Curious about Bacchus' daygame insights

[Atlas IV]

I've been going through some old threads and have often seen this forum member Bacchus mentioned. From what I gather he was a skilled daygamer who used Gunwitch Method, but fell out of grace for whatever reason.

It seems like he had some unique techniques and perspectives when it comes to daygame. But all his posts have disappeared (presumably he was banned for something egregious). This thread is one such example, and I can only infer what he said from what other people quoted.

Now I'm not making this thread to idolize a person who obviously must have been a piece of work to get banned and all his writings nuked, but I wonder what his main daygame insights were and why I see people referring to him again and again. I'm guessing he had a good system that he got overly dogmatic about and pissed a lot of people off?

I don't need to know the full story of the drama, but if someone could give me a brief rundown of his key insights, I would appreciate it and that would really satiate my curiosity (and possibly others who joined the forum after the saga).

 

[KJ Francis]

I wasn't around for most of his tenure but I think I remember his bread and butter was stationary sets at bus stops (like leaving the mall, then ride with her to a SDL).

I think a lot of it was focused on descriptive conversations about emotions. This probably doesn't help, but if you don't get enough answers, it might be worth looking into Ross Jeffries and old school NLP stuff.

I could be wrong, but think that had a similar focus of spiking emotions, building trance states, etc. and leading swiftly ("speed seduction") before the bubble popped.

 

[Atlas IV]

I could be wrong, but think that had a similar focus of spiking emotions, building trance states, etc. and leading swiftly ("speed seduction") before the bubble popped.

Interesting. Well, reading through @Lofty's journal, I can see plenty of great examples of this stuff anyway. He really knew how to draw girls in quickly with emotionally descriptive language and cold reads. I've never seen such detailed application of Gunwitch method and sexual framing in street approaching (day and night).

@Spike & @Skills I can see that you guys commented a lot on Lofty's journal back then. What's your take on it in reflection? Would you still use that style of emotional spiking verbal material nowadays?

 

[Spike]

Would you still use that style of emotional spiking verbal material nowadays

I never used it so I can’t comment on that. But you can dm @Skippy who I believe went out and gamed with bacchus. So he would be better able to help you on what his experience was like

 

[Skills]

Interesting. Well, reading through @Lofty's journal, I can see plenty of great examples of this stuff anyway. He really knew how to draw girls in quickly with emotionally descriptive language and cold reads. I've never seen such detailed application of Gunwitch method and sexual framing in street approaching (day and night).

@Spike & @Skills I can see that you guys commented a lot on Lofty's journal back then. What's your take on it in reflection? Would you still use that style of emotional spiking verbal material nowadays?

Well it was a different era, milleneal s... Guys like lofty had success with it, other guys like @Skippy abandoned it... I will ping @Devilicious he would be the best one since he tried multiple styles and met in person... I doubt he will be 100 percent honest but i think he is the one to ask... Atlas you are not supposed to mention hos name is against the rules.... But i think enough time has passed and nobody cares... Lol we were not supposed to mention Velasco or bachaus namey and you are asking Spike to comment just lol... The last person you want to ask about bach is Spike just lol... Bach was trained by teevester and gun... For me personally I like James d day game... Spike doesn't do day game...

 

[Skills]

I never used it so I can’t comment on that. But you can dm @Skippy who I believe went out and gamed with bacchus. So he would be better able to help you on what his experience was like

Just lol we wrote at same time

 

[KJ Francis]

Interesting. Well, reading through @Lofty's journal, I can see plenty of great examples of this stuff anyway. He really knew how to draw girls in quickly with emotionally descriptive language and cold reads. I've never seen such detailed application of Gunwitch method and sexual framing in street approaching (day and night).

@Spike & @Skills I can see that you guys commented a lot on Lofty's journal back then. What's your take on it in reflection? Would you still use that style of emotional spiking verbal material nowadays?

Damn that is one meaty journal. I'll have to check it out.

Here's more on the general verbal style

Using descriptive, emotional language to arouse

I have not seen much on this topic, but it seems to be an old school concept, perhaps tangentially related to NLP. It seems @Teevster can get descriptive about sensations in his gambits, so perhaps it is partly inspired by the school of thought. I am not quite ready for Riker. Basically the...

www.skilledseducer.com

I often forget to try it, even during deep diving, but especially during the approach. Interesting seeing Lofty would get right to it from the opener.

I did recently try it while texting a girl about the feelings of a hot shower, with light innuendo (hot water deeply penetrating pores)... Not just brief, but enough to draw her into it. She was previously pretty bland, but then she texted "shower was a good idea" with a few nude pics from inside. I remember the flip surprising me.

Not sure how scientifically accurate this is, but Franco would write that girls use both sides of the brain in communication and we use one... So it is difficult to grasp how easily affected their emotions can be.

 

[TomInHo]

Bacchus had a tendency to try to sound smarter than he needed to

But if you strip it down, his daygame ideas were pretty straightforward.

Bacchus’s Main Day Game Ideas (as far as I remember):

1. Have solid fundamentals before opening
2. Use Pre-Openers to make girls aware of your presence before delivering an opener
3. Use a lot of curiosity gambits and cold reads in the beginning of the interaction to get her to hook
4. Fractionate between social and sexual verbals to set sexual frames and reduce resistance past hook point
5. Project sexuality with non-verbals to prime her for intimacy
6. Watch for signs of arousal and pull using plausible deniability when she seems ready

It was basically Gunwitch Method 1.0 with more polished sexual framing

What made him stand out was his use of “flowery talk” . . . poetic, emotionally charged language meant to sound deep or seductive

Some girls respond well to it, but all girls don't. In fact if you look at Lofty's journal you will often see girls clown on him for sounding like a weirdo

I also experimented with flower talk and found it mostly unnecessary

Once I understood how to set sexual frames correctly, I just did that talking how I normally talk, sometimes even using 6th grade level vocabulary

And that worked well without making me sound like I was reciting Shakespeare

In the end, a lot of Bacchus's stuff was just a fancier way of doing what most solid game already aims for: Open, hook, escalate vibe, pull when it feels on

EDIT

Oh and regarding Lofty's journal, something worth pointing out:

If you pay close attention, a lot of his results started happening when he improved his presentation and began opening more girls who were already down to hook up.

Sure, he used flowery openers and emotionally charged language, but if you look closely at the dynamics, many of those girls were receptive from the start

I've been in similar situations myself where none of that was necessary. Just a simple "Hey," a bit of fun banter, then leading things forward was enough to secure the lay

Sometimes it wasn’t the lines. It was that he found a girl that was receptive, handled the logistics, and escalated when in isolation

Reading through his reports, I often felt he was overcomplicating things and didn’t always see what was actually moving the needle.

Just my 2c.

 

[Atlas IV]

@TomInHo

Thanks for your take, that puts a lot of it in perspective actually.

Once I understood how to set sexual frames correctly, I just did that talking how I normally talk, sometimes even using 6th grade level vocabulary

And that worked well without making me sound like I was reciting Shakespeare

That's a very good point. Being able to set sexual frames without using fancy language is undoubtedly a more powerful skill, just as being able to write effectively using simple language makes you more relatable to a wide variety of people.

There's also the sprezzatura aspect of it. Most girls haven't thought about the sexual framing topics on a deep intellectual level, so if you can get them thinking differently with minimal effort and simple words, it makes you both sophisticated and relatable as opposed to just sophisticated.

Oh and regarding Lofty's journal, something worth pointing out:

If you pay close attention, a lot of his results started happening when he improved his presentation and began opening more girls who were already down to hook up.

Sure, he used flowery openers and emotionally charged language, but if you look closely at the dynamics, many of those girls were receptive from the start

I can tell just from reading the first few pages of his journal that Lofty was an extremely intelligent guy (even just the fact that he remembered all his interactions word for word is insane), and he was taking a very systematic approach to improving his game.

But I can also see that he was very very focused on the material itself, and interpreted any mistake as a matter of not saying the right words. Actually many of the mistakes may have arisen from overdelivering that emotional deep dive + rainbow ruse stuff, which certainly stimulates girls emotionally but is probably overkill for getting to sex. He would have benefited greatly from this article.

He was getting really good results by the end though, so he must have come to these realizations himself. I wonder where he ended up.

 

[Devilicious]

Well it was a different era, milleneal s... Guys like lofty had success with it, other guys like @Skippy abandoned it... I will ping @Devilicious he would be the best one since he tried multiple styles and met in person... I doubt he will be 100 percent honest but i think he is the one to ask... Atlas you are not supposed to mention hos name is against the rules.... But i think enough time has passed and nobody cares... Lol we were not supposed to mention Velasco or bachaus namey and you are asking Spike to comment just lol... The last person you want to ask about bach is Spike just lol... Bach was trained by teevester and gun... For me personally I like James d day game... Spike doesn't do day game...

His game, if you're curious Atlas, is David Riker's Language and Conversation Course (look it up online, can get it for free), go heavy on the SOTs (seduction oriented topics) and pair it with an archetype model of women to adapt your verbals to.

Caveat is you need a bunch of intent and sexual presence, which in of itself should already be getting you laid, for you to really get results from it, imo and ime

 

[ziggydust]

Some girls respond well to it, but all girls don't. In fact if you look at Lofty's journal you will often see girls clown on him for sounding like a weirdo

I really think your location and must play a role in this. I tried using stuff from Riker and Jefferies before and the girls thought I was super weird for speaking like that! I think you need to know your audience!

 

[PaulieFlyn10]

I really think your location and must play a role in this. I tried using stuff from Riker and Jefferies before and the girls thought I was super weird for speaking like that! I think you need to know your audience!

I've never been called or looked at as weirs for speaking like that.

What I think is happening here is you're probably not used to speaking like that so of course it might come across as stiff or weird

 

[ziggydust]

I've never been called or looked at as weirs for speaking like that.

What I think is happening here is you're probably not used to speaking like that so of course it might come across as stiff or weird

I always felt it's because where i live i'm going for hot, very young girls who are from slightly 'rougher' areas and they go for 'bad boys' who speak the complete opposite and probably can't even read very well and speak nothing like that lol. (similar to their female friends too) - They probably thought I sounded like a poet from the olden days lol. But whatever works for each person I guess. Throughout the years i've tended to rely less and less on 'outer game' anyway, as i've always found that what you say isn't that important if she's attracted to you, and if she has no attraction for you, then all the outergame stuff doesn't work either. (but then that's kind of the red-green stuff which isn't even worth discussing)

 

[PaulieFlyn10]

I always felt it's because where i live i'm going for hot, very young girls who are from slightly 'rougher' areas and they go for 'bad boys' who speak the complete opposite and probably can't even read very well and speak nothing like that lol. (similar to their female friends too) - They probably thought I sounded like a poet from the olden days lol. But whatever works for each person I guess. Throughout the years i've tended to rely less and less on 'outer game' anyway, as i've always found that what you say isn't that important if she's attracted to you, and if she has no attraction for you, then all the outergame stuff doesn't work either. (but then that's kind of the red-green stuff which isn't even worth discussing)

Yeah... if she barely understands english definitely not gonna work lol.

But like you said... you can mix and match with the bad boy thing you talked about... And/or tone down the Riker style of speaking

 

[James Cruse]

Interesting. Well, reading through @Lofty's journal, I can see plenty of great examples of this stuff anyway. He really knew how to draw girls in quickly with emotionally descriptive language and cold reads. I've never seen such detailed application of Gunwitch method and sexual framing in street approaching (day and night).

I used alot of NLP and emotionally based language in the below Lay Report and I use it to great success in daygame regularly.

Lay Report - Primarily with NLP & Emotional language

 

[MuST0BtA1NSkR1Lla]

I've been going through some old threads and have often seen this forum member Bacchus mentioned. From what I gather he was a skilled daygamer who used Gunwitch Method, but fell out of grace for whatever reason.

It seems like he had some unique techniques and perspectives when it comes to daygame. But all his posts have disappeared (presumably he was banned for something egregious). This thread is one such example, and I can only infer what he said from what other people quoted.

Now I'm not making this thread to idolize a person who obviously must have been a piece of work to get banned and all his writings nuked, but I wonder what his main daygame insights were and why I see people referring to him again and again. I'm guessing he had a good system that he got overly dogmatic about and pissed a lot of people off?

I don't need to know the full story of the drama, but if someone could give me a brief rundown of his key insights, I would appreciate it and that would really satiate my curiosity (and possibly others who joined the forum after the saga).

Haven’t chatted with him in a long while but I remember trying to get him unbanned at some point.

PUA’s I’ve found have been really ego driven people so drama and all that has been a forte.

His style is a cross between Teevster and Gunwitch method. So sexualization, nlp and “I feel something different about you, you have a different energy

But quite honestly I don’t feel qualified to talk on his behalf we should get him back on here I’d be interested to see if he has new insights on the game in 2025.

 

[S.S Can]

what'd he get banned for?

 

[MuST0BtA1NSkR1Lla]

what'd he get banned for?

pretty much was spazzing out and stopped talking about seduction. And then wouldn’t let it go and kept doggin on which created an annoyance with the mods. Sort of like Mystery and RSD when they had the split.