A tale of 2 naturals, their styles and the women they get

[Razorjack]

This is what I was getting at in my last post. . . I just thought we were discussing the entire seduction process.



I tweak my appearance depending on the environment to trigger various forms of investment before I approach.

When day gaming I'll go with elegantly disheveled outfits. The tight-fitting jeans, suede boots, and color contrasts draw attention. Hinting at a more refined fashion sense than most North Americans. But instead of putting together completely stylish look. . . I keep it nonchalant.

Throw in a very small awareness radius and I look like a guy. . . who fails to notice all the women checking him out.

Peripheral vision is a big part of my pre-approach game. So I can see if the girl beside me is worth opening, or notice new ones positioning themselves next to me. But if I'm looking around. . . I turn my head slowly. Keeping my eyes above people's heads, to give the impression that I'm currently immersed in my own thoughts. The goal is to set up approaches that will appear organic. . . with girls who are already aware of my presence.

There are some slight differences when I game at college bars. I dress a little better than a day game session at the mall. . . going with a more artistic presentation but still casual-looking. Typically I'll stand beside a girl I want to approach. Slowly turn my head with an intrigued expression. . . she'll often be looking at me, before I've made eye contact. If things are more hectic and I have energy. . . I might take a social proof route.

But if my energy is low and I'm rolling solo. . . I'll change behavior to encourage girls to approach me.

I'll stand at a very high-traffic spot and appear immersed in my thoughts. This is different from when I do it during the day. . . instead I allow myself to look vulnerable. . . giving off a slightly tormented vibe. Like I've been contemplating a personal tragedy. Something similar to what Marlon Brando is doing here (LINK). This is when I find myself getting approached very consistently. . . it's really sort of a last resort.

@Bacchus

Dude I'm blown away by how much PU knowledge guys like you and Teevster have. Equally impressed by the control over all the micro-details.

There is simply no way, I could PU like this. Respect.

I'll be honest, a lot of what you wrote is getting lost in translation. I just can't translate what you wrote to my retarded understanding of PU.

Game recognizes game, I can sense the genius in your post but I can't quite place my finger on it for the aha moment.

If I'm doing night game in other venues. . . I dress like an elegant rockstar. My behavior and vibe becomes kind of glamorous. So the girls who approach me typically work in the fashion industry. Otherwise I'll make good use of peripheral vision and slow head turns while opening.

Please break it down to a 5 year old! LOL!

What is it exactly (in your opinion) that is causing the girls to approach you? What are they feeling that creates the impulse for them to approach you?

If I can get an understanding not of what you are doing, but what the girls are feeling when you are doing your magic, then I can recreate it.

Hope this made sense.

 

[FunGuy]

Yes, which is EXACTLY what M-natural projects all of the time naturally without having to demonstrate it via stories, intelligence, etc.

Have you ever figured out what is it about his vibe that gives women that impression? I feel like in most cases people have no choice in the vibe they give off. Sometimes a persons face regardless of what mood their in will give off a vibe. For instance, Willem Dafoe and Terence Fletcher look like a shady assholes even though they aern't doing anything to give off that impression, their face just says it.

Is your friend M-natural just lucky to have a face that gives off a certain vibe, or is it a behavioral thing that can be replicated?

 

[Razorjack]

Have you ever figured out what is it about his vibe that gives women that impression? I feel like in most cases people have no choice in the vibe they give off. Sometimes a persons face regardless of what mood their in will give off a vibe. For instance, Willem Dafoe and Terence Fletcher look like a shady assholes even though they aern't doing anything to give off that impression, their face just says it.

Is your friend M-natural just lucky to have a face that gives off a certain vibe, or is it a behavioral thing that can be replicated?

This has been purely from my experience and my own way of looking at PU:

People definitely have a choice in the vibe they give off. It's based on the person's belief systems, no matter what you try to do, your belief system will bleed through into your behavior.

If you are insecure about your looks, that insecurity will bleed through into your behavior and people will pick it up (they may not be able to say "oh, this guy's insecure about his looks", but they will feel that the "vibe" is off)

In M-natural's case, he's a good looking dude, NOT what guys would consider good looking but what girls would consider good looking. He doesn't have the face of a model, but girls find him "ruggedly handsome"

It's not just his face that gives off this vibe, it's his entire body language and what's sub-communicated in everything he does. It's because when it comes to women he is completely congruent in his belief systems, he doesn't fake anything.

So how can this be replicated?

Two factors I think, one internal the other external:
1. Completely internalizing your belief system until there are zero incongruencies
2. Being in your market - country / culture that is tailor made for your style

So M-natural's market is Scandinavia. I can replicated M-natural's results in Eastern Europe, Middle East, Japan and China because these are my markets.

 

[Bacchus]

@Bacchus

Dude I'm blown away by how much PU knowledge guys like you and Teevster have. Equally impressed by the control over all the micro-details.

Thank you Razorjack

Please break it down to a 5 year old! LOL!

When I'm going for a glamorous presentation. . . I make sure I feel amazing right before I leave my apartment.

Because while I generally come off as detached in other environments, to exude glamour I need to go much further than this. Towards transcendence. . . so a sense of internal bliss, becomes implicit in my slow, deliberate and graceful movements.

Like I'm a distinguished member of society, living in a world of pleasure. . . and paying scarce attention to the mundane majority.

What is it exactly (in your opinion) that is causing the girls to approach you? What are they feeling that creates the impulse for them to approach you?

If I can get an understanding not of what you are doing, but what the girls are feeling when you are doing your magic, then I can recreate it.

I'd say it's a feeling of curiosity combined with a craving for my attention.

Sometimes I get opened with a compliment on my outfit. . . but that's a once in a while thing. Most of the girls who approach me. . . start by asking me a question. I get asked for directions, if I know any good venues, if I want to join her group, if we've met before, if I want to dance. Etc.

One approached me with her phone in hand. To ask if I was the guy in a video she filmed at the same club. . . over one year ago.

Hadn't been to that venue in a long while. . . and I'd never seen her before. But yeah I was the guy she secretly filmed. . . she was excited to see me again, and very curious about how I seem to live in a separate world, while everyone around me just scrambles around frantically.

 

[Razorjack]

Thank you Razorjack



When I'm going for a glamorous presentation. . . I make sure I feel amazing right before I leave my apartment.

Because while I generally come off as detached in other environments, to exude glamour I need to go much further than this. Towards transcendence. . . so a sense of internal bliss, becomes implicit in my slow, deliberate and graceful movements.

Like I'm a distinguished member of society, living in a world of pleasure. . . and paying scarce attention to the mundane majority.



I'd say it's a feeling of curiosity combined with a craving for my attention.

Sometimes I get opened with a compliment on my outfit. . . but that's a once in a while thing. Most of the girls who approach me. . . start by asking me a question. I get asked for directions, if I know any good venues, if I want to join her group, if we've met before, if I want to dance. Etc.

One approached me with her phone in hand. To ask if I was the guy in a video she filmed at the same club. . . over one year ago.

Hadn't been to that venue in a long while. . . and I'd never seen her before. But yeah I was the guy she secretly filmed. . . she was excited to see me again, and very curious about how I seem to live in a separate world, while everyone around me just scrambles around frantically.

Yes, I recognize this.

I describe this as you living in your own universe and people (women) become curious. I've been doing the same for some time now.

I also recognize your situation about getting filmed, for me it was before YouTube but women would approach me and start conversations with "How are you? How have you been? Do you remember me?" but I honestly have no idea who they are or where I met them.

 

[BigPapa]

@Razorjack did you managed to find the answer to your initial question ?

Lately I hit a rough patch , and I think it is because of the fuck boy vibe that I give + high value , and girls just do not take me seriously .

I try to be emphatic , and open them up , but most of the times I feel that they just see it as a trick on my end to deceive them to have sex With me , so most of the times I feel that I am not really making a connection with them .

This hits me in the head exactly with the type of girls that I like the most , and can not really move things in the direction of actually really getting to know them , unless I put a lot of investment by myself , but somehow women feel when you are over investing and is not really going in the Right direction

it is a crazy thing that I never thought I would experience , nor th

 

[Razorjack]

@Razorjack did you managed to find the answer to your initial question ?

@BigPapa

Yes, I managed to find the answer to my situation. It was a combination of several things which I'll go into a bit further down. My situation might have been completely different to yours.

Lately I hit a rough patch , and I think it is because of the fuck boy vibe that I give + high value , and girls just do not take me seriously .

I can't stress this enough:

It's extremely important that you are very clear (not only to me, but more importantly to yourself) about what you mean by "girls just do not take me seriously"

Seriously for what? What is that you are trying to do? How do you want girls to perceive you? What is the greater goal / purpose?

I have a feeling this could get quite complex, so we'll probably have to roll up our sleeves and hammer this out over several days.

I try to be emphatic , and open them up , but most of the times I feel that they just see it as a trick on my end to deceive them to have sex With me , so most of the times I feel that I am not really making a connection with them .

This to me sounds like you're coming across as ingenuine, this was actually never my problem.

I need a bit more information about your level of skills and the results you are getting.

Where do you pick up?
What is your style (are you direct, indirect)?
How often do you pull girls?
Do you consider yourself advanced or still in the beginning stages?
Do you feel different (e.g less confident, insecure about looks / money / etc) about yourself when with "your type" compared to other girls?
Do you feel that you have to be a bit deceptive to get "your type" of girls (as well as others) to have sex with you? (I don't need the seduction community's answer, you need to be completely honest with yourself)
Do you feel that you (just you, not your wealth, status, social circles etc) is enough to pick up?

The more info you can give me, the better.

The advice I would give to a highly skilled seducer would be very different from a guy who is still in the learning phase.

This hits me in the head exactly with the type of girls that I like the most , and can not really move things in the direction of actually really getting to know them , unless I put a lot of investment by myself , but somehow women feel when you are over investing and is not really going in the Right direction

Yes, this is a delicate balance act, it can be frustrating but it's completely possible to fix

it is a crazy thing that I never thought I would experience , nor th

I know what you mean, I swallowed a bit too much of the ASF/mASF KoolAid, which solved one set of problems but created another.

Ok, let's take my specific case. I've never had problems with girls not taking me seriously. I've been with hundreds (500+ maybe? stopped counting a long time) of girls, because they had no problems having sex with me including girls that were "my type".

My problem was that girls didn't want to have more than just sex, like a longer relationship.

15 years ago, there was quite a few things that contributed to my situation:

1. I was in a bit of a mild depression, I had more pussy than most guys could imagine, but I felt very lonely in addition to having a dead end career. I had money, a nice car etc but I was very unhappy about my professional / career outlook.
2. I truly believed that the way to a serious LTR was through being a player/sexual guy/pick up artist (Like I said, I swallowed a bit too much of the ASF/mASF KoolAid)
3. At the top of my game, I used to rule the local nightclubs, I had absolutely no problem picking up the hot party chicks for sex and the occasional professional career women looking for ONS.
4. However very few of the women that I picked up were interested in something more serious including many of the women that picked me up.
5. The ones that were interested in something more had their own issues and while I didn't mind having sex with them, I screened them out for relationships

My theory for my case is similar to the phenomena where women auto-reject unattainable guys. Women could see that I was completely immersed in the player / playboy lifestyle and while they were happy to have sex with me, they auto-rejected an LTR as they thought I was unattainable for a serious relationship outside of my player lifestyle.

In addition to that, and more importantly, women could see/imagine/envision themselves having sex with me but not something more serious

This is where a discussion with my natural friends helped me to set things in perspective.

Let's take M-natural as a comparison:

1. M-natural has one of the most balanced lives I've ever seen.
2. He rarely parties at nightclubs or in general, maybe 10-12/ year, except during the summer time when he's on vacation and relaxing.
3. He doesn't go out to pick up women (they pick him up), doesn't feel the need to.
4. In addition to being in excellent shape doing sports, he travels quite a bit competing in several different motorsports racing genres and horse riding etc
5. he gets into playing PC games with his kids and going to their soccer games
6. thoroughly enjoys his career and has advanced quite a bit in is professional life but he is never stressed by it.
7. Actively monitors his work-life balance, when work gets a bit too much he quickly rebalances it by doing something fun
8. Never has a boring a weekend, he's always doing something: traveling to exciting and exotic places, going to concerts / events, competing in sporting events, etc
9. Always making jokes, laughing and has a positive attitude. I've rarely seen him upset about something, even when things get tough, he remains cool and does what needs to be done and is making jokes shortly afterwards again.
10. Knowingly commits 100% of himself into a relationship in order to make it work, but he won't do this for just any girl. (e.g. he sees an LTR as building a family and treats women as such)
11. He's happy to have ONS with girls, but because of the commitment/investment he is willing to put into a relationship is very picky and selective about who he gets into a serious relationship with

All of the above permeates M-natural, it's written all over him, girls see a good looking, down-to-earth, fun, sexual and exciting guy that they could totally envision being a part of his life.

Compared to me at that time:

1. outside of work my time was spent hooking up with women I met for sex
2. spending time with my kids
3. some quiet time at home to decompress from work or posting / interacting with other PUAs on mASF
4. On weekends I would play golf during the daytime and pick up women at nightclubs (at nighttime)
5. I would emotionally hold women at arms length from me and I didn't get to close to them until they've proven / qualified themselves to be relationship material.

(By the way, most guys are shocked when they learn that my pick up / seduction journey started after I had kids and that some of the best guys I know have kids. Yes, you read that correctly, me and a couple of other "dads" in our mid 30s would pick up women in their 20s. Both M-natural and I are the same age and at the time we had girls in their 20s (10+ years younger than us) picking us up, me for sex, him for sex and LTRs).

So I think you can see where I'm going with this, while women loved having sex with me, they didn't find mingling with PUAs and picking up women at nightclubs too appealing.

Now don't get me wrong, women didn't know how M-natural or I spent our free time, but they sense what we naturally radiate outwards. Just think of that time when you met people that give off a vibe that they are not trustable or you feel uneasy around them. Now amplify and tweak what you felt and realize that this is what a lot of women (and some guys) do instinctively and naturally.

So M-natural basically radiates his fun and exciting life outwards, while I (unintentionally) radiated my "player lifestyle" outwards.

So for me I had to make lifestyle changes, I "retired" from the mASF pick up community and completely redesigned my life.

Fast forward about 7 months and I'm travelling all over the world in an exciting job. I got about 15 marriage proposals from women within a year, professional women at work wanting to date me, girls picking me up at airports, on trains, in hotel lobbies etc

 

[Carousel]

So M-natural basically radiates his fun and exciting life outwards, while I (unintentionally) radiated my "player lifestyle" outwards.

Have you read about modelling levels in NLP?

You remarked some place here that the NextASF crowd of guys are talking generally in much more technical terms than you, while you are often talking about radiating some abstract energy.

I think these are just complementary perspectives like the modelling ladder above.

The downside with modelling on the lower levels is that it may come off as a bit ungenuine. The upside is that it is easily actionable.

The downside with modelling the higher levels is that the advice may not be easily actionable. The upside is that once it clicks it will be more genuine.

With regards to the concrete problem we are talking about here, I can add that I have practiced a "double life" for a long time where one part of me is a respectable and professional STEM educated guy working in tech and programming while another side is a PUA/fuckboy type in flashy clothes. I can switch these on more or less instantly because I have 1) spent a lot of time in both states and 2) done a breakdown of the levels above so I know exactly how to behave and what to communicate in both settings.

 

[BigPapa]

@BigPapa

Where do you pick up?

I pick up all over the place , I do not have a favorite place anymore , I just go for the "kill" where I feel something interesting

What is your style (are you direct, indirect)?

Depends on the situation , but on average I would say is almost 50-50 . Usually when I feel a girl is shy or an introvert I go indirect so I do not scare her haha

How often do you pull girls?

On average I pull like 1 girl per week, sometimes a little bit more , sometimes nothing. I usually have like 30-40 % conversion rate from this , as usually I loose interest if things do not really move fast and just feel like putting the energy into the next prospect , except for girls that I really like and somehow feel a connection with, or are just gorgeous .

Do you consider yourself advanced or still in the beginning stages?

I would say that I am intermediate , I just do not see the point at the moment to hone my skills further , as I have decent traction I would say and just do not have that much time & energy to go out more often.

Do you feel different (e.g less confident, insecure about looks / money / etc) about yourself when with "your type" compared to other girls?

Nope , I have a really high esteem as I am naturally a quite handsome guy , have a really good career , good work life balance , just got into Harvard
to do a masters degree in Data Science ( it is the extension school so not quite the real Harvard , but hey I still will get a degree from Harvard haha )

Do you feel that you have to be a bit deceptive to get "your type" of girls (as well as others) to have sex with you? (I don't need the seduction community's answer, you need to be completely honest with yourself)

Nope , I am ok with how I am , and feel somehow blessed . What I do though is that I hide my enthusiasm , as I do not want her to feel that I like her more than she likes me .

Do you feel that you (just you, not your wealth, status, social circles etc) is enough to pick up?

I went through so much shit in my life so far , that I feel that even if you let me in the desert I would somehow find a way to live a good life there and come back to society . What I am aware though is that wealth, social status , etc are helping me to achieve my goals , but only this

The more info you can give me, the better.

The advice I would give to a highly skilled seducer would be very different from a guy who is still in the learning phase.

Yes, this is a delicate balance act, it can be frustrating but it's completely possible to fix

I know what you mean, I swallowed a bit too much of the ASF/mASF KoolAid, which solved one set of problems but created another.

Ok, let's take my specific case. I've never had problems with girls not taking me seriously. I've been with hundreds (500+ maybe? stopped counting a long time) of girls, because they had no problems having sex with me including girls that were "my type".

My problem was that girls didn't want to have more than just sex, like a longer relationship.

Same thing here . My problem is that I feel that I have to chase them for more than sex , which just sounds bad to me

So I think you can see where I'm going with this, while women loved having sex with me, they didn't find mingling with PUAs and picking up women at nightclubs too appealing.

Yeah , even though I do not have an intense nightlife , I tend to get this wired questions like "did you ever had a relationship" , "did you ever fall in love" bla bla . To be frank I do not know from where I give this fuckboy vibe ... I think that is because women see me like a high value guy and over their league

Most women I feel that they are somehow intimidated by me , even though I am laidback , trying to get to know her and stuff like that . I mean I traveled a lot , read a lot of books , etc and just tell stories of things that happened to me that are funny , or places that I saw and really loved.

Also I started reading about PU and stuff like that , like 6 years ago , after my last long relationship . Till 24 I was all the time in serious long term relationships , but when I reached 24 I realized that me following my dreams and having a long term relationship is somehow incompatible , as I had to work abroad in different countries and move every year and so , and women usually do not support you in this , quite the contrary , they want you to settle down

 

[Carousel]

I think that is because women see me like a high value guy and over their league

Analyzing PU in terms of "value" is like trying to communicating a work of Shakespeare with the language of a toddler.

Both an IT billionaire with the charisma of a living room lamp like Mark Zuckerberg and a random fuckboy with 500 notches are "high value".

They induce rather different reactions in people as a whole and women specifically.

 

[BigPapa]

Analyzing PU in terms of "value" is like trying to communicating a work of Shakespeare with the language of a toddler.

Both an IT billionaire with the charisma of a living room lamp like Mark Zuckerberg and a random fuckboy with 500 notches are "high value".

They induce rather different reactions in people as a whole and women specifically.

Well , what I mean by high value @Carousel is that I am quite a handsome guy , with good education , good career , good fundamentals ,etc that is doing interesting stuff and then tell the stories in a quite charismatic ways . Sometimes I tend to be a little bit arrogant , but most of the times I try to be humble . What I noticed though is that people that are kinda far away from me from a financial perspective tend to think that I am bragging and tend to feel negative emotions towards me , but mainly this is because they just hate themselves for not doing this , so instead of hating themselves or doing something about it they redirect this emotions towards someone else

 

[Carousel]

Well , what I mean by high value @Carousel is that I am quite a handsome guy , with good education , good career , good fundamentals ,etc that is doing interesting stuff and then tell the stories in a quite charismatic ways . Sometimes I tend to be a little bit arrogant , but most of the times I try to be humble .

Haha, every single of these traits will be present among both fuckboys and LTR guys. I for sure know both fuckboy types/PUAs and LTR guys who can tick off all the boxes.

Probably this is some sort of pure framing/communication issue.

 

[BigPapa]

@Carousel maybe this framing issue might happen because I push for the sex more than for the connection ?

 

[Razorjack]

I pick up all over the place , I do not have a favorite place anymore , I just go for the "kill" where I feel something interesting



Depends on the situation , but on average I would say is almost 50-50 . Usually when I feel a girl is shy or an introvert I go indirect so I do not scare her haha



On average I pull like 1 girl per week, sometimes a little bit more , sometimes nothing. I usually have like 30-40 % conversion rate from this , as usually I loose interest if things do not really move fast and just feel like putting the energy into the next prospect , except for girls that I really like and somehow feel a connection with, or are just gorgeous .



I would say that I am intermediate , I just do not see the point at the moment to hone my skills further , as I have decent traction I would say and just do not have that much time & energy to go out more often.



Nope , I have a really high esteem as I am naturally a quite handsome guy , have a really good career , good work life balance , just got into Harvard
to do a masters degree in Data Science ( it is the extension school so not quite the real Harvard , but hey I still will get a degree from Harvard haha )



Nope , I am ok with how I am , and feel somehow blessed . What I do though is that I hide my enthusiasm , as I do not want her to feel that I like her more than she likes me .



I went through so much shit in my life so far , that I feel that even if you let me in the desert I would somehow find a way to live a good life there and come back to society . What I am aware though is that wealth, social status , etc are helping me to achieve my goals , but only this


Same thing here . My problem is that I feel that I have to chase them for more than sex , which just sounds bad to me



Yeah , even though I do not have an intense nightlife , I tend to get this wired questions like "did you ever had a relationship" , "did you ever fall in love" bla bla . To be frank I do not know from where I give this fuckboy vibe ... I think that is because women see me like a high value guy and over their league

Most women I feel that they are somehow intimidated by me , even though I am laidback , trying to get to know her and stuff like that . I mean I traveled a lot , read a lot of books , etc and just tell stories of things that happened to me that are funny , or places that I saw and really loved

This is good, a few more clarifications:

1. What do you want with these women that you put extra energy and time into? ("except for girls that I really like and somehow feel a connection with, or are just gorgeous")
2. Why are you putting in extra time, energy and effort into these specific women? What are you hoping to achieve? (BTW, I'm not saying it is wrong, I just want to know the motivation behind it)
3. What do you do outside of work and pick up? E.g. hobbies and other activities?
4. In your interactions with women, what else do you talk about after you told your stories and mentioned the places that you saw and really loved?

 

[Carousel]

@Carousel maybe this framing issue might happen because I push for the sex more than for the connection ?

This is hard to tell without a couple of detailed LRs with followup communication.

However, take note of the fact that some of the biggest club game slayers on this forum routinely have to deal with drama from women who want exclusivity.

 

[BigPapa]

This is good, a few more clarifications:

1. What do you want with these women that you put extra energy and time into? ("except for girls that I really like and somehow feel a connection with, or are just gorgeous")

With the gorgeous ones they are a great bandana for my self esteem and see them as trophies , as I am quite a competitive guy by nature . With this ones I am happy just to have sex a couple of times till I get bored .With this ones I do not really have an issue besides that it takes longer to bed them for the first time.

With the ones that I feel that I somehow have a connection with , I like how they smile , that they are alive and maybe a little bit naive , are feminine , and see them as muses. Mind you , they might not be super good looking , but have that je nais se quois . I just like having them around , looking at them how they talk about something that I do not really care with passion . Dunno if you understand . With this ones I struggle .

2. What do you do outside of work and pick up? E.g. hobbies and other activities ?

I have quite a few hobbies : I like fashion , perfumes ,art ,watches , wines ( I even took a sommelier course in France haha ) , travel , read books about philosophy and history and economics , made a nice garden at my apartment block with some nice Japanese trees ( and they look amazing as they are a splash of unusual colors and now is somehow a popular place for people to take pictures ), etc

3. In your interactions with women, what else do you talk about after you told your stories and mentioned the places that you saw and really loved?

Depends on the context , but usually I talk also about philosophy,history, things that happened to me good or bad , but mainly I try to let her do most of the talking

 

[BigPapa]

This is hard to tell without a couple of detailed LRs with followup communication.

However, take note of the fact that some of the biggest club game slayers on this forum routinely have to deal with drama from women who want exclusivity.

Well I do not really get into drama , but I feel that there is like a cold war and the girls are just focused on picking the slightest detail to backwards rationalize that we are not compatible . Basically they are somehow in a dormant form of auto rejection

 

[Razorjack]

Have you read about modelling levels in NLP?

This is interesting, I've never seen this specific one before but I have seen other similar ones.

You remarked some place here that the NextASF crowd of guys are talking generally in much more technical terms than you, while you are often talking about radiating some abstract energy.

Not quite how I would phrase it.

What I was trying to say was that most game is taught from the outside => in, e.g. modelling your voice by recording yourself listening back and adjusting, fixing your posture via a mirror or video recording, looking more relaxed via practicing facial expressions in the mirror etc

While I look at game from inside => out, e.g. fix my mindset and attitude: every woman is attracted to me. Just the mental shift alone fixed my voice, my posture and makes me more relaxed.

The downside with modelling on the lower levels is that it may come off as a bit ungenuine. The upside is that it is easily actionable.

The downside with modelling the higher levels is that the advice may not be easily actionable. The upside is that once it clicks it will be more genuine.

Agreed

 

[Razorjack]

With the gorgeous ones they are a great bandana for my self esteem and see them as trophies , as I am quite a competitive guy by nature . With this ones I am happy just to have sex a couple of times till I get bored .With this ones I do not really have an issue besides that it takes longer to bed them for the first time.

With the ones that I feel that I somehow have a connection with , I like how they smile , that they are alive and maybe a little bit naive , are feminine , and see them as muses. Mind you , they might not be super good looking , but have that je nais se quois . I just like having them around , looking at them how they talk about something that I do not really care with passion . Dunno if you understand . With this ones I struggle .



I have quite a few hobbies : I like fashion , perfumes ,art ,watches , wines ( I even took a sommelier course in France haha ) , travel , read books about philosophy and history and economics , made a nice garden at my apartment block with some nice Japanese trees ( and they look amazing as they are a splash of unusual colors and now is somehow a popular place for people to take pictures ), etc


Depends on the context , but usually I talk also about philosophy,history, things that happened to me good or bad , but mainly I try to let her do most of the talking

Ok now it feels like we're getting somewhere.

When you're letting them do the talking, what do they talk about?

How are you leading the conversation?

And where are you leading it to?

What information are you trying to find out from them?

 

[Rakkum]

While I look at game from inside => out, e.g. fix my mindset and attitude: every woman is attracted to me. Just the mental shift alone fixed my voice, my posture and makes me more relaxed.

What specific steps did you take to permanently change your mindset?