot of people that are longtime pickup business owners are looking at other markets they can switch to instead.

That said, you can still make it work. It is just a lot harder now than it was 2009-2014, which was when GC really got going.

We are working with a top marketing agency right now for some of our marketing. They have been consistently surprised at some of the difficulty getting marketing campaigns to work for us. I have had to personally write all our sales landing pages (with some help cleaning up one of them from a talented copywriter I know), handle all our ad copy and designs, and plan out the campaigns, because nothing they've tried has worked. It took me years and years to figure this stuff out.

There's still plenty of opportunity if you can find a good channel to reach guys, and you are a hustler. You need to figure out how you're going to do that, and whether there's longevity there. I probably would not do YouTube... I don't know how long our channel will be up on YouTube, but I bet if things continue the way they have been it won't be there 2-3 years from now. However, I am seeing guys blow up on TikTok right now (one of the dating advice business owners I know recently caught a TikTok PUA with 300,000 subscribers there ripping off the business owner's sales page... had I not heard about this, I'd never have known there was a TikTok PUA with 300K subscribers. Though from what I've seen a lot of what he's doing is goofy viral-esque content).

Personally I wax and wane on this niche. Sometimes I wonder what I'm doing and whether I ought to just get out. Other times I think it is a great niche and I'm glad to be in it.

When starting your business, also keep in mind you need to know how to monetize. The big problem in pickup is that everybody wants to know how to get the girl, but most guys do not have a lot of money to spend on it. And the guys who do have the money do not always recognize they have an issue... often they are focused on getting more money, rather than buying a product to teach them how to talk to girls. You can get a big following of guys who will not spend much money. But it is like that anywhere you are building a following of people.

Also, anyone who wants to get rich by blogging, I suggest you read this first:


I will tell you, personally -- 2014 was the year I tried the experiment of writing more words in one year than ever I had, churning out more content than ever, busting my ass on the comments and in the forum, just content, content everywhere (I wrote somewhere between 3 million and 5 million words that year) -- the result was a steep traffic decline in 2015 (due to Google penalizing our site for super slow load times, thanks to the crappy servers EIG moved us to when they acquired our then-host, HostGator), along with a revenue decline so sharp (due largely, I think, to the general sales decline the entire pickup industry experienced starting around May/June 2014) we had to lay people off and cut bonuses for the staff. I have never worked so hard, for such a disappointing outcome... but it certainly taught me a lot.

That's not to say you can't make it here. I think anything is always possible, with sufficient hustle, and the right angle.

(I don't want to sound like I'm trying to discourage competitors, btw. So long as you aren't blatantly ripping off GC stuff, we'll have no issues. Many of the pickup businesses all mail for each other, and we mail for some of the other companies whose products I like as well -- there's a lot more cooperation in this niche than in many niches. It is a cool niche at a personal level, and it is cool to work with the audience in this niche. That is one of the best parts, helping guys learn and improve and develop and grow. It's a difficult niche, but it's rewarding, too)

Chase
 

Vision

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30K a year is enough for most people, even myself. Let me rephrased it. I am coming from a place of David Deangelo. The potential to earn 'fuck you money'.

I think he was the only one, who made millions, based on what i have read, an old article.

Eh, Sinn made over $500k in a two week launch, there are plenty of people who make millions in the dating space.
 

trashKENNUT

Cro-Magnon Man
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Eh, Sinn made over $500k in a two week launch, there are plenty of people who make millions in the dating space.

I didn't know! :(

But I stick to SMMA.

I actually have been working on it since and before lockdown. So yea, do it right, and don't have so much problems that is unnecessary. And focus on more important stuff.
 
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