ElderPrice: From 30 y/o virgin to ?

ElderPrice

Tool-Bearing Hominid
Tool-Bearing Hominid
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Jun 11, 2018
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Hello there. I figured I'd start a journal for a few reasons.
1. I'm checking the boards daily anyway
2. My back story and new posts will help put me and my journey in context for the awesome people willing to help me on my, well, "help me" posts. haha
3. I definitely need a journal to document the good times. I'm pretty damn moody when it comes to this journey. There are good days where I feel like things are going in the right direction, but then there are far more negative days where I feel pretty depressed, hopeless, and like I'm spinning my wheels and getting nothing from it. So by documenting everything, on the bad days it'll be much easier for me to look back, find the good times, and remind myself that indeed progress is being made.

So since this is the first post, I'll make it about my back story.

I am a 30 y/o virgin whose never had a girlfriend before. I absolutely hate this about myself. There isn't much of a particular reason for how I got here. I just never had a strong desire to have this be a part of my life before. In high school I was cocky. I had the balls to approach the cutest girls at the school. They'd reject and that would basically be it lol. I didn't care. But I had no idea what I was doing. No mentors, no reading about the right way to game online, no good social circle, nothing. I just saw what I saw in pop culture and went for it.

When college came around, I bombed with girls for a different issue - I had bad self esteem issues. I've always had terrible skin. My parents should have forced me to do accutane at 13, but they didn't. So to this day I still get severe acne on my torso, especially during the summer. I'm planning to go on accutane as soon as I get a longer term healthcare solution figured out so I know what it'll cost me for the I believe 5 month course of treatment. I think those pills can be expensive. But the real skin problem is the scars. The acne won't take all that long to pop and heal, but they all leave red or purple scars that remain for at least 6-12 months. So my chest and shoulders are covered with scars. It's still an insecurity to this day, but nowhere near as much as it was in college. I should also note I went to the derm like 10-12 times in college to try and treat the scars but nothing they tried would work. They're just very stubborn and you basically have no choice but to wait and let them fade on their own.

The other major (and bigger) self esteem issue I had in college was about my height. It's fascinating in retrospect how in high school I didn't give two shits about my being short (possibly because for most of those years I was expecting a growth spurt...) but in college it just destroyed me. Lots of confirmation bias. All the attractive girls I saw flirting with guys were exclusively flirting with tall guys. Never noticed a short guy with a bunch of hotties. So for all my college years and a few years after college I was pretty convinced that I was just fucked being a short guy, so I didn't bother finding girls or a girl at all.

It wasn't until 26 or 27 that I stopped and realized "hey asshole. people your age are starting to get married. you need to start making an effort to meet girls." So I began the very first stages of my journey. I started by learning how clothes should fit. Pants, shirts, suits, you name it. I don't want to get into a whole thing about my dad, but in many many ways he was useless as a father. I can't think of a less alive man or a man with less a purpose in life that I've ever met. Anyway, in this example if you asked him about how to dress, he would recommend Target or Walmart clothes because 'you can get a good xxxx for a cheap price' and he would have zero clue about how it should fit or if he did he just didn't give a shit. Baggy shirt? 'oh well. it looks fine.' Long pants that need to be hemmed? 'it's okay. they'll just scrunch at the ankles like mine.' Fucking ridiculous. Anyway, since he was no help here ever I taught myself how things should fit and started building my new wardrobe.

Also around this time I went back into the gym. I lifted weights in high school and stopped in college because my studies were just too demanding time-wise, but after college I went back to the gym. Just thought I'd toss that out there. I won't go into detail here because this was something that has nothing to do with girls. I never stepped foot in a gym hoping to build a body to impress girls. I've always just wanted to be muscular and strong for myself. So I don't count this as a life change I made in order to get girls.

Once I got my wardrobe in order, I went straight into online dating. The #1 mistake of my journey. I ended up being on apps for about a full year, doing nothing else to meet girls. It didn't do much more than destroy my mood and self esteem. I just couldn't get matches/swipes/responses for the life of me, regardless of what I wrote in the bio. I knew it was obviously my photos. They just sucked. So on THREE occasions I asked female friend photographers to take photos of me so I had some quality photos for online dating. Didn't make a difference. Even the best photos couldn't score more than 7/10 attractiveness on sites like photofeeler. So rather than waste more time seeking photos that would probably never work, I decided it was time to grow a pair of balls and go out to meet girls in person.

I've now been going out for about a year. Maybe a month or two less. All in all, I've gone on about 40 dates in total. Maybe half from online dating, half from going out. Mostly dance nights. I've gotten pretty good at cold approaching, socializing, and meeting people and girls in general. Obviously good enough to get 40 dates! And however many numbers that translates to and however many approaches that translate to! But, zero results. Can't get past Date #2 to save me, and second dates are very rare. Can't get laid to save me. I've posted a couple threads on the boards here that have been very helpful and I look forward to applying the advice I received in those threads as soon as I can line up some more dates.

That's all I can think of for now. I'll post more throughout the journal entries. Thank you for reading!
 

ElderPrice

Tool-Bearing Hominid
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1/4/19 - Not a good day, but possible key learning day.

Went out dancing with new friends. Not a good night. It was one of those nights out where there's just not many girls at the establishment that catch your eye and excite you. Meanwhile the prettiest ones there seem to be with SOs or close friends. And they're not smiling so their walls are clearly wayyy up. I'm referring to people outside of my friend group lol.

Dancing with the friends was fun. Hopefully I can get to know them better over time.

My energy when going out was not good. My mood was a little down all day. I'm coming off a positive crest because I had 3 new numbers to hit up for this weekend. Two haven't answered and one has been responding, but the responses are definitely coming across as 'i don't want to see you. sorry.' So at this very moment it feels like I went 0 for 3. Basically any negative thoughts destroy my mood. I probably shouldn't go out when my mood is like this, but I'll feel worse sitting at home and wasting an opportunity to meet new girls, so regardless of mood I always force myself out.

On the plus side, I may have identified a major weakness in my internal game. I was reading a book recommended in a thread - "No More Mr. Nice Guy" and in one part he talks about masculine energy. He asks if I feel like a different kind of man from the kind that have a strong presence/get laid/however you want to describe it. And the answer is a clear yes. I've never really felt masculine on the inside. I've never understood that raw internal masculinity. Like when I had friends playing football in high school. They'd describe how when on the field they just flip a switch and turn on this super aggressive, intense part of themselves. I didn't have that. I can't envision myself getting so angry or emotional about something. I've always preferred being in control of my emotions. I've always felt like I must be from a different planet because of this. Those guys act a certain way. I don't. Anyway, bullshit reasoning and philosophizing aside, a new task of mine is to figure out how to develop that masculine energy, and ideally in a way faster than just hanging out and befriending masculine guys and waiting for their personalities to rub off onto me. Not saying that isn't good. It definitely is. But I'm low on patience. If there's a way to do this as quickly as possible, I'm interested.
 

Sub-Zero

Space Monkey
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That was a pretty good read.

It's good that you went on many dates, and it does sound like you might be being too nice to women and they just aren't sexual attracted to you. Good thing is that you can get them out and that's part of the battle. Chase has some articles on being an asshole and pretty much anything on how to not be seen as a nice guy and to become a sexy guy.

I know you didn't talk much about your father, but do you know why he is the way he is? Is he divorced? Is he in a un happy marriage? I ask because it would be good to find out on why he is this way, that way you don't end up like him when you're older.

As for masculinity, you can only get it doing masculine things, you wouldn't get it the same way even if you hung around your friends all day. Maybe if you guys played sports a lot together.

But yeah working out and playing sports increases testosterone, it makes you competitive.

Chase has articles about this also, one that comes to mind is the aggressive one.

I feel if you just read the articles for your exact problems, you'll be able to get sex. It's all a process, trust the process.
 

ElderPrice

Tool-Bearing Hominid
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Hey man, thanks for the comment! Yeah I think you're right that there's some sexiness issue going on. I'll write about it after this comment.

Regarding my father, he's been divorced for a couple decades now. I don't think he's even hit on a woman since. As for why he is the way he is, I think it's just his wussy characteristics and incorrect views on life. For instance, he doesn't have an understanding for hard work. He actually thinks successful people were just born lucky. He can't conceive of people starting with disadvantages and overcoming them by sheer determination. I don't know. He's just happy living in his boring world and never pursues any legit improvements or challenges.

As for masculine activities, I already powerlift if that counts! Not competitively, but I'm very determined to get stronger. My squat is closing in on 300, deadlift 350ish, and my overhead press is getting close to my bodyweight.

I have read numerous articles and watched numerous videos on masculinity/aggressiveness/manliness, but it's just not helping. It's not an issue of understanding. After seeing all this material, I definitely get it. To me it's just like an internal feeling that just doesn't click on, even after reading about it. That being said, I do want to try krav maga classes eventually to help with this. I can't commit quite yet for financial reasons, but I'm sure I'll start at some point in 2019.
 

ElderPrice

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1/5/18 - Good outing, felt down during the day, another possible epiphany

Like yesterday I just felt down all day. Not super depressed though. Of the three numbers I mentioned in yesterday's post, one of them responded and flaked out of a coffee date. Oh well.

For the night out, it was dancing again. I was able to improve my mood before leaving in two ways: 1. I watched some videos on new dance moves. This helps because by looking up new moves to learn and implement, it gets my brain thinking about dancing just for the fun of it, and NOT as a tool to get girls. In other words, it keeps me focused on having fun, not on the female agenda. 2. I watched RSD Tyler videos. Just watching that man shoot the shit and laugh is an instant mood improver every. single. time.

Also to help my mood, the dancing venue(s) had much better people there than last night. There were a good number of cute girls that actually excite me to approach, and everyone else was very friendly. I felt good dancing. Some nights it feels like there's cement in your gut and you just can't get loose to save you. Not this night! This night I felt great and the friends I dance with noticed too.

As a result of all this, I was able to get 3 new numbers. On this night as a very minor side experiment, I wanted to try asking for numbers much quicker. Before, I'd chat girls up to first see if she was even worth the time, then in an effort to be non-needy I'd break away to dance more and re-engage with them later in the evening. However, it got frustrating because even when a girl would clearly confirm she'll be sticking around and dancing all night, all too often she'd either leave with her friends 5 minutes later, or leave the venue without ever making contact with me again. Now, I take this to mean she wasn't all that interested anyway, but to avoid this I tried asking for numbers much faster - maybe 3-5 minutes after approaching, and, well, it didn't seem to hurt at all.

I basically haven't texted with these girls yet, but I'm just not optimistic about them. They just didn't seem excited to give me their numbers. They're basically never super excited to do it. Similarly, I'm getting pretty tired of girls NEVER chasing me. Even unattractive ones don't chase me. Girls just never work to get my attention. I don't know what the issue is - too low value? too high value? too unattainable? too attainable?

Thinking about this gave me a possible epiphany... am I just not sexy? It would explain the lack of excitement. But then again, I don't know. Am I overthinking and being overly critical? Is it really possible to go on so many dates and acquire so many numbers if I didn't have some sex appeal? Bah. Too much to think about. I'm probably overthinking.
 

Seppuku

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Hey ElderPrice,

Happy new year to you. In 2019 you are going to lose this V card.

Very good initiative to keep this journal. I'll be following it.
Thinking about this gave me a possible epiphany... am I just not sexy? It would explain the lack of excitement. But then again, I don't know. Am I overthinking and being overly critical? Is it really possible to go on so many dates and acquire so many numbers if I didn't have some sex appeal? Bah. Too much to think about. I'm probably overthinking.
Yes you are overthinking. You had 40 unique dates in one year, which is a lot, and it means you ARE doing something right. Just keep doing what you have been doing. About girls chasing, that will come later. At the beginning you HAVE to be the one opening and pursuing. So don't worry about it for now.

Now you also wrote this, and it is probably the key to your problems:
I am a 30 y/o virgin whose never had a girlfriend before.
This is huge lack of congruence. From my own experience, women have a very good sixth sense to smell what is your overall experience with opposite sex. So here is my guess. You initially make a good impression online or on cold approach, she gives you her number and agrees to a date. Then on the date she intuitively figures out, thanks to this sixth sense, that you are lacking sexual experience. That is not congruent with the impression she initially got. And that is massively not congruent with you being 30 years old. Then you never get past the second date.

Your virginity is probably like a big thing in your mind, and your dates must sense it. It is not attractive. Girls like experienced guys. And if you are 30, they expect you to be experienced.

OK I am going to take this as my best guess of your problem. Now, to the solutions.

First solution. I am normally against going to a professional girl, but this is a case where it could actually be helpful. You book yourself a good looking professional and get the v card problem handled. Then book two more. You will have a little experience in your hood, and a little self confidence in your abilities as a man. I think it will help you tremendously. After you done that, proceed to the second solution below - but it will just be easier.

Second solution. No prostitute (I understand that we guys have our egos and we like to earn things via our own merits). OK. But then you are going to work hard outside your comfort zone. We are back to what I advocated in the other thread. On the date, don't worry much about "gaming", and instead you focus on leading smoothly towards a sexual objective on the first date.

Yes, on the first date. This is where you will have to push yourself out of your comfort zone. On the first date, is when your chance of success is the highest. Yes, many girls are open to that, no matter them saying otherwise. And, as you now know, you may never get the second date. This is your chance, so go for it.

Your logistics. You need to be clear where it is going to happen. It is for you to figure out. But you must have your logistics handled. I would suggest you go for your car if you don't have a place to pull. It may be easier (for now) than trying to push to her place.

Your sexual objective. Set yourself a goal which is out of your comfort zone. Take out her boobs and suck them. Or have her take your dick in her hand. Or get a blowjob. Or finger her. Decide what is your goal before hand, then find a way to get there. The how is for you to figure out. Then if you achieve the objective, proceed to next step up. Note: kissing is not a valid sexual objective.

Getting compliance. That will help you to achieve your sexual objective. I noticed for your FR (the other thread) that you managed to get her to comply. Work on that, and get even better at that.

Making her comfortable. Remember she came on a date with you, means she already likes you. To get sexual with you she needs to be emotionally and physically comfortable with you. Connect with her, make an emotional bond, for instance by making her talk. Establish physical contact with her very early.

Ignore the mixed signs. Stars will never align perfectly. And you will face some resistance - just be ready to handle objections.

So now your question about masculine energy. No need to become a caveman. If you just keep pursuing a sexual objective on date one, you will automatically have the masculine aggressiveness that will get you there. Getting to sex fast IS masculine energy. It will be well received, believe me. It is in fact, sort of expected from you. So just do it. You don't have to do much more than that.

If you do the above, there will be some fails initially - but just remember that you probably wouldn't see her again anyway. But as you keep doing it, you will somehow learn how to do it better and eventually succeed. My bet: one third of all these dates (at least) would be ready to go all the way with you. Think about it. That would be 13 girls in a year. More than I did last year (I had 11).

OK good luck EP, and keep posting here on your results!

Seppuku
 

ElderPrice

Tool-Bearing Hominid
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Thank you my man! Good advice like the last thread. I'll keep at it!

I see where you're coming from by suggesting a professional, but I think I'm going to keep working at it without going down that route. I've thought about the idea of it before, and I've always been pretty confident that it would actually make me feel WORSE.

You see, it's not so much that that being a virgin weighs on my mind. If that's all it was, then I would gladly have gotten that taken care of a while ago and gotten that off my back. What weighs on my mind is simply that as a 30 y/o virgin whose never had a girlfriend, I consider myself a huge loser. Like, as a matter of fact. And it's not like a 'don't care what others think of you' thing. It's entirely what I think. I think if you are an able bodied man, and you don't have a legit religious excuse, if you make it to 30 without any relations with girls, you are a huge loser. It's not the virginity per se. It's the total failure of the situation and the total patheticness of it. So if there's anything in the back of my mind holding me back from top level confidence, it would be this general belief or certainty that I am indeed a loser until I continue working at it, continue making progress, and ultimately counter this horrible life highlight by sleeping with tons of gorgeous girls, finding an excellent one to marry, and turning that huge failure into a huge payoff. In other words, making all of the bad times worth it in the end.

Now, to be perfectly clear, when I'm on dates, I'm not thinking about this belief. 100% of my brain power is focused on the present. Not the past. Entirely on the present. I'm focusing on the conversation, I'm focusing on her responses, I'm trying to read her to see the signals on whether to move forward or not. I'm trying to remember all the things Seppuku told me to do in that one thread :) I'm thinking about logistics, backup plans, you name it. I'm NOT AT ALL thinking the negative thoughts. I'm happy to have the opportunity to try again to figure all this out and to make progress. If I get stuck or blow it, it's because I just haven't learned certain skills at certain points. It's not like I depress myself in the middle of the date and ruin my mood.

So my plan is to just continue meeting girls, going on dates, and assume it'll start producing results. Trusting the process. That is, unless you or any of the coaches here actually believe this incongruence is too impossible to overcome in a timely manner...

Also, I think I mentioned it in another thread, but I really, really want to get my own place and try inviting over girls directly. Either texting them to come over instead of setting up a coffee date, or inviting them over the same night I meet them. And of course it makes it easy to meet for coffee then try moving her home in 30-60 minutes. I just want to test 'moving faster.' For all you and I know, these girls could be attracted and ready to go right off the bat, then get bored or disappointed when I come across as going the traditional dating route. Who knows. But very eager to test it!

Thanks again man, you're the best!
 

ElderPrice

Tool-Bearing Hominid
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1/8/19

Not much of an update today. Went dancing tonight. This night is more of a social circle night so there's very few new girls to open. Basically none. This is a night where it's like 95% about improving dance skills and 5% hoping a new girl or two will be there.

As for all the numbers I'm working on, basically no responses yet. I'll try some of them again tomorrow.

Mood was pretty darn good all day today. Then on the drive back home it fell. It doesn't cease to amaze me how an entirely random thought that just pops into my head can so much affect my mood. In this case, "Jessie's Girl" came on the radio. It has a line "Where can I find a woman like that?" that instantly made my brain start thinking about relationships and that instantly crushed my mood.

Thinking about game, and strategies to improve with women, and the opportunity to meet new girls is cool and fun. But when I think about relationships or other people in relationships it really packs a punch. It depresses me how that hasn't been me for a day in my life. Or how I have yet to meet a cutie that really really wants to have sex with me and wants to make me her boyfriend over all the other options in the world. It's such an alien concept to me. It's so unbelievable.

I read an article here not more than a week or two ago, I think it was by Chase, who talked about how when you see other people in relationships, or if you see a guy with a smoking girl at his side, you should feel positive, happy, or invigorated. You should be thinking 'hell yeah. good for him. good for her. that'll be me soon!' I get it. But my brain just isn't there yet. Seeing anything like that just reminds me of my failure of a life up until this point and is pretty crushing. Oh well. At least it's easy to recover from and at least I'm making progress.
 

ElderPrice

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1/9/19

Not much of an update today. Met one girl at a work function today. Talked to a friend about her and he said she might be engaged. He offered to find out that intel for me which I appreciate.

The numbers I've been working on continue to go nowhere. Some have responded once or twice, but clearly aren't particularly excited to talk to me and meet up with me anytime soon. Oh well. We'll see if given another week or so if any of them turn into anything. I guess I'm just saying I'm pessimistic.

Felt fine all day until thinking about my journey like 15 minutes ago. Just depressing to think about. Again, oh well. On to the next day.
 

Sub-Zero

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EP what's your main goal with women? Well not main main because I'm sure you want a top notch chick to settle down with, but what is your goal with women? Is it to sleep with a lot then settle down? Get ok enough with them? Try to be a master of women and be single for a while?

I always want men to get really good with women and sleep with a lot no matter what. You deserve it, you put in so much work. I heard some guys just sleep with a couple of chicks and just settle down. I really don't like the idea of that because I feel a guy who learns this stuff and goes through all of this and puts all of this work in deserves to keep pimpin for a while.

Just my opinion though and I was curious.
 

ElderPrice

Tool-Bearing Hominid
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Sub-Zero said:
EP what's your main goal with women? Well not main main because I'm sure you want a top notch chick to settle down with, but what is your goal with women? Is it to sleep with a lot then settle down? Get ok enough with them? Try to be a master of women and be single for a while?

I always want men to get really good with women and sleep with a lot no matter what. You deserve it, you put in so much work. I heard some guys just sleep with a couple of chicks and just settle down. I really don't like the idea of that because I feel a guy who learns this stuff and goes through all of this and puts all of this work in deserves to keep pimpin for a while.

Just my opinion though and I was curious.
Of course! Happy to hear your thoughts and to have your help. I have two goals:
1. Yes, to eventually find an AMAZING, top notch chick to settle down/get into LTR with.
2. Sleep with many truly attractive girls. I agree with you completely that after putting in so much time and effort and work to learn how to get good with women, a man should reward himself by, well, drowning in top notch pussy. An additional motivation for me is my loser life until this point. I feel like if I can get a high notch count (high defined as significantly higher than all the standard guys I'll encounter in life, whatever that number may be), I can make up for wasting my youth. Or in other words, by building toward a significant notch count, I can make the terrible years worth it in the end. IE "yeah it sucks he started so late, but it led to him becoming a fucking legend." Something like that haha
 

Sub-Zero

Space Monkey
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Good stuff my man.




ElderPrice said:
Sub-Zero said:
EP what's your main goal with women? Well not main main because I'm sure you want a top notch chick to settle down with, but what is your goal with women? Is it to sleep with a lot then settle down? Get ok enough with them? Try to be a master of women and be single for a while?

I always want men to get really good with women and sleep with a lot no matter what. You deserve it, you put in so much work. I heard some guys just sleep with a couple of chicks and just settle down. I really don't like the idea of that because I feel a guy who learns this stuff and goes through all of this and puts all of this work in deserves to keep pimpin for a while.

Just my opinion though and I was curious.
Of course! Happy to hear your thoughts and to have your help. I have two goals:
1. Yes, to eventually find an AMAZING, top notch chick to settle down/get into LTR with.
2. Sleep with many truly attractive girls. I agree with you completely that after putting in so much time and effort and work to learn how to get good with women, a man should reward himself by, well, drowning in top notch pussy. An additional motivation for me is my loser life until this point. I feel like if I can get a high notch count (high defined as significantly higher than all the standard guys I'll encounter in life, whatever that number may be), I can make up for wasting my youth. Or in other words, by building toward a significant notch count, I can make the terrible years worth it in the end. IE "yeah it sucks he started so late, but it led to him becoming a fucking legend." Something like that haha
 

ElderPrice

Tool-Bearing Hominid
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1/10/19

No updates today. No responses from any of the numbers I'm currently working on. That's like 0 for 6ish. Fuck!

Chase posted a new article today suggesting that if you're hitting a particular wall, you might just be coming across as intimidating to women. I have no idea how a short guy like me could be like that but I guess it's possible. And it would explain my consistent failure despite trying new tweaks to my game. Unfortunately it sounds really fucking hard to make yourself less intimidating. Wonderful. Oh well. At least it's something else to try working on.
 

Sub-Zero

Space Monkey
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Did you check Chase's bullet points on how girls act when they're intimidated? It shows how they act to make sure if they feel comfortable with you or not. Think he said that you can get a better read if there's multiple bullet points together.

How are you meeting women? How did you meet the 6 women that gave you no responses?

That's good work man, keep getting these girls.



ElderPrice said:
1/10/19

No updates today. No responses from any of the numbers I'm currently working on. That's like 0 for 6ish. Fuck!

Chase posted a new article today suggesting that if you're hitting a particular wall, you might just be coming across as intimidating to women. I have no idea how a short guy like me could be like that but I guess it's possible. And it would explain my consistent failure despite trying new tweaks to my game. Unfortunately it sounds really fucking hard to make yourself less intimidating. Wonderful. Oh well. At least it's something else to try working on.
 

ElderPrice

Tool-Bearing Hominid
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Sub-Zero said:
Did you check Chase's bullet points on how girls act when they're intimidated? It shows how they act to make sure if they feel comfortable with you or not. Think he said that you can get a better read if there's multiple bullet points together.

How are you meeting women? How did you meet the 6 women that gave you no responses?

That's good work man, keep getting these girls.



ElderPrice said:
1/10/19

No updates today. No responses from any of the numbers I'm currently working on. That's like 0 for 6ish. Fuck!

Chase posted a new article today suggesting that if you're hitting a particular wall, you might just be coming across as intimidating to women. I have no idea how a short guy like me could be like that but I guess it's possible. And it would explain my consistent failure despite trying new tweaks to my game. Unfortunately it sounds really fucking hard to make yourself less intimidating. Wonderful. Oh well. At least it's something else to try working on.
1 Quiets and reserves her speech
2 Closes off body language
3 Shrinks the space she takes up with her body
4 Pauses/deliberates before she speaks and answers
5 Keeps her path to the exit clear/open
6 Gives excuses for why she should go
7 Voices reservations she has about comfort/feeling 'right'

Yep, I definitely see those bullet points a lot. Actually I basically always see them at some point. However, I've never heard a girl say #7 before, and I haven't noticed anyone doing #5. They're probably doing it and it's just hard to notice.

With some girls it'll be right as I meet them and try to converse with them. Others it'll be during the date with them. Basically it's rare as fuck to meet a girl legitimately excited to meet me and be around me. Almost all these girls aren't really excited when they gave me their numbers. If I had to categorize them I'd probably categorize them as maybes/fence sitters who figure 'what the heck' and agree to give me their numbers, but then never follow through since they weren't particularly excited to start with.

I met em all at country bars. I asked them to dance, chatted with them, then got their numbers. Most of them (if not all of them) had horrible logistics so nothing could happen the night of. Don't know how much that matters because none of them were giving me the "take me home" eyes anyway.

Thank you for the compliment my friend! Should be lots more opportunities this weekend. Hopefully I'll have some good reports/journals to post!
 

Sub-Zero

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Sep 6, 2014
Messages
596
Ah.... that's most likely the reason why then. Chase and others have told me that clubs and bars are for same night lays and that numbers are pretty much useless. I can attest, I have been doing night game for years and all my girls flake, they can be all over me kissing me all that, get the number and they act very uninterested.

I still like to go to get my social skills better, but I stopped taking numbers for a while.

So still go to the bars and get numbers because it's good for practice, but like you said you get the numbers and then nothing, same thing happened to me and I'm talking years man, and these girls were pursuing me so heavy too.

So yeah, don't get your hopes up, but still go out and get numbers until you feel comfortable enough to get a same night lay.

Are you going out alone?
Are they different bars or the same one?
How many night a week are you going out?

You're putting in work man, I'm guessing you have no problems with aa or going out solo like that, which is very good.





ElderPrice said:
Sub-Zero said:
Did you check Chase's bullet points on how girls act when they're intimidated? It shows how they act to make sure if they feel comfortable with you or not. Think he said that you can get a better read if there's multiple bullet points together.

How are you meeting women? How did you meet the 6 women that gave you no responses?

That's good work man, keep getting these girls.



ElderPrice said:
1/10/19

No updates today. No responses from any of the numbers I'm currently working on. That's like 0 for 6ish. Fuck!

Chase posted a new article today suggesting that if you're hitting a particular wall, you might just be coming across as intimidating to women. I have no idea how a short guy like me could be like that but I guess it's possible. And it would explain my consistent failure despite trying new tweaks to my game. Unfortunately it sounds really fucking hard to make yourself less intimidating. Wonderful. Oh well. At least it's something else to try working on.
1 Quiets and reserves her speech
2 Closes off body language
3 Shrinks the space she takes up with her body
4 Pauses/deliberates before she speaks and answers
5 Keeps her path to the exit clear/open
6 Gives excuses for why she should go
7 Voices reservations she has about comfort/feeling 'right'

Yep, I definitely see those bullet points a lot. Actually I basically always see them at some point. However, I've never heard a girl say #7 before, and I haven't noticed anyone doing #5. They're probably doing it and it's just hard to notice.

With some girls it'll be right as I meet them and try to converse with them. Others it'll be during the date with them. Basically it's rare as fuck to meet a girl legitimately excited to meet me and be around me. Almost all these girls aren't really excited when they gave me their numbers. If I had to categorize them I'd probably categorize them as maybes/fence sitters who figure 'what the heck' and agree to give me their numbers, but then never follow through since they weren't particularly excited to start with.

I met em all at country bars. I asked them to dance, chatted with them, then got their numbers. Most of them (if not all of them) had horrible logistics so nothing could happen the night of. Don't know how much that matters because none of them were giving me the "take me home" eyes anyway.

Thank you for the compliment my friend! Should be lots more opportunities this weekend. Hopefully I'll have some good reports/journals to post!
 

ElderPrice

Tool-Bearing Hominid
Tool-Bearing Hominid
Joined
Jun 11, 2018
Messages
245
Sub-Zero said:
Ah.... that's most likely the reason why then. Chase and others have told me that clubs and bars are for same night lays and that numbers are pretty much useless. I can attest, I have been doing night game for years and all my girls flake, they can be all over me kissing me all that, get the number and they act very uninterested.

I still like to go to get my social skills better, but I stopped taking numbers for a while.

So still go to the bars and get numbers because it's good for practice, but like you said you get the numbers and then nothing, same thing happened to me and I'm talking years man, and these girls were pursuing me so heavy too.

So yeah, don't get your hopes up, but still go out and get numbers until you feel comfortable enough to get a same night lay.

Are you going out alone?
Are they different bars or the same one?
How many night a week are you going out?

You're putting in work man, I'm guessing you have no problems with aa or going out solo like that, which is very good.
Haha well then I'm fucked! And I thought dance night was one of the easiest ways to meet women! Now to be clear, I said country bar, but I wouldn't think of it as the bar/club category. I met all these girls out dancing. Like, legit partner dancing. Since it was country it happened to be in country bars. People go to that to dance... it's very different from the super guards up, Hollywood attitudes at night clubs. Don't know if that changes your opinion or not, but I did want to toss that out there, as nights out to go partner dancing seems different than nights out clubbin IMO.

I don't think my issue with same night lays is confidence (but don't get me wrong, it can be much better). It's logistics and just finding girls into it. Show me a girl that's into me and has decent logistics, and I'll push for a same night lay. Absolutely. But show me girls on the fence and with horrible logistics (ie. they live 45 minutes away, they're the DD tonight for their friends, etc.) and I just don't feel like it.

Yes, I'm basically going out alone. I have some new friends that I meet at all these places, but we don't coordinate. They either go or they don't. I either go or I don't.
The last month or so it's been the same bars because they are the most popular and get the highest turnover of new girls week in and week out.
I got out 3 nights a week.

Thanks man!
 

Sub-Zero

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Sep 6, 2014
Messages
596
Chase hasn't mentioned country bars, but from what you're tellin me, it sound exactly like what everyone goes through with clubs and bars lol.

I think it might just be nightlife in general, idk about street pick up, but I know Chase said the best places would be lounges and dive bars and I believe he said to go for sml's there too.

Are you trying to go to their place or bring them to yours ? I know the closer one of you are to the place the better.

With me I live like 30+ minutes away and it feels like a long drive.

I don't know what a person is supposed to do if both of you live far away.





ElderPrice said:
Sub-Zero said:
Ah.... that's most likely the reason why then. Chase and others have told me that clubs and bars are for same night lays and that numbers are pretty much useless. I can attest, I have been doing night game for years and all my girls flake, they can be all over me kissing me all that, get the number and they act very uninterested.

I still like to go to get my social skills better, but I stopped taking numbers for a while.

So still go to the bars and get numbers because it's good for practice, but like you said you get the numbers and then nothing, same thing happened to me and I'm talking years man, and these girls were pursuing me so heavy too.

So yeah, don't get your hopes up, but still go out and get numbers until you feel comfortable enough to get a same night lay.

Are you going out alone?
Are they different bars or the same one?
How many night a week are you going out?

You're putting in work man, I'm guessing you have no problems with aa or going out solo like that, which is very good.
Haha well then I'm fucked! And I thought dance night was one of the easiest ways to meet women! Now to be clear, I said country bar, but I wouldn't think of it as the bar/club category. I met all these girls out dancing. Like, legit partner dancing. Since it was country it happened to be in country bars. People go to that to dance... it's very different from the super guards up, Hollywood attitudes at night clubs. Don't know if that changes your opinion or not, but I did want to toss that out there, as nights out to go partner dancing seems different than nights out clubbin IMO.

I don't think my issue with same night lays is confidence (but don't get me wrong, it can be much better). It's logistics and just finding girls into it. Show me a girl that's into me and has decent logistics, and I'll push for a same night lay. Absolutely. But show me girls on the fence and with horrible logistics (ie. they live 45 minutes away, they're the DD tonight for their friends, etc.) and I just don't feel like it.

Yes, I'm basically going out alone. I have some new friends that I meet at all these places, but we don't coordinate. They either go or they don't. I either go or I don't.
The last month or so it's been the same bars because they are the most popular and get the highest turnover of new girls week in and week out.
I got out 3 nights a week.

Thanks man!
 

ElderPrice

Tool-Bearing Hominid
Tool-Bearing Hominid
Joined
Jun 11, 2018
Messages
245
Sub-Zero said:
Chase hasn't mentioned country bars, but from what you're tellin me, it sound exactly like what everyone goes through with clubs and bars lol.

I think it might just be nightlife in general, idk about street pick up, but I know Chase said the best places would be lounges and dive bars and I believe he said to go for sml's there too.

Are you trying to go to their place or bring them to yours ? I know the closer one of you are to the place the better.

With me I live like 30+ minutes away and it feels like a long drive.

I don't know what a person is supposed to do if both of you live far away.
You might be right about it still being a bar. I'll keep giving it a shot and see if anything changes.

I don't have a place of my own, so the ideal situation would be to get myself over to their's. If we both live far away and the logistics are pure garbage, then that only leaves a couple options:
- pull her to your car
- get a hotel room
- public sex

Hopefully I can get a place of my own soon and start experimenting with that whole new catalog of possibilities.
 

ElderPrice

Tool-Bearing Hominid
Tool-Bearing Hominid
Joined
Jun 11, 2018
Messages
245
1/11/19 Good night

This wasn't really a successful night in terms of pulling/getting new numbers/etc. It was just a solid, fun night and it's definitely a good night after being depressed for a lot of the week.

Some friends threw a party by reserving some space at a big bar in town. I saw a good number of acquaintances that I haven't seen in a couple months (including a number of girls) and there was a decent number of new people to meet too.

The girls that I knew here that I had met before either I wasn't particularly crazy about or they just weren't into me... that's why I never grabbed their contact info or dated them before. For the ones that are cute enough that I wouldn't mind if something happened, I've placed them in experimentation categories, IE I want to see if some of these girls will start chasing me, I want to see if a couple of these girls - who outright declined to give me their numbers in the past but still are friendly and possibly toss out some signs of interest here and there - can be won with a long-term game, etc.

I did get a couple of these girls to add me on social media (including one who would not give me her number lol) so I'd count that as a 'getting new numbers' win. But I don't care about that tonight. It was just a fun, social night and the only way it could have gone better was if there were some girls there that particularly excited me. On to tonight!
 
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