Working the Bouncers - Att: Teevs, Pelu, Skills

[Glow]

Im working on a new venue and made good initial contact w the door men. I wanna work these smartly so just curious to your tactics.

Bouncers are key in many places, beyond pickers ofc. And i figured atm my main targets would be bouncers.

I know knowing the managers and lead hostesses, lead promoters etc. maybe the promoters ofc provide a lot. But im not into table life, and inner crowd workings etc. I know a few DJs though who provides access to things at the level i like. Atm. I just wanna easen the access route and avoid lines etc. From there i work more low key.

So im trying to understand and know the bouncer situation to be a cool guy around them who speak their language and behave smartly.

Field proven tactics and awareness level please.

 

[Toby2030]

I know a lot of bouncers because of my dad's profession. He has a lot of bouncers under him. Keep in mind that most bouncers are people that either couldn't become police officers or get into the military. It's mostly macho guys/pretend macho guys that LOVE power and authority. He has fired A LOT of bouncers because of abuse of power and authority. They are really motivated by displaying power. If you can give them power or set them in scenarios where they have authority, you are already a huge step in front of everybody. I haven't tested things out from a cold approach scenario - most of the bouncers I know has been because of introduction through my dad. But what has worked in the past for me has been opening girls in line and setting up chase frames like them chasing the bouncer. Other than that once you are inside, chatting them up and asking if they want a redbull or something. I can't really give great actional guidelines - it's not really an area I have explored much, but maybe it can get you in the right direction. idk.

 

[Watts]

Firstly, go early, when they are checking ID's but there isn't a line (or even before the are checking ID's, but there and just hanging out).

I open them, like I would a girl, at least when I'm up in line, or possibly sooner if I see a situational opener.

And then I just start a conversation.

Situational is best, saying something funny about something going on, or just awareness of someone doing something out of place (like someone being drunk and stupid).

I also did this in my recent field rapport when I came to a new venue and a girl was hitting a juul. Take a look if you haven't already

https://www.skilledseducer.com/threads/first-time-in-new-venue-almost-pull-but-bad-logistics.21922

If nothing situational I'll ask them how the night is going, I may say it's my first time there or I just started coming there and ask when it gets good (which also sets the stage for a longer conversation, since I'm "new"), and more or less try to hook them then and there (maybe saying something like "When do the girls who want to make mistakes get here? Like the ones who want to make a bad decision?" - Used that in the past to success but haven't in a while, haven't had to).

If there is no hook because they are busy or in a bad mood or whatever, I'll make a mental note and just circle around to them later. I'm pretty sure @Skills mentions offering to or just grabbing them a water later. Personally I'll just float back around and find an excuse to talk to them i.e. I need a stamp to get back in and ask them if they'll remember me, thus can I do it without a stamp (turn a bit close to them "I don't want my girlfriend to know I was out here picking up chicks" said with a smirk, just something funny like that). But better is if something happens out front or in line and I will just look at them, make eye contact like and an expression of "can you believe that!", comment on the situation etc.

Also, I look at it as essentially having to close the bouncer, so if don't get anything really good going with a girl, I still consider the night a success if I feel I made a connection there (which to me, on a first night out, would be that they remember me and we exchanged names, as a minimum).

For a really strong hook, like I had on Wednesday, I'll chat with the bouncer and anyone else around (in this case the hostess), and then actually just hang out there as people start coming in. I'll even start opening the cute girls in line, a lot of times taking their ID's (if you're just standing with the bouncer, a lot of times they assume you work there. Could just be part of my persona, decently built and professional, but either way you can joke with them and/or take ID's), and of course after I check their ID's and make a comment on it (On Wednesday I made a cute blonde pronounce her god awful last name, and then said "Whatever, if you say so" as if it was a fake name from a fake ID and she was making it up lol).

And, I think it is obvious to a guy like you Glow, but anyone else reading this, this is an easy way to get some sets started for the night, particularly if you're going out solo (not to mention get some social and sexual momentum, sexual from the flirting).

But to the point of the minimum (name close, will remember me) on a first night at a new venue (or a first night seeing a new bouncer), if nothing else, when I leave I make a point to thank them, tell them it's a good place, that I'll be back, ask their name, shake their hand and tell them to have a good night.

Further, I'll go to the same place again the next night in particular if I had a weaker close in order to lock it down, it's much easier to become known if they see you Friday night and then Saturday night for example. With a solid close (like Wednesday), I may move on to another venue altogether as I lock down the area. Also, this assumes you're scouting venues or have a good idea this is a place locking down, I'm almost certain Teevster mentioned scouting 2 or 3 new places one night while becoming accustomed to a new area in one of our two "Teevster and Watts discuss" threads, although for some reason I couldn't find it (those threads may be a worth a look anyway). Although, I may also make it a point to get to one venue early, before they even convert to "nightlife", and commit to staying the whole night (or pulling, even better! haha), just to understand the flow of things. Sometimes a particular bar will become great at a certain time, or it will be too crowded past a certain time, so that may be worth knowing.

I will also write down the position, name, physical description and short summary of what we talked about or anything of note that happened in my Evernote. That way I can check it before seeing them next time (in the uber, on the way).

Described that here:

Going out every night on the limited budget

Hi beginner here I've been studying game for a year-and-a-half now. even though I made a lot of strives and a lot of progress it's not at the pace that I want. (By that I mean I still haven't gotten laid or been on dates). Now my first year I was completely clueless and it was so much...

www.skilledseducer.com

Hope this was helpful!

Side Note: I used a variant of your "relaxed, expressive and enthusiastic" routine (what is congruent with me) Wednesday and Friday in my FR, from the https://www.skilledseducer.com/threads/seduction-oriented-topics.21690/, and I'm going to work it into my process (I feel it's a good low risk way to start introducing some sex talk). Thanks again for that!

 

[Pelusita]

Hello Glow!

I have actually worked as a bouncer some years ago and gained some insight from the inside about the dynamics at the door. Bouncers are very macho types that wound up at a club.

I would actually not at all recommend you to chat up the bouncers at all. Most people try that snd they will only look down on you as trying to suck up to them. These dudes have been instructed to only let people with high value in, therefore they will be extremely susceptible to your value-level. People perceived as low-value will not rank high in their judgement.

Best way of getting the guards on your good side is to just be friendly when you enter and behave well once you are inside. If you always dress dashingly, are nice to them and follow their instructions once they ask you to do something for them as moving out of the way they will remember you.
The professional dudes are often hard and cold so they will not be friendly to you even if they recognize you. It can easily take months before they say hi to you or even greet you. This is because their job is to sort out the people that are sober enough, cool enough and may spend their money on drinks. If they start being friendly with you and you show up too drunk, rejecting you would then be harder for them. This is a way of preventing them to face a problem in the future. When they seen you often enough and they perceive you as a cool and harmless dude that coldness will wanish.

Actually I’m writing an article about this subject because there is a lot to share about this matter.

Good luck!
Pelusita

 

[Watts]

I would actually not at all recommend you to chat up the bouncers at all. Most people try that snd they will only look down on you as trying to suck up to them. These dudes have been instructed to only let people with high value in, therefore they will be extremely susceptible to your value-level. People perceived as low-value will not rank high in their judgement.

Best way of getting the guards on your good side is to just be friendly when you enter and behave well once you are inside. If you always dress dashingly, are nice to them and follow their instructions once they ask you to do something for them as moving out of the way they will remember you.

The professional dudes are often hard and cold so they will not be friendly to you even if they recognize you. It can easily take months before they say hi to you or even greet you. This is because their job is to sort out the people that are sober enough, cool enough and may spend their money on drinks. If they start being friendly with you and you show up too drunk, rejecting you would then be harder for them. This is a way of preventing them to face a problem in the future. When they seen you often enough and they perceive you as a cool and harmless dude that coldness will wanish.

Thanks for those insights.

I didn't think to mention it, but I generally dress one level or a half level above the other bar patrons, am well-mannered and friendly, and sober for half a decade.

I agree people try to suck up to bouncers, and I've seen people do it (and long in the past was guilty of it too), but being able to be a high-value charismatic guy that people want to be liked by (not just someone who is looking to be liked) is probably one of my stronger points. Part of this is being always happy and positive, quick with a joke, and also aware and empathetic.

So really, I didn't think to mention any of it because it's just who I am at this point. But I do agree.

Also

If they start being friendly with you and you show up too drunk, rejecting you would then be harder for them. This is a way of preventing them to face a problem in the future.

A very good point I hadn't considered from the outside.

The professional dudes are often hard and cold so they will not be friendly to you even if they recognize you. It can easily take months before they say hi to you or even greet you.

But I do feel that doing what I said, both A) treating closing the bouncer with the same urgency you treat closing a hot girl (while being appropriately indirect as necessary) and B) going to the same place in quick succession as necessary in a Thur/Fri/Sat period, along with the obvious C) get there before the rush just to hang out; there is no reason it should take months.

And all of those are a big commitment of time and energy. So it has to be worth it to you. However I can say I've done this many times at many different venues (and up the chain at that, bartenders, managers, even owners), and I'm confident it's reproducible.

I also don't mind buying girls drinks if I like them (as a way to isolate), so I'll spend money there too (I know some guys are very against this). Plus, if I see something bad going down, I usually tell someone (a fight breaking out for instance).

Another thing, I tend to not get a bad reputation with girls, burning sets to the ground etc. I've seen guys from local lairs get banned from bars I was a VIP at because they had girls constantly claim they were harassing them, and spent zero money.

 

[Skills]

Im working on a new venue and made good initial contact w the door men. I wanna work these smartly so just curious to your tactics.

Bouncers are key in many places, beyond pickers ofc. And i figured atm my main targets would be bouncers.

I know knowing the managers and lead hostesses, lead promoters etc. maybe the promoters ofc provide a lot. But im not into table life, and inner crowd workings etc. I know a few DJs though who provides access to things at the level i like. Atm. I just wanna easen the access route and avoid lines etc. From there i work more low key.

So im trying to understand and know the bouncer situation to be a cool guy around them who speak their language and behave smartly.

Field proven tactics and awareness level please.

There is no "gaming bouncers" per se, the chatting up the bouncers as pelusita said is a nono, till you reach the "the bouncer know you stage" , with bouncer relationship will eventually happen as you become a regular, in other words as they constantly see you over and over and become familiar with you.... You can use one word comments but not to be confuse as chatting, and always touch them in the shoulder, and shake their hands every chance you get, i do this going in and out of the club, i go for the shoulder if i speculate the hand is not there....

@Watts That was a seducer name Diagoro that offers a bouncer a drink instead of paying cover
“I don’t want to pay cover. I just want to have a few drinks. Can I buy you a drink instead?” No fuss, no drama. And if he refuses, I either walk away or have to pay up.

p.s. cost of success was a boncer too cosy

 

[Watts]

There is no "gaming bouncers" per se, the chatting up the bouncers as pelusita said is a nono, till you reach the "the bouncer know you stage" , with bouncer relationship will eventually happen as you become a regular, in other words as they constantly see you over and over and become familiar with you.... You can use one word comments but not to be confuse as chatting, and always touch them in the shoulder, and shake their hands every chance you get, i do this going in and out of the club, i go for the shoulder if i speculate the hand is not there....

So, to connect it a bit. What I pointed out was that at a minimum if you set it as a goal that they should remember you and you two exchange names. It should feel to them like they would want to do it.

Also, just like in mystery method, if you walk up and say "what's your name" before attraction is there (or in this case, the perception of high value), you will become an annoyance ("why would I care to get to know this person?"). This is also how the low value guys who try to befriend the bouncers often come across. And of course there a variety of ways though game/social dynamics to convince someone that you are high value.

That minimum I said is in line with what you're saying for a night out when you got there early before the rush, and made a point to make some friendly comments, or even come back later if they were busy.

As far as "chatting up" etc. we are going to disagree that it's not possible if it's your priority for that night. There's going to be some drunk person causing a scene, or someone with a fake, or some silly situation you can use to spark a conversation. I've done it countless times. It's field tested.

The point I'm making is you may have to be willing to sacrifice a lay that night, or at least accept you'll do subpar game.

Which to me is worth it in the long term for a place I may be going to, possibly for years.

Here's a distinction and I feel it's very strong but I'm willing to hear a response to this:

You, @Skills and @Pablo ”Pelusita” Garcia , both guys whose game I respect a lot, believe and have achieved (to my knowledge):

Meeting a 9 who is a complete stranger, convincing her you are high value, convincing her to let you fuck her in the same night you met her.

But for some reason believe you can't:

Meet an average Joe bouncer who is a complete stranger, convince him you are high value, become friendly enough with him that he will remember you and say hello next time you see him (or, in fact, let you skip the line).

Given those two missions were given the same time, energy and priority.

I can't agree both of these two premises are true.

Granted, you may not be able to do both in the same night.

That was a seducer name Diagoro that offers a bouncer a drink instead of paying cover
“I don’t want to pay cover. I just want to have a few drinks. Can I buy you a drink instead?” No fuss, no drama. And if he refuses, I either walk away or have to pay up.

p.s. cost of success was a boncer too cosy

I actually like that. I'd guess some places comp drinks to some employees, but that could be a good move. Thank you.

Cool, and I'd love to hear his opinion on it too. Will probably be some interesting insights.

 

[Teevster]

You, @Skills and @Pablo ”Pelusita” Garcia , both guys whose game I respect a lot, believe and have achieved (to my knowledge):

Meeting a 9 who is a complete stranger, convincing her you are high value, convincing her to let you fuck her in the same night you met her.

But for some reason believe you can't:

Meet an average Joe bouncer who is a complete stranger, convince him you are high value, become friendly enough with him that he will remember you and say hello next time you see him (or, in fact, let you skip the line).

I actually like that. I'd guess some places comp drinks to some employees, but that could be a good move. Thank you.

Cool, and I'd love to hear his opinion on it too. Will probably be some interesting insights.

You cannot compare those two things. They are by nature very different.

I agree with Pablo's advice though - although there is an exception: the bouncers who are not those macho power-hungry guys, but more the sociable and friendly dude. Those are like 5 % of the bouncers.
But in general, I have nothing more to add.

 

[Watts]

You cannot compare those two things. They are by nature very different.

I agree they are very different.

Even though, there is skill and tactic carryover (for instance, you can "hover" near the entrance waiting for an opportunity to engage the bouncer or other important individual of that establishment, again field tested).

And, in my opinion the second is far easier than the first. But I must be missing something, because I could do the later consistently long before I could the former (inconsistently).

I agree with Pablo's advice though - although there is an exception: the bouncers who are not those macho power-hungry guys, but more the sociable and friendly dude. Those are like 5 % of the bouncers.
But in general, I have nothing more to add.

Honestly I think that's the best for me too.

I think I made a pretty detailed guide for my first post, and I think I've fleshed out my responses to the conflicting opinions presented after.

I have tremendous respect for the game of everyone in this thread (as well as respect for everyone in general and this forum), so I'd rather just let it stand at that then.

 

[Teevster]

Even though, there is skill and tactic carryover (for instance, you can "hover" near the entrance waiting for an opportunity to engage the bouncer or other important individual of that establishment, again field tested).

If you do that in a high-end venue, you risk never EVER getting in. This is outright terrible advice.

Again, keep in mind that Pablo is here talking about high end venue bouncers. Not those venues where everybody gets in.

 

[Watts]

If you do that in a high-end venue, you risk never EVER getting in. This is outright terrible advice.

Again, keep in mind that Pablo is here talking about high end venue bouncers. Not those venues where everybody gets in.

Maybe the direct translation wasn't appropriate then. I've waited around nearby for an opportunity to engage in conversation, while already in the bar, but far enough to not bother people who are working. So similar to hovering, but just being a patron of the venue standing nearby.

Edit: Standing close to a group of girls (and possibly guys) to listen to their conversation till you find an appropriate opening, without being intrusive. That's the related sort of opener I'm describing. Which may not be exactly what's meant by "hovering".

By high end venue do you mean one where if you walk up and ask about it, they won't even tell you it exists unless you're with a member? I've heard of these before, but don't have concrete experience. And in which case, wouldn't a "members only" establishment remove the need for this sort of connecting anyway (since you're already a "member" or with one)?

Because I've also done this at venues that regularly have celebrities (pro athletes several times I was there), but yes they are open to public (although there is usually a line around the block after a certain time).

 

[Teevster]

Edit: Standing close to a group of girls (and possibly guys) to listen to their conversation till you find an appropriate opening, without being intrusive. That's the related sort of opener I'm describing. Which may not be exactly what's meant by "hovering"

Again, dealing with bouncers is not the same as dealing with girls in a club.

By high end venue do you mean one where if you walk up and ask about it, they won't even tell you it exists unless you're with a member? I've heard of these before, but don't have concrete experience. And in which case, wouldn't a "members only" establishment remove the need for this sort of connecting anyway (since you're already a "member" or with one)?

A. You don't ask about those clubs, you don't engage the pickers/bouncers
B. yes, mostly guestlist only - but some differences in their selection of crowd occurs
C. Non-members can get in, as long as they display high social value and is suitable to the club

Here, all the advice you have given will guarantee you NOT getting in.


-Teevster

 

[Teevster]

Read this passage carefully...

HAIL THE KINGS OF COPENHAGEN

Lately I have been hanging out a bit with our fellow pick-up-artist named Glow (old mASF poster, who I met up when moving to Copenhagen). Together we planedn on building a social circle that would rock the Copenhagen nightlife. In particular we had a desire to conquer this venue in Copenhagen that happens to be a popular spot that usually focuses on membership, guest lists while allowing occasional random guests in, but only if they pass through the pointer/picker (a picker/pointer is basically that judgmental asshole with low self-esteem who tells people to come in or fuck off outside a popular high end venue).I tried to contact my DJ friend to get us on the guest list. Unfortunately he couldn’t do it for some reasons, but told us to send a message to a number that he gave us to get us on a VIP list to an event that started at 10 (that’s quite early), before the club was officially opened. This event had offered free bar to the VIP guests, who more or less with either directly or indirectly friends with the club’s owners and staff. We were a bit skeptical about this since we weren’t technically invited. Glow was a bit nervous to head there, and to be frank, so was I, without admitting it to him.

We met up and headed to the venue. We were both dressed to kill. Glow was wearing a black longline black scooped-neck long armed t-shirt, a silver necklace, a silver scarf, slim-fit jeans with black boots topped with a classy black trench coat. I on the other hand was wearing a black v-neck, black skinny jeans, and black boots, topped with a flashy red bomber jacket with Chinese dragons on, followed with a silver dragon necklace to add some spice. I was dressed to murder as well.

We arrived the venue. Nervous as we were, we followed Pablo's advice to just come across as confident at the door and kind of ignore the picker until he or she tries to get our attention. This signifies high value, which is the only language the world of nightclubs understands. Through the guest list entrance, we were walking with a confident posture striaght into the venue, in a determined fashion (there was nobody in front of us) while talking to each other and more or less ignoring the girl at the door. We kept walking and 1 meter before the entrance the girl at the door just clears the entrance for us without saying a word. We didn’t have to stop, we walked straight in. I guess I can confidently say that Pablo's trick does in fact work!

Next was the guy who checks the guest list… he lets uswalk straight past him… “Just go in sir”. We were blown away. What an entrance! We were kind of mind-blown for a bit.

 

[Watts]

Again, dealing with bouncers is not the same as dealing with girls in a club.

Yes. Agree.

And I was pointing out one way to socially open (if you're patient).

Also, I find relating to a regular dude who probably goes to the gym and is interested in fucking girls much easier to do than a hot girl.

But like I said, I may be missing something here, since it seems to not be the consensus with the seducers here.

However to me this is more like something I'd do in business networking, so maybe I'm just coming with a different background and experiences.

We can unpack another time how girls I've met while out have told me they thought I was in sales or other industries.

For now, I'd just say we should agree we experience this differently (and trust me, I'd prefer it be the opposite!).

A. You don't ask about those clubs, you don't engage the pickers/bouncers
B. yes, mostly guestlist only - but some differences in their selection of crowd occurs
C. Non-members can get in, as long as they display high social value and is suitable to the club

Here, all the advice you have given will guarantee you NOT getting in.

-Teevster

This may also be a function of the city I'm in. I don't know of a bar/club with "pickers" but I'm familiar with the concept.

Although, as an aside (topical), as a joke before I saw a fat girl walking away from a bar crying and I opened the bouncer with "I'm glad to see you guys are finally enforcing a weight requirement" lol. Who knows, maybe I just speak their language?

But yeah, I can understand that would be a different dynamic than a regular place. And I have been to ritzier sorts of places that have a velvet rope and selectively let girls/guys in, and as you said, based on your value.

They also generally split up the entrance with the bouncers with the place to pay cover etc. So that one tip in particular (to stay near the entrance) probably wouldn't be as useful, but I have tons of ways to open and engage with time on my side.

I do disagree that my advice to get there early, say 9 or even 8, and chat with the people who have to be there ready for the rush but currently with very little to do, would not result in an opportunity to talk to them for a bit. I would expect them to be just bullshiting around and waiting.

But I have limited experience here in this one specific circumstance "velvet rope type place". So I won't pretend to know exactly how things would work there, and I'm glad you pointed it out so people won't use that advice for that place with the same confidence.

Edit: Let us know what kind of places you were interested in @Glow so we can better guide this discussion.

Edit: And with "velvet rope type places" I would say better to go for promoters, that's what they are there for (I have done that here). But that's on the only places in my city that approach that, which, having traveled, is far from top tier exclusivity.

However in other places, I'm confident I can do it and what I said works (for me).

 

[Skills]

Yes. Agree.

And I was pointing out one way to socially open (if you're patient).

Also, I find relating to a regular dude who probably goes to the gym and is interested in fucking girls much easier to do than a hot girl.

But like I said, I may be missing something here, since it seems to not be the consensus with the seducers here.

However to me this is more like something I'd do in business networking, so maybe I'm just coming with a different background and experiences.

We can unpack another time how girls I've met while out have told me they thought I was in sales or other industries.

For now, I'd just say we should agree we experience this differently (and trust me, I'd prefer it be the opposite!).



This may also be a function of the city I'm in. I don't know of a bar/club with "pickers" but I'm familiar with the concept.

Although, as an aside (topical), as a joke before I saw a fat girl walking away from a bar crying and I opened the bouncer with "I'm glad to see you guys are finally enforcing a weight requirement" lol. Who knows, maybe I just speak their language?

But yeah, I can understand that would be a different dynamic than a regular place. And I have been to ritzier sorts of places that have a velvet rope and selectively let girls/guys in, and as you said, based on your value.

They also generally split up the entrance with the bouncers with the place to pay cover etc. So that one tip in particular (to stay near the entrance) probably wouldn't be as useful, but I have tons of ways to open and engage with time on my side.

I do disagree that my advice to get there early, say 9 or even 8, and chat with the people who have to be there ready for the rush but currently with very little to do, would not result in an opportunity to talk to them for a bit. I would expect them to be just bullshiting around and waiting.

But I have limited experience here in this one specific circumstance "velvet rope type place". So I won't pretend to know exactly how things would work there, and I'm glad you pointed it out so people won't use that advice for that place with the same confidence.

However in other places, I'm confident I can do it and what I said works (for me).

Yes such comment "indirect comment/joke" will work (which is the point i was making)....

chatting up is like befriend with agenda=will not work.- no only with bouncer but with anybody, i have people come to me at the club "chatting me up" is annoying and won't work...

Also remember is also venue, country, culture specific... a bit... if it works for you, keep doing it, regardless... Since you can not replicate personalities/vives/calibration etc...

 

[Teevster]

I do disagree that my advice to get there early, say 9 or even 8, and chat with the people who have to be there ready for the rush but currently with very little to do, would not result in an opportunity to talk to them for a bit. I would expect them to be just bullshiting around and waiting.

Again, talking about high-end venues.

Well, how would you standing at the entrance to a private party you are not invited to make you look good?

At 8-9 those clubs usually host private events for their members.

I think that in normal dive bars type of venues this should be doable. But In those venues you do not really need to work the bouncers, and if you do... all you have to do is work the bouncers over time by being a regular.

Sure you can chat them up. Maybe it works. But what if it pisses them off (which can happen). Then you lose a venue. So why pick the risky option when you can pick the less risky option and get equally good results?

I just don't get it.

 

[Watts]

Yes such comment "indirect comment/joke" will work (which is the point i was making)....

I figured we'd find some agreement. I do know you do this successfully too.

chatting up is like befriend with agenda=will not work.- no only with bouncer but with anybody, i have people come to me at the club "chatting me up" is annoying and won't work...

I think this was a definition misunderstanding. I have felt that too. No one wants a low value person (as they perceive it) wasting their time, not a hot girl, not a bouncer, not me, and not you.

Also remember is also venue, country, culture specific... a bit... if it works for you, keep doing it, regardless... Since you can not replicate personalities/vives/calibration etc...

Agree. Maybe need to be more careful to put a qualifier in there.

 

[Watts]

Again, talking about high-end venues.

Well, how would you standing at the entrance to a private party you are not invited to make you look good?

At 8-9 those clubs usually host private events for their members.

Maybe they do Teevster. You know I try to only speak from experience and qualify anything that is a theory.

I don't go to or have those types of venues in my city. If that's what they do, you're right then there wouldn't be a "slow time" to take advantage of.

I think that in normal dive bars type of venues this should be doable. But In those venues you do not really need to work the bouncers, and if you do... all you have to do is work the bouncers over time by being a regular.

I wouldn't classify a place that famous multi-millionaire athletes frequent as a "dive bar", I think there is quite a bit of room here below what you called a "high-end venue" (which I've only ever experienced as a club: loud, dark, dancing focused, bottle service, which is counterproductive to my style of game anyway).

To me a "dive bar" is a small neighborhood bar, out of the way, that is very cheap, and probably implicitly lets teenagers in to drink with or without fakes (this may not be the same in Europe, but where local 18-20 or even 16-17 year olds try to go in to drink, often successfully). And it would be rare for anyone who didn't live in the area to go there.

Edit: I didn't mean for this to be nitpicking, although it may have come off that way. Suffice it to say, generally in America, a dive bar wouldn't even have a line, because it's not that desirable a place anyway.

Sure you can chat them up. Maybe it works. But what if it pisses them off (which can happen). Then you lose a venue. So why pick the risky option when you can pick the less risky option and get equally good results?

I just don't get it.

I mean, it's fairly easy for me to back off from pissing off regular guy (in person, I make no such claims over the internet! But it is never my intention).

Actually, probably easier to not have a guy get carried away emotionally at me than a girl. It's simple enough for me to apologize if that's the case or just say something friendly but in a masculine, respectful way. I also played sports and am part of the gym culture, that might influence it.

I also don't need to make any high risk moves. I'm just trying to make a friend... not fuck them! haha

And taking months to become a VIP is not equally good results in my book, when I know I can do it in a weekend.

 

[Watts]

I'm still a little sick, and didn't go out this Saturday night, but I can at least give some value here.

I'll put out three field tested ways to do this, all done successfully by me, without having to rely on whatever unique traits I have that get bouncers to be open to talking to me (And I agree they have to be aggressive, and judge people as part of their job. And maybe some are hard to befriend, so let's get around that).

This should also work in high end venues (although I haven't tested it there), where talking to bouncer directly might be a problem. Or, if you don't get there early enough for it to be very slow (although it could be hard at "peak" hours).

I have

1) Ordered a drink from a male bartender, tipped them well, and talked with them for a bit (female bartenders might think you're hitting on them). I got their name. The next night, coming back to the bar, I say "Is (bartender) working tonight?" and this will both open up conversation and potentially get them to consider me a regular. They may ask "Do you know him?" and I will say "Yes". But I won't lie if they ask where I know him from.

You can also do this with more than one low ranking employee, which will increase your odds of getting in free/skipping the line next time.

2) Do the same, but instead befriend the manager. Usually this is enough to get in free, and it will certainly open the door for conversation (because if you know their boss they are likely to want to make a good impression on you).

3) In befriending the manager, tell him "I really like this place. Nice layout, cool vibe. I'll definitely come back again." They will likely appreciate this compliment, it is their job to attract patrons and the compliment means they are doing well. Then ask "Would you mind introducing me to the bouncer, so that he knows me next time I come back?" and then they will walk you over to him, tell them you are a good dude, and to take care of you. Get the bouncer's name at that point, and when you come back, you can skip the line, greet him, and if for some reason he doesn't remember you, drop the manager's name and remind him of the meeting.

There you have it. If you are not able to present yourself as at least a somewhat cool, friendly person who is gainfully employed, this may not work. They do want to encourage paying customers who will be pleasant and not cause problems.

Other than that, I have nothing else to add.

 

[Glow]

I can't really give great actional guidelines - it's not really an area I have explored much, but maybe it can get you in the right direction. idk.

Cool, thanks for the self-reflective pointer.

Keep in mind that most bouncers are people that either couldn't become police officers or get into the military. It's mostly macho guys/pretend macho guys that LOVE power and authority. He has fired A LOT of bouncers because of abuse of power and authority. They are really motivated by displaying power. If you can give them power or set them in scenarios where they have authority, you are already a huge step in front of everybody.

Cool. This resonates w Pablos points but gives another inside view. Thanks.