Socializing Just Friendzoned!!!

[AdamC]

What to do here??

If you've seen over the last couple of days, this is regarding the Eastern European Daygame Pickup.
We are scheduled to meet at 1:30, and today Iis her last day in Los Angeles before going to Mexico for a month (and who knows who could pick her up there :/ )
And she just dropped this:

Hi hi. I just felt that I have to tell you that I appreciate our friendship and I don't want any confusion. You are a very cool person, I like to talk with you a lot and you already know my point of view about many things. I am writing in case you have different expectations, I just wanted to let you know that I would like to remain friends. I hope you are cool with that.

I haven't responded, and won't respond until I see her at 1:30.
I am going to disagree with her "Frame," all-while respecting her boundaries - I'm not here to do anything agaisnt free will, an abundant guy doesn't need to - right?

Question 1 - What does the Group Suggest in terms of turning this around???

Question 2 - (Without going into the whole history)How the Fuck did I get Friendzoned again, God-Damint!!!

Interested in your thoughts!
- Adam C

 

[topcat]

Question 2 - (Without going into the whole history)How the Fuck did I get Friendzoned again, God-Damint!!!

Easy. You don't fit her expectations for a lover nor her expectations for a boyfriend, but you're cool enough to hang out with as a friend.

I don't think overtly reframing this situation is going to solve this issue, not in as short a timeframe as you have with her.

Your best bet is agreeing with the frame, friendzoning her back, and improving your sexual vibe and lover frame with other women, all while keeping her as a legitimate friend you do platonic activities with. Flirt innocently but don't push it, then eventully get more busy with other paramours. That MIGHT flip her.

Worth the effort? probably not. But that's what i would do if she were cool enough..

 

[orkie123]

Easy. You don't fit her expectations for a lover nor her expectations for a boyfriend, but you're cool enough to hang out with as a friend.

This is so true.

Its why its important to be the lover first, even if you want a relationship.

Lover to LTR is often doable if not preferred route. Friendzone to relationship, extremely difficult.

I still get burned sometimes when I give BF vibes to girls I wouldnt date. Damn hollywood movies

 

[AdamC]

So, I'm trying to figure out where I failed to present Lover rather than BF, or friend.
In our first full meet up I did ask her about having Travel Romances and she said she was on the conservative side because she's very sensitive, and gets attached easily...

Another person on the forum said this:
One angle I'm looking at is that you are dealing with FSC [Female State Control].

She's conflicted on her value of independence...causing her to control her emotions and hold back from making a decision on you.

In other words, she does not trust her judgement to let go...due to the risk of catching feelings and becoming dependent.

Providing a safety net could help you here. As in, make her feel allowed to emotionally invest in you without consequence. I've done this before by setting rules to ensure no feelings get involved. It reduces the conflict and lets her remain independent.

I'm trying to learn at where in the interaction I didn't present being a Lover, and what I have to work on moving forward to STOP being friendzoned!!!

 

[topcat]

So, I'm trying to figure out where I failed to present Lover rather than BF, or friend.
In our first full meet up I did ask her about having Travel Romances and she said she was on the conservative side because she's very sensitive, and gets attached easily...

Another person on the forum said this:
One angle I'm looking at is that you are dealing with FSC [Female State Control].

She's conflicted on her value of independence...causing her to control her emotions and hold back from making a decision on you.

In other words, she does not trust her judgement to let go...due to the risk of catching feelings and becoming dependent.

Providing a safety net could help you here. As in, make her feel allowed to emotionally invest in you without consequence. I've done this before by setting rules to ensure no feelings get involved. It reduces the conflict and lets her remain independent.

I'm trying to learn at where in the interaction I didn't present being a Lover, and what I have to work on moving forward to STOP being friendzoned!!!

Interesting. Not sure what to make of that, though i still feel it’s lack of lover VIBES that’s causing it..

When you’re a lover if she’s going to evade you, she’ll just ghost or tell you “we aren’t on the same page” and then ghost you. She won’t hit you with the friendzone as it would be a ridiculous proposition.

Look up articles on cultivating a sexual vibe.

 

[orkie123]

One thing that was missing for me was strong eye contact. I find that if I have good eye contact, and every once in a while put pressure on her by keeping it a tad longer than is normal (till she giggles or turns away), it would make the overall interaction more seductive.

Im not saying thats the thing you need to improve on, but you need to turn up the dial somewhere whether its:

- eye contact
- kino
- sexualisation
- getting investment
- leading

Etc

Another personal correlation for me is getting her to link arms with me when moving from 1 place to another. Does linking arms get girls wet? Not really. But when you have the confidence to do all these little things, it really adds up

 

[Karea Ricardus D.]

You just had a win: you now have a pivot. Use her to good health for social proof.

 

[AdamC]

Wait What, Karea?? - Just had a win??
I see you are a "Tribal Elder," so I'm not going to discount what you are saying, but I don't understand it.

So what did turn out, she explained is - that she just came out of an abusive relationship where she lives in Norway, and this trip to LA, and then on to Mexico is her "healing trip." That there are two types of females and how they quote "heal." One, immediately rebounds sexually, but she is the other who doesn't want to be with a Man for a long time after. Before this abusive relationship she had a long break after coming out of another abusive relationship - sooooo I may have dodged a bullet in a sense...

She said she found me attractive and that something romantic between us could've happened in another world if she didn't have the previous relationship emotional fog... NOW I'm gonna leave that up to the group to determine if that's a sincere statement or a typical female "easy let down," to quote, unquote - not hurt any feeeling (sweetheart, you ain't gonna hurt my feelings. However this woman isn't a very good liar, I will say that compared to the Viper Entertainment LA Girls out here.

I did bring her back to my place, a kind of a 5 minute deal to introduce it to her, but also cuz I had to pee, and they're aren't very many public restrooms. Besides I was taking her to a nature hiking place near Pasadena that doesn't exactly have a restroom.
I found her outside the door to my place when I finished, and asked her why she left my place for outside. She said there was some quote "heavy energy" that made her feel uncomfortable that she didn't want to stay inside. I asked her if she felt unsafe with me, and she replied - "If I felt unsafe with you, I wouldn't be in your car."

We went to the nature place in Pasadena but only stayed a for a little because of the cold, rainy weather, and she had to be back at her Aunt's place at a time that intense traffic would allow. We stopped again at my place - persistence, as I invited her in to see my film for my film photographs and again she said NO, insisting the negative energy of which this time I got upset, not crazy but stern and said - it's kind of a disrespect to say my place has negative energy. If someone in Asia, or even Mexico (she's well traveled to both places and more) invited you in to their place and you told them they had negative energy they'd probably be offended and tell you to (Fuck Off) - I didn't say Fuck Off, but used polite words, and basically said - "We're done here." And I went cold as Ice, polite professional - and she got all apologetic, and kept saying - "I feel guilty now, and I didn't mean to hurt you, now you're mad at me." I didn't answer her instead focusing on the road, and doing polite talk about traffic in LA etcetera. Gave her a handshake outside her aunts place and wished her safety on her trip to Mexico......

A couple incites she gave me. I guess I used the term friends, or buddies on the Opener and invite to hang out, which she used as an excuse to try and Friendzone me. However when I opened her I related her to this Romanian girl who I had a Passionate Experience with, and she reminded me of her and how I had to just come over to her and see what she was about.

She complimented me on how Gentlemanly and polite I was, and how I invited her to such a rare experience such as the Personal Studio Tour of where I use to work, and unlike Universal, or Warner Brothers, they don't offer public tours.
This got me thinking that either I came off toooo try-hard, or tooo High Value, perhaps Boyfriend material which might be something to work on.
Recall, she did say I was attractive, and that she could see herself being romantic with me if there wasn't this former relationship thing.
She didn't say I was like a brother, like she said her other male friends in Norway are like. Sooooooo Yeah!

In the words of the Mafia Bosses in Goodfellas after they "took care of" Tommy - "And That is That!"

 

[TomInHo]

Wait What, Karea?? - Just had a win??
I see you are a "Tribal Elder," so I'm not going to discount what you are saying, but I don't understand it.

So what did turn out, she explained is - that she just came out of an abusive relationship where she lives in Norway, and this trip to LA, and then on to Mexico is her "healing trip." That there are two types of females and how they quote "heal." One, immediately rebounds sexually, but she is the other who doesn't want to be with a Man for a long time after. Before this abusive relationship she had a long break after coming out of another abusive relationship - sooooo I may have dodged a bullet in a sense...

She said she found me attractive and that something romantic between us could've happened in another world if she didn't have the previous relationship emotional fog... NOW I'm gonna leave that up to the group to determine if that's a sincere statement or a typical female "easy let down," to quote, unquote - not hurt any feeeling (sweetheart, you ain't gonna hurt my feelings. However this woman isn't a very good liar, I will say that compared to the Viper Entertainment LA Girls out here.

I did bring her back to my place, a kind of a 5 minute deal to introduce it to her, but also cuz I had to pee, and they're aren't very many public restrooms. Besides I was taking her to a nature hiking place near Pasadena that doesn't exactly have a restroom.
I found her outside the door to my place when I finished, and asked her why she left my place for outside. She said there was some quote "heavy energy" that made her feel uncomfortable that she didn't want to stay inside. I asked her if she felt unsafe with me, and she replied - "If I felt unsafe with you, I wouldn't be in your car."

We went to the nature place in Pasadena but only stayed a for a little because of the cold, rainy weather, and she had to be back at her Aunt's place at a time that intense traffic would allow. We stopped again at my place - persistence, as I invited her in to see my film for my film photographs and again she said NO, insisting the negative energy of which this time I got upset, not crazy but stern and said - it's kind of a disrespect to say my place has negative energy. If someone in Asia, or even Mexico (she's well traveled to both places and more) invited you in to their place and you told them they had negative energy they'd probably be offended and tell you to (Fuck Off) - I didn't say Fuck Off, but used polite words, and basically said - "We're done here." And I went cold as Ice, polite professional - and she got all apologetic, and kept saying - "I feel guilty now, and I didn't mean to hurt you, now you're mad at me." I didn't answer her instead focusing on the road, and doing polite talk about traffic in LA etcetera. Gave her a handshake outside her aunts place and wished her safety on her trip to Mexico......

A couple incites she gave me. I guess I used the term friends, or buddies on the Opener and invite to hang out, which she used as an excuse to try and Friendzone me. However when I opened her I related her to this Romanian girl who I had a Passionate Experience with, and she reminded me of her and how I had to just come over to her and see what she was about.

She complimented me on how Gentlemanly and polite I was, and how I invited her to such a rare experience such as the Personal Studio Tour of where I use to work, and unlike Universal, or Warner Brothers, they don't offer public tours.
This got me thinking that either I came off toooo try-hard, or tooo High Value, perhaps Boyfriend material which might be something to work on.
Recall, she did say I was attractive, and that she could see herself being romantic with me if there wasn't this former relationship thing.
She didn't say I was like a brother, like she said her other male friends in Norway are like. Sooooooo Yeah!

In the words of the Mafia Bosses in Goodfellas after they "took care of" Tommy - "And That is That!"

Let me translate this for you, from womanese to guy logic

“You’re a very nice man and I think you could make a good boyfriend. But I’m currently not looking for a boyfriend because I just got out of a relationship.

I would also love to heal during this trip but want to do that on some meaningless dick. Your dick has too much meaning behind it and if I fuck you fast I will feel like a slut

But when I go to Mexico, if I meet a man named Enrico that has a girlfriend and never dates women like me but digs my energy… I would gladly heal on his dick. Because he has no expectations of anything and neither do I

Also him taking me on a cheap date and escalating hard on me within 1 hour of face time is so fucking hot

Because all my Boyfriends were super careful and treated me like a virginal princess with long drawn out romantic dates without making a move

But Enrico treats me like a sexual being and loves that I’m such a slut with no judgment…. So I had no other choice but to be turned on and fuck him

Technically I’m not a slut if I fuck him since guys like him don’t count hehehehe”

 

[AdamC]

Appreciate and understand that painful reality TominHo...
That's why I cut it off because I know what might-probably happen in Mexico.
What pisses me off, and makes me so upset, is how or why I have this boyfriendzone stigma still attached to me.
And how do I shake it off to become a Lover Guy while still having high value?

 

[AdamC]

But, thankfully I'm not a friendzone guy... However!

 

[TomInHo]

That's why I cut it off because I know what might-probably happen in Mexico.

Honestly… who gives a fuck what she does in Mexico? She ain’t your girlfriend so not sure why you care what she does with her pussy

What pisses me off, and makes me so upset, is how or why I have this boyfriendzone stigma still attached to me.

Your comment above shows your BF energy. You come off way too invested

And how do I shake it off to become a Lover Guy while still having high value?

Checking out some of the content on the main site. Maybe even getting a product or 2

And posting lots of field reports here for feedback

But, thankfully I'm not a friendzone guy... However!

The longer you do this the less you will care about titles

Regardless what zone she put you in you still didn’t fuck. Dick in pussy is what matters most

 

[Will_V]

So what did turn out, she explained is - that she just came out of an abusive relationship where she lives in Norway, and this trip to LA, and then on to Mexico is her "healing trip." That there are two types of females and how they quote "heal." One, immediately rebounds sexually, but she is the other who doesn't want to be with a Man for a long time after. Before this abusive relationship she had a long break after coming out of another abusive relationship - sooooo I may have dodged a bullet in a sense...

This is kind of bs, the way I see it these 'two' types of women are the same, they want to be psychologically distant from men but not necessarily physically. This is her tweaking reality to send you a particular message.

She said she found me attractive and that something romantic between us could've happened in another world if she didn't have the previous relationship emotional fog... NOW I'm gonna leave that up to the group to determine if that's a sincere statement or a typical female "easy let down," to quote, unquote - not hurt any feeeling (sweetheart, you ain't gonna hurt my feelings. However this woman isn't a very good liar, I will say that compared to the Viper Entertainment LA Girls out here.

It's quite possible, she doesn't have any reason to lie about this - she could have just said that you weren't her type or something.

I did bring her back to my place, a kind of a 5 minute deal to introduce it to her, but also cuz I had to pee, and they're aren't very many public restrooms. Besides I was taking her to a nature hiking place near Pasadena that doesn't exactly have a restroom.
I found her outside the door to my place when I finished, and asked her why she left my place for outside. She said there was some quote "heavy energy" that made her feel uncomfortable that she didn't want to stay inside. I asked her if she felt unsafe with me, and she replied - "If I felt unsafe with you, I wouldn't be in your car."

You went on an hours long tour of fox studios and then to a nature hike when she's rebounding from an ex .. this is what you call 'overselling the customer'.

Well done on bringing her home though, it looks like by then she'd made up her mind about what category you fit into, and perhaps you contrasted too much with the sort of guy she was looking to spend time with, and because she liked you she felt guilty about it - hence the 'negative energy'.

We went to the nature place in Pasadena but only stayed a for a little because of the cold, rainy weather, and she had to be back at her Aunt's place at a time that intense traffic would allow. We stopped again at my place - persistence, as I invited her in to see my film for my film photographs and again she said NO, insisting the negative energy of which this time I got upset, not crazy but stern and said - it's kind of a disrespect to say my place has negative energy. If someone in Asia, or even Mexico (she's well traveled to both places and more) invited you in to their place and you told them they had negative energy they'd probably be offended and tell you to (Fuck Off) - I didn't say Fuck Off, but used polite words, and basically said - "We're done here." And I went cold as Ice, polite professional - and she got all apologetic, and kept saying - "I feel guilty now, and I didn't mean to hurt you, now you're mad at me." I didn't answer her instead focusing on the road, and doing polite talk about traffic in LA etcetera. Gave her a handshake outside her aunts place and wished her safety on her trip to Mexico......

A couple incites she gave me. I guess I used the term friends, or buddies on the Opener and invite to hang out, which she used as an excuse to try and Friendzone me. However when I opened her I related her to this Romanian girl who I had a Passionate Experience with, and she reminded me of her and how I had to just come over to her and see what she was about.

She complimented me on how Gentlemanly and polite I was, and how I invited her to such a rare experience such as the Personal Studio Tour of where I use to work, and unlike Universal, or Warner Brothers, they don't offer public tours.
This got me thinking that either I came off toooo try-hard, or tooo High Value, perhaps Boyfriend material which might be something to work on.

Yes, you showed too much value here imo, and you mentioned that the tour went for 'hours' right? So you're investing a lot of time into her and building up your value too high when she just wants to drink tequila and get railed on some filthy bed in mexico.

Recall, she did say I was attractive, and that she could see herself being romantic with me if there wasn't this former relationship thing.
She didn't say I was like a brother, like she said her other male friends in Norway are like. Sooooooo Yeah!

Sometimes you can be unfortunate enough to remind a woman of her ex - maybe you are similar personality, or there are certain other similarities. Or maybe you simply did not come across as exciting or sexually stimulating enough. From the way she treated you it does come across as if you might be putting out too much 'nice guy' vibes - the way she talks to you suggests that she is comfortable trying to take care of your feelings.

I think the lesson here is that the sort of guy a woman wants for a rebound is not the same as the sort of guy she gets into a relationship with, and you gotta pick up on that sort of thing a lot faster and adjust accordingly.

 

[AdamC]

To clarify - The Fox Tour was our first meet-up Friday, after I daygamed picked her up Thursday afternoon at a cvs in Chinatown - this was the day she got in town.
It actually was a cheap date for me because it didn't cost anything. I actually killed two birds with one stone, getting a chance to catch up with another professional female friend of mine who I previously worked with there (she's married but cool,) and she put in security passes. We went and met up with her (which I thought was kinda like Social Proof) but she was busy on a project so we just walked around the lot as I explained cool history about the place (I learned about working there in the past). I asked her about Travel Romances as I drove her to Hollywood, since I had to go to work on a night-shoot Friday night, and she described how she was conservative with romance, and very sensitive, and got attached easily. We agreed to meet on Saturday.

On Saturday I tried to escalate, and she let me play with her hair, caress her inner forearm, lead her with the middle of her back, but I never could get a window to kiss her. (Or maybe I really was playing it too safe...)

Sunday she had to spend time with her Aunt, of whom she was staying with, but had planned to hang out today.

Today before we meet up at the mall, before going to Pasadena (and swinging by my place) she dropped the friendzone message above, but here:

Hi hi. I just felt that I have to tell you that I appreciate our friendship and I don't want any confusion. You are a very cool person, I like to talk with you a lot and you already know my point of view about many things. I am writing in case you have different expectations, I just wanted to let you know that I would like to remain friends. I hope you are cool with that.

And, the rest is what you've replied to today.

*An Interesting Note - taking an LA Girl to Fox Studios never really came off as too high investment. I've taken local girls there before when I worked there, and they were like - Cool, (whatever,) I worked a commercial here a month ago. Or I did an interview with someone in the Exec Building there a while back.

 

[Will_V]

To clarify - The Fox Tour was our first meet-up Friday, after I daygamed picked her up Thursday afternoon at a cvs in Chinatown - this was the day she got in town.
It actually was a cheap date for me because it didn't cost anything. I actually killed two birds with one stone, getting a chance to catch up with another professional female friend of mine who I previously worked with there (she's married but cool,) and she put in security passes. We went and met up with her (which I thought was kinda like Social Proof) but she was busy on a project so we just walked around the lot as I explained cool history about the place (I learned about working there in the past). I asked her about Travel Romances as I drove her to Hollywood, since I had to go to work on a night-shoot Friday night, and she described how she was conservative with romance, and very sensitive, and got attached easily. We agreed to meet on Saturday.

It's not how big of a deal it is for you but what it means to her. I don't know how much exposure she's had to western culture but for a lot of foreign girls the sort of scene you move around in would represent a huge prospect.

On Saturday I tried to escalate, and she let me play with her hair, caress her inner forearm, lead her with the middle of her back, but I never could get a window to kiss her. (Or maybe I really was playing it too safe...)

Probably, she doesn't come across like the sort of woman who likes to play it safe with guys.

A lot of these eastern european girls come from a culture where dudes are way different from what you typically find in western society. Together with the fact she's tatted and has come out of two 'abusive' relationships in the recent past, what does that tell you about the sort of guys that she's attracted to or used to?

*An Interesting Note - taking an LA Girl to Fox Studios never really came off as too high investment. I've taken local girls there before when I worked there, and they were like - Cool, (whatever,) I worked a commercial here a month ago. Or I did an interview with someone in the Exec Building there a while back.

But she's not an LA girl is she?

And she's going to mexico for a month, not to vegas.

 

[Karea Ricardus D.]

Wait What, Karea?? - Just had a win??
I see you are a "Tribal Elder," so I'm not going to discount what you are saying, but I don't understand it.

I just mean that you have a female friend now, is that not a good thing? Most guys who aren't good with women don't have female friends... now you have one. She can introduce you to more people (including other hot girls), you can go out with her and girls will immediately be more interested in you because you already have a beautiful woman with you, and if you open a set with her on your arm, you will NEVER get rejected.

I'll say that I've sometimes had difficulty closing heart broken girls. It seems to me that some girls really can't get themselves to have sex with a new guy while they're still hurting badly over the ex. Some will put out, but some just won't or can't... they literally don't feel ready, can't see themselves with another guy yet. That's been my experience. So it may have been very difficult to win this one through no fault of your own even.

 

[orkie123]

Appreciate and understand that painful reality TominHo...
That's why I cut it off because I know what might-probably happen in Mexico.
What pisses me off, and makes me so upset, is how or why I have this boyfriendzone stigma still attached to me.
And how do I shake it off to become a Lover Guy while still having high value?

Recently a girl who I slept with twice gave me:
"I cannot see you anymore, I have someone serious and want to put all my attention on them and no one else"

The facts of that message are true - she is seeing someone serious for a while and I knew from her Insta stories. She also booked one way ticket to SE asia with this guy in-between the 1st and 2nd session.

But the reason she gave was most likely false. Chances of her suddenly growing a conscious? Very little. So what happened?

The 2nd time we met, the sex was a little less exciting and our pillow talk was more intimate in a BF-GF way. Any other day, and I wouldn't have thought I did that bad, but with this particular girl, I was sure it was over and it was.

The point of sharing this story is that being a good lover means understanding girls better than they understand themselves, being able to adapt to the situation they are in based on experience so that you can provide the emotions that they need.

For someone who is cheating on their partner, I should have avoided the BF-GF themes even though she was eating them up and was really engaged in them. Yet at one point, her mind just clicked and realised what she was doing. It was no longer just a fun, sexual experience.


The girl in your story required the lover boy that TomInHo described: "Enrico treats me like a sexual being and loves that I’m such a slut with no judgment…. So I had no other choice but to be turned on and fuck him". That won't be the same strategy for another girl, who may need more connection and deep-diving to have sex with someone, it won't be the same as the girl who is looking for someone who can just chill and banter about superficial topics.

So the next time you meet a girl that gives you similar vibes to the one in your story, you'll know to try out being more sexual in one of the many ways described in GC. Maybe you'll overdo it the next time. But after a couple of experiences with such girls, and you will naturally start finding the sweet spot.

I also get frustrated with myself when I ruin something, but as long as that energy is used to self-evaluate and to find more girls to use what was learned, then it's just part of life. Being a lover wouldn't be exciting if it was easy or certain.