FU Not owning it

[Higher]

Posting this for future reference. I dont have a specific question here, tho feedback is always welcome - might help me spot other stuff i need to work on.

tl;dr
Had a stunner over last night and i botched the escalation, as i was worrying too much about potentially fucking-up with such a high-level girl.

APPROACHING HER

I meet her last week in a nearby city. Its noon and shes at the lake, seated on a bench and eating. Shes gorgeous, slim, a bit short but shes got incredible shapes, full sexy lips, middle-eastern looks and great style.

So i open informational and we start chatting. Vibe is really good, great eye contact and body language. Shes smart and fun, and has great energy. I compliment her and deep-dive quickly, then get her phone number.

TEXTING

We text back and forth and we agree on meeting for coffee (she actually soft-closes and hard-closes me, what a texter!). She seems really into me.

FIRST MEET

So we meet in her city. We have a great time bouncing around in a couple bars. We talk about all sorts of good stuff, especially sex and connection. She also tells me that she typically bf-rejects guys that approach her during the day, but i had "the right energy".

Anyway at some point i tell her, i gotta go. We hug, i go for the kiss and she deflects. But i can feel she likes me, so its ok.

TEXTING AND ARRANGING THE SECOND MEET

So back to texting a bit. Vibe is more flirty/sexual and shes investing a fair amount. First leadership mistake i do here is not properly inviting her to a 2nd meet in my city. We slightly stumble on this but im able to recover from it, and she agrees on coming to my city. This was yesterday morning.

During the day she keeps texting me, bursting with excitement - im so happy to see u today, thinking about it makes work today a breeze, she sends me pics of her attire, etc. Shes just genuinely attracted, and i like this girl a lot too: not only shes naturally beautiful and has an incredible body (legit a 9 to me), but shes cool too, very interesting, fun, and shes got that soothing energy that relaxes me and makes me focus on her.

Problem is, im worried shitless. I dont have many reference points with such top-caliber girls (which in reality doesnt really make any big difference compared to other girls). Im already half-sure that ill fuck up the escalation - and i guess im calling it.

SECOND MEET AND INVITING HER OVER

So we meet in my city. I move us around for a walk, we grab a drink and we sit. We talk about love, romance, sex, relationships and connect on many things. Then i suggest we go grab some groceries and do poke bowls at my place.

AT MY PLACE

Its now 8pm. She goes to the toilet, i fix us some tea and water, then i take her hand and tour her around the place. We sit on the sofa and chat, cuddle and kiss a bit.

Not much time passes before we make out, and my hands are all over her body. Im getting hard and i put her hand on me, so she feels my cock from under my pants. I can feel its not a strong erection and i keep worrying about performance, so i suggest we move to the bedroom (i typically get better erections in bed) and shes like, noo i like to tease a bit. Its cool, i pull back and we chat a bit. This back and forth goes on for a while, then she tells me shes hungry and we go prepare the food (2nd leadership mistake here, but i think its ok).

So we cook the thing, and while at it i kiss her neck, back, and make her feel my half-hard cock on her perfect ass. She moans, arches her back and enjoys my hands running all over her. When food is ready, we go back to the living room. A thunderstorm is forming outside, and the scattered sunset light, coupled with the dim lights in the room, creates the perfect atmosphere for the moment.

FUCKING UP

We look outside from one of the windows, and im again behind her, grinding on her and touching her. Shes getting more and more turned on and puts her hand on my cock. THIS is the moment where things should have happened. I could have lifted her and lead us to the bedroom, i could have pycoed, i could have tried other stuff.

Instead i simply PULL BACK, and we go back to the food.

And this of course is when things go downhill.

We eat, chat, go back to the sofa, kiss a bit, but im still in my head, worried about the escalation, and more and more convinced that im fucking up with such a gorgeous girl. Of course she feels it (plus tbh i had told her i have a flight the next day, and from our previous convos i think she suspects im gonna visit a flame of mine in another country - which is actually the case - so this contributes to her feeling even less desired).

So anyway, the vibe is now friendly and she leaves not long after. Ofc i dont even dream of seeing this girl again.

INSIGHTS AND LOOKING ONWARD

My current, huge sticking point is not really owning my desires with such hot girls and constantly worrying about making "the right move" and "looking competent" instead of just assuming she wants me, simplifying things and going with the flow. This manifests at any point in the interaction - it happened recently with a couple tourists that i shoulda tried an instapull with, a couple of other good leads that went cold after my tentativeness over texting, and it happened now with this absolute stunner of a girl at home.

Weirdly interesting thing i noticed (not proud of stating this publicly, but fuck it, whatever) is that as soon as my hand ran on her pussy, i started worrying really bad, i sweated and lost erection. I felt that move was "The Point of No Return" and i "had to perform" after it. Made a huge deal out of it in my mind. This is something that happened already in the past with some higher-level girls, but not really with girls that i considered "lesser than me". I felt i was "out of this girls league", and any fuck-up on my side would have been "a tragedy".

Guess i put this girl in the drivers seat, thinking she has way more experienced than me, and built her up to stellar proportions. Great recipe to disaster.

Im not really sure whats the best solution to this apart from getting more exposure to such girls (while also going on getting "lesser" ones too) and just building a rock-solid frame for when im escalating at home. Doesnt matter if i dont get hard asap - just move things forward, escalate and calibrate. Go on and keep doing what youre doing until you either fuck her senseless or she resists. But dont drop out all of a sudden thinking about "the imminent fuckup" when shes loving all of what youre doing.

This girl was the hottest (and highest-caliber in many aspects) i had home all excited and ready to go so far. I feel im always making progress in this journey, even if really slowly. I dunno how long itll take for me to reach the level i want. Theres a lot of gaps in my overall frame, but i can only take them on one by one, look onward and move the fuck on.

Got a number yesterday from a pretty hot and bubbly Portuguese girl. Lets see what the lesson will be this time.

 

[alexlaguma]

Hey bro. Really interesting report.

First things first - sounds like you are making excellent progress. Smooth approach, good first date, got her back to your place. There is a lot to be happy with there. You might have lost out on this one but clearly you've got the skills to do this over and over again. So that's all good.

I think you have set out quite well where you went wrong. You did all the right things but then mentally you blocked yourself from doing what came next. Sounds like you have a bit of a sticking point / confidence issue around sex. That is pretty normal, but it is something you can get around.

One resource I can recommend to you is an ebook called Sex God by Daniel Rose. I read this book about 10 years ago and it completely changed my approach to sex with women. It really explains how sex is a phycological act rather than a physical one ... and it helped me understand what women want. I think it could really help you.

The other thing (and he talks about this in the book) is meditation. Sounds like you got inside your own head when you were at your place, when really during sex you want to be clear minded, relaxed, fully present in the moment. Just going with the vibe and feeling and enjoying it, not thinking or worrying. Maybe try a regular meditation practice ... its something I am personally trying to get into my schedule.

But yeh - good work man, you'll get the next one.

 

[PaulieFlyn10]

Ah yes. Another intermediate problem lol

Welcome to the club. Though I don't understand how guys still fuck once they've made it all the way to their hands on her pussy. For me, once I'm there it's game over no matter how hot she is. Guess you have to read more stuff on you being the prize to fix that frame

If there's one thing I've learnt.. is that it's not over until it is over.

Now, what's the vibe between both of you. Is she acting kind of cold or distant? If so, send an autorejection text.

Alternatively, if she's on WhatsApp you can use your status to reframe yourself in a more positive light. You can post memes on connection, chemistry, sex, romance. And give your perspective on it.

Once she starts responding keep it chill and game her from there in a more confident, dominant manner

Your best bet tho will be to see if you can run into her again

 

[Higher]

@alexlaguma, @PaulieFlyn10 -

Appreciate your feedback gents, lots of useful stuff in there.

Sounds like you have a bit of a sticking point / confidence issue around sex.

Yeah, its seems my frame holds ok with girls i perceive as "lower than me", but crumbles with girls i build up too much in my head.

Hopefully ill fix it this year, as im getting way more good leads now (im approaching way more and my texting/dating process improved a lot due to the sheer volume at play) than in the past (i was approaching a girl or two PER WEEK, which ofc took me nowhere).

One resource I can recommend to you is an ebook called Sex God by Daniel Rose.

I read this some time ago but totally forgot about it, thanks for reminding me. Ill get back to it it today.

The other thing (and he talks about this in the book) is meditation.

Good point as well. I used to meditate quite a bit in the past but sorta lost the habit. That will def help along with sheer experience with higher-quality girls.

Guess you have to read more stuff on you being the prize to fix that frame

Yeah, my overall frame is still far from being solid. Ill read up some articles on the blog - feel free to link resources that might be helpful.

Ill do more visualization too, i found it helped with other stuff in the past.

send an autorejection text

Great tip, didnt think about it. I texted her yesterday telling her i loved the time we spent together and i really mean it, and wishing her a good weekend.

Ofc i dont expect anything out of this, but good to clear the air of any misunderstandings.

 

[Atlas IV]

Hey bro. Really interesting report.

First things first - sounds like you are making excellent progress. Smooth approach, good first date, got her back to your place. There is a lot to be happy with there. You might have lost out on this one but clearly you've got the skills to do this over and over again. So that's all good.

I think you have set out quite well where you went wrong. You did all the right things but then mentally you blocked yourself from doing what came next. Sounds like you have a bit of a sticking point / confidence issue around sex. That is pretty normal, but it is something you can get around.

One resource I can recommend to you is an ebook called Sex God by Daniel Rose. I read this book about 10 years ago and it completely changed my approach to sex with women. It really explains how sex is a phycological act rather than a physical one ... and it helped me understand what women want. I think it could really help you.

The other thing (and he talks about this in the book) is meditation. Sounds like you got inside your own head when you were at your place, when really during sex you want to be clear minded, relaxed, fully present in the moment. Just going with the vibe and feeling and enjoying it, not thinking or worrying. Maybe try a regular meditation practice ... its something I am personally trying to get into my schedule.

But yeh - good work man, you'll get the next one.

You're the second person I've seen recommend Sex God recently. Gonna give it a read this week, it must be good!

@Higher
Too bad you couldn't close this one, but you should be proud you got so far with such an amazing-sounding girl. What happened after dinner though? Why couldn't you just pour a couple glasses of wine and say "let me show you some music in the bedroom" and then wham bam slam?

 

[Higher]

@Atlas IV -

What happened after dinner though? Why couldn't you just pour a couple glasses of wine and say "let me show you some music in the bedroom" and then wham bam slam?

We went back to the sofa, we kissed a bit but she felt i was not there, present and truly desiring her. So she pulled back as well and the vibe switched to friendly.

All due to me building her up too much in my head and anticipating the worst case scenario - me fucking up and her feeling rejected.

I swear man, ill fix this thing if its the last thing i do

 

[DarkJedi]

@Higher ,
Man you were doing so well. She was in the bag. Completely lol. But its ok. You're doing things super smooth upto that point. You will get over this sticking point soon I'm sure.

Its all to do with the negative thoughts in your head. I have the same problem. Meditation, detachment from outcome (note to self as well). Its interesting though that we second-guess at different points in the seduction. If a girl clearly shows me heavy interest back like this, I roll right ahead. I have trouble escalating mid-game when her interest is unclear.

I felt that move was "The Point of No Return" and i "had to perform" after it. Made a huge deal out of it in my mind. This is something that happened already in the past with some higher-level girls, but not really with girls that i considered "lesser than me". I felt i was "out of this girls league", and any fuck-up on my side would have been "a tragedy".

Yeah you were in a supplicating frame. A tip for when you're this close to sex which might help: "be selfish", focus on your pleasure, not hers. If she's letting you touch her pussy, think that she's yours. You just have to take her.

 

[Higher]

@DarkJedi -

You will get over this sticking point soon I'm sure.

Thanks man, ill keep working on this until i crack it.

A tip for when you're this close to sex which might help: "be selfish", focus on your pleasure, not hers. If she's letting you touch her pussy, think that she's yours. You just have to take her

Yes, good tip. Exactly as i would do with "normal" girls - ie. i almost see them as objects for my own pleasure. And thats when they feel im "present" and desire them.

--

Now id like to have another chance with this girl, so i wanna ping her soon.

Problem is, i think she knows i went to visit another girl i know abroad, so if i ping her she might think shes "second place".

I sent her a "thanks for the great time" text the day after this mess and she reacted with .

When should i ping her? Was thinking 1-2 weeks from now.

 

[Higher]

(Wrote this real quick after coming back home)

I just met this girl again. And i think i fucked up again.

POST-PREVIOUS FUCKUP

So i ping her not long after the previous fuckup. She replies warmly and actually invites me to join her on a spontaneous 1-week trip to the mountains, only the two of us. Im like, sounds good but im traveling, but id love to see u when im back.

(I dont think i woulda joined her anyway, sounded too much for what we are right now.)

Anyway she keeps sending me sexy pics of her, i qualify her, i ask her a couple questions about her trip but she doesnt reply or replies vaguely. She seems to want to be mysterious while still keeping herself present in my life.

ARRANGING ANOTHER MEET

Fast forward 1-2 weeks and she tells me shes otw back. I ask her how the trip was, she replies vaguely again, but this time i tell her, would love to hear about it sometime. Shes like, yeah tonight maybe? Im like, sure. Shes like, ok ill let u know if i make it, im meeting my family rn but ill be home at 9pm, maybe u can come over . Aint saying no to that.

Unfortunately she texts me a couple hours later telling me she cant make it (maybe she was still busy with her family, or maybe she thought she was being too easy), but tomorrow she can. Im like, ill be traveling again for a couple days, ill let u know when im back.

So i text her again when im back (was monday this week), and shes like, lets go at the lake on thursday (today). Alright, lets do it.

MEETING AGAIN AND FUCKING UP AGAIN

So we meet today after lunch. We lay somewhere in the shadows, eat something and chat. Shes in bikini and super fucking hot. I touch her a bit, then go for the kiss, but she only gives me quick pecks on the lips in return. Its still good to me and i do that a couple more times, but the last time she gives me a peck and turns her head to the side.

Thats when i think i fucked up, cause i read it as a, i dont feel super comfortable kissing u right now. So i back off and stop with the touching/kissing altogether.

The vibe is now friendly and boring (yet again) and at some point she puts up a time constraint for tonight - nothing set in stone, but shes like, yeah id be nice if i did that thing tonight. Im like, ok well, sounds super important; id have loved to grab a drink, but if u have plans then ill join my buddies for beach volleyball. Shes goes, when are ur buddies playing? Im like, right now. So shes like, ok then lets go. So we walk a bit, then hug and part ways.

ANALYSIS

This is a pattern i noticed in my behavior - its like, if a girl is putting up some resistance a few times, i back off, never to try again unless she gives me some signs that she wants me to escalate. This is all good if the girl is visibly not ready/comfortable for me to lead further, but no bueno if shes just playing (as i think she was in this case).

As far as she told me, shes used to date alpha males - she dated ceos, top athletes, guys who aggressively go for what they want until they have it. These guys are able to chase and persist like crazy.

(Although she also complained about them being very self-centered and not really caring about developing a genuine connection - something that i suspect she thinks is possible with me instead.)

Unfortunately thats not me. Im not good at persisting/overly chasing, and when i feel im trying to extract something from a girl or to convince her to do something, i lose all the drive to make things happen.

And in part this is bad, because i think i can be a bit more aggressive. For example, when she turned her head after i kissed her the last time, i could have manhandle-kissed her, or told her, just kiss me properly, instead of just accepting her frame.

But im also starting to think we have a mismatch in expectations/personalities.

This is the third time i met this girl (fourth including the initial daytime approach), and i think my chances to bed her have gone below zero. Tbh im sorta losing interest too, the whole thing now feels forced/messy and no longer the whirlwind romance that (if not for my previous fuckup) could have materialized instead.

Now, shes a lawyer, and i told her i might need one for something related to my apartments rent. She was super helpful, she explained how some things work and suggested she help me writing a letter of complaint and potentially raising the thing in a court - and she would do that for free.

It might be a way for her to sorta keep herself present in my life, but im not sure i wanna take this chance - id have to send her my rental contract + other docs with my full name in them, and i just dont know how i feel about this.

As usual, any suggestions/perspectives/feedback much appreciated.

EDIT: i think now that she was playing a bit cause she just wanted me to prove to her that i want her, since last time it was probably not clear to her given my tentativeness. So the move here would have really been manhandle-kissing her or telling her, hey what is this? kiss me properly now.

 

[Mr.SocialAcceptableHarem]

Posting this for future reference. I dont have a specific question here, tho feedback is always welcome - might help me spot other stuff i need to work on.

tl;dr
Had a stunner over last night and i botched the escalation, as i was worrying too much about potentially fucking-up with such a high-level girl.

APPROACHING HER

I meet her last week in a nearby city. Its noon and shes at the lake, seated on a bench and eating. Shes gorgeous, slim, a bit short but shes got incredible shapes, full sexy lips, middle-eastern looks and great style.

So i open informational and we start chatting. Vibe is really good, great eye contact and body language. Shes smart and fun, and has great energy. I compliment her and deep-dive quickly, then get her phone number.

TEXTING

We text back and forth and we agree on meeting for coffee (she actually soft-closes and hard-closes me, what a texter!). She seems really into me.

FIRST MEET

So we meet in her city. We have a great time bouncing around in a couple bars. We talk about all sorts of good stuff, especially sex and connection. She also tells me that she typically bf-rejects guys that approach her during the day, but i had "the right energy".

Anyway at some point i tell her, i gotta go. We hug, i go for the kiss and she deflects. But i can feel she likes me, so its ok.

TEXTING AND ARRANGING THE SECOND MEET

So back to texting a bit. Vibe is more flirty/sexual and shes investing a fair amount. First leadership mistake i do here is not properly inviting her to a 2nd meet in my city. We slightly stumble on this but im able to recover from it, and she agrees on coming to my city. This was yesterday morning.

During the day she keeps texting me, bursting with excitement - im so happy to see u today, thinking about it makes work today a breeze, she sends me pics of her attire, etc. Shes just genuinely attracted, and i like this girl a lot too: not only shes naturally beautiful and has an incredible body (legit a 9 to me), but shes cool too, very interesting, fun, and shes got that soothing energy that relaxes me and makes me focus on her.

Problem is, im worried shitless. I dont have many reference points with such top-caliber girls (which in reality doesnt really make any big difference compared to other girls). Im already half-sure that ill fuck up the escalation - and i guess im calling it.

SECOND MEET AND INVITING HER OVER

So we meet in my city. I move us around for a walk, we grab a drink and we sit. We talk about love, romance, sex, relationships and connect on many things. Then i suggest we go grab some groceries and do poke bowls at my place.

AT MY PLACE

Its now 8pm. She goes to the toilet, i fix us some tea and water, then i take her hand and tour her around the place. We sit on the sofa and chat, cuddle and kiss a bit.

Not much time passes before we make out, and my hands are all over her body. Im getting hard and i put her hand on me, so she feels my cock from under my pants. I can feel its not a strong erection and i keep worrying about performance, so i suggest we move to the bedroom (i typically get better erections in bed) and shes like, noo i like to tease a bit. Its cool, i pull back and we chat a bit. This back and forth goes on for a while, then she tells me shes hungry and we go prepare the food (2nd leadership mistake here, but i think its ok).

So we cook the thing, and while at it i kiss her neck, back, and make her feel my half-hard cock on her perfect ass. She moans, arches her back and enjoys my hands running all over her. When food is ready, we go back to the living room. A thunderstorm is forming outside, and the scattered sunset light, coupled with the dim lights in the room, creates the perfect atmosphere for the moment.

FUCKING UP

We look outside from one of the windows, and im again behind her, grinding on her and touching her. Shes getting more and more turned on and puts her hand on my cock. THIS is the moment where things should have happened. I could have lifted her and lead us to the bedroom, i could have pycoed, i could have tried other stuff.

Instead i simply PULL BACK, and we go back to the food.

And this of course is when things go downhill.

We eat, chat, go back to the sofa, kiss a bit, but im still in my head, worried about the escalation, and more and more convinced that im fucking up with such a gorgeous girl. Of course she feels it (plus tbh i had told her i have a flight the next day, and from our previous convos i think she suspects im gonna visit a flame of mine in another country - which is actually the case - so this contributes to her feeling even less desired).

So anyway, the vibe is now friendly and she leaves not long after. Ofc i dont even dream of seeing this girl again.

INSIGHTS AND LOOKING ONWARD

My current, huge sticking point is not really owning my desires with such hot girls and constantly worrying about making "the right move" and "looking competent" instead of just assuming she wants me, simplifying things and going with the flow. This manifests at any point in the interaction - it happened recently with a couple tourists that i shoulda tried an instapull with, a couple of other good leads that went cold after my tentativeness over texting, and it happened now with this absolute stunner of a girl at home.

Weirdly interesting thing i noticed (not proud of stating this publicly, but fuck it, whatever) is that as soon as my hand ran on her pussy, i started worrying really bad, i sweated and lost erection. I felt that move was "The Point of No Return" and i "had to perform" after it. Made a huge deal out of it in my mind. This is something that happened already in the past with some higher-level girls, but not really with girls that i considered "lesser than me". I felt i was "out of this girls league", and any fuck-up on my side would have been "a tragedy".

Guess i put this girl in the drivers seat, thinking she has way more experienced than me, and built her up to stellar proportions. Great recipe to disaster.

Im not really sure whats the best solution to this apart from getting more exposure to such girls (while also going on getting "lesser" ones too) and just building a rock-solid frame for when im escalating at home. Doesnt matter if i dont get hard asap - just move things forward, escalate and calibrate. Go on and keep doing what youre doing until you either fuck her senseless or she resists. But dont drop out all of a sudden thinking about "the imminent fuckup" when shes loving all of what youre doing.

This girl was the hottest (and highest-caliber in many aspects) i had home all excited and ready to go so far. I feel im always making progress in this journey, even if really slowly. I dunno how long itll take for me to reach the level i want. Theres a lot of gaps in my overall frame, but i can only take them on one by one, look onward and move the fuck on.

Got a number yesterday from a pretty hot and bubbly Portuguese girl. Lets see what the lesson will be this time.

Pull the trigger.

 

[gameboy]

(Wrote this real quick after coming back home)

I just met this girl again. And i think i fucked up again.

POST-PREVIOUS FUCKUP

So i ping her not long after the previous fuckup. She replies warmly and actually invites me to join her on a spontaneous 1-week trip to the mountains, only the two of us. Im like, sounds good but im traveling, but id love to see u when im back.

(I dont think i woulda joined her anyway, sounded too much for what we are right now.)

Anyway she keeps sending me sexy pics of her, i qualify her, i ask her a couple questions about her trip but she doesnt reply or replies vaguely. She seems to want to be mysterious while still keeping herself present in my life.

ARRANGING ANOTHER MEET

Fast forward 1-2 weeks and she tells me shes otw back. I ask her how the trip was, she replies vaguely again, but this time i tell her, would love to hear about it sometime. Shes like, yeah tonight maybe? Im like, sure. Shes like, ok ill let u know if i make it, im meeting my family rn but ill be home at 9pm, maybe u can come over . Aint saying no to that.

Unfortunately she texts me a couple hours later telling me she cant make it (maybe she was still busy with her family, or maybe she thought she was being too easy), but tomorrow she can. Im like, ill be traveling again for a couple days, ill let u know when im back.

So i text her again when im back (was monday this week), and shes like, lets go at the lake on thursday (today). Alright, lets do it.

MEETING AGAIN AND FUCKING UP AGAIN

So we meet today after lunch. We lay somewhere in the shadows, eat something and chat. Shes in bikini and super fucking hot. I touch her a bit, then go for the kiss, but she only gives me quick pecks on the lips in return. Its still good to me and i do that a couple more times, but the last time she gives me a peck and turns her head to the side.

Thats when i think i fucked up, cause i read it as a, i dont feel super comfortable kissing u right now. So i back off and stop with the touching/kissing altogether.

The vibe is now friendly and boring (yet again) and at some point she puts up a time constraint for tonight - nothing set in stone, but shes like, yeah id be nice if i did that thing tonight. Im like, ok well, sounds super important; id have loved to grab a drink, but if u have plans then ill join my buddies for beach volleyball. Shes goes, when are ur buddies playing? Im like, right now. So shes like, ok then lets go. So we walk a bit, then hug and part ways.

ANALYSIS

This is a pattern i noticed in my behavior - its like, if a girl is putting up some resistance a few times, i back off, never to try again unless she gives me some signs that she wants me to escalate. This is all good if the girl is visibly not ready/comfortable for me to lead further, but no bueno if shes just playing (as i think she was in this case).

As far as she told me, shes used to date alpha males - she dated ceos, top athletes, guys who aggressively go for what they want until they have it. These guys are able to chase and persist like crazy.

(Although she also complained about them being very self-centered and not really caring about developing a genuine connection - something that i suspect she thinks is possible with me instead.)

Unfortunately thats not me. Im not good at persisting/overly chasing, and when i feel im trying to extract something from a girl or to convince her to do something, i lose all the drive to make things happen.

And in part this is bad, because i think i can be a bit more aggressive. For example, when she turned her head after i kissed her the last time, i could have manhandle-kissed her, or told her, just kiss me properly, instead of just accepting her frame.

But im also starting to think we have a mismatch in expectations/personalities.

This is the third time i met this girl (fourth including the initial daytime approach), and i think my chances to bed her have gone below zero. Tbh im sorta losing interest too, the whole thing now feels forced/messy and no longer the whirlwind romance that (mainly due to my previous fuckup) could have materialized instead.

Now, shes a lawyer, and i told her i might need one for something related to my apartments rent. She was super helpful, she explained how some things work and suggested she help me writing a letter of complaint and potentially raising the thing in a court - and she would do that for free.

It might be a way for her to sorta keep herself present in my life, but im not sure i wanna take this chance - id have to send her my rental contract + other docs with my full name in them, and i just dont know how i feel about this.

As usual, any suggestions/perspectives/feedback much appreciated.

Hmm if it doesn't feel good I'd say don't do it. Follow your intuition

 

[Higher]

Ill send her (yet another) autorejection text today.

 

[Mr.SocialAcceptableHarem]

Ill send her (yet another) autorejection text today.

could u clarify, I don’t understand

 

[Higher]

could u clarify, I don’t understand

Ill write her sth like, hey, just wanted to make it clear that i find u attractive both physically and mentally, this is clear to me but i suspect its not clear to u, i wouldnt want u to feel rejected/unwanted or that im playing games or something.

I dont count too much on it, i think i burned all my credit with this girl, but i dont see any other option.

 

[Will_V]

@Higher you've read the situation fairly well.

She wanted you to take her the first time you were home together, and you didn't. She was still attracted though (maybe her thinking you were off banging a flame of yours was actually good in that instance) and so she gave you another chance. But she wasn't going to be so enthusiastic this time since you dropped the ball before, and that's why she's gone for little pecks, and turned her face away.

You gotta realize this isn't her trying to be annoying, it's the way female nature operates when she isn't sure you are the man for the job. For a woman, opening up sexually feels comfortable around a sexually confident man, but around an unconfident man it feels uncomfortable and anxiety-inducing, which results in her giving mixed signals, and showing open and closed body language, as her emotions swing to and fro. Guys call this 'testing', maybe there's some of that but imo it is mainly just the inability to let herself go in the face of the risk that the dude will not take her.

As far as the previous report goes, yes you should have gone for it. You could manhandle kiss her. If you're sitting together, you can put your arm around her and pull her in firmly, and start running your hands over her - lift up the back of her top and run your hands up her back, slide your fingers up into her hair, etc. Same thing for lying down. Basically you just have to show clear sexual/physical intent that isn't easily repelled by her being lukewarm.

Do that until she pulls away a little, which she usually will do if you're coming on unexpectedly strong. She might look at you to see what's going on, just smile and chill and go back to conversation. But you've already accomplished the objective, she'll be aroused and in no two minds about what will happen if she opens the door and invites you in. The frame from then on will be different.

At this point, it's going to be tough since you already blew things twice. First thing to do is accept that she is probably gone, and that this might be just a lesson on your journey. Second, DON'T CHASE. That text you were about to send, about finding her attractive physically and mentally, yeah that's not actually going to improve anything, quite the contrary. It will just reinforce the notion that you're a man of talk and not action.

I suggest you read this article as it has the principles of how to behave when you've messed up. The main points imo:

• Don't chase!
• Accept that getting her at this point is low odds.
• Start getting compliance from her in one form or another - I like what the article suggests about going for a short walk. You want to be fairly commanding and not beat around the bush, as if it's something important, ideally she's thinking "hm something seems different, I wonder what this is about?" rather than "oh he's angling for ANOTHER try".
• If you meet again, lead her, and be physically dominant and comfortable touching her from the get go, like she belongs to you, and you want to let your desire and intent show. If you mess up at least mess up by falling off the other side of the horse. That way you can enjoy the lesson and move on if it isn't meant to be.
• Take her to bed asap.

Best of luck!

 

[ChrisXKiss]

Ill write her sth like, hey, just wanted to make it clear that i find u attractive both physically and mentally, this is clear to me but i suspect its not clear to u, i wouldnt want u to feel rejected/unwanted or that im playing games or something.

What I have realised is that this kind of autorejection text could be effective when the autorejection is because of a lack of attainability. If she considered you really attractive but for some reason felt she could not get you or you did not really like her, then this kind of angle could reassure her.

However when there is lack of value this text will look a lot more like chasing. The thing is that this girl was into you, expected something to happen and eventually felt you didn't live up to it. But she knows you liked her, you were kissing, it can't be an attainability thing. So what she ended up feeling probably in the end is that: "This guy just doesn't have what it takes".

And this really destroys your value in her eyes. To the point that she might even start feeling disgusted that you had her open up sexually but didn't deliver. I feel that the process in her mind goes something like: He does seem interesting -> Omg at last someone exciting that can take action -> Wait why is he not moving forward anymore, he clearly likes me -> Don't tell me I presented my sexual side to some loser that can't get things done, eww disgusting, how did I get played like that, I want nothing to do with him!

Now this is a bit of an exaggeration but I feel that the more you prime her for a great sexual experience, the more when you don't deliver it she feels tricked and kinda appalled. This girl did come for the second meeting, probably because she wondered if in the end it was an attainability problem and not a value one on your side, because you were going to visit another girl and your mind was there.

But of course she took smaller and more restrained steps during the second meeting to check how you would act and I have the feeling she eventually concluded that the problem is indeed that you don't get things done, so your value plummeted in her eyes.

So yeah it will be very difficult, if you can manage to get her out again I would follow Will's suggestions and that article, that said it's better to first accept that it's probably a lost cause, so that you don't spend a lot of mental and emotional energy on something with low odds.

 

[Mr.SocialAcceptableHarem]

Ill write her sth like, hey, just wanted to make it clear that i find u attractive both physically and mentally, this is clear to me but i suspect its not clear to u, i wouldnt want u to feel rejected/unwanted or that im playing games or something.

I dont count too much on it, i think i burned all my credit with this girl, but i dont see any other option.

it’s chase and nice guy behavior doing that

u gotta act as if your already fucking a ton of other girls

don’t mention anything about how attractive she is

you gotta show, not tell your interest

Proclaiming your lust is not a bad idea at this point, if possible

just gotta find the right way to do it

“hey look, I was thinking, and your hot as fuck, your ass is so sexy, x, y, z, and I think you should come over again, I want to fuck your pussy”

Now how to do this in a calibrated way?

that takes skill

if it’s not a opportune time,

you just gotta act normal

but attraction wears off, so you gotta turn her on with Uber direct game before it’s too late; it’s your last option

 

[Higher]

Good thing i didnt send her that horrible text.

Will just ignore her for now. Ill ping her again in some time with a low investment ping and do as the gurus suggested.

Its too bad, but this is already dead in my mind. Hard lesson but life goes on.

Thanks guys!

 

[AspiringStoic]

I struggle with this too. I am trying to follow these guidelines.

@Chase has a great post on here about it. If I read it right, polarization is your issue as well.

When and How Much Should You Polarize?

Here’s a common issue I see guys run into: trying to decide how polarizing they should be. The general breakdown is: Beginners: polarize a LOT, across the board Journeymen: still polarize a lot, but start reeling it in and being more refined Advanced: polarize in small, controlled doses – use...

www.skilledseducer.com

P.S. I mean generally this seems to be the issue. Not how to go forward with this girl.

 

[Jan]

It seems to me that your main problem is FEAR OF FAILURE.

This manifests in two ways:
- fear of losing a really hot girl
- fear of performance (in other words fear of losing at performing)

There are several ways you can overcome it.

INTELLECTUAL FRAME

You need to realize that failure is actually a success. The only real failure is if you didn't try. If you try and fail is still a win, because you at least tried and you gained experience.

Secondly, you need to realize that even very good seducers fail. Think about professional sportsmen - even the top players don't succeed in 100% attempts/games. Sometimes they need to try to score several times, to just score one goal. If you consider a try to be a failure, then pros fail MORE OFTEN than they succeed.

EMOTIONAL FRAME

Fear of failure is an emotion. And the best way to deal with fear is to FACE IT. You can face it in two ways: in your head and body, and also in real life.

Try to relax with closed eyes and IMAGINE THE FAILURE in your head. Imagine that you make an attempt and she resists, or you fail at performing. You should be able to feel the fear through imagination. And the critial part is to STAY ENGAGED with your imagination and stay engaged with the emotions. Let your mind present what it sees as possible consequences of what it's fearing. Stay as long as you feel fear and as long as the brain is creating these imaginary scenarios. If you keep facing your fear, you will realize that at some point the emotion starts fading away. Because that's the nature of emotions. They are temporary. Emotions are signals. If you open yourself to the signal and receive it in full (feel the fullness of emotion), it will disappear. If you run away from the emotions, it will get stuck in your body/psyche and it will come back next time. Through this exercise you are able to expose yourself to the emotion without the actual risks.

ACTION FRAME

The most important thing of course just to take the shots in real life. Anytime you feel fear, it should be a sign for you to FACE IT. Get involved with it so take forward action. If we take your example of kissing, when she was half-assing her kiss, you should have lunge forward and kiss her more passionately. What you did instead, you passed your fear into her, and at some point she had enough of it, so she backed up.