Socializing There is one thing I am just realising about the difference between daygame and nightgame

[StrayDog]

No its not. Its very very small. I have never heard of anyone learning daygame in a city with less than 500k- 1 million population but to be honest, if you are starting as a hard case, you definitely need a city with at least more than a million, bare minimum.

I learned in a city of about 100k.

it's doable, just slower moving. and a little more of a reputation risk.


Also I had some natural abilities so I wasn't exactly starting from 0

 

[StrayDog]

That's why I keep asking you guys if you would walk up and down your local town wearing a pair of camera glasses and describe what a "set" even is, because it seems that your expectations for an average small English city are somewhat off.

dude this is a lot to ask from most guys who aren't are building some brand around this kind of content.

yes it can for sure he helpful to see other dudes approaching, but ultimately pick up is something you have to figure out by doing.

I think you will get way more value from posting clear field reports about the precise technicals of your approaches, then applying the feed back you get (like using some of those openers/approach angles/vibe checks I have already mentioned), then you will seeing some other dude approach women. Not saying it's not valuable but it will only go so far, and can actually be a trap if you are not developing your own style any way.

 

[average_daygamer]

I am not forcing you to do anything. My intention is not to be harsh on you. I am just laying down the reality as I see it.

Your words here indicate that gym and martial arts are more important to you than solving your dating issues. That is okay. You dont have to justify that to anyone.

But Richard from the video from Street Attraction that you said you know about, do you think he got that good by prioritizing the gym and martial arts over approaching?

There were guys back in the day, who moved cities and slept in closets and crashed on other people's couches to learn pickup. The reality is that if you really want this, you have to prioritize this over everything else apart from your survival.

That is just reality. You cannot say, I will hit the gym, do martial arts, these are all more important than cold approach and then try to get good at this.

This is a hard and very rare skillset, there is no way you can acquire it without prioritizing it.

Its upto you, what you do. But that is the reality.

It just seems odd to me that most people don't have to prioritise this skillset in order to get laid once. It should be enough to tick over in the background. Oh and thanks for the statistics, I will reply in another comment to that thread

I have been daygaming on and off since 2018 and nightgaming less frequently since 2022.

Daygame is my preferred method because the daytime is when I am alert and have the most energy.

However it doesn't deliver the volume outside of major cities. Which leads to nightgame. Nightgame requires huge motivation to go out, especially in the winter, when all I want is to be tucked in bed.

I could get to London a couple of times per month but from watching infields, so few of the chicks actually live in London which makes it a problem unless the girl is really interested.

Oh and also, I don't know anyone else into pickup, which makes it harder, I don't have anyone's couch to crash on or provide real time feedback on my fundamentals. I have already spent money on coaches but that is a one and done kinda deal. It's a bleak, lonely journey out here, all to get laid once and then retire.

 

[StrayDog]

It just seems odd to me that most people don't have to prioritise this skillset in order to get laid once. It should be enough to tick over in the background. Oh and thanks for the statistics, I will reply in another comment to that thread

dude, it takes whatever it takes. everybody is gonna be at different levels. you either do what it takes for you, or your don't

Oh and also, I don't know anyone else into pickup, which makes it harder, I don't have anyone's couch to crash on or provide real time feedback on my fundamentals. I have already spent money on coaches but that is a one and done kinda deal. It's a bleak, lonely journey out here, all to get laid once and then retire.

dude, I learned entirely on my own. not even with the help of this forum.

If I were you I'd aim to stop focusing so much on the current state of lack, learn to enjoy the process, and take better advantage of the resources available to you here.

or pack up and decide pick up isn't for you

 

[AspiringStoic]

It just seems odd to me that most people don't have to prioritise this skillset in order to get laid once. It should be enough to tick over in the background.

This is like the guy crying over his height and saying its just sooo hard for me, you guys dont know. Blah blah blah.

Look nobody cares how it SHOULD be, it is what it is. You play the cards you are dealt. What good is going to come out of you whining about how much more easier it is for others??

You know you are on a pickup forum right? The reason most of us are here is because this was NOT easy for us! We had to go out of our way to figure this out.

I was a virgin before I found the community. I had hobbies too that I put on the back burner for a few years and put most of my free time into figuring out this stuff.

It took a year+ of online dating and slowly changing my behavior till I got good at getting laid from online.

Then I wanted to learn cold approach and realized my location was not amenable to do that. I relocated (which also entailed a career change) so that I could be in a city where I could learn cold approach.

Took 1 and a half years of daygaming with wings and trying to get past crippling AA to get some successes under my belt. Then Covid happened and all my wings left.

Then since last year, I have systematically worked myself up to where I can cold approach solo now and I am at the stage where I am.

So the idea that one does not need to prioritize this is absolutely laughable to me.

If I had just let this "tick over in the background" while focusing on other things like you are doing with the gym and martial arts, I would have still been a virgin.

Come on bro. Its time to wake up! You are living in fantasy land.

 

[gameboy]

I mean I don't like saying the whole "Hey, I just walked past you and you looked really beautiful" opener as I find it a bit cringe, but I don't know any other opener.

Rather than "you look really beautiful", point out something you like about her. Ideally something she chose herself, like a piece of clothing, hairstyle, something like that. Avoid stuff like body type obviously.

I would rather come up with a witty and slightly sarcastic opener,

Sarcastic? I'm not sure what you mean by that. Sarcastic about her? About something in the environment? I don't generally think that's a good idea, unless she has exactly your type of humor (which you can't know beforehand).

Anyway, the opener itself doesn't matter as much as one might think. You can make a comment about literally anything in the environment. If she's in the mood for talking, she will. If not, just move on.

 

[Ratata]

In daygame, you have to chase down girls and even then you can't approach without hesitation because it may not be clear how old the girl is.

You have to "chase down girls" to speak with them? Why don't you just go to a calmer, easier place, where people slow down and are more receptive to a chat? Or where they congregate naturally? Why-Oh-why do all these day gamers insist on doing in on the busiest corner of a highstreet??? Is there some secret competition I don't know about?

When I meet women during the day, it's in the book store or at the beach. Calm places. I don't run after girls who are already trying to catch the bus or the tube! I generally speak to girls at the pier, who are already sitting down and enjoying the sun. "Aw wow what a wonderful day. You been here long? Mind if I sit?" (Just to showcase like the dumbest thing you can say that still works, you don't even need an observation about her, small talk is enough!) Done. Or - and here's a revolutionary place to day game - the coffee shop...

If you want to be low key, ask if you can borrow her USB charging bank or something. Bad choice if your phone is already fully charged tho... Better yet, just go and sit down nearby some targets. Look around you. Catch the eye of one, sheepishly smile and just go "O hi dere".

And why does it matter how old the girl is? You'll get to know her age soon enough, and if she's too young to date then just bounce. Or tell her that she's just gonna have to wait a year until she can date you. It's not illegal to speak to people - even underage people. It's by opening your pie hole and uttering words that you find out if the girl is eligible for dating or not.

In nightgame, inside a venue atleast, you already know that girl is atleast 18 and you are already in proximity of dozens of girls. Also the girls in nightgame are usually 18-28 whereas you don't see an abundance of this demographic during the day and when you do, you often won't approach for aforementioned reasons, at least on the lower end of that age scale.

Yeah, it's horrible. Go over to the hottest girl. Make out with her a bit. Turn away for two seconds, now she's making out with someone else. Or worse, you make out with someone else, and now the first girl gets all mad and wants to give you a black eye. Clubs are pure chaos! But that can be your best friend (and a lot of fun) if you learn to live with it. (Even noise can be your best friend, cuz you get to practise yer non verbals.) So find a girl and get away from there as soon as possible. And then learn to deal with LMR (just baby-step it, first food, then a drink at a calm place, conveniently right nearby your place, but - ohhh - you forgot your jacket at home so go "Hey, come with, I need to fetch my ja" ... ohhh we're naked in my bed now...)

The reason I don't do more night game is because ...

Ok bro.

However, I do plan on ...

That's nice.

Now I don't know about you but spending £30 to have ...

IKR.

Oh and also I usually work a Saturday shift which tires me ...

Omg you poor soul! Woe is to you! But why should we care? Do you want to get laid or not? If the answer is "yes" then spare us the excuses, and let's get down to the brass tax. So, you like day game, let's talk day game. Nobody cares about why or why not you prefer Pepsi over Coca-Cola. What matters is how you can get it all for free! And while the lady at the soda stand gives you a BJ just for flirting with her.

Edit: Sorry for getting all lemon over you in this post. You seem genuine. But if you are truly genuine, then all we really want to know is what you did, and how you failed at it. We love people who try. But we hate people who make excuses.

 

[KnownUniverse]

That's interesting, but it's not what I mean.

I mean, what are you going for? What looks attractive? How do you chose the girl you approach in the first place? Have a look at this Manchester nightlife video and tell me which ones you would approach and why

There are a lot of girls in that video, who, despite being conventionally attractive, I would not approach, due to the way they are dressed, their annoying behaviour, chavy accent and various other small things that would put me off.

This looks like a great environment to run gutter game in. You get the night club atmosphere without the loud music or bouncer harassment. I'd be approaching all those girls.

 

[KnownUniverse]

Two things

I do group sets. You can see them in some of my field reports from earlier this year. I am not as confident as Robert in the video and do often back out if there are 3 or more or if it's a mixed set. But I have pushed myself in nightgame a lot out on the street. But the ROI isn't there which effects my motivation.

Funnily enough, I have also had coaching with them before their channel got deleted. Not with Richard but the two other lads (I won't name them in case they want to lay low). They were legit but I needed a lot of work and didn't have the funds at the time; then they got cancelled.

Richard has insane skills and I am not capable of that, particularly not with the young hotties you get on nights out. I can be high energy but lack a system other than the generic daygame number close which doesn't make a lot of sense in night game. So in night game ain't lack a goal to steer the girl to.

Actually a couple of years ago, I went hug approaching, offering "free Christmas hugs" which worked quite well. I did 15 hug approaches and got 3 hugs, including a double hug.

Hugs are good because they are easier to coordinate than kisses and you get to feel the girl's body against yours which is more satisfying than kissing in my view. But it didn't go further than the hug, that was it once they had hugged me. There was no escalation possible as they saw it as the conclusion to the interaction. I am afraid to push too far and be condemned as a creep, you see.

this guy has at least one wingman (holding the camera). Aren't you gaming solo? The dynamic is a bit different when gaming with a wing. It's more fun when you've got someone with you as long they're having fun too.

 

[average_daygamer]

This looks like a great environment to run gutter game in. You get the night club atmosphere without the loud music or bouncer harassment. I'd be approaching all those girls.

So how do you do that? What if it is a big group? There are loads of big groups at night which I can't approach.

 

[KnownUniverse]

So how do you do that? What if it is a big group? There are loads of big groups at night which I can't approach.

I'll make a comment about their outfit or sometimes use an indirect comment while physically escalating to show intent. I'll start my approaches for the night at a local shop or train station before arriving on the high steet. I'll just do some crazy hit and runs. They are often horrendous because im so in my head - women will look at me like im a freak and keep walking but once those are done i feel a lot more confident to handle the girls on high street.

it's what I learned from 60YOC. embrace creepy etc...

 

[average_daygamer]

I'll make a comment about their outfit or sometimes use an indirect comment while physically escalating to show intent. I'll start my approaches for the night at a local shop or train station before arriving on the high steet. I'll just do some crazy hit and runs. They are often horrendous because im so in my head - women will look at me like im a freak and keep walking but once those are done i feel a lot more confident to handle the girls on high street.

it's what I learned from 60YOC. embrace creepy etc...

I appreciate the honesty. I have had those exact reactions and made me question what I am doing. I am glad to know it is just a case of pushing through until you get into a good mood.

I have also made some pretty bold approaches on night game sets but I find myself so in my head, especially as I am solo, depending on how I'm feeling in general. I start seeing these big groups and getting more in my head as there is too much pressure to go in.

I too have done some audacious "hit and run" approaches as well. It makes me remember this guy one night jumping Infront of people asking them for spare change for a busker who was complaining about no one giving him money.

The guy was obviously drunk but people just walked around him. Seeing that gave me more confidence to actually approach groups, but it's still nerve wracking.

You using using the word highstreet makes me think you are located somewhere in the UK. Would you be interested to link up? I think I remember talking to you before and you were an English guy living in a common wealth country which was why you used English phrases, so maybe not.

This 60 years of challenge" book, the title isn't very descriptive, but I ought to look into it. I have "embraced the creepy" before and it can occasionally have surprising results, but it does tend to leave behind a trail of destruction. It is best suited to high energy environments where the girls might be overexcited like in night game.

My main method of getting approaches going is to have a very straightforward opener delivered not with a front stop or anything but from the side. Like going to a girl and turning to face them over my shoulder and just saying "you look good" can get the momentum going and break the ice. I did that in daygame yesterday as recently I have been feeling quite reticent about approaching and I had to go back to basics of just approaching for sport.

 

[KnownUniverse]

i

I appreciate the honesty. I have had those exact reactions and made me question what I am doing. I am glad to know it is just a case of pushing through until you get into a good mood.

I have also made some pretty bold approaches on night game sets but I find myself so in my head, especially as I am solo, depending on how I'm feeling in general. I start seeing these big groups and getting more in my head as there is too much pressure to go in.

I too have done some audacious "hit and run" approaches as well. It makes me remember this guy one night jumping Infront of people asking them for spare change for a busker who was complaining about no one giving him money.

The guy was obviously drunk but people just walked around him. Seeing that gave me more confidence to actually approach groups, but it's still nerve wracking.

You using using the word highstreet makes me think you are located somewhere in the UK. Would you be interested to link up? I think I remember talking to you before and you were an English guy living in a common wealth country which was why you used English phrases, so maybe not.

This 60 years of challenge" book, the title isn't very descriptive, but I ought to look into it. I have "embraced the creepy" before and it can occasionally have surprising results, but it does tend to leave behind a trail of destruction. It is best suited to high energy environments where the girls might be overexcited like in night game.

My main method of getting approaches going is to have a very straightforward opener delivered not with a front stop or anything but from the side. Like going to a girl and turning to face them over my shoulder and just saying "you look good" can get the momentum going and break the ice. I did that in daygame yesterday as recently I have been feeling quite reticent about approaching and I had to go back to basics of just approaching for sport.

I could avoid those reactions if i went full indirect and just asked for directions or something but 60 yoc method relies on showing intent until you land on a green who's dtf. I prefer this way. I've had wings who mostly do indirect and i didnt see them get anywhere even after talking to girls for long lengths of time.

I don't think im near you. I only used the term "high st" because i saw you use it. It's a good way of describing night life districts.

I havent done any approaches for the last couple of weeks. I need to get back into it. i find i go hard and approach heaps of girls all day every day or crash out and do nothing for days on end.

I did one approach today on my way home from the computer store. She was a 9/10 latina or something. I ejected to early. I tried to go for the insta date and told her to change her plans and come with me a local mall where she can try on outfits for me and she said she can't right now. I should've gone for the number close as she didnt say no she just said she cant right now.

I went semi-direct with her. I talked about her look and invited to come with me to the mall but i didnt sexualise the interaction at all. Usually i would look for reasons to escalate and all that.

 

[isildur1]

daygame is bigger learning curve for sure - but my flake rate was way lower from Daygame than it was nightgame- night and day really. I started nightgame back when i was aged 20 , i would get a lot of "false positives" a lot of make outs but then little follow through on text or facebook, i think it was mainly due to the women being just drunk and horny making out with anything then once they sobered up saw no need to follow through - then again it did make me realise what was possible esculation wise and i eventually lost my virginity to a "yes girl" through it - but all the flakes weren't really worth it - daygame i gleaned a lot of more dates and was able to have more experiences and it exposed a lot of my weaknesses , i was a boring person who needed to improve his conversations , from having more dates it also taught me how to hook for longer, improve my social media and win rapport with strangers- with night game there was too much alcohol and too much stimulus to track when things were going right or wrong and it was taking its toll on my sleep and health- i quit alcohol and nightgame aged 26 and my health has improved a lot since plus my skin feels younger and im less sleep deprived - overall a win.

Dont worry about age - if the woman is under 18 just abort the set- ask questions like " you go to university right?" to check for age and if they say high school just exit the conversation.

There are huge benefits to daygame - but its mentally tough - you need to stop overthinking and as someone who overthinks a lot myself it can be hard to focus well.

 

[average_daygamer]

.

Dont worry about age - if the woman is under 18 just abort the set- ask questions like " you go to university right?" to check for age and if they say high school just exit the conversation.

There are huge benefits to daygame - but its mentally tough - you need to stop overthinking and as someone who overthinks a lot myself it can be hard to focus well.

I'm going to need a wing to go in field with and deliberately approach girls who may be underaged because I'm never going to be strong enough to make myself do it.

I've been in daygame for 7+ years and it's still a major sticking point for me. And even then, it would have to be locally, not in a big city, due to the spotlight effect being stronger locally.

Looking at results, I have had way more phone numbers and meets from daygame then from nightgame.

But daygame had it's limits. The hottest girls come out at night.

 

[average_daygamer]

yes, if my intuition is correct I think this is the style that @average_daygamer has been attempting. But I am getting the feeling it is not quite aligned with his core personality.

Hence all the blowouts and such.

I'll rock this style sometimes. But only when I am high state, high social momentum.

otherwise I'm kicked back style all the way.

It's actually the opposite of my style.

My natural style is to go over to a girl and say "Hey, you look good" and then see how they respond and go from there.

Or even go over and ask permission to give them a compliment beforehand.

This is against the conventional wisdom but it works well with my personality
.

 

[average_daygamer]

again, the reason this isn't going further is because it is not congruent with your style. You are bringing this big energy then expecting it to move forward from the hug with no clear process how.

you can't skip steps, just because you get a hug doesn't mean you don't have to then work the interaction.

You are afraid of being a creep because your intuition is telling you something is off about the way you are interacting. it is not congruent. you know that you have skipped steps or acted out of character.

Actually, the hugging had a high success rate

Out of 15 approaches, I got 3 hugs with hot girls. That is more physical contact than a get a whole year.

I am not sure why you are so against my innovative approach idea.

 

[Rancorous]

If you want to approach girls like in the Manchester video you gotta have this guy's kind of Game and energy. It can be done but its way tougher and requires a lot more balls and high energy to pull off. He is killing it in this video:

I agree. You need to approach in a bright high energy tone and make good eye contact. You just have to keep doing it until you get better and get desensitized towards it.

 

[average_daygamer]

I agree. You need to approach in a bright high energy tone and make good eye contact. You just have to keep doing it until you get better and get desensitized towards it.

I've been in nightgame since 2022 and have yet to become desensitized. If I had a wing, it would help. I plan to get some nightgame coaching in the new year.

 

[Rancorous]

I've been in nightgame since 2022 and have yet to become desensitized. If I had a wing, it would help. I plan to get some nightgame coaching in the new year.

after I was doing night game for about 5-6 years I got desensitized towards it. It's like that with anything.