Socializing 2021 in review and the state of seduction as we enter 2022

POB

Tribal Elder
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Today, while I was riding the subway, I got at least 3 approach invites from very decent chicks (no, they were not 10s, but I'm sure 80% of guys in this forum would give them a shot).

Daygame is the easier it has ever been, by a large margin.
Guys were not approaching before corona, but now, oh boy....women are just dying to feel desired again.

Skills is right: once you jump that first hurdle, it's very easy to bang them
(of course, fundamentals in check: conversation, logistics, isolation, escalation, etc).
 

POB

Tribal Elder
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But now longer texting conversations with the current crop of 18 -24 year olds can massively work in your favor and reduce flaking by quite a lot.

Back in 08 I was having a lot more flakes than I thought I should and a guy that’s went by the name “Blackdragon” told me to stop talking about having sex with her during the textings because even when they are enjoying that it takes away from her being able to just say “well the sex just kinda happened” and so they flaked so they wouldn’t feel “slutty.”

Now? The current young women don’t give a fuck about plausible deniability and looking slutty. I learned how to write good sex scenes and now when im texting I’ll get very descriptive and vivid and paint pictures in her mind of us fucking. They fucking love it and makes them excited to meet up. It’s all about evolution.
Yes, this is a trend I've been noticing since 2017 (maybe a little earlier)!
The key is always convey "secret society"
But yes, what you said is very much on point with what's happening.

BD has an audience who's very much diverse and new to seduction.
He's really talking to the average chump who has no clue.
That kind of guy tend to fuck up fast when texting, so in that case "less is more" works for sure.

Just not what my friends and I have noticed. Women are CRAVING real men. If you fit that description with her there is a good chance she is going to want to fuck your brains out.
It was already bad, but corona made it worst for them.
 

pancakemouse

Space Monkey
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Today, while I was riding the subway, I got at least 3 approach invites from very decent chicks (no, they were not 10s, but I'm sure 80% of guys in this forum would give them a shot).

Daygame is the easier it has ever been, by a large margin.
Guys were not approaching before corona, but now, oh boy....women are just dying to feel desired again.

Skills is right: once you jump that first hurdle, it's very easy to bang them
(of course, fundamentals in check: conversation, logistics, isolation, escalation, etc).

Location: South America
 

pancakemouse

Space Monkey
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I don’t do night game anymore but I haven’t seen any of my friends who do complain about women being “harder” only that places are sometimes more dead.

While I seem to be known as the “social circle” guy around here I’m more of a day game guy. Have been since 2006.

Here is the thing man, every year for the past 15 years people in the community have been sounding the alarm about “women getting harder “ and that “cold approach is dying.”

Apparently cold approach and the dating scene has had one foot in the grave for 15 years now lol.

Neither me nor my close friends have noticed.

NOTE: Most guys would say that online game, and especially Tinder, has gotten harder and I do somewhat agree there. When Tinder first came out it was like “sex on demand” now you must have professional pictures and actually take care of your looks a little.

Daygame was actually harder back in 2009 when RSD was turning every dude into an approach machine and the PUA show was on Vh1. Women started being very skeptical of any dude who would approach her.

A hell of a lot less dudes approaching now.

OK, so, you don't do nightgame, that explains part of it. Nightgame has been less shielded to change than daygame.

I'll re-iterate my question: how many daygame approaches in 2021? What were your results like compared to previous years? Do you track numbers? The reason this is important is that there's a ton of keyboard warriors that post similar tripe to you every year (usually on the Roosh V forum and similar). It's usually cope/ego defense to avoid external realities:
this-is-fine-meme.jpg


I gather you're in NYC: every NYC wing I have reports that daygame results have cratered since 2015, to the tune of numbers being 1/3rd less effective.

The reason: hypergamy and the rise of apps. You're no longer competing with the RSD guys on the street in 2009: you're competing with every chode on her phone.

So, what are you and your friends doing differently that you don't notice this? Do you daygame in East Village/Soho/Lower East Side? Are you going after 18-24 year olds?

My only other former wing that agrees with you on this is an older white guy in Japan. It's like, yeah, of course you don't notice it's getting worse, you have massive status and don't live in the USA.
 
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sab

Tool-Bearing Hominid
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Like real estate: location, location, location. My place the best looking, fit, solo girls are always on the move, jogging, biking, roller-skating, volley-ball rarely stationary or maybe walking a dog or watching a sunset. The latter created the best shots for approaches. My new year resolution: travel to more target rich places.
 
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Warped Mindless

Tribal Elder
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OK, so, you don't do nightgame, that explains part of it. Nightgame has been less shielded to change than daygame.

I'll re-iterate my question: how many daygame approaches in 2021? What were your results like compared to previous years? Do you track numbers? The reason this is important is that there's a ton of keyboard warriors that post similar tripe to you every year (usually on the Roosh V forum and similar). It's usually cope/ego defense to avoid external realities:
this-is-fine-meme.jpg


I gather you're in NYC: every NYC wing I have reports that daygame results have cratered since 2015, to the tune of numbers being 1/3rd less effective.

The reason: hypergamy and the rise of apps. You're no longer competing with the RSD guys on the street in 2009: you're competing with every chode on her phone.

So, what are you and your friends doing differently that you don't notice this? Do you daygame in East Village/Soho/Lower East Side? Are you going after 18-24 year olds?

My only other former wing that agrees with you on this is an older white guy in Japan. It's like, yeah, of course you don't notice it's getting worse, you have massive status and don't live in the USA.
You have been “competing” with every dude on her phone since they have become popular. Seriously, I heard that same argument back in 2006.
“Your competiting with every guy on MySpace.”

why is she not competing with every girl on YOUR phone? When I post a pic to my Facebook lots of girls will Like it and comment on it. Any girl who likes me instantly sees that she has competition. Stop trying to compete for women and flip the tables. Make them compete for you.

You say hypergamy is making it harder but if that’s the case why not take advantage of it? Most guys are so lame now that I don’t even consider them competition. Improve your life and yourself so that you don’t either.

Anyways, I’m not in NYC. I’m mainly in Columbus OH, Cincinnati OH, Chicago IL, and Nashville Tenn. I also don’t track my results via some spreadsheet or stuff like that. I see a cute girl I approach, that is all.

That said, I already have 4 girls on rotation that I’m seeing. About five years ago I transitioned from “sleep with a bunch of different random girls” to “find a few high quality women and fuck them over and over again” so I don’t approach nearly as much as I used to but because I love meeting new women I’d say on 2021 I averaged about like 10 approaches a week the first half of the year and I was still having to turn down women because 1) already had multiple high quality women 2) little free time due to running my businesses. In November I took some time off from business and in November and December I reconnected with an old wing and his newphew just turned 18 and wanted to learn daygame so we spent a few weeks going out hard. I honestly can’t figure out why you and others think women are getting harder because current younger women are both horny and aggressive.

Not trying to sound like an ass but your comment about “competing” with other men shows me where your headspace is at. Work on yourself so you don’t feel like your even competing.
 
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Starboy

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Did people read op were I said multiple times women 50 times easier... please guy re read post, is like we are talking about total different things....
Sorry hombre @Skills I don't wanna be that guy,but in your op you didn't say it was easier you made points that implied game was harder
Again the numbers meet to lay ratios have gone to total shit from all type of cold approach
In this market place the maiting market is becoming crazy, you need to have fundamentals, know how to do a to z aspects of seduction, from opening to close almost flawlessly
If you don't have a follow up method (for me texting) good luck getting laid all the time with ons, ons are becoming harder and harder, dtf not comming out
All these points you made imply that it was harder. At the end you kind of had some disclaimers that game isn't dead you just have to grind a bit more.

I have no idea if it's harder or not I don't have much of an opinion i'm in the learning phase so you tribal elders know more. I would rather believe it's the same as any other time instead of discouraging myself from trying to get better.
 

Skills

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Sorry hombre @Skills I don't wanna be that guy,but in your op you didn't say it was easier you made points that implied game was harder



All these points you made imply that it was harder. At the end you kind of had some disclaimers that game isn't dead you just have to grind a bit more.

I have no idea if it's harder or not I don't have much of an opinion i'm in the learning phase so you tribal elders know more. I would rather believe it's the same as any other time instead of discouraging myself from trying to get better.
You cherry picked, I put pros, cons and solutions re read the post
 

Skills

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Alright guys just got home, so i have more time to respond to the post and the people talking past each other.....I will talk with FACTUAL STUFF based on USA..... And the disconnect with the post....

-First there are multiple types of guys and multiple types of seducers..... Some like the contact sports and are actively in the field via day game or night game.

- There is a panademic this is factual, and a new variant that is super contagious many countries, many states and even many cities within states are handling the pandemic and the sanctions different this has had an impact in all aspects of life from biz, societal behavior, routines etc....... (keep in mind as per the op i made money, and i benefited somewhat of this screw up market place, why? cause as i explained in the op, players that are good, gave up! get it! i keep grinding, so this has worked in my favor in my area, all the rsdtards gone, all the local players gone including primo lol, they are all gone, i keep grinding...

^ why is this important to know, cause most pick up is based on field experience accrosss the wolrd, if we do micro escalation or the 8 orgasms routine or ______ in the blank method, it will likely world accross the world.... BUT, the sexual market place is the most different from city to city, from country to country NOW MORE THAN EVER DUE TO MAINLY TO AS OF NOW corona... get it guys or do i have to explain in more detail how this change the whole thing?

Do you guys think when the top dude i ever met in seduction told me in pm,"i did not get laid almost a year due to corona" he is in Europe... I told him, dude i heard couple of kids back in 2009 saying they could not get laid, you are mentally masturbating... come on! guys! this is ridiculous! I got a come explain this shit...


-I made a post based on my observations and FIELD EXPERIENCE MAINLY ON NIGHT GAME IN USA SOUTH FLORIDA end of 2021 going into 2022.... there happens to be out of all the posters here another one, that ACTIVELY DOES DAY GAME IN SOUTH FLORIDA who is verified and has met with multiple seducers from and out of the forum, travels and belong to many ACTIVELY GAMING COMMUNITY GROUPS... Then we have multiple poster jump in, most are no active in the field, which is clear and getting super annoying, or are from Brazil, Europe and China.... Which is turning a no excuses, no whining, actual post of people that are active into some type of CLUSTER FUCK CONSPIRACY THEORY, this is really annoying me... And again part of what i call posturing..(which both i bring up in the op)..

- This post i have never ever made in mind AVERAGE OR CIVILIANS, most guys in this forum, are in shape, have game, have no fucking aa, dress nice, i know i seen them all for years..... I even help them out all the time... So when i hear go out approach bro, go and fix your style and work out bro... It is borderline water is wet and it gets annoying....

^ the only reason i brought up fundamental and seduction a to z, is cause i was in a club, some of you guys know this story and i wanted to keep it private but fuck it i am annoyed... There was really hot doctor from England i was competing with some younger guy, pretty much his fundamentals were good, his game was ok,, not really good, i totally destroyed him (again, one day if they do the private stuff i suggested you will hear in detail)....


I will explain once again the problem with night game as of post covid, INCONSISTANCY OF WOMEN COMMING OUT IN USA, i don't give a shit if she is hot and horny and wants to be approach and missing touch, if your game is 2.0 if there is not enough supply of women in VENUES, plural, is not like i don't travel other places and shit, and go to other club, good luck gaming even if you are putting in the work, you will have since the sexual market place is so inconsistent to put way more work than pre covid get it dudes? I can get away with this cause what i do things 99% of guys including most reading this can not really do, but again i made it clear the post is not about skills, is about the FUCKED UP SEXUAL MARKET PLACE....

^ now the problem is with the follow up answer STRAWMAN, the day game dude, use a bad word HYPERGAMY, (i fucking hate that word and seducers don't give a shit about hypergamy that is the point of being a seducer to get around that crap) the dude clearly was trying to make the point that since there is a short supply of women, lets say in the club 20 guys per girl (at times, again my point on consistancy, is not always, you can go out on a night and get a beutiful 5 dudes per girl ratio, which has most of my life being the norm, yes all my life i pull with those ratios no biggie, but good luck with 20 to 1 ratios) this is due to WOMEN ARE NOT CONSISTENTLY COMMING OUT..... Again for the strawman, i will keep repeating the word consistancy...aka women staying home....

- the dude brought up competing in phone, which made him sound silly, he is saying what we all been saying that a lot of the girls have been lost to the apps. in other word dtf gone to apps, instagram... So back to ratios, there is no way the market 2022 is the same "i been hearing this from 1998, come on".... strawman......

clubs were not like this 5 years ago: - Clubs and night venues gone to shit..- All bottle services, is design to total separate "bottle service" with "general population" what this is causing a death in my opinion of the larger clubs i used to recommend due to volume, this is pointless now again multiple clubs is better.....

@Starboy


this is by skills:
since the sexual market place is total crap, we saw how we had a massive exodus of problem oriented solutions (seduction community) to delay communities, red pill once you are in shape, you money is right, and you are the best of yourself THEN women get a memo now they will chase you, crap.... Or give up don't try community since is all about looks (black pill) or lets way till the sexual market place levels (men go their own way)... Total shit crap, vs guys grinding it out with seduction which in turn is one of the reasons guys out there got 0 game even with good fundamentals, so helping the guys with actual game get that 0 to 100 attraction i talk about....


- Following the above since the sexual market place is total shit, most guys are not getting the same level of reference experiences with women, sexual experience, real live women understanding and relationships that we got to enjoy in a bit more favorable market place. This works in our favor since the guys good with women had 1000s of successful reference field experience, relationship, women dynamics etc... this translate in the seduction which is not fair at all to other dudes that even if they try won't be able to compete.

Keep grinding is my solution number 1 you can still get laid and lot, but you need to be consistent, find a day or 2 preferably no less than 2 to CONSTANTLY SARGE, the excuse of work, running biz etc... is just excuses i am sure you can find some type to consistant sarge i have done and cont. doing it for more than 20 years... (again getting rid of drugs and alcohol help with this)


this is what is going to happen to this post all of you that want to get cute will have to do what i did in another post, i should have done the same in this post, remember the women are women post? i specifically made requirements to post, i should have done this in this post....

HERE IS THE REQUIREMENT FROM NOW ON, IF YOU ARE NOT ACTIVELY DOING DAY GAME OR NIGHT GAME COLD APPROACH I DON'T WANT YOUR OPINION.... Thanks in advance...
 
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Warped Mindless

Tribal Elder
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@Skills Sounds like night game sucks right now in Florida. Glad I don’t do night game anymore lol.

You can take shots at me all you want but I have been hearing this “the sky is falling BS” since the mASF days 15 years ago. Every year some group of dudes proclaim that getting laid is to hard now or some BS. Nah, some guys just can’t evolve.

I hear the same shit from my business clients.

“Sales and marketing doesn’t work now, all customers are privy to our tactics!!” Nah, they just haven’t evolved. Getting customers is just as easy now (for most industries and niches) as it’s always been.
 

Warped Mindless

Tribal Elder
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Today, while I was riding the subway, I got at least 3 approach invites from very decent chicks (no, they were not 10s, but I'm sure 80% of guys in this forum would give them a shot).

Daygame is the easier it has ever been, by a large margin.
Guys were not approaching before corona, but now, oh boy....women are just dying to feel desired again.

Skills is right: once you jump that first hurdle, it's very easy to bang them
(of course, fundamentals in check: conversation, logistics, isolation, escalation, etc).
100% have noticed the same shit.

Young chicks now are AGGRESSIVE when they like you. Way more than they were in the past.
 

Skills

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@Skills Sounds like night game sucks right now in Florida. Glad I don’t do night game anymore lol.

See you still don't get it, if you were to do night game, you would still do good, but you will have to put more work than before....
You can take shots at me all you want but I have been hearing this “the sky is falling BS” since the mASF days 15 years ago. Every year some group of dudes proclaim that getting laid is to hard now or some BS. Nah, some guys just can’t evolve.

Be specific and quote where i said "the sky is falling" and where did i proclaim that getting laid is hard, i think i said about 5 times, getting laid easier????

here is by skills:

- Seducers with game when they met a girl, got more attraction times a million than ever along with power (i will put this as a good but is a weird good).... In other words if you are good with women(which is a really really small minority).... When you hooked a girl she would get 0 to 100 type attraction... (good for a super minority but bad for everyone else, i will explain later in the cons).

- Following the above since the sexual market place is total shit, most guys are not getting the same level of reference experiences with women, sexual experience, real live women understanding and relationships that we got to enjoy in a bit more favorable market place. This works in our favor since the guys good with women had 1000s of successful reference field experience, relationship, women dynamics etc... this translate in the seduction which is not fair at all to other dudes that even if they try won't be able to compete.

this is by dowhatworks:

Good Post and matches a lot of what I'm seeing in London, UK too.

TLDR: The start of the seduction has got slightly harder but the end part of the seduction part has gotten easier.


"“Sales and marketing doesn’t work now, all customers are privy to our tactics!!” Nah, they just haven’t evolved. Getting customers is just as easy now (for most industries and niches) as it’s always been."

I am the top sales guy in every company, come on!
 

metalbird

Tool-Bearing Hominid
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This thread really highlights the biggest issue that this community has, which others like Skills have mentioned here.

While the general principles of attraction and game are rooted in human biology, social environmental factors vary so much between countries, cities, states, etc... That one man's anecdotes may not match another man's at all.

Easy example: I heard about street game on this site for years and thought it was sheer lunacy. I'm a bread-and-butter day gamer, but I couldn't even conceive of approaching women on the sidewalk. Then I moved to an East Coast city, and it made much more sense...

Sometimes we are like the blind men trying to describe an elephant...
 

pancakemouse

Space Monkey
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This thread really highlights the biggest issue that this community has, which others like Skills have mentioned here.

While the general principles of attraction and game are rooted in human biology, social environmental factors vary so much between countries, cities, states, etc... That one man's anecdotes may not match another man's at all.

Easy example: I heard about street game on this site for years and thought it was sheer lunacy. I'm a bread-and-butter day gamer, but I couldn't even conceive of approaching women on the sidewalk. Then I moved to an East Coast city, and it made much more sense...

Sometimes we are like the blind men trying to describe an elephant...
Yup. Most arguments in Game are guys talking at cross purposes because they unable to understand someone else's context.

This is why I've gamed in 20+ US cities and 10+ countries. This is why I've meticulously studied most active PUAs in the community. I want to have full context to uncover and set straight the truth about game.

@Skills Sounds like night game sucks right now in Florida. Glad I don’t do night game anymore lol.

You can take shots at me all you want but I have been hearing this “the sky is falling BS” since the mASF days 15 years ago. Every year some group of dudes proclaim that getting laid is to hard now or some BS. Nah, some guys just can’t evolve.

I hear the same shit from my business clients.

“Sales and marketing doesn’t work now, all customers are privy to our tactics!!” Nah, they just haven’t evolved. Getting customers is just as easy now (for most industries and niches) as it’s always been.
And New York City. And San Francisco. Can confirm from personal experience in 2021.

It sucks everywhere, because this is an American cultural issue. Women no longer have to turn up to general admission venues to get laid. Instead, they either don't come or rock up with a giant mixed set, or they know a promoter and are at a table.
 

ZacAdam

Cro-Magnon Man
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Sometimes we are like the blind men trying to describe an elephant

On a bigger scale, a phenomenon of Macro micro merging.

This post and The context of it, how we read it from our pre-belief (belief = experience) and how we wrote our message to each other........ along with Rain's post accidentally unveils PUA as a community, our weakness.

i was like oh shit. Hopefully somebody didn't see what Rain has pointed out. It is something that we have not addressed on.

z@c+
 

Skills

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This thread really highlights the biggest issue that this community has, which others like Skills have mentioned here.

While the general principles of attraction and game are rooted in human biology, social environmental factors vary so much between countries, cities, states, etc... That one man's anecdotes may not match another man's at all.

Easy example: I heard about street game on this site for years and thought it was sheer lunacy. I'm a bread-and-butter day gamer, but I couldn't even conceive of approaching women on the sidewalk. Then I moved to an East Coast city, and it made much more sense...

Sometimes we are like the blind men trying to describe an elephant...

Correct! I got into huge fights with guys like lobo and others new yorkers due to logistics issues, on why they don't pull women to hourly motels in ny lol... For what i hear this does not exist in NY....

But pretty much the community is based on field experience most stuff will actually work everywhere (that is why you need to test vs blindly follow stuff)..... Also it seems that people totally did not read the op, till today i still don't understand the reading comprehension level of some tribal elders

p.s this is post made by skills a year ago
 
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