Insight from men on this guy’s behavior needed

[Lilly]

I hope this is the correct category to post this in.

Some recap about me: female, 28, virgin, has been going out alone a lot more to find a long-term relationship.

I need some input from experienced men here about what happened today.

I went to the local spa and I immediately got creepy vibes from a guy upon first seeing him and instinctively knew he was attracted. I ignored him and focused on swimming, then went outside where he circled me twice from different directions. He deliberately looked sideways each time, but the weird vibe stayed

Before entering the spa, I’d booked the pool and the sauna—my first time at a mixed non-textile sauna (meaning everyone is fully naked). I chose to do this to see how I’ll hold myself in such discomfort, being naked around strangers.

So to avoid the creepy guy, I went upstairs to the sauna and entered one with two women, who promptly left however. A minute later the guy arrives (!) and also enters the sauna I chose. My stress level is through the roof by now. Then he steps directly in front of me with a hand covering his dick, sprays some more water onto the bench and then sits right beside me.

I was very close to a freeze response. I stared straight ahead at the clock, not moving a muscle. After 15 mins my system was close to overheating so I left the sauna first, which meant he saw my rear fully naked but I needed to get out of the heat and drink some water. I went to the sauna bar, the workers give me water, and two minutes later I walk back to the changing room when I see the guy step out of the shower.

I put my bikini back on quickly, went downstairs to the pool and immediately looked for a woman to chat with. I clicked with a nice old lady and her grandkids, we had a long conversation, and I see the guy look down at the pool from the upstairs sauna balcony.

An hour later (8PM) I got out of the pool, bid the lady farewell, and five mins later he walks past me again.

At this point I felt a sliding door moment of choice. I’d actually planned to stay at the pool till 9PM, then go to the hotel bar and have a mocktail, maybe meet a man I’m attracted to. But now I felt like that’d be untrue. I was torn between, “You paid a lot of money for this pool + sauna experience. You wanted to mingle and maybe get to know a guy your age to click with, have a nice Sunday evening and drive back home late. Do you really want to let this creep ruin your plans??” and “Every woman who’s been raped had to choose between staying and leaving at some point. Are you really going to ignore your gut feeling??”

So I left and got back home safely.

What do you guys think?

Maybe he wouldn’t have done anything. But the deliberate entering the sauna I was in alone, stepping up to my face naked and sitting right next to me honestly disturbed me, aside from his whole following me around.

 

[gameboy]

I believe that's what happens when a man desires to be with women, but fears expressing the desire and actually approaching her in a way that actually allows the woman to respond (and potentially reject him). He turns to creepy behaviour like this, since he can't open his mouth and just talk to you in a normal way. It sounds paradoxical, but he's afraid of doing that. It's an irrational fear.

I don't think he would have raped you. Of course we can't say for sure, but I've seen this creepy behaviour myself on the beach lots of times. Guys will just sit close to a (hot) woman and stare, but not be able to approach. Until the woman finally leaves.

 

[KJ Francis]

Agreed. You saw an extreme example of creepiness (his desired intent not matching his actions... which creates a lot of worry about what his actual unknown intent is), and it sounds like an extremely uncomfortable experience. But attraction does kind of operate like this. It's like if you were on the beach during a beautiful sunset, it would be very difficult to turn your back to it. If I am in a waiting room and there's a beautiful girl way on the other side of the room, it is next to impossible to remove her from my peripheral awareness.

 

[Skills]

I hope this is the correct category to post this in.

Some recap about me: female, 28, virgin, has been going out alone a lot more to find a long-term relationship.

I need some input from experienced men here about what happened today.

I went to the local spa and I immediately got creepy vibes from a guy upon first seeing him and instinctively knew he was attracted. I ignored him and focused on swimming, then went outside where he circled me twice from different directions. He deliberately looked sideways each time, but the weird vibe stayed

Before entering the spa, I’d booked the pool and the sauna—my first time at a mixed non-textile sauna (meaning everyone is fully naked). I chose to do this to see how I’ll hold myself in such discomfort, being naked around strangers.

So to avoid the creepy guy, I went upstairs to the sauna and entered one with two women, who promptly left however. A minute later the guy arrives (!) and also enters the sauna I chose. My stress level is through the roof by now. Then he steps directly in front of me with a hand covering his dick, sprays some more water onto the bench and then sits right beside me.

I was very close to a freeze response. I stared straight ahead at the clock, not moving a muscle. After 15 mins my system was close to overheating so I left the sauna first, which meant he saw my rear fully naked but I needed to get out of the heat and drink some water. I went to the sauna bar, the workers give me water, and two minutes later I walk back to the changing room when I see the guy step out of the shower.

I put my bikini back on quickly, went downstairs to the pool and immediately looked for a woman to chat with. I clicked with a nice old lady and her grandkids, we had a long conversation, and I see the guy look down at the pool from the upstairs sauna balcony.

An hour later (8PM) I got out of the pool, bid the lady farewell, and five mins later he walks past me again.

At this point I felt a sliding door moment of choice. I’d actually planned to stay at the pool till 9PM, then go to the hotel bar and have a mocktail, maybe meet a man I’m attracted to. But now I felt like that’d be untrue. I was torn between, “You paid a lot of money for this pool + sauna experience. You wanted to mingle and maybe get to know a guy your age to click with, have a nice Sunday evening and drive back home late. Do you really want to let this creep ruin your plans??” and “Every woman who’s been raped had to choose between staying and leaving at some point. Are you really going to ignore your gut feeling??”

So I left and got back home safely.

What do you guys think?

Maybe he wouldn’t have done anything. But the deliberate entering the sauna I was in alone, stepping up to my face naked and sitting right next to me honestly disturbed me, aside from his whole following me around.

this sounded like a rape porno plot gone wrong.... made me lol... So his issue is what we a called parking (taking too long too open), he should have gone up to you and open you, and that way he knew were he stand, or he should have thrown an approach invite (i think he did though) but after the fuck off body language, he should have moved on and gotten the hint...

guys that park come across as creepy due to lack of confidence and staring... Same with guys that don't get hints...

But good job getting naked and comfortable doing so in public, that is huge...

P.S, Saunas HAVE ALWAYS BEEN creepy guys breeding grounds... is common knowledge for men and women..

 

[Atlas IV]

First time I've heard of a sauna where men and women are naked TOGETHER.

I know in Japan it's traditional to enter an onsen naked, but they are always segregated between men and women, for obvious reasons.

Even here in Thailand, where saunas, gay saunas and such are common, I do not believe I have ever heard of an establishment where both men and women are naked together.

That sounds like a terrible idea, a place that would naturally attract the worst sorts. I would not be comfortable with the idea of a woman I care about ever going somewhere like that.

So to avoid the creepy guy, I went upstairs to the sauna and entered one with two women, who promptly left however. A minute later the guy arrives (!) and also enters the sauna I chose. My stress level is through the roof by now. Then he steps directly in front of me with a hand covering his dick, sprays some more water onto the bench and then sits right beside me.

This sounds like a nightmare. A situation like this should not be permitted in a properly regulated society.

Is this one of those places that has gone full woke LGBTQ++ and thrown all safety rules out the window?

 

[Will_V]

I hope this is the correct category to post this in.

Some recap about me: female, 28, virgin, has been going out alone a lot more to find a long-term relationship.

I need some input from experienced men here about what happened today.

I went to the local spa and I immediately got creepy vibes from a guy upon first seeing him and instinctively knew he was attracted. I ignored him and focused on swimming, then went outside where he circled me twice from different directions. He deliberately looked sideways each time, but the weird vibe stayed

Before entering the spa, I’d booked the pool and the sauna—my first time at a mixed non-textile sauna (meaning everyone is fully naked). I chose to do this to see how I’ll hold myself in such discomfort, being naked around strangers.

So to avoid the creepy guy, I went upstairs to the sauna and entered one with two women, who promptly left however. A minute later the guy arrives (!) and also enters the sauna I chose. My stress level is through the roof by now. Then he steps directly in front of me with a hand covering his dick, sprays some more water onto the bench and then sits right beside me.

I was very close to a freeze response. I stared straight ahead at the clock, not moving a muscle. After 15 mins my system was close to overheating so I left the sauna first, which meant he saw my rear fully naked but I needed to get out of the heat and drink some water. I went to the sauna bar, the workers give me water, and two minutes later I walk back to the changing room when I see the guy step out of the shower.

I put my bikini back on quickly, went downstairs to the pool and immediately looked for a woman to chat with. I clicked with a nice old lady and her grandkids, we had a long conversation, and I see the guy look down at the pool from the upstairs sauna balcony.

An hour later (8PM) I got out of the pool, bid the lady farewell, and five mins later he walks past me again.

At this point I felt a sliding door moment of choice. I’d actually planned to stay at the pool till 9PM, then go to the hotel bar and have a mocktail, maybe meet a man I’m attracted to. But now I felt like that’d be untrue. I was torn between, “You paid a lot of money for this pool + sauna experience. You wanted to mingle and maybe get to know a guy your age to click with, have a nice Sunday evening and drive back home late. Do you really want to let this creep ruin your plans??” and “Every woman who’s been raped had to choose between staying and leaving at some point. Are you really going to ignore your gut feeling??”

So I left and got back home safely.

What do you guys think?

Maybe he wouldn’t have done anything. But the deliberate entering the sauna I was in alone, stepping up to my face naked and sitting right next to me honestly disturbed me, aside from his whole following me around.

Sounds like a weird dude, whether he had bad intentions or just couldn't figure out how to say hi, I'm not sure anyone can tell you. Sounds like you took care of yourself, keeping other people around and leaving when your instinct told you so.

This being a seduction forum, I'm not sure where the seduction is? Except maybe as an example of how not to do it lol.

 

[Lilly]

I believe that's what happens when a man desires to be with women, but fears expressing the desire and actually approaching her in a way that actually allows the woman to respond (and potentially reject him). He turns to creepy behaviour like this, since he can't open his mouth and just talk to you in a normal way. It sounds paradoxical, but he's afraid of doing that. It's an irrational fear.

I don't think he would have raped you. Of course we can't say for sure, but I've seen this creepy behaviour myself on the beach lots of times. Guys will just sit close to a (hot) woman and stare, but not be able to approach. Until the woman finally leaves.

It does make me feel kinda relieved that you’ve seen this behavior a lot before and that it might be due to awkwardness instead of malicious intent. Thanks for your response!

 

[Lilly]

First time I've heard of a sauna where men and women are naked TOGETHER.

I know in Japan it's traditional to enter an onsen naked, but they are always segregated between men and women, for obvious reasons.

Even here in Thailand, where saunas, gay saunas and such are common, I do not believe I have ever heard of an establishment where both men and women are naked together.

That sounds like a terrible idea, a place that would naturally attract the worst sorts. I would not be comfortable with the idea of a woman I care about ever going somewhere like that.


This sounds like a nightmare. A situation like this should not be permitted in a properly regulated society.

Is this one of those places that has gone full woke LGBTQ++ and thrown all safety rules out the window?

I live in a region in Europe where naked mixed beaches are a normal thing. The changing area at that spa is also not segregated. Honestly, it probably is full woke, but in that case it has been so for 10+ years. I’d never visited the sauna area before though and had no idea it was 1) zero textiles and 2) mixed.

And I wouldn’t have minded much either if that creep hadn’t been there. The other men there didn’t give off creepiness/danger vibes.

For me personally, I won’t be repeating this experiment though. I realized that strange men shouldn’t see my body naked. I didn’t think I’d mind in an ‘innocent’ context, but apparently I do.

 

[Skills]

I live in a region in Europe where naked mixed beaches are a normal thing. The changing area at that spa is also not segregated. Honestly, it probably is full woke, but in that case it has been so for 10+ years. I’d never visited the sauna area before though and had no idea it was 1) zero textiles and 2) mixed.

And I wouldn’t have minded much either if that creep hadn’t been there. The other men there didn’t give off creepiness/danger vibes.

For me personally, I won’t be repeating this experiment though. I realized that strange men shouldn’t see my body naked. I didn’t think I’d mind in an ‘innocent’ context, but apparently I do.

Lily any places with mix naked there will be creepy/perverts.... Naked beaches, naked pools, naked communities, swing clubs...

it just come with the territory, the pervs and creepers are going to be there....

The solutions:

-hint
- if they don't get hint strong rejection (over the top a bit rude)
- move away
- befriend a dude or a couple and whisper (that creeper is following me can i hang out for a bit just to get rid of him}
- call security/police in venue usually security

^ i experience also creepers as a dude in South Beach, homo creepers, not a good feeling or dudes following me around.... or in bathroom urinals creepers looking at your dick...

Till today women ask me why i don't like them behind me going up stairs "my ptsd" from gay guys following me around in south beach..

 

[gameboy]

Lily any places with mix naked there will be creepy/perverts.... Naked beaches, naked pools, naked communities, swing clubs...

it just come with the territory, the pervs and creepers are going to be there....

The solutions:

-hint
- if they don't get hint strong rejection (over the top a bit rude)
- move away
- befriend a dude or a couple and whisper (that creeper is following me can i hang out for a bit just to get rid of him}
- call security/police in venue usually security

^ i experience also creepers as a dude in South Beach, homo creepers, not a good feeling or dudes following me around.... or in bathroom urinals creepers looking at your dick...

Till today women ask me why i don't like them behind me going up stairs "my ptsd" from gay guys following me around in south beach..

Yep same here. Which is why I avoid nude beaches like the plague.

Years ago, an ex gf took me to a nude beach on some island. I didnt get naked but she did. Sure as hell there was an old creeper hiding behind some rock, spying on us.

I also get the homo creepers at the beach, more often than I would like. Good to know its not just me.

 

[Lilly]

Naked beaches, naked pools, naked communities, swing clubs

So this got me thinking about swing clubs. Like getting naked myself is a bad idea, but maybe it’d be good for me to watch some real sex happening instead of what porn I’ve seen so far in my life?

Anyways, there are no swingers clubs anywhere close to my area at all and even if they existed nearby 1) paying for a year-long membership probably wouldn’t be possible and 2) I probably would chicken out anyways.

But do you guys think that the idea itself—getting exposed to real sexual activity by watching in person to get used to it a bit more—isn’t completely nuts?

Or would I be setting myself up for lifelong trauma and nightmares?

Have you ever heard of a virgin ‘desensitizing’ herself like that?

 

[Skills]

So this got me thinking about swing clubs. Like getting naked myself is a bad idea, but maybe it’d be good for me to watch some real sex happening instead of what porn I’ve seen so far in my life?

Anyways, there are no swingers clubs anywhere close to my area at all and even if they existed nearby 1) paying for a year-long membership probably wouldn’t be possible and 2) I probably would chicken out anyways.

But do you guys think that the idea itself—getting exposed to real sexual activity by watching in person to get used to it a bit more—isn’t completely nuts?

Or would I be setting myself up for lifelong trauma and nightmares?

Have you ever heard of a virgin ‘desensitizing’ herself like that?

Unnecessary... But a virgin in a swingclub would be for the lolz...

You don't need to do any of that..

Getting naked to be comfortable is ok... But is not necessary at all for your goal...

 

[KJ Francis]

What is the goal exactly... Just so you are more comfortable when you eventually are in a relationship and want to lose your virginity?

Honestly I would just go on tinder... Find a guy who gets girls but seems like a genuine and kind guy, and fool around with him. Just be honest about your situation and meet for coffee or something. He'll think it's cute.

Key would be he gets laid elsewhere so he is not needy for sex. Then you are safe not being pushed past your comfort zone. You can just make out, get comfortable being felt up, cuddling, etc. If you meet a few times maybe eventually have your tits sucked, fingering, hand jobs, blow jobs, etc. Teenager stuff.

I did this with a religious virgin for a long time. I was fucking other girls so it was no problem. It was really fun honestly. I taught her how to kiss.

 

[Lilly]

Yep same here. Which is why I avoid nude beaches like the plague.

Years ago, an ex gf took me to a nude beach on some island. I didnt get naked but she did. Sure as hell there was an old creeper hiding behind some rock, spying on us.

I also get the homo creepers at the beach, more often than I would like. Good to know its not just me.

Re: old creeper.

It might sound paradoxical after I made a post detailing creepy male behavior, but interestingly age doesn’t seem to have anything to do with that creep vibe. There’s an about 80 year old married guy I met through acquaintances who’s open about his sexual frustration and lack of sex life with his wife (same age), and he made it (subtly) clear that he’s attracted to me and would do me if he could, but I wasn’t creeped out once. He’s strangely attractive and hot, even though he’s so old. He’s just a savvy, cool, chill guy. And if he weren’t married, I’d have no reason not to let him feel me up tbh. Maybe not PiV, but tamer stuff. So yeah, as long as a man is attractive, he can still get women’s positive attention regardless of age.

 

[Lilly]

What is the goal exactly... Just so you are more comfortable when you eventually are in a relationship and want to lose your virginity?

Honestly I would just go on tinder... Find a guy who gets girls but seems like a genuine and kind guy, and fool around with him. Just be honest about your situation and meet for coffee or something. He'll think it's cute.

Key would be he gets laid elsewhere so he is not needy for sex. Then you are safe not being pushed past your comfort zone. You can just make out, get comfortable being felt up, cuddling, etc. If you meet a few times maybe eventually have your tits sucked, fingering, hand jobs, blow jobs, etc. Teenager stuff.

I did this with a religious virgin for a long time. I was fucking other girls so it was no problem. It was really fun honestly. I taught her how to kiss.

Not a bad idea. I actually tried to do this when I was 23. But the guy never wanted to meet in person and we just sexted for a while before I got bored and honestly upset by his passivity.

How would I recognize a guy who “gets girls” exactly? Like that whole proposition of “I’m a virgin and want some fondling experience” sounds like a recipe to attract rapists and creeps.

 

[KJ Francis]

80 years old??? Amazing.

See yeah he is not hiding his intent and is not needy or chasing by showing unrelenting unreciprocated interest. So there's no "creeping".

Well I would not put it in your bio or anything. I would basically use a blank bio or similar. Put a few basic photos with some smiling and cleavage. Put looking for short term open to long. This should get you a high volume of matches to choose from.

Don't be picky at all with the swiping so you get a large starting funnel.

Skip the guys with selfies or mirror photos etc.

From there I'm not sure... Maybe a guy with some photos with girls present. Someone who has a kind looking smile in at least one of the photos.

You will probably just be able to tell from if he is good at flirting and smooth messaging. Someone who shows some personal level of interest in you. Remember he does not need to meet your long term criteria, but you need a trustworthy guy who will respect your limits.

And probably wait until you banter a little bit before explaining anything about your situation.

 

[KJ Francis]

Oh and maybe test his neediness by cycling a bit between showing flirty interest and withdrawing. You're looking for someone who shows warmth but does not chase you or get upset because he has other options.

 

[Lilly]

80 years old??? Amazing.

See yeah he is not hiding his intent and is not needy or chasing by showing unrelenting unreciprocated interest. So there's no "creeping".

Well I would not put it in your bio or anything. I would basically use a blank bio or similar. Put a few basic photos with some smiling and cleavage. Put looking for short term open to long. This should get you a high volume of matches to choose from.

Don't be picky at all with the swiping so you get a large starting funnel.

Skip the guys with selfies or mirror photos etc.

From there I'm not sure... Maybe a guy with some photos with girls present. Someone who has a kind looking smile in at least one of the photos.

You will probably just be able to tell from if he is good at flirting and smooth messaging. Someone who shows some personal level of interest in you. Remember he does not need to meet your long term criteria, but you need a trustworthy guy who will respect your limits.

And probably wait until you banter a little bit before explaining anything about your situation.

80 years old??? Amazing.

See yeah he is not hiding his intent and is not needy or chasing by showing unrelenting unreciprocated interest. So there's no "creeping".

Well I would not put it in your bio or anything. I would basically use a blank bio or similar. Put a few basic photos with some smiling and cleavage. Put looking for short term open to long. This should get you a high volume of matches to choose from.

Don't be picky at all with the swiping so you get a large starting funnel.

Skip the guys with selfies or mirror photos etc.

From there I'm not sure... Maybe a guy with some photos with girls present. Someone who has a kind looking smile in at least one of the photos.

You will probably just be able to tell from if he is good at flirting and smooth messaging. Someone who shows some personal level of interest in you. Remember he does not need to meet your long term criteria, but you need a trustworthy guy who will respect your limits.

And probably wait until you banter a little bit before explaining anything about your situation.

So I downloaded Tinder and OkCupid and boy what a leftist cesspool these apps have become. Seeing the pride or BLM flag in mens’ bios is disgusting. The guys in my area are either overweight or need teeth implants None of them have any pics with women either (unsurprisingly). Zero fundamentals. But I’ll keep looking. Thank you for your advice.

 

[Spyce D]

Oh and maybe test his neediness by cycling a bit between showing flirty interest and withdrawing. You're looking for someone who shows warmth but does not chase you or get upset because he has other options.

You are helping the enemy. .

Just kidding.