FR the adventures of sunflowergirl04

[sunnygirl]

Hey guys (and gals), pretty new to this forum, glad to have such a warm welcome from all the seasoned seducers on here. I've recently been interested in interpersonal relationships/gender relations and found this forum, was researching the art of seduction in particular, it's such a topic that intrigues me. Most of my life, I've spent focused on academics, sports, etc so by the time I thought about seduction/social networking/relationships, I feel like I'm a bit behind so reading such material has helped me learn A LOT. I've read and watched everything from extreme red pill to radical feminism, have concluded that both are trash as they are unempathetic, dehumanizing towards the opposite sex, and don't take in account the nuances of human behavior. I believe most people on this forum share this viewpoint, and I've found this place to be welcoming and encouraging self-improvement for both genders. Most importantly there are more field reports/actual action taking place rather than theories/circlejerking like other seduction spaces which is a nice change.

There is another bi girl on here, @girlchasing and she's young as well, so keep in mind we might have different perspectives than some of you guys, we appreciate that you respect us to contribute to this place. I don't know about her, but I have known I was into women since very early on, unfortunately I do not see myself entering a LTR with one because of homophobic relatives, but I think I will overcome that barrier in time. Interacting with guys I don't really see myself seducing them because they tend to initiate, but reading all this stuff has improved my social awareness and I just think I need to work on socializing with guys and having a few as friends, for girls it's a different story, keep in mind I have pretty much no experience with this so I'm going in headfirst in real life with my only "experience" is reading forums lol.

But enough rambling, onto the field report. I'll share the screenshots of our convo on the private group chat (our txt messages, since snap notifies if you screenshotted the page) We met at work; I'd just finished my shift. I work at the local Publix, just bagging food, pretty boring job, I'm graduating high school in a few months so it's just after school a couple hours to kill some time and more $$ to pay for tuition. I clocked out and took off my work apron, I was just looking around the store to buy protein drinks, chicken, healthy foods, it was Sunday night and I usually do my school lunch shopping which I pack myself the night before the beginning of the week. The outfit which I took a photo of later on was a teal 'sunflower' dress (matches my name, lol) that I've gotten a lot of compliments on. My boss gave me shit before because I wore my work apron on top of outfits instead of the regular old Publix green shirt that I was supposed to wear, usually because I forget to wash the green shirt and put it in the laundry but this was one of the few times I slipped up, lol.

Anyways, was just checking out the aisles for anything I missed, did a detour route around the bread/crackers area, and almost ran into this literal SMOKESHOW. She has a public vsco/social media account, you can see for yourselves, I am not exaggerating when I say she is a fucking supermodel. Tall as hell, long tanned legs, gorgeous hair, I could go on and on about her. I found out later she was Colombian and plays soccer for UVA. Literally my dream girl. Absolute stunner.
Edit: ok, I've deleted her vsco on the public forum as I never told her I would share her social media and this is a violation of her privacy, however, I did share her vsco (basically a social media platform to upload images but it doesn't have likes like ig does) in the priv group chat, and all the guys unanimously agreed that she's freaking gorgeous. You'll just have to take our word for it


I was kinda speechless for a few moments because the customers at my store tend to be older people or children, she appeared to be my age (found out later she was 23 so 5 years older) and a literal dime. Around attractive girls, my legs become jelly, I say the most random shit, and I ALWAYS involuntarily blush, which I fucking hate, hopefully I can learn how to overcome this lol. I don't really remember the beginning of our convo since it was kinda hazy, I think I asked her something stupid like was she looking to purchase crackers and if I could help her as I just clocked out of work, I didn't have my apron on. she asked me which ones I recommended, I forgot what I said because I was just looking up at her, and she's a tall girl, I put her around the 6'0-6'1 mark. I'm fairly tall myself at 5'7/5'7.5 so it's pretty exciting to see a girl taller than me in the wild since I live in a heavily concentrated asian/latin area where everyone is a midget, I usually tower over my petite friends and my asian relatives from my mom's side of the family.

We talked and I was saying the most random things, and I was blushing so hard. However- and this is really important to mention- I kept my frame. I was dying on the inside but outwards projected some semblance of confidence, what really helped was that I thought to myself "pretend this girl is your older sister. Someone you know casually, not some supermodel at the grocery store." I asked her how if she was around this area, we talked for a solid 5-10 mins, got to know a bit about her, when she found out I was still in high school she asked me about which college I was planning to go to in the future. I then asked her what college and this was great because I'm familiar with that school that she goes to (have deleted the name of the institution on my FR, as I'm worried this will incriminate her privacy as well). This is where I may have messed up, I told her "I might transfer there in the future if I can meet girls like you." It was so out of character because I'm not bold and I have practically zero experience with seducing girls because of my militant helicopter parents, I have no 'real life' experience, but she ended up smiling and she gave me her social media info at the end.

We have been talking for the past week, her snap score is pretty high, so she probably talks to a lot of people and is in a social circle, her personality to me came off as super cool and casual and confident, she gives me very cool girl vibes. I have always been more introverted and shyer and into academics so never interacted with the 'cool' people of my high school, but since I had glowup last year physically, grew into my body and read about confidence and frame, things have improved dramatically. However, my mom still berates me and compares my thighs (5'7 130ish lbs) to that of my 15 yr old brother whose 6'3 and 125 lbs, she is one toxic bitch and I can't wait to limit our communication after I graduate. Unfortunately, east Asian culture pressures women to be 50 kg no matter the height, I firmly believe my severe eating disorder which I overcame at least partially six months ago is one of the main reasons I lag behind socially as well which I'm trying to make up for, all that time wasted thinking about food 24/7 and thinking that guys like skeletons. Ironically now in my recovered body I get more attention than I did when I was a stick, yet my mom still thinks I'm sloppy and calls me "curvy" which is basically an insult in our culture. I was so insecure calling me that I literally posted photos from when I was like 14 on a couple other places and asked them to rate my apperance to see if they really prefered skinny girls and confirmed what I thought, so I just wanna to tell my mom to fuck off because she has no idea what men really want. She's still stuck into thinking that men prefer women with bodies like little girls and she keeps triggering me with her stupid comments. Anywaysssss

Getting off topic here, anyways this girl is one of the coolest girls, she comes off as a bit intimidating though, maybe because of her height or her attitude, either way it's extremely exciting for me. I posted a private story on snapchat in a bikini, and swiped up on my story and said "hey ur the girl from publix right" after that we talked for a bit and video called on there, I played it cool and confident, asked her if she was down to call. She's in Tampa for two weeks taking a break from her soccer off season and she said it's great to meet new friends around this area. However, I asked her for some advice about college and stuff and I'm afraid I'm coming off like an inexperienced naive girl, I have asked my friends for feedback and I'm worried she sees me as a clingy little sister or something as i respond to her snapchats right away, in her tiktok bio it shows the pride flag and she showed herself attending multiple pride events on instagram. I know that she's bi as well as I scrolled through her TikTok and she shows herself flirting around with her friends and made a video about making out with her best friends she made a video of her snap friends and who she would kiss if she was black out drunk and there was a tiktok sound voice over "all of them sober." she comemnted with scissoring emojis and then a question mark on one of her comments on TikTok, I believe she's flirted around with me a bit asking what I've done before and my rice purity score to which I truthfully admitted I never did anything with a girl. The thing is I'm not sure if she's bi for like attention or if she's genuinely into girls like I am, but I read a study that 99 percent of girls are fluid so it gives me hope that I can seduce more girls in the future. I snapchatted her in the gym with the caption "glute pump lol" and she commented heart eye emojis which is a good sign and now she's asking me how much I work out a week.

This is coming more off as an advice thread than a field report lol, but anyways, considering we're talking and I'm talking to a literal model and we're setting up plans to meet next week at the beach to hang out, I initiated by saying that this weekend would be a great time to go to there as the weather is heating up here in Florida, and she wrote back "ofc this weekend sounds great when are you free girl." She said that she could bring some of her friends over to come chill and smoke, due to my sheltered upbringing tho I feel like I overcompensated and tried to give her the vibe that I was a "cool" 18 yr old who went to a lot of places and had a lot of friends and knew my way around the area. I don't know if it worked or not especially since I asked her a lot of advice at first but she kind of has caught on to this new vibe, so I have to keep it this way. The thing about her vibe is that she seems really picky about the type of people she talks to, she gives off this sorta arrogant vibe like she knows she's hot which is really fucking hot to me, she also posts snapchat stories about her with a bunch of equally hot friends in the area so she's well socially calibrated and she "knows people." Half the time she snaps me she looks like she's on something or drinking with friends and she mentioned doing coke, she plays a sport (specifics can't go into, just privacy reasons), I don't know if she's a d division athlete or plays just for fun but she sent me videos of her playing which were really nice, and she always is doing something socially with friends in her spare time.


She's always with a group of girls drunk and posting it online. I'm on the school tennis team and I kinda lied and told her I like (her sport) when I actually hate it lol, she asked me what I do in my free time, well other than studying all the time, going to the gym, working, doing seasonal sports, and going on the internet to read stuff (which is really lame behavior) I told her I hung out with some of my friends. Ugh, I need to become more social in college lol. But yeah, getting off the internet is probably gonna help my social skills tremendously, literally half the time I feel like I'm on websites and not living in reality, sometimes the online spheres and reading extreme points of view makes me feel irritated and disillusioned.

So yeah, entry 1 of sunflowagoil hope to keep updating you guys with this and see where it goes. I recently got out of a literal one week relationship with a 29 yr old dude, guy from church, I kinda got weird vibes from him and we didn't sleep together or anything so I'm still a virgin, he just asked me out and I said yeah but it was a week and I ghosted him because he kept asking me where I was and I told him school and he just kept asking, it felt off so I called it off, so now I'm free to talk to other people.

 

[Gaturro]

Hey welcome to the forum and congrats on your first FR!

It's ok to be a bit behind in relationships if you were focused on something else, you'll catch up quickly, and maybe even have an advantage above others because sports and academics are important aspects of your life as well.

Personally I would recommend that you delete the link to the girl's vsco because it's against the rules, and against her privacy in general. This community advocates being discrete, and in this "secret society" we don't kiss and tell

You will overcome getting nervous with practice. After you approach lots of girls, and sleep with many others, it will be easy. You just have to approach and deal with the anxiety until you can feel calm naturally. It seems that you dealt with it pretty well, so congratulations on that

Honestly I liked your bold comment, even if it was a bit direct (being a girl you can get away with it) but it was smooth. You took something from the conversation and connected it naturally to show your intentions, and ended up getting her socials. It's a win to me... (I usually do this when I go for a kiss, for example last time a girl was talking about how she loved her lipstick, how good it smells, etc., so after a while when I isolated her and was ready to kiss her I told her that her lipstick smells good but I wanted to see if it tastes good as well...).

I was going to tell you that you should make plans with her but it seems you already did, and being inexperienced, I would like to ask you a few questions that you should ask yourself first and according to that you could ask for advice on how to proceed...

1. What do you want to do with this girl? Do you want to sleep with her, to just have some fun, to have a greater social circle, all of the above?
2. What are you looking for? A monogamous relationship, devoting your soul to one person? Multiple meaningful relationships? Just fun?
3. What kind of girls do you like? What are your boundaries? What will you accept? What won't you accept?
4. Will you be posting FR with dudes as well?
5. It might help to know about your social circle, your group of friends, etc.

By the way, be careful with the age difference. I know in this forum there are guys who've had experience with even bigger age gaps, but I believe most of us try to "leave them better than we found them". However, outside there are lots of guys that will hurt you and not give a shit about you. Of course this might happen with a younger dude as well, but this can come from inexperience and not in a "manipulative" way. It seems like you got weird vibes from the older dude, so I believe you already understand what I'm talking about, but some guys with more social skills will try to manipulate you with good vibes. I'm not saying don't go for older dudes, but if you do, keep an eye open. That's why you should also ask yourself what you want first. Your age is great to experiment everything, but the least risky it is, the better. Your first relationships will kinda shape your brain and you don't want to end up with unnecessary trauma / bad thoughts.

Something that might help you know what you want and how to proceed is this post from Chase, but at the end of the day, only you know what you want. And even then, you will need a bit of experience to know what you like and what you don't.

EDIT: About looks. Your health goes first, after that, you should think if you want boys to like you, girls to like you (our tastes are a bit different but not that much) or if you want you to like yourself. I guess it will be a bit of the three, and you will like yourself more the more others like you. But be healthy first. Your mom is from another generation, so she won't know what our generation likes. Don't listen to her, and try to become independent as soon as possible.

Congratulations on your first report and I look forward to hearing more from you

 

[sunnygirl]

Hey welcome to the forum and congrats on your first FR!

It's ok to be a bit behind in relationships if you were focused on something else, you'll catch up quickly, and maybe even have an advantage above others because sports and academics are important aspects of your life as well.

Thank you for reassuring me about this, sometimes I feel like I missed out on the crucial time of my life (13-18) to socialize but honestly I can say focusing on my academics/sports paid off because I have options for really good colleges rn and I learned so much discipline. Also, in socialization you are at least somewhat reliant on others, so if they flake/ghost/are mean, it can crush your spirits and demotivate your self esteem. So doing all those internal things, to improve myself, was good.

Personally I would recommend that you delete the link to the girl's vsco because it's against the rules, and against her privacy in general. This community advocates being discrete, and in this "secret society" we don't kiss and tell

Thank you for reminding me, again I'm pretty new to this forum but I absolutely should've checked the rules before posting her vsco, I have since deleted it the link which was up for only 30 mins before I saw your message. : )

Honestly I liked your bold comment

Lol, I shocked myself for going straight for the kill and being direct with her, especially considering at that point I had no idea if she was bi or not, I just totally took myself for surprise by using that flirtatious line. I don't know how to explain it but she gave me very coy/cool/flirtatious energy, sometimes I can tell (but not 100 percent of the time) if a girl is like that, I confirmed later on, it was just my gut instincts.

1. What do you want to do with this girl? Do you want to sleep with her, to just have some fun, to have a greater social circle, all of the above?
2. What are you looking for? A monogamous relationship, devoting your soul to one person? Multiple meaningful relationships? Just fun?
3. What kind of girls do you like? What are your boundaries? What will you accept? What won't you accept?
4. Will you be posting FR with dudes as well?
5. It might help to know about your social circle, your group of friends, etc.

1. I have no idea, I'm a blank slate with these kinds of stuff. She does come off to me as a bit hoeish and like I mentioned earlier she has a new galpal everyday on social media just hanging out everywhere, posting herself taking shots, just popular in general I guess around the area. Maybe it would be good to have a casual experience, to know my sexual likes and dislikes.
2. A LTR would be nice but everyone is so fickle at my age, finding a decently attractive partner my age who shares similar interests who doesn't participate in hookup culture like most of my gen (gen z) is kinda like finding a diamond in the rough. I'm not gonna keep waiting for that special someone to come, but I CAN take a step and be more proactive in my search for it. Socialization, volunteering, work, school, clubs, etc. Half my problems stem from being unironically "chronically online," I just read extreme feminism and redpill stuff online and let it corrupt my world view, I don't want to be bitter like all the men and women I see online. I don't even have any bad experiences with men or women irl but I used to be influenced by this sub called femaledatingstrategy.com and they would call men scrotes and stuff and post about really bad men but I kinda realized that they were doing the EXACT same thing as redpill does. Just cherry pick horrible people from the opposite gender and whine/bitch about them all day. Really horrible stuff, rots your world view about people. Glad I stopped reading that crap, as well as the other side. Both are hypocritical in the sense that they want hvm or hvw but there not exactly high value themselves, lol. This forum is actually full of sane people which I appreciate.
3. Any girl really physically isn't morbidly obese or has some physical defect, I'm into all types of girls. I'm still rather on the thin side (have gained 15 lbs from recovery from when I was 115 lbs) but on my 5'7/5'8 frame I'm still considered slim. I lovee "bigger" girls because they seem so much more inviting and sweet, and more cushion, I feel like angular bone thin girls would be unpleasant to cuddle with. So nothing on the extreme end. But anyways, just someone to get a long with, kind, has some semblance of motivation/ambition in her life as well.
4. Yes, I will.
5. Yeah, hope I explained it well enough, haha.

By the way, be careful with the age difference. It seems like you got weird vibes from the older dude. I'm not saying don't go for older dudes, but if you do, keep an eye open. Your first relationships will kinda shape your brain and you don't want to end up with unnecessary trauma / bad thoughts.

Yeah, thanks, she's a junior in college as she took two gap years in Colombia and she transferred to UVA after being involved in a mission there, it seems like she kinda comes off from a well off family as she went to a private school in Taiwan, she also posts on ig about lucrative places she visits and travels all over the world, so she's international and is very well connected, at first to be completely honest I was intimidated by her "mean" resting face (if you know what I mean) but she is literally so sweet and wanted to get to know about me and my cultural background too. Being half asian (korean and chinese from mom's side) and half white from my dad's side I've always been kinda conflicted about my identity as many mixed people experience, she's mixed as well, colombian and something else, so we talked a lot about that too which was really connective.

Anyways, I will keep your advice about age gaps in mind. Yeah, the 29 year old ended up being very off and I'm glad I just stopped it before it could proceed further, but there are of course manipulative young people as well, just gotta keep look out for toxic traits in general.

 

[sunnygirl]

EDIT: About looks. Your health goes first, after that, you should think if you want boys to like you, girls to like you (our tastes are a bit different but not that much) or if you want you to like yourself. I guess it will be a bit of the three, and you will like yourself more the more others like you. But be healthy first. Your mom is from another generation, so she won't know what our generation likes. Don't listen to her, and try to become independent as soon as possible.

And, Thank you for your kind words, I'm currently seeing a therapist tho for my bdd and I feel like my self esteem is like a bucket with a hole in it, even if I get validation from others (and especially online validation) that I look good the sand is constantly following through as I have no real confidence in myself, especially considering my mom keeps commenting on my body every single day. I feel like in east asian cultures it is normalized to call someone chubby if they stray from the stick thin standard, this is why I eat with my family as I can't stand my mom constantly commenting on what I eat and if I'm gaining weight. She harrasses me for eating more than one portion, eating more than one sweet potato (because think of all those carbs! even tho I'm an athlete and need some carbs and because I'm young too) and she shames me for eating after 6 pm. First of all I gained weight for my health, now I can finally think clearly, my bmi might be 20 now instead of 17 but it is still in the thin/normal range and I'm so sick of hearing her comments on how she misses when I was underweight and looked like a model. I feel pressure to be perfect because I had other people rate my skinny photos on reddit and another forum and ppl told me some really hurtful comments, you can't really win unfortunately in today's society which is why internal validation is so incredibly important. If I decide to go one route or the other I defy the frail east asian beauty standards or the western thicc standards, so literally screw it! I'm focused on being healthy now.

Edit: thank you for your recommendations to go to therapy for my OCD in the chat, it is incredibly insidious as it narrows your world down to ruminating over specific comments and then the intrusive thoughts, its torture and I've lived like this my entire life but it's gotten progressively worse in the past few years. I don't know what medications are good for OCD but anyone recommend anything, I've tried prozac in the past but that's more of an antidepressant than something for OCD.

 

[Teevster]

However, I asked her for some advice about college and stuff and I'm afraid I'm coming off like an inexperienced naive girl, I have asked my friends for feedback and I'm worried she sees me as a clingy little sister or something as i respond to her snapchats right away, in her tiktok bio it shows the pride flag and she showed herself attending multiple pride events on instagram so idk if it's a green flag to proceed or not. I snapchatted her in the gym with the caption "glute pump lol" and she commented heart eye emojis which is a good sign.

Good first attempt. It takes times to grow balls and it is ok to be shaky in the beginning. But understand this: unless this girl is some experienced bi or lesbo girl, you will have to maintain a strong frame and take the leadership role. Many girls are bi-curious (trust me on this one!) but that does not mean they have much (or even any) experience with girls. Thus, if you want to pull a girl like that, you MUST come off as confident and come off as you know what you are doing. You are leading her into your world - that is... trying to get her to explore the beauty of girl-to-girl sex; that is, something she has no past-experience with, and isn't that part of her modus operandi.

This is why you have to lead.

But you CANNOT lead if you come off as overly submissive, shy, and perhaps slightly insecure.

And your age... well fuck that. It is true that being older gives you a slight age, but I started out at 15 (that's 16 years ago) and I still managed to pull some girls and lead the process. And sure, sometimes older women would take the leader-role, but whenever I wanted to get girls to experiment with new stuff (threesomes, anal, BDSM etc) I always had to be the confident "know what i am doing" type of leader, the made her feel at ease, and "allowed" to feel carried away .

Hope this helps.

I don't know if you heard of FlyPUA, but she was a lesbianPUA and actually really skilled (she pulled some nice girls, and she always loved filming it lol). She had a very dominant and confident vibe.

PS: the dynamic with men is different. With men you can play the cute and submissive (they like it). Ditto with experienced lesbian/bi-girls, especially the more masculine ones.

Best,
Teevster

 

[sunnygirl]

unless this girl is some experienced bi or lesbo girl, you will have to maintain the strong frame take the leadership role. Many girls are bi-curious (trust me on this one!) but that does not mean they have much (or even any) experience with girls. Thus, if you want to pull a girl like that, you MUST come off as confident and come off as you know what you are doing.

Thank you so much for giving me insight on how to proceed with a relationship with another woman, I really appreciate it being inexperienced and all. She does come off to be as rather dominant and a bit sly, but I can't be certain, I noticed her interest level in me skyrocketed once I stopped asking her for advice (kind of like when I was in a feminine frame) to when I started talking about my multicultural experiences and knowing my way around the area of tampa, I feel like she took me "seriously" then because I came off as a mature 18 yr old not a naive sheltered one (which I technically am, but I kinda bolstered my "resume" in a sense, haha). I get what guys have to deal with, leading and dominating, but she's also I feel like very experienced, casually mentioning drugs and hookup culture, she seems very worldly.

But you CANNOT lead if you come off as overly submissive, shy, and perhaps slightly insecure.

I've always believed in the phrase that even if confidence is faked, some people don't know the difference, so that has helped me tremendously, I mirrored her vibe and acted kinda cool and sly, I changed my snapchat settings from uppercase to lowercase, stuff like that can actually make a big difference in how you're perceived I think. She's just such a cool girl and older too, totally my type.

PS: the dynamic with men is different. With men you can play the cute and submissive (they like it). Ditto with experienced lesbian/bi-girls, especially the more masculine ones.

I COMPLETELY agree with this statement. With guys I always maintain a feminine frame, honestly it comes naturally to me nowadays, guys will say I give off really cute and sweet vibes, I'm VERY submissive around masculine energy, but as you mentioned this can potentially be a negative when interacting with girls, because who knows if they want to lead or be lead. For this girl it's hard to tell, because she does give me dominant vibes, but when I matched her dominant energy she wanted to talk to me a lot more than when I was asking for advice from her.

 

[Conquistador]

This is where I may have messed up, I told her "I might transfer there in the future if I can meet girls like you."

In this case I wouldn't sweat it since it already happened. She probably thought it was cute.

It was so out of character because I'm not bold and I have practically zero experience with seducing girls because of my militant helicopter parents, I have no 'real life' experience

Welcome to my world

her snap score is pretty high

What's that?

I was so insecure calling me that I literally posted photos from when I was like 14 on a couple other places and asked them to rate my appearance to see if they really preferred skinny girls and confirmed what I thought

Oh that's what that was about. I was really confused

She's still stuck into thinking that men prefer women with bodies like little girls and she keeps triggering me with her stupid comments.

Does your mom herself have a body like a little girl? Lol

I'm afraid I'm coming off like an inexperienced naive girl

Don't bother trying to fool her honestly. She seems to find it hot.

I'm worried she sees me as a clingy little sister or something as i respond to her snapchats right away,

Just don't go too far in the opposite direction.

my rice purity score

I didn't know that was a thing. Thanks!
Wow, mine is embarrassingly high

to which I truthfully admitted I never did anything with a girl.

Honesty is the best policy here.

I'm not sure if she's bi for like attention

I don't know enough to comment but doubtless others do.

she could bring some of her friends over to come chill and smoke

Imho better to

again I'm pretty new to this forum but I absolutely should've checked the rules before posting her vsco, I have since deleted it

Some of this is common sense. I would respectfully suggest that it's generally a very good idea to keep anything remotely identifying to chat and PMs. The

I shocked myself for going straight for the kill and being direct with her, especially considering at that point I had no idea if she was bi or not, I just totally took myself for surprise by using that flirtatious line.

I don't know how to explain it but she gave me very coy/cool/flirtatious energy, sometimes I can tell (but not 100 percent of the time) if a girl is like that, I confirmed later on, it was just my gut instincts.

Trust your intuition.

I kinda lied and told her I like soccer when I actually hate it lol

...

So yeah, entry 1 of sunflowagoil hope to keep updating you guys with this and see where it goes.

Can't wait

a literal one week relationship with a 29 yr old dude, guy from church, I kinda got weird vibes from him and we didn't sleep together or anything so I'm still a virgin, he just asked me out and I said yeah

Whoa lol, u never mentioned that

Half my problems stem from being unironically "chronically online,"

At least you're aware of that lol

2. A LTR would be nice but everyone is so fickle at my age, finding a decently attractive partner my age who shares similar interests who doesn't participate in hookup culture like most of my gen (gen z) is kinda like finding a diamond in the rough.

You're not the first person to have said so.

I used to be influenced by this sub called femaledatingstrategy.com

OMG lol

and they would call men scrotes and stuff and post about really bad men but I kinda realized that they were doing the EXACT same thing as redpill does. Just cherry pick horrible people from the opposite gender and whine/bitch about them all day. Really horrible stuff, rots your world view about people. Glad I stopped reading that crap, as well as the other side. Both are hypocritical in the sense that they want hvm or hvw but there not exactly high value themselves, lol. This forum is actually full of sane people which I appreciate.

Well said.

I lovee "bigger" girls because they seem so much more inviting and sweet, and more cushion, I feel like angular bone thin girls would be unpleasant to cuddle with.

Most men feel the same way. Of course, no one ever tells girls that.

For this girl it's hard to tell, because she does give me dominant vibes, but when I matched her dominant energy she wanted to talk to me a lot more than when I was asking for advice from her.

This is really interesting.

 

[sunnygirl]

Lol, @Surveyor I enjoyed reading your commentary on my posts!

Welcome to my world

For real, glad you can relate, strict parents bring about sneaky kids

Does your mom herself have a body like a little girl? Lol

My mom is 95 lbs at 5'2 and she has always brought up how she was 100 lbs most of her life and back to the number exactly a couple weeks after giving birth to me. Now she is asking me why I, with half my 6'4 big bone structure white dad's genetics, being a solid 5-6 inches taller than her, is not 110 lbs. I got down to that weight a couple years ago and literally felt like I was dying. She is like a broken record, just nagging and screaming in my ears, and when I was younger was the stereotypical asian 'tiger mom' but worse. She projects her eating habits on to me and whenever I weigh myself at a public location (my dad literally smashed my scale last year bcus of everything) I'm in the 125-132 lbs range, which is healthy for my height and age, yet she keeps commenting...

Most men feel the same way. Of course, no one ever tells girls that.

Which is why we develop unhealthy habits and obsess over our weight, causing interference in regular life.

OMG lol

Yea lmao, FDS, the infamous qweeens of reddit. Anyways, I stopped listening to their advice a couple months ago as it caused nothing but bitterness towards the opposite gender, not to mention all their ridiculous standards are projection. These women are 40+ have been single most of their lives and some of them have admitted to being over 300 lbs! I listened to them at first because to be honest they DID seem to have solid advice about vetting out guys who are addicted to porn, junk food, and video games. But then as I continued listening their requirements for their 'high value men' list kept going on...and on...and on. I'm like girls wtf are you on. And I kinda came to the realization that no man would wanna put up with their nasty entitled attitude, the golden pussy syndrome. Another part of me realized that I would never date a girl who follows fds principles. There are some bi women on there as well who listed requirements for the girls they date, I just had a headache.

Anyways, thanks again Surveyor for making observations on my thread, haha.

 

[sunnygirl]

Some of this is common sense. I would respectfully suggest that it's generally a very good idea to keep anything remotely identifying to chat and PMs. The

Agreed, shared in on the chat with no problems but I realize the chat is more private and self deletes while the forum is public and permanent.

Well said.

Most people on this forum share this perspective, and its so much more refreshing.

 

[mist]

It takes times to grow balls

she's a late bloomer that's for sure

 

[sunnygirl]

she's a late bloomer that's for sure

Well, as many ppl have advised me on here...comes with time and practice, seduction/social skills does.

 

[Lucky]

www.fastseduction.com/archives

This might give you a kick start, always helps to have reports you can relate to especially in the beginning.

Look for Hitori and Chess club, pretty sure those were prolific female seducers, in the old community.

 

[sunnygirl]

www.fastseduction.com/archives

This might give you a kick start, always helps to have reports you can relate to especially in the beginning.

Look for Hitori and Chess club, pretty sure those were prolific female seducers, in the old community.

tysm for the recs, are these gals on the forum?

 

[Conquistador]

tysm for the recs, are these gals on the forum?

Not on this one, afaik.

Also check this out:
https://www.tumblr.com/lesbianpickup and old site https://thelesbianpickupartist.wordpress.com/
(FlyePUA, homoflexible pickup artist)

 

[Lofty]

Saw your PM. Rest assured that laying this girl is not only 100% possible, but it is 100% feasible.

And great job on the approach, getting her Snap, and managing the communication so far. I know those little apprehensive vibes may sometimes seep in when doing something so new, but you’ve done a wonderful job to put yourself in a great position to make it happen.

On top of that, props for writing the field report and dedicating yourself to creating the best version of sunflowergirl04 you can. It's a bit unique of course because you're a woman, but I have no doubt that seduction concepts talked about here can help you seduce another woman. Overall, it's definitely an interesting thought exercise.

First off I think it’s important to cover some fundamental things, and then we’ll get into how some discussion regarding how you might go about laying this girl. And I agree with Gaturro as well and he raises important points!

With understanding where you’re at now – an inexperienced virgin which is totally okay – I would highly recommend you adopt the baseline frame of “I am going to gain quality experiences to discover my likes/dislikes, to improve my own skills for present and future benefit, and to create great pleasure/enjoyment in my life.”

So if you do like this girl a lot as you say, then fuck it, hell yeah try to get her in bed and have a quality experience even if it’s not long-term.

There’s going to be plenty of opportunities to have LTRs or whatever you said you wanted down the road. All of these experiences leading up to that will only help you get what you want long term and provide pleasure along the way. If not that, why subject yourself to the torture of NOT having sex but thinking about it often, as most humans naturally do? Instead, why not just have that pleasure yourself right?

In terms of any negative ideas towards “hookup culture” and "hoes," etc - those are largely coming from places of social conditioning which would be best to ironed out (which is totally fine, we’ve all been there in some way).

But these are concepts that we will actually contrast AGAINST as seducers for purposes of sexual framing and reducing Anti-Slut Defense (ASD).

For example, a classically inspired technique to do this could go like:

“Isn’t it so unfair that men are celebrated as ‘players’ if they have lots of sex, but women are denounced as ‘sluts’? To me, I believe that no one should be judged or degraded for having sex because sex is natural like the air we breathe, and in fact it’s only fair if women are not subject to such a cruel double standard that society forces on them, and instead they feel totally allowed to feel the kind of pleasure that they dream of when they close their eyes at night, the kind of pleasure they truly deserve as human beings.”

Now I am not saying to hookup with every chode – what I am saying is to gradually work on ironing out some tribulations towards the ideas of "hoes" and such... which I do see you facing a bit right now based on your notes about "Tinder hoes" and hookup culture. Again, it’s totally fine to be looking for something different, but feeling any sense of slut-shaming, etc, towards other women could lead to a roadblock for yourself down the road if it’s not chipped away at now.

To me, it seems like the ideal for women is low ASD + a high level perception/screening of what brings them pleasure.

So this means you’re screening out chodes and time-wasters, but you're totally comfortable having sex with those who you know can bring you pleasure - the kind of pleasure that is your natural right as a human. Doing so, again, will also help you gain experiences to discover more about yourself and increase the enjoyment of your life now and in the future.

With that, I would also find it advantageous if you familiarized yourself with the concept some may call Female State Control (FSC). This is the phenomenon women have where they may feel the rush of an overwhelming “I just don’t know” kind of sensation that could lead them to have an avoidant ”flight” response towards any sexual escalation. This may be triggered if all the bricks of the seduction/interaction weren’t laid as well as they could’ve been, and the vibe is escalated too quickly. Of course, every girl and context has variation as well.

But I expect you may feel this at some point if you haven’t already, so if you do, remember to take a few deep breaths and think about whether you think the encounter will lead to pleasure for you or not. If you want the person for the pleasure they could bring you and there aren’t tangible risks to it (like personal safety, etc), then it’s well within your right to just go for it and gift yourself a quality experience you can learn from.

Lastly, regarding your notes on Gen Z - yeah, a lot of “Gen Z” and people in general will act like they get laid a lot… but those who get laid a lot aren't the majority. Many have trouble to get sex at all or get locked up in overly convenient relationships. Much of all that and the TikToks about “pulling”… it's really a bunch of smoke and mirrors. But these are dynamics that seducers flip to their advantage!

Now let’s work on getting this girl naked

---

Making This Lay Happen - Things to Consider​

I’m also glad you mentioned that she is in your area for two weeks – I was wondering how long she was going to be there considering school is going on right now and spring break is still a couple weeks away for most schools. Whatever her situation is, what matters is your opportunity to lay her and I’d figure you have enough time then. So we'll assume there's still time, and who knows you may see her again when she's on break or in the summer regardless.

Foremost, for you in this context and to get THIS lay, I see three really pivotal things for you to dial in on here:

• Getting her alone in a place where sex can happen
• Getting on the topic of sexuality/bisexuality/sex/kissing girls/etc
• Escalating to sex

Because she seems openly sexual (especially with girls), experienced with bisexuality, and clearly has interest in you already (see the heart eye emojis and asking you about what you’ve done with girls), these areas come to the forefront and are sensible to discuss in this context as you gain experiemce. Heck, she may even be the one to begin escalating on you. She does sound like the bad bitch type lol

But yeah, let’s get into these three things in more detail.

---

Getting her alone in a place where sex can happen

Once more, she clearly has interest in you and meeting up with you. You’ve done a great job with this. She mentioned bringing her friends over, but honestly they might just make things harder right now – though a female orgy type thing is possible as is pulling her from a group event… but in this context I would say to just focus on how you can get her isolated with you in a setting where sex can happen. She’s very responsive towards you – getting her out alone is a legitimate possibility.

Your social frame as a woman she likes and responds to is very good. In terms of the weed and alcohol, I would personally advise against it because you don't have much experience with them. Obviously you can do what you want with drugs/alcohol otherwise (personally I don't drink or smoke, but some people love them ofc)... though considering you don’t have a lot of experience with being high/drunk - let alone seducing/having sex while high or drunk! - I would say to stay away from the drinking/smoking sesh in this case.

Instead, I would think about how you can get her out alone + pulled to that spot where you can escalate. Here are some questions to think about to get the ball rolling on this:

• Could you bring her over to your room – would your parents/siblings leave you two alone if you did? You said they wouldn’t be happy if you were dating a girl... but like, they probably wouldn’t assume if you bring a female friend over that you’d be having sex lol. So if there will be someone home, could you two be peacefully left alone in your room without a parent knocking on the door checking on you or asking if you want Pizza Bagels?
• Where is she staying? Is she at home? A hotel? Does she stay with people? Could you go hang out at her place?
• If none of those are options, hell, a car is an option. Tough logistics make tough seducers lol.

Having flexibility and adjusting on the fly is key too, but from considering some ideas on where you could isolate her at, we can also think about some possibilities of how we could get her out with you to begin with:

• You could try getting her to come hang out straight to either your place or to hers (again, preferably when she is alone). You can think of something that you can do together which is NOT sex to use as plausible deniability – such as to talk about whatever or just listening to music as basic examples – there’s a million options and you gave a great social frame to work it from as woman she likes
• She was interested in you working out and is an athlete herself – there’s a possibility of going to work out together and then hanging out wherever alone afterwards
• Going to the beach is a possibility, yeah, though it does bring in more variables and wildcard opportunities
• Going for a walk and talk in a scenic area you know about, then isolating her wherever afterwards
• Going to get smoothies, coffee, or whatever (preferably it's a mutual interest) and then isolating her afterwards
• A million other things

But I do think that getting her straight over is a real possibility.

It’s clear you’re already a good texter and your social frame is great, which is a problem most have when trying to pull from text/get her out. If you think of a good plausible deniability with her, you can even seed it through a text as an open loop and then bring it back up later to invite her over/go over to her place. That’s a good technique to use for pulling, generally speaking. But if you feel a bit of that tension over Snap where you feel her compliance is high (like she will say yes), you can also just go for it.

It’s variable and intuitive, but these are some things to think about to get her isolated.

---

Getting on the topic of sexuality/bisexuality/sex/kissing girls/etc

Getting onto seduction-oriented topics (SOTs) during the interaction will be key. Just doing this will get a lot of the work done for you because she will want to talk about these things – if she doesn’t initiate them herself already. These will further set sexual frames and escalate the vibe towards sex.

Naturally, these topics can be discussed while you do whatever with her if she doesn’t come straight over, but once she’s isolated, it’s good to bring them back up again to get things going in an efficient direction.

Two methods you could use to introduce/reintroduce these topics this in a very calibrated, social frame-friendly way is to bring up the following:

• Recall how she asked about your experience with girls
  • Ex: “Hey, you know how you asked me about what I’ve done with girls before?”
• Mention the flag in her TikTok bio
  • Ex: “Hey, so you know how you have a flag in your bio right?” – assuming she's aware you know of her TikTok? If she isn't aware you know about it, the angle could just be adjusted like, “Sooo I saw your TikTok and noticed the flag in your bio" OR how you noticed the X video of her talking about girls/kissing girls, etc.

These will get you right onto SOTs conducive to sex that she is also interested in talking about. What you’re doing with this is just setting the sexual frames for either you to escalate on her, or for her to escalate on you, which would also be likely in this context.

It's not like it’s always best to repeat the verbal structures I'll use as examples word for word, but here are some themes which could be conducive for you. You’re very intelligent and I have no doubt you could flow with these and dig deep with her on these and others. Also note that eliciting her throughout and really focusing on where she’s at will be highly beneficial. Note the frames these kind of things are setting as well - for instance they also set Us vs. Them/"Othering" frames, too.

Examples of verbal themes for sexual framing and escalating the vibe​

Spoiler: Praising her for her open mindedness in a world where so many are closed minded

Praising her for her open mindedness in a world where so many are closed minded

Ex: “You know, I find it very inspiring how confident and open minded you are in a society that places so many pressures on women… it’s like everyone wants to box us into neat little labels when each person is so much more than that. It's like we should feel free to break the chains of society and be ourselves – the kind of people we want to be right? I’ve noticed that you really are able to do just that and unapologetically march to the beat of your own drum and be who you want to be without giving a fuck about what dumb people may think. To be honest, from the moment I met you I could tell that you were different, like the kind of special and unique woman who really lives in the moment and lives your life to the fullest, and that’s such a rare thing for someone to have.”

• Now it’s important to note that what we’re doing here is setting frames and feeding her ego to make her more
  impressionable. It doesn’t matter if any of these or true or not or anyone’s personal opinions on LGBTQ+ or whatnot – what matters is the pleasure of laying her and the pleasure of the process to do so.

Spoiler: Being interested in “learning more” about LGBTQ+/bisexuality/”what it’s like with women, etc.

Being interested in “learning more” about LGBTQ+/bisexuality/”what it’s like with women, etc.

Ex: "Hey, do you remember when you were really learning about what you liked, didn’t like, and discovering sides of yourself that you didn’t even know existed? Yeah, I’m kinda feeling like I’m at that stage where… like… maybe I don’t only like guys… and maybe the thought of being with a girl I really like kinda excites me. Like maybe I’m curious about what a bad bitch’s lips feel like on mine of what it would be like to feel her… or for her to feel me… I don’t know it’s just something I think about sometimes as I grow as a woman you know? So given that you’re so in touch with yourself with liking girls too and everything, could you tell me more about what it’s like and how you came to the wonderful place you’re at now with everything?”

• Obviously this could be a topic that could lead her into escalating
• Have noticed that openly bisexual women may really love to teach other women about it, so this “teaching and learning” frame could be something that she totally eats up

Spoiler: Your Conservative Upbring/Sexual Repression

Your Conservative Upbring/Sexual Repression

Ex: “Have you ever had that feeling where it feels like you’re trapped in a cage by your parents, and it’s like they only want you to be a certain way when you want to be so much more than the box they put you in? Yeah… my parents are very conservative and they want me to be this perfect little Korean girl who THEY want me to be… not who I want to be... like I just want to be sunflowergirl04… so while I love my parents, you’ve really reminded me that it should be a priority for us to be our own person who does the things we want to without second guessing ourselves you know?”

• Can expand this to sexual themes and their expectations for your relationships how you may have an interest in women but they’re so conservative, etc.

Spoiler: The excitement of her worldwide adventures/college experiences

The excitement of her worldwide adventures/college experiences

Ex: “I remember you mentioning that you do such cool things in school and really live your life to the fullest… if you could name like the three most fun and crazy things you’ve done through your adventures and college experiences, what would they be?”

• Elicit these and praise her for behaviors related to sex

Spoiler: Dominance/submission (also considering how you’ve said you’re excited by being submissive, and how she gives off a dominant vibe that excites you, etc)

Dominance/submission (also considering how you’ve said you’re excited by being submissive, and how she gives off a dominant vibe that excites you, etc)

Ex: “Hey… I feel like I can really trust you with this… like you know about dominance, submission, and BDSM and stuff right? Yeah… well, honestly it’s something that my friends don’t talk about but… do you find it kinda exiting too? It’s like I wonder what it would feel like to fully dedicate myself to pleasuring another woman the best I possibly can… to be her good little obedient submissive girl and do whatever she says so we both could both feel sooooo goooood… like I wonder what it would feel like to look up at her while I’m pleasuring her, gently licking my tongue all over her body… gently licking and kissing wherever she tells me too, all the way from her neck to her nipples to her pussy… and looking up and seeing her eyes roll back while she tells me “good girl”… do you like that kind of stuff? Or maybe even having a bad bitch do that for me too… or doing it for each other…”

• Million different ways you can go with this and obviously it’s arousal tech on top of the sexual framing

Alright so you see where those kind of things are going. Can expand on them in so many different ways – thinking you get the point. And it’s also important to frame them in ways that make sense with the interaction and how you’ve been acting throughout. Calibrating these kinds of themes to you and her is the place to go with it.

Once you get more experienced you could be lethal with more getting deeper into sexual prizing and stuff too, though seduction is built as a process so best to view it from that frame as you gain empiricism and build your reference points/skills.

---

Escalating to sex

She may escalate herself when isolated and talking about sexual topics. Maybe she’ll ask if you want to know what it’s like to kiss a girl or be with a girl. Maybe she would get really physical. Tons of variables involved. And this escalating can also be happening as you’re talking about those sexual frames, obviously.

If she does escalate on you when you’re isolated, of course go for it and you could really emphasize on the frame of "learning what it's like" as you already told her you didn't have any experience - again she seems like the bisexual type who likes teaching other women about bisexuality, as she is experienced with women and yeah she seems excited by thought of teaching you about it. Note that you’d be the one who is really guiding the interaction "behind the scenes" as in this case you’re basically seduce her to escalating on you.

If you can tell she’s about ready to be escalated on, which takes experience to feel out – but maybe there’s a lot of tension in the eye contact between you and it’s liminal – here are a couple ways you could initiate the physical escalation (the vibe itself should already be escalated – like there should be sexual tension):

• Due to the frame of the entire interaction, you could literally ask/tell her to “show you what it’s like to kiss a girl”
• Fractionate your touching of her and gradually escalate

But it will be highly dependent on the context and where she’s at, so it's important to calibrate to the moment. It takes experience to nail down the escalation, but reading her, focusing on her, and responding to her is key.

---

Wrap-Up And Final Thoughts

Know that was a lot but wanted to provide you with a resource to reflect on and refer to for this girl and beyond. I overviewed things a bit in terms of the structure here because of this unique situation – for a comprehensive view of transition phases I recommend this article and also this one generally (it's a primer on Gunwitch's 3 keys - social frame, emotional stimulation, and sexual arousal).

About privacy – yeah, be very careful with names, pictures, and any personal details of yourself or those you interact with. In public and in private chats alike because there are absolutely great people around… but there are also creeps and weirdos. Generally it’s good practice to always err on the side of caution with it. To the degree of caution is a personal decision – personally I’m on the very cautious side and it’s paid off to be honest. Just some advice!

In terms of your health – definitely keep working out and eating in the ways that keep you healthy and feeling well. Your mom is just coming from her frame of mind and it’s difficult for her to see anything else. But when you get in a high-quality relationship with the skills you’re working on here, she probably won’t have much to say if she likes the guy too – hopefully that mends things between you both.

It's also possible that getting consistent sex/the kind of relationship you want could help you with what you’re seeing the therapist for too. Sometimes mainstream therapists can just kinda reinforce the issue without resolving the underlying factors it seems (disclaimer: not "professional medical advice" lol - but speaking from experiences I've seen with others). I additionally recommend checking out things like cognitive behavioral therapy (CBT) and body oriented therapies like trauma release exercises (TRE) as well - both have had a variety of benefits for myself and others on the forum.

But yeah you mentioning the therapist reminded me of my own experiences with women. One of my girls was seeing a therapist before I met her, and shortly after meeting me she stopped going to the therapist and later sent me this message as I described in my journal:

Her sexual world has been revolutionized while I’ve gained lots of valuable experience. More than that, though, lots of strides have been gained in long-term compliance building. She’s completely and gleefully obedient inside and outside of the bedroom. A happy learner to my direction. It’s reached this level because of the effort I put into understanding her desired identities and narratives, and how I’ve really worked at bringing us to those dreams. I put a lot of work into building her up to make her life sparkle with or without me, but of course, she ties everything back to me as her trusted, guiding hand.

Here's a message she sent to me:

“When we first started talking, I wasn’t feeling so good about myself or what I’m doing with my life or the friends I have. I was honestly kinda depressed at that time and I was still seeing a therapist, but now not only am I not depressed but I feel much much more happy about my life. I feel more confident, I feel more opened, I have friends who I actually enjoy spending time with and I feel like I can do soo much more.”

Those are all some of the things that I’ve worked on with her. I swear reading this message was one of the happiest moments in my life. I’m a big believer in Machiavellianism for mutual benefit and all my work paid off – our relationship is awesome, and I’ve changed the trajectory of her life in a positive way. Wow, my heart feels so warm

Now she’s a very happy girl

And I'm not saying that for reasons other than that with a good seduction, it tends to, generally speaking, mutualistically work out where you’re able to have an intense experience with her, and she has a really intense experience with you. For the wonderful girl I mentioned here, there seems to be a kind of therapeutic aspect to everything that's helped her a lot so yeah. It's part of the reason why good game and seducing women to sex is not exploitative in nefarious ways – it’s really working in the way that you’re able to influence her to an intense experience she wouldn’t have had otherwise.

So yeah, keep working on putting yourself in great positions to have the kind of sex life you want, and I think you’ll find yourself very happy with the results.

Hope this helps and wishing you the best on everything!

 

[PaulieFlyn10]

www.fastseduction.com/archives

This might give you a kick start, always helps to have reports you can relate to especially in the beginning.

Look for Hitori and Chess club, pretty sure those were prolific female seducers, in the old community.

Bro the pdf links for the archives don't work for me. Were you able to get them?

 

[PaulieFlyn10]

Saw your PM. Rest assured that laying this girl is not only 100% possible, but it is 100% feasible.

And great job on the approach, getting her Snap, and managing the communication so far. I know those little apprehensive vibes may sometimes seep in when doing something so new, but you’ve done a wonderful job to put yourself in a great position to make it happen.

On top of that, props for writing the field report and dedicating yourself to creating the best version of sunflowergirl04 you can. It's a bit unique of course because you're a woman, but I have no doubt that seduction concepts talked about here can help you seduce another woman. Overall, it's definitely an interesting thought exercise.

First off I think it’s important to cover some fundamental things, and then we’ll get into how some discussion regarding how you might go about laying this girl. And I agree with Gaturro as well and he raises important points!

With understanding where you’re at now – an inexperienced virgin which is totally okay – I would highly recommend you adopt the baseline frame of “I am going to gain quality experiences to discover my likes/dislikes, to improve my own skills for present and future benefit, and to create great pleasure/enjoyment in my life.”

So if you do like this girl a lot as you say, then fuck it, hell yeah try to get her in bed and have a quality experience even if it’s not long-term.

There’s going to be plenty of opportunities to have LTRs or whatever you said you wanted down the road. All of these experiences leading up to that will only help you get what you want long term and provide pleasure along the way. If not that, why subject yourself to the torture of NOT having sex but thinking about it often, as most humans naturally do? Instead, why not just have that pleasure yourself right?

In terms of any negative ideas towards “hookup culture” and "hoes," etc - those are largely coming from places of social conditioning which would be best to ironed out (which is totally fine, we’ve all been there in some way).

But these are concepts that we will actually contrast AGAINST as seducers for purposes of sexual framing and reducing Anti-Slut Defense (ASD).

For example, a classically inspired technique to do this could go like:

“Isn’t it so unfair that men are celebrated as ‘players’ if they have lots of sex, but women are denounced as ‘sluts’? To me, I believe that no one should be judged or degraded for having sex because sex is natural like the air we breathe, and in fact it’s only fair if women are not subject to such a cruel double standard that society forces on them, and instead they feel totally allowed to feel the kind of pleasure that they dream of when they close their eyes at night, the kind of pleasure they truly deserve as human beings.”

Now I am not saying to hookup with every chode – what I am saying is to gradually work on ironing out some tribulations towards the ideas of "hoes" and such... which I do see you facing a bit right now based on your notes about "Tinder hoes" and hookup culture. Again, it’s totally fine to be looking for something different, but feeling any sense of slut-shaming, etc, towards other women could lead to a roadblock for yourself down the road if it’s not chipped away at now.

To me, it seems like the ideal for women is low ASD + a high level perception/screening of what brings them pleasure.

So this means you’re screening out chodes and time-wasters, but you're totally comfortable having sex with those who you know can bring you pleasure - the kind of pleasure that is your natural right as a human. Doing so, again, will also help you gain experiences to discover more about yourself and increase the enjoyment of your life now and in the future.

With that, I would also find it advantageous if you familiarized yourself with the concept some may call Female State Control (FSC). This is the phenomenon women have where they may feel the rush of an overwhelming “I just don’t know” kind of sensation that could lead them to have an avoidant ”flight” response towards any sexual escalation. This may be triggered if all the bricks of the seduction/interaction weren’t laid as well as they could’ve been, and the vibe is escalated too quickly. Of course, every girl and context has variation as well.

But I expect you may feel this at some point if you haven’t already, so if you do, remember to take a few deep breaths and think about whether you think the encounter will lead to pleasure for you or not. If you want the person for the pleasure they could bring you and there aren’t tangible risks to it (like personal safety, etc), then it’s well within your right to just go for it and gift yourself a quality experience you can learn from.

Lastly, regarding your notes on Gen Z - yeah, a lot of “Gen Z” and people in general will act like they get laid a lot… but those who get laid a lot aren't the majority. Many have trouble to get sex at all or get locked up in overly convenient relationships. Much of all that and the TikToks about “pulling”… it's really a bunch of smoke and mirrors. But these are things dynamics that seducers flip to their advantage!

Now let’s work on getting this girl naked

---

Making This Lay Happen - Things to Consider​

I’m also glad you mentioned that she is in your area for two weeks – I was wondering how long she was going to be there considering school is going on right now and spring break is still a couple weeks away for most schools. Whatever her situation is, what matters is your opportunity to lay her and I’d figure you have enough time then. So we'll assume there's still time, and who knows you may see her again when she's on break or in the summer regardless.

Foremost, for you in this context and to get THIS lay, I see three really pivotal things for you to dial in on here:

• Getting her alone in a place where sex can happen
• Getting on the topic of sexuality/bisexuality/sex/kissing girls/etc
• Escalating to sex

Because she seems openly sexual (especially with girls), experienced with bisexuality, and clearly has interest in you already (see the heart eye emojis and asking you about what you’ve done with girls), these areas come to the forefront and are sensible to discuss in this context as you gain experiemce. Heck, she may even be the one to begin escalating on you. She does sound like the bad bitch type lol

But yeah, let’s get into these three things in more detail.

---

Getting her alone in a place where sex can happen

Once more, she clearly has interest in you and meeting up with you. You’ve done a great job with this. She mentioned bringing her friends over, but honestly they might just make things harder right now – though a female orgy type thing is possible as is pulling her from a group event… but in this context I would say to just focus on how you can get her isolated with you in a setting where sex can happen. She’s very responsive towards you – getting her out alone is a legitimate possibility.

Your social frame as a woman she likes and responds to is very good. In terms of the weed and alcohol, I would personally advise against it because you don't have much experience with them. Obviously you can do what you want with drugs/alcohol otherwise (personally I don't drink or smoke, but some people love them ofc)... though considering you don’t have a lot of experience with being high/drunk - let alone seducing/having sex while high or drunk! - I would say to stay away from the drinking/smoking sesh in this case.

Instead, I would think about how you can get her out alone + pulled to that spot where you can escalate. Here are some questions to think about to get the ball rolling on this:

• Could you bring her over to your room – would your parents/siblings leave you two alone if you did? You said they wouldn’t be happy if you were dating a girl... but like, they probably wouldn’t assume if you bring a female friend over that you’d be having sex lol. So if there will be someone home, could you two be peacefully left alone in your room without a parent knocking on the door checking on you or asking if you want Pizza Bagels?
• Where is she staying? Is she at home? A hotel? Does she stay with people? Could you go hang out at her place?
• If none of those are options, hell, a car is an option. Tough logistics make tough seducers lol.

Having flexibility and adjusting on the fly is key too, but from considering some ideas on where you could isolate her at, we can also think about some possibilities of how we could get her out with you to begin with:

• You could try getting her to come hang out straight to either your place or to hers (again, preferably when she is alone). You can think of something that you can do together which is NOT sex to use as plausible deniability – such as to talk about whatever or just listening to music as basic examples – there’s a million options and you gave a great social frame to work it from as woman she likes
• She was interested in you working out and is an athlete herself – there’s a possibility of going to work out together and then hanging out wherever alone afterwards
• Going to the beach is a possibility, yeah, though it does bring in more variables and wildcard opportunities
• Going for a walk and talk in a scenic area you know about, then isolating her wherever afterwards
• Going to get smoothies, coffee, or whatever (preferably it's a mutual interest) and then isolating her afterwards
• A million other things

But I do think that getting her straight over is a real possibility.

It’s clear you’re already a good texter and your social frame is great, which is a problem most have when trying to pull from text/get her out. If you think of a good plausible deniability with her, you can even seed it through a text as an open loop and then bring it back up later to invite her over/go over to her place. That’s a good technique to use for pulling, generally speaking. But if you feel a bit of that tension over Snap where you feel her compliance is high (like she will say yes), you can also just go for it.

It’s variable and intuitive, but these are some things to think about to get her isolated.

---

Getting on the topic of sexuality/bisexuality/sex/kissing girls/etc

Getting onto seduction-oriented topics (SOTs) during the interaction will be key. Just doing this will get a lot of the work done for you because she will want to talk about these things – if she doesn’t initiate them herself already. These will further set sexual frames and escalate the vibe towards sex.

Naturally, these topics can be discussed while you do whatever with her if she doesn’t come straight over, but once she’s isolated, it’s good to bring them back up again to get things going in an efficient direction.

Two methods you could use to introduce/reintroduce these topics this in a very calibrated, social frame-friendly way is to bring up the following:

• Recall how she asked about your experience with girls
  • Ex: “Hey, you know how you asked me about what I’ve done with girls before?”
• Mention the flag in her TikTok bio
  • Ex: “Hey, so you know how you have a flag in your bio right?” – assuming she's aware you know of her TikTok? If she isn't aware you know about it, the angle could just be adjusted like, “Sooo I saw your TikTok and noticed the flag in your bio" OR how you noticed the X video of her talking about girls/kissing girls, etc.

These will get you right onto SOTs conducive to sex that she is also interested in talking about. What you’re doing with this is just setting the sexual frames for either you to escalate on her, or for her to escalate on you, which would also be likely in this context.

It's not like it’s always best to repeat the verbal structures I'll use as examples word for word, but here are some themes which could be conducive for you. You’re very intelligent and I have no doubt you could flow with these and dig deep with her on these and others. Also note that eliciting her throughout and really focusing on where she’s at will be highly beneficial. Note the frames these kind of things are setting as well - for instance they also set Us vs. Them/"Othering" frames, too.

Examples of verbal themes for sexual framing and escalating the vibe​

Spoiler: Praising her for her open mindedness in a world where so many are closed minded

Praising her for her open mindedness in a world where so many are closed minded

Ex: “You know, I find it very inspiring how confident and open minded you are in a society that places so many pressures on women… it’s like everyone wants to box us into neat little labels when each person is so much more than that. It's like we should feel free to break the chains of society and be ourselves – the kind of people we want to be right? I’ve noticed that you really are able to do just that and unapologetically march to the beat of your own drum and be who you want to be without giving a fuck about what dumb people may think. To be honest, from the moment I met you I could tell that you were different, like the kind of special and unique woman who really lives in the moment and lives your life to the fullest, and that’s such a rare thing for someone to have.”

• Now it’s important to note that what we’re doing here is setting frames and feeding her ego to make her more
  impressionable. It doesn’t matter if any of these or true or not or anyone’s personal opinions on LGBTQ+ or whatnot – what matters is the pleasure of laying her and the pleasure of the process to do so.

Spoiler: Being interested in “learning more” about LGBTQ+/bisexuality/”what it’s like with women, etc.

Being interested in “learning more” about LGBTQ+/bisexuality/”what it’s like with women, etc.

Ex: "Hey, do you remember when you were really learning about what you liked, didn’t like, and discovering sides of yourself that you didn’t even know existed? Yeah, I’m kinda feeling like I’m at that stage where… like… maybe I don’t only like guys… and maybe the thought of being with a girl I really like kinda excites me. Like maybe I’m curious about what a bad bitch’s lips feel like on mine of what it would be like to feel her… or for her to feel me… I don’t know it’s just something I think about sometimes as I grow as a woman you know? So given that you’re so in touch with yourself with liking girls too and everything, could you tell me more about what it’s like and how you came to the wonderful place you’re at now with everything?”

• Obviously this could be a topic that could lead her into escalating
• Have noticed that openly bisexual women may really love to teach other women about it, so this “teaching and learning” frame could be something that she totally eats up

Spoiler: Your Conservative Upbring/Sexual Repression

Your Conservative Upbring/Sexual Repression

Ex: “Have you ever had that feeling where it feels like you’re trapped in a cage by your parents, and it’s like they only want you to be a certain way when you want to be so much more than the box they put you in? Yeah… my parents are very conservative and they want me to be this perfect little Korean girl who THEY want me to be… not who I want to be... like I just want to be sunflowergirl04… so while I love my parents, you’ve really reminded me that it’s should be a priority for us to be our own person who does the things we want to without second guessing ourselves you know?”

• Can expand this to sexual themes and their expectations for your relationships how you may have an interest in women but they’re so conservative, etc.

Spoiler: The excitement of her worldwide adventures/college experiences

The excitement of her worldwide adventures/college experiences

Ex: “I remember you mentioning that you do such cool things in school and really live your life to the fullest… if you could name like the three most fun and crazy things you’ve done through your adventures and college experiences, what would they be?”

• Elicit these and praise her for behaviors related to sex

Spoiler: Dominance/submission (also considering how you’ve said you’re excited by being submissive, and how she gives off a dominant vibe that excites you, etc)

Dominance/submission (also considering how you’ve said you’re excited by being submissive, and how she gives off a dominant vibe that excites you, etc)

Ex: “Hey… I feel like I can really trust you with this… like you know about dominance, submission, and BDSM and stuff right? Yeah… well, honestly it’s something that my friends don’t talk about but… do you find it kinda exiting too? It’s like I wonder what it would feel like to fully dedicate myself to pleasuring another woman the best I possibly can… to be her good little obedient submissive girl and do whatever she says so we both could both feel sooooo goooood… like I wonder what it would feel like to look up at her while I’m pleasuring her, gently licking my tongue all over her body… gently licking and kissing wherever she tells me too, all the way from her neck to her nipples to her pussy… and looking up and seeing her eyes roll back while she tells me “good girl”… do you like that kind of stuff? Or maybe even having a bad bitch do that for me too… or doing it for each other…”

• Million different ways you can go with this and obviously it’s arousal tech on top of the sexual framing

Alright so you see where those kind of things are going. Can expand on them in so many different ways – thinking you get the point. And it’s also important to frame them in ways that make sense with the interaction and how you’ve been acting throughout. Calibrating these kinds of themes to you and her is the place to go with it.

Once you get more experienced you could be lethal with more getting deeper into sexual prizing and stuff too, though seduction is built as a process so best to view it from that frame as you gain empiricism and build your reference points/skills.

---

Escalating to sex

She may escalate herself when isolated and talking about sexual topics. Maybe she’ll ask if you want to know what it’s like to kiss a girl or be with a girl. Maybe she would get really physical. Tons of variables involved. And this escalating can also be happening as you’re talking about those sexual frames, obviously.

If she does escalate on you when you’re isolated, of course go for it and you could really emphasize on the frame of "learning what it's like" as you already told her you didn't have any experience - again she seems like the bisexual type who likes teaching other women about bisexuality, as she is experienced with women and yeah she seems excited by thought of teaching you about it. Note that you’d be the one who is really guiding the interaction "behind the scenes" as in this case you’re basically seduce her to escalating on you.

If you can tell she’s about ready to be escalated on, which takes experience to feel out – but maybe there’s a lot of tension in the eye contact between you and it’s liminal – here are a couple ways you could initiate the physical escalation (the vibe itself should already be escalated – like there should be sexual tension):

• Due to the frame of the entire interaction, you could literally ask/tell her to “show you what it’s like to kiss a girl”
• Fractionate your touching of her and gradually escalate

But it will be highly dependent on the context and where she’s at, so it's important to calibrate to the moment. It takes experience to nail down the escalation, but reading her, focusing on her, and responding to her is key.

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Wrap-Up And Final Thoughts

Know that was a lot but wanted to provide you with a resource to reflect on and refer to for this girl and beyond. I overviewed things a bit in terms of the structure here because of this unique situation – for a comprehensive view of transition phases I recommend this article and also this one generally (it's a primer on Gunwitch's 3 keys - social frame, emotional stimulation, and sexual arousal).

About privacy – yeah, be very careful with names, pictures, and any personal details of yourself or those you interact with. In public and in private chats alike because there are absolutely great people around… but there are also creeps and weirdos. Generally it’s good practice to always err on the side of caution with it. To the degree of caution is a personal decision – personally I’m on the very cautious side and it’s paid off to be honest. Just some advice!

In terms of your health – definitely keep working out and eating in the ways that keep you healthy and feeling well. Your mom is just coming from her frame of mind and it’s difficult for her to see anything else. But when you get in a high-quality relationship with the skills you’re working on here, she probably won’t have much to say if she likes the guy too – hopefully that mends things between you both.

It's also possible that getting consistent sex/the kind of relationship you want could help you with what you’re seeing the therapist for too. Sometimes mainstream therapists can just kinda reinforce the issue without resolving the underlying factors it seems (disclaimer: not "professional medical advice" lol - but speaking from experiences I've seen with others). I additionally recommend checking out things like cognitive behavioral therapy (CBT) and body oriented therapies like trauma release exercises (TRE) as well - both have had a variety of benefits for myself and others on the forum.

But yeah you mentioning the therapist reminded me of my own experiences with women. One of my girls was seeing a therapist before I met her, and shortly after meeting me she stopped going to the therapist and later sent me this message as I described in my journal:



Now she’s a very happy girl

And I'm not saying that for reasons other than that with a good seduction, it tends to, generally speaking, mutualistically work out where you’re able to have an intense experience with her, and she has a really intense experience with you. For the wonderful girl I mentioned here, there seems to be a kind of therapeutic aspect to everything that's helped her a lot so yeah. It's part of the reason why good game and seducing women to sex is not exploitative in nefarious ways – it’s really working in the way that you’re able to influence her to an intense experience she wouldn’t have had otherwise.

So yeah, keep working on putting yourself in great positions to have the kind of sex life you want, and I think you’ll find yourself very happy with the results.

Hope this helps and wishing you the best on everything!

Almost didn't want to open this thread but this is a very detailed response. Can even apply it for male PUAs

 

[Lucky]

Bro the pdf links for the archives don't work for me. Were you able to get them?

Cheers for pointing this out, don't know why those links are out...
http://web.archive.org/web/20130817122905/http://www.fastseduction.com/archives/
Useful info on those archives only thing which could stop you is a passcode which is in the download

just in case it's

fastseduction.com

Also found this second link as a bonus
Fastseduction player guide
Haven't looked into it too much but if it clashes with Girls chase (GC), to set the record straight, I'd bet on the GC school of thought over it, the individuals here made leaps in what was considered possible back then

eg Alek's sex talk/ sexual prizing theory went against the general consensus on what they believed was possible, and now its advanced tech
see This article
for more context

tysm for the recs, are these gals on the forum?

Pretty sure those girls aren't on here, to my knowledge most of those folks are retired/ no longer posting but that's something the GC staff would know more about (most of them made their start there on that board)

I'm still pretty green to this gig and found these archives when they were posted earlier.

Saw your PM. Rest assured that laying this girl is not only 100% possible, but it is 100% feasible.

And great job on the approach, getting her Snap, and managing the communication so far. I know those little apprehensive vibes may sometimes seep in when doing something so new, but you’ve done a wonderful job to put yourself in a great position to make it happen.

On top of that, props for writing the field report and dedicating yourself to creating the best version of sunflowergirl04 you can. It's a bit unique of course because you're a woman, but I have no doubt that seduction concepts talked about here can help you seduce another woman. Overall, it's definitely an interesting thought exercise.

First off I think it’s important to cover some fundamental things, and then we’ll get into how some discussion regarding how you might go about laying this girl. And I agree with Gaturro as well and he raises important points!

With understanding where you’re at now – an inexperienced virgin which is totally okay – I would highly recommend you adopt the baseline frame of “I am going to gain quality experiences to discover my likes/dislikes, to improve my own skills for present and future benefit, and to create great pleasure/enjoyment in my life.”

So if you do like this girl a lot as you say, then fuck it, hell yeah try to get her in bed and have a quality experience even if it’s not long-term.

There’s going to be plenty of opportunities to have LTRs or whatever you said you wanted down the road. All of these experiences leading up to that will only help you get what you want long term and provide pleasure along the way. If not that, why subject yourself to the torture of NOT having sex but thinking about it often, as most humans naturally do? Instead, why not just have that pleasure yourself right?

In terms of any negative ideas towards “hookup culture” and "hoes," etc - those are largely coming from places of social conditioning which would be best to ironed out (which is totally fine, we’ve all been there in some way).

But these are concepts that we will actually contrast AGAINST as seducers for purposes of sexual framing and reducing Anti-Slut Defense (ASD).

For example, a classically inspired technique to do this could go like:

“Isn’t it so unfair that men are celebrated as ‘players’ if they have lots of sex, but women are denounced as ‘sluts’? To me, I believe that no one should be judged or degraded for having sex because sex is natural like the air we breathe, and in fact it’s only fair if women are not subject to such a cruel double standard that society forces on them, and instead they feel totally allowed to feel the kind of pleasure that they dream of when they close their eyes at night, the kind of pleasure they truly deserve as human beings.”

Now I am not saying to hookup with every chode – what I am saying is to gradually work on ironing out some tribulations towards the ideas of "hoes" and such... which I do see you facing a bit right now based on your notes about "Tinder hoes" and hookup culture. Again, it’s totally fine to be looking for something different, but feeling any sense of slut-shaming, etc, towards other women could lead to a roadblock for yourself down the road if it’s not chipped away at now.

To me, it seems like the ideal for women is low ASD + a high level perception/screening of what brings them pleasure.

So this means you’re screening out chodes and time-wasters, but you're totally comfortable having sex with those who you know can bring you pleasure - the kind of pleasure that is your natural right as a human. Doing so, again, will also help you gain experiences to discover more about yourself and increase the enjoyment of your life now and in the future.

With that, I would also find it advantageous if you familiarized yourself with the concept some may call Female State Control (FSC). This is the phenomenon women have where they may feel the rush of an overwhelming “I just don’t know” kind of sensation that could lead them to have an avoidant ”flight” response towards any sexual escalation. This may be triggered if all the bricks of the seduction/interaction weren’t laid as well as they could’ve been, and the vibe is escalated too quickly. Of course, every girl and context has variation as well.

But I expect you may feel this at some point if you haven’t already, so if you do, remember to take a few deep breaths and think about whether you think the encounter will lead to pleasure for you or not. If you want the person for the pleasure they could bring you and there aren’t tangible risks to it (like personal safety, etc), then it’s well within your right to just go for it and gift yourself a quality experience you can learn from.

Lastly, regarding your notes on Gen Z - yeah, a lot of “Gen Z” and people in general will act like they get laid a lot… but those who get laid a lot aren't the majority. Many have trouble to get sex at all or get locked up in overly convenient relationships. Much of all that and the TikToks about “pulling”… it's really a bunch of smoke and mirrors. But these are things dynamics that seducers flip to their advantage!

Now let’s work on getting this girl naked

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Making This Lay Happen - Things to Consider​

I’m also glad you mentioned that she is in your area for two weeks – I was wondering how long she was going to be there considering school is going on right now and spring break is still a couple weeks away for most schools. Whatever her situation is, what matters is your opportunity to lay her and I’d figure you have enough time then. So we'll assume there's still time, and who knows you may see her again when she's on break or in the summer regardless.

Foremost, for you in this context and to get THIS lay, I see three really pivotal things for you to dial in on here:

• Getting her alone in a place where sex can happen
• Getting on the topic of sexuality/bisexuality/sex/kissing girls/etc
• Escalating to sex

Because she seems openly sexual (especially with girls), experienced with bisexuality, and clearly has interest in you already (see the heart eye emojis and asking you about what you’ve done with girls), these areas come to the forefront and are sensible to discuss in this context as you gain experiemce. Heck, she may even be the one to begin escalating on you. She does sound like the bad bitch type lol

But yeah, let’s get into these three things in more detail.

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Getting her alone in a place where sex can happen

Once more, she clearly has interest in you and meeting up with you. You’ve done a great job with this. She mentioned bringing her friends over, but honestly they might just make things harder right now – though a female orgy type thing is possible as is pulling her from a group event… but in this context I would say to just focus on how you can get her isolated with you in a setting where sex can happen. She’s very responsive towards you – getting her out alone is a legitimate possibility.

Your social frame as a woman she likes and responds to is very good. In terms of the weed and alcohol, I would personally advise against it because you don't have much experience with them. Obviously you can do what you want with drugs/alcohol otherwise (personally I don't drink or smoke, but some people love them ofc)... though considering you don’t have a lot of experience with being high/drunk - let alone seducing/having sex while high or drunk! - I would say to stay away from the drinking/smoking sesh in this case.

Instead, I would think about how you can get her out alone + pulled to that spot where you can escalate. Here are some questions to think about to get the ball rolling on this:

• Could you bring her over to your room – would your parents/siblings leave you two alone if you did? You said they wouldn’t be happy if you were dating a girl... but like, they probably wouldn’t assume if you bring a female friend over that you’d be having sex lol. So if there will be someone home, could you two be peacefully left alone in your room without a parent knocking on the door checking on you or asking if you want Pizza Bagels?
• Where is she staying? Is she at home? A hotel? Does she stay with people? Could you go hang out at her place?
• If none of those are options, hell, a car is an option. Tough logistics make tough seducers lol.

Having flexibility and adjusting on the fly is key too, but from considering some ideas on where you could isolate her at, we can also think about some possibilities of how we could get her out with you to begin with:

• You could try getting her to come hang out straight to either your place or to hers (again, preferably when she is alone). You can think of something that you can do together which is NOT sex to use as plausible deniability – such as to talk about whatever or just listening to music as basic examples – there’s a million options and you gave a great social frame to work it from as woman she likes
• She was interested in you working out and is an athlete herself – there’s a possibility of going to work out together and then hanging out wherever alone afterwards
• Going to the beach is a possibility, yeah, though it does bring in more variables and wildcard opportunities
• Going for a walk and talk in a scenic area you know about, then isolating her wherever afterwards
• Going to get smoothies, coffee, or whatever (preferably it's a mutual interest) and then isolating her afterwards
• A million other things

But I do think that getting her straight over is a real possibility.

It’s clear you’re already a good texter and your social frame is great, which is a problem most have when trying to pull from text/get her out. If you think of a good plausible deniability with her, you can even seed it through a text as an open loop and then bring it back up later to invite her over/go over to her place. That’s a good technique to use for pulling, generally speaking. But if you feel a bit of that tension over Snap where you feel her compliance is high (like she will say yes), you can also just go for it.

It’s variable and intuitive, but these are some things to think about to get her isolated.

---

Getting on the topic of sexuality/bisexuality/sex/kissing girls/etc

Getting onto seduction-oriented topics (SOTs) during the interaction will be key. Just doing this will get a lot of the work done for you because she will want to talk about these things – if she doesn’t initiate them herself already. These will further set sexual frames and escalate the vibe towards sex.

Naturally, these topics can be discussed while you do whatever with her if she doesn’t come straight over, but once she’s isolated, it’s good to bring them back up again to get things going in an efficient direction.

Two methods you could use to introduce/reintroduce these topics this in a very calibrated, social frame-friendly way is to bring up the following:

• Recall how she asked about your experience with girls
  • Ex: “Hey, you know how you asked me about what I’ve done with girls before?”
• Mention the flag in her TikTok bio
  • Ex: “Hey, so you know how you have a flag in your bio right?” – assuming she's aware you know of her TikTok? If she isn't aware you know about it, the angle could just be adjusted like, “Sooo I saw your TikTok and noticed the flag in your bio" OR how you noticed the X video of her talking about girls/kissing girls, etc.

These will get you right onto SOTs conducive to sex that she is also interested in talking about. What you’re doing with this is just setting the sexual frames for either you to escalate on her, or for her to escalate on you, which would also be likely in this context.

It's not like it’s always best to repeat the verbal structures I'll use as examples word for word, but here are some themes which could be conducive for you. You’re very intelligent and I have no doubt you could flow with these and dig deep with her on these and others. Also note that eliciting her throughout and really focusing on where she’s at will be highly beneficial. Note the frames these kind of things are setting as well - for instance they also set Us vs. Them/"Othering" frames, too.

Examples of verbal themes for sexual framing and escalating the vibe​

Spoiler: Praising her for her open mindedness in a world where so many are closed minded

Praising her for her open mindedness in a world where so many are closed minded

Ex: “You know, I find it very inspiring how confident and open minded you are in a society that places so many pressures on women… it’s like everyone wants to box us into neat little labels when each person is so much more than that. It's like we should feel free to break the chains of society and be ourselves – the kind of people we want to be right? I’ve noticed that you really are able to do just that and unapologetically march to the beat of your own drum and be who you want to be without giving a fuck about what dumb people may think. To be honest, from the moment I met you I could tell that you were different, like the kind of special and unique woman who really lives in the moment and lives your life to the fullest, and that’s such a rare thing for someone to have.”

• Now it’s important to note that what we’re doing here is setting frames and feeding her ego to make her more
  impressionable. It doesn’t matter if any of these or true or not or anyone’s personal opinions on LGBTQ+ or whatnot – what matters is the pleasure of laying her and the pleasure of the process to do so.

Spoiler: Being interested in “learning more” about LGBTQ+/bisexuality/”what it’s like with women, etc.

Being interested in “learning more” about LGBTQ+/bisexuality/”what it’s like with women, etc.

Ex: "Hey, do you remember when you were really learning about what you liked, didn’t like, and discovering sides of yourself that you didn’t even know existed? Yeah, I’m kinda feeling like I’m at that stage where… like… maybe I don’t only like guys… and maybe the thought of being with a girl I really like kinda excites me. Like maybe I’m curious about what a bad bitch’s lips feel like on mine of what it would be like to feel her… or for her to feel me… I don’t know it’s just something I think about sometimes as I grow as a woman you know? So given that you’re so in touch with yourself with liking girls too and everything, could you tell me more about what it’s like and how you came to the wonderful place you’re at now with everything?”

• Obviously this could be a topic that could lead her into escalating
• Have noticed that openly bisexual women may really love to teach other women about it, so this “teaching and learning” frame could be something that she totally eats up

Spoiler: Your Conservative Upbring/Sexual Repression

Your Conservative Upbring/Sexual Repression

Ex: “Have you ever had that feeling where it feels like you’re trapped in a cage by your parents, and it’s like they only want you to be a certain way when you want to be so much more than the box they put you in? Yeah… my parents are very conservative and they want me to be this perfect little Korean girl who THEY want me to be… not who I want to be... like I just want to be sunflowergirl04… so while I love my parents, you’ve really reminded me that it’s should be a priority for us to be our own person who does the things we want to without second guessing ourselves you know?”

• Can expand this to sexual themes and their expectations for your relationships how you may have an interest in women but they’re so conservative, etc.

Spoiler: The excitement of her worldwide adventures/college experiences

The excitement of her worldwide adventures/college experiences

Ex: “I remember you mentioning that you do such cool things in school and really live your life to the fullest… if you could name like the three most fun and crazy things you’ve done through your adventures and college experiences, what would they be?”

• Elicit these and praise her for behaviors related to sex

Spoiler: Dominance/submission (also considering how you’ve said you’re excited by being submissive, and how she gives off a dominant vibe that excites you, etc)

Dominance/submission (also considering how you’ve said you’re excited by being submissive, and how she gives off a dominant vibe that excites you, etc)

Ex: “Hey… I feel like I can really trust you with this… like you know about dominance, submission, and BDSM and stuff right? Yeah… well, honestly it’s something that my friends don’t talk about but… do you find it kinda exiting too? It’s like I wonder what it would feel like to fully dedicate myself to pleasuring another woman the best I possibly can… to be her good little obedient submissive girl and do whatever she says so we both could both feel sooooo goooood… like I wonder what it would feel like to look up at her while I’m pleasuring her, gently licking my tongue all over her body… gently licking and kissing wherever she tells me too, all the way from her neck to her nipples to her pussy… and looking up and seeing her eyes roll back while she tells me “good girl”… do you like that kind of stuff? Or maybe even having a bad bitch do that for me too… or doing it for each other…”

• Million different ways you can go with this and obviously it’s arousal tech on top of the sexual framing

Alright so you see where those kind of things are going. Can expand on them in so many different ways – thinking you get the point. And it’s also important to frame them in ways that make sense with the interaction and how you’ve been acting throughout. Calibrating these kinds of themes to you and her is the place to go with it.

Once you get more experienced you could be lethal with more getting deeper into sexual prizing and stuff too, though seduction is built as a process so best to view it from that frame as you gain empiricism and build your reference points/skills.

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Escalating to sex

She may escalate herself when isolated and talking about sexual topics. Maybe she’ll ask if you want to know what it’s like to kiss a girl or be with a girl. Maybe she would get really physical. Tons of variables involved. And this escalating can also be happening as you’re talking about those sexual frames, obviously.

If she does escalate on you when you’re isolated, of course go for it and you could really emphasize on the frame of "learning what it's like" as you already told her you didn't have any experience - again she seems like the bisexual type who likes teaching other women about bisexuality, as she is experienced with women and yeah she seems excited by thought of teaching you about it. Note that you’d be the one who is really guiding the interaction "behind the scenes" as in this case you’re basically seduce her to escalating on you.

If you can tell she’s about ready to be escalated on, which takes experience to feel out – but maybe there’s a lot of tension in the eye contact between you and it’s liminal – here are a couple ways you could initiate the physical escalation (the vibe itself should already be escalated – like there should be sexual tension):

• Due to the frame of the entire interaction, you could literally ask/tell her to “show you what it’s like to kiss a girl”
• Fractionate your touching of her and gradually escalate

But it will be highly dependent on the context and where she’s at, so it's important to calibrate to the moment. It takes experience to nail down the escalation, but reading her, focusing on her, and responding to her is key.

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Wrap-Up And Final Thoughts

Know that was a lot but wanted to provide you with a resource to reflect on and refer to for this girl and beyond. I overviewed things a bit in terms of the structure here because of this unique situation – for a comprehensive view of transition phases I recommend this article and also this one generally (it's a primer on Gunwitch's 3 keys - social frame, emotional stimulation, and sexual arousal).

About privacy – yeah, be very careful with names, pictures, and any personal details of yourself or those you interact with. In public and in private chats alike because there are absolutely great people around… but there are also creeps and weirdos. Generally it’s good practice to always err on the side of caution with it. To the degree of caution is a personal decision – personally I’m on the very cautious side and it’s paid off to be honest. Just some advice!

In terms of your health – definitely keep working out and eating in the ways that keep you healthy and feeling well. Your mom is just coming from her frame of mind and it’s difficult for her to see anything else. But when you get in a high-quality relationship with the skills you’re working on here, she probably won’t have much to say if she likes the guy too – hopefully that mends things between you both.

It's also possible that getting consistent sex/the kind of relationship you want could help you with what you’re seeing the therapist for too. Sometimes mainstream therapists can just kinda reinforce the issue without resolving the underlying factors it seems (disclaimer: not "professional medical advice" lol - but speaking from experiences I've seen with others). I additionally recommend checking out things like cognitive behavioral therapy (CBT) and body oriented therapies like trauma release exercises (TRE) as well - both have had a variety of benefits for myself and others on the forum.

But yeah you mentioning the therapist reminded me of my own experiences with women. One of my girls was seeing a therapist before I met her, and shortly after meeting me she stopped going to the therapist and later sent me this message as I described in my journal:



Now she’s a very happy girl

And I'm not saying that for reasons other than that with a good seduction, it tends to, generally speaking, mutualistically work out where you’re able to have an intense experience with her, and she has a really intense experience with you. For the wonderful girl I mentioned here, there seems to be a kind of therapeutic aspect to everything that's helped her a lot so yeah. It's part of the reason why good game and seducing women to sex is not exploitative in nefarious ways – it’s really working in the way that you’re able to influence her to an intense experience she wouldn’t have had otherwise.

So yeah, keep working on putting yourself in great positions to have the kind of sex life you want, and I think you’ll find yourself very happy with the results.

Hope this helps and wishing you the best on everything!

Don't really need to say this but... this is awesome, the way you break everything down and all is always super useful

 

[PaulieFlyn10]

Cheers for pointing this out, don't know why those links are out...
http://web.archive.org/web/20130817122905/http://www.fastseduction.com/archives/
Useful info on those archives only thing which could stop you is a passcode which is in the download

just in case it's


Also found this second link as a bonus
Fastseduction player guide
Haven't looked into it too much but if it clashes with Girls chase (GC), to set the record straight, I'd bet on the GC school of thought over it, the individuals here made leaps in what was considered possible back then

eg Alek's sex talk/ sexual prizing theory went against the general consensus on what they believed was possible, and now its advanced tech
see This article
for more context




Pretty sure those girls aren't on here, to my knowledge most of those folks are retired/ no longer posting but that's something the GC staff would know more about (most of them made their start there on that board)

I'm still pretty green to this gig and found these archives when they were posted earlier.




Don't really need to say this but... this is awesome, the way you break everything down and all is always super useful

Thank you bro

This was very helpful

 

[sunnygirl]

Hope this helps and wishing you the best on everything!

Can't even begin to express my gratitude for the amount of effort and thought you put into helping me out. All I can say is that your advice is spot on and will be duly noted. Lofty your insights are absolutely amazing, honestly you could write a book on relationships and it will probably be best seller because of how thorough you delve into. You are one wise guy! And yeah, I feel like I still have a lot of internalized misogyny from reading a bunch of extreme redpill and I feel like I can't think sexually of anyone without feeling immense shame because according to them, a good girl would keep her legs closed and not experiment sexually, she instead would find a guy and settle down into a marriage as a virgin. I used to have a pretty high libido but that's tanked because I just think I don't want to be seen as a cheap hoe or anything and I've read a lot of scathing comments about "hoes, sluts, whores" in the redpill space. I just feel like they hate women who enjoy sexual feelings or something. But yeah, that's something I need to work on. So not sure if I want to initiate right away, but I'm also scared she'll get bored that I'm a prude because like I said she does seem like a bit of a naughty girl lol