Special Girl My crush keeps telling me about her sexual life

[mirror]

Yes, you could have kissed. But she is still open to you. Don't fret.

I will tell you now: imagine kissing her, use that imagination of yours to prepare for the thing you want and just go for it.

 

[TrailBlazer]

Again, here are your alternatives:

1. You do nothing and keep on living in agony as she tells you of how she fucked a literal football team of other guys, while pining over them, and enjoying every excruciating moment it's causing you inner pain and suffering. Congratulations, you've now become her emotional tampon!
2. You escalate and it fails miserably. Face it, you would never even get a "right moment" and there was no "right way" of doing it. But by doing it, you're still victorious, because now you know for certain. And most likely she will tell her friends what a brave guy you are, how big your balls are and how long your - oh wait, she never got to know that, but she will still assume that you've got big balls (unless you got an involuntary boner while you failed). So, ok, fair, maybe you could have done some things better... I will allow you that! So, then what? Well, then you learn from it. Write an FR. Get feedback. Find a sticking point. But even if you're rejected, it's still a win, because you A. took action and B learned.
3. You escalate and she kisses you back... I mean, do I even need to explain this? This is a clear victory.

So, as you can see: #1 is by far your worst option here. #2 and #3 are merely the possible results of you taking action. And I'll tell you up front IDGAF about your excuses. You're in the army now, and and here we don't do excuses, we only do drills. And your current drill is to deliver escalations. You may die in the trenches, but - son - we'll patch you right up again and send you to the front yet another time, just as in Starship Troopers!

Btw. here's the rather big caveat in terms of finding sticking points: You can only find sticking points by by way of repetition. That means that you have to be willing to fail multiple times before it really counts. Because if you only do it once, your failure might not be due to your action, but instead cuz she's on her period, or cuz o the ordering of the planets, or just plain bad luck. Shit happens, and it's not always your fault. But if it happens multiple times, for approximately the same reasons, then congratulations you've found a sticking point.

Bottom line, you have to make that mistake a few times before you can write it up as such. But you're of course not willing to do that, because you've got oneitis and you've got a fear of loss for this particular girl.... How sad. So, the solution to that is to open your eyes and see the world through the glasses of abundance, and really notice how the world is FULL of women, instead of living in scarcity like you are now.

Right now, you want the silver bullet. And - sorry - it doesn't exist. But you sure seem to know when and how is a good time to escalate or not. Well, in that case, why don't you just create those moments? If you're having trouble seeing them, then we're here to help. You already got a ton of great advice on how to get compliance, build sexual tension and go for at least a kiss close. What do you think about those ideas? Which one of them do you like best? Will you write an FR testing one or two of them out in the near future? Atta boy!

I mean, in the end, whether you choose to whine or take action, that's your choice. If you're only here to invent excuses, then I think our time here is up and you should perhaps seek help elsewhere. Up to you!

So, you wanna share more of your excuses?

My message above is for you @Ratata but I messed up the quoting.

 

[TrailBlazer]

Yes, you could have kissed. But she is still open to you. Don't fret.

I will tell you now: imagine kissing her, use that imagination of yours to prepare for the thing you want and just go for it.

Okay, yeah but also doesn’t kissing too early ruin things too? As Chase says we should kiss once we are isolated so we can go all the way. Let’s say I kiss her on the meeting and then we have to part ways and she rationalises that it was a mistake! (Quite easy to do since we are in that anxiety program).

So I’m thinking isolate first and kiss second, but then there’s all this pressure.

I try to visualise it but it makes me almost faint with stress and visualising it too much will make me too outcome dependent! I need to go talk to more girls…

 

[mirror]

I try to visualise it but it makes me almost faint with stress

The stress is the thing you need to face. Try yoga / breathing exercises

 

[TrailBlazer]

I need to slap you.

SLAP!

Jokes aside (or now begins the actual slapping). Listen very carefully: You pussied out. Nothing never didn't just not happen. (Omg does that sentence even compute?) What happened was that you didn't make it happen. Now you've learned the hard way that you have to make it happen.

So... What will you do next time someone says that they keep thinking about you?

That's right: You will make it happen. By escalating. Even if you don't "feel" the correct vibe yet. And even if nothing has "happened" yet (you're the only one who can make things happen mkay). Cuz you're there alone with her for a reason. She put herself in that position - alone with you - to make it easy for you, and now all you have left do to is to man up and do the rest. I.e. escalate. Kiss her. Make it happen.

You were essentially waiting for a perfect moment, and then you pussied out because you didn't get that perfect moment. Well, here's the perfect moment for you. Say "Omg." Then just pull her in and kiss her out of the blue. (You don't actually have to say omg before you kiss her but it can help.) Then give her some excuse like "Sorry, I just had to do that!" Or even better "Omg what are you doing to me?"

But you're afraid. What if she rejects your attempt. Well, then you at least tried. And then at least she has respect for you, cuz you just showed that you've got a pair. Moreover, if you just keep talking as if nothing happened, or just make a slight excuse like "Oh sorry" if you are rejected, then just switch the topic, keep talking and try again later. It's always better to try, and get rejected, than not trying at all. (And if you wait for too long, she'll get pissed off at you for wasting her time, and you don't want that cuz she'll not just get pissed at you - she'll also tell her friends what a waste of time you are.) Bottom line is, you have to make it happen. And not feeling it is just an excuse. And a poor one at that. Remember, she's there alone with you for a reason.

Tho make sure you stay close to her. Always. In situations like that. Because if you are ten metres away from her and suddenly feel the urge to kiss her, then... Man, you'll have to cross a bunch of space to get there, and on the way you'll feel awkward, or worse, you'll trip on something cuz you're so nervous. So, do the two of you a favour and stay within arms reach of her as much as possible. Makes it easier for when you do feel it.

With that said, don't expect a long term relationship with this girl. Expect fun times, and wrap it up. She obviously likes to have fun, so don't fall in love with her, ok.

End note: Is my advice possible some uncalibrated shit that risks rejection? Yes. But if you don't risk it, you'll never find out either. And if you do try it, there is so much upside. Even if she rejects you, instead of telling her friends that you're a safe loser, she'll tell them that "Omg what a man, did you know he tried to kiss me? Yeah, he did!" So, even if you don't get her in particular, now all her friends will be hot for you. See, almost only upsides to going for it, even if uncalibrated. And when you try it enough times, you learn - and then you become smooth. But you never become smooth on the first try, so you gotta go for it. Always.

Hey, so another update after like 4 more meetings with her. We still didn’t have sex, it really isn’t that easy. If she wasn’t my anxiety coach and everything, if I didn’t risk as much by showing my cards… it would be easier. But I really find it difficult to escalate with her.

On the last meeting I got close to the touching we had when I first did the tantric touch routine with her. But this time she didn’t give me as many windows to try more things.

Still this is a really good “simulator” for dates and teaches me a lot. Also it’s a great challenge.

But I still don’t understand how some guys here were saying that she was practically asking for sex. If she was, I would have taken the chance…

Anyway now I’ll find the post you mentioned you made for me, and do what you told me there. Your advice and support has been great so far.

 

[Ratata]

Again, for fear of making this sound very harsh, but you really need to know this... You really deserve to hear the truth.

We still didn’t have sex, it really isn’t that easy.

Well of course you haven't. You haven't even touched her! You haven't even tried to escalate. Have you even put a hand on her knee - even held hands with her? If not, then let's not even discuss sex at this point. It's just a fantasy.

But I still don’t understand how some guys here were saying that she was practically asking for sex. If she was, I would have taken the chance…

She was. But you pussied out because you're afraid of rejection. That's the only reason.

You think she wasn't. But she was. (And even if she wasn't, the number one way to make a girl attracted to you is to have some balls and escalate.) Except you were just afraid of the potential consequences.

And there are potential consequences. For example, you might weird her out for a bit. You might make things awkward. (Oh noes.) Moreover, you might make yourself feel vulnerable with her. She might see that you actually like her, which could potentially be a huge blow to your ego if she says no. And this will just keep building and building as long as you see her like this, without taking action. It's very bad. That's why all advice on oneitis is to GTFO and meet other women, stat.

Moreover, that would make you really uncomfortable, because you don't know how to handle a no. Or maybe you fear how you'd react to a no; that you wouldn't be able to hide anything from her. (Don't even try.) But here's the catch: In order to learn those things, you have to push yourself into those awkward situations, and learn how to deal with it. Here's ripping off the band aid: I don't think that's gonna happen with this girl, for various reasons. I hear you say that she's a sim of sorts. Ok, idk. If you say so. Personally I think you're wasting your time. If you're not pushing things forward, then you're just deluding yourself.

But listen, it's much better to push things forward when the stakes are low. That's why I think this girl is a dud. She's your oneitis. She's a lost cause. It's over. She's already friend-zoned you. Your best course of action at this point is to start meeting other girls.

I mean, you already told me that you "know", and since you are so cucksure, then why shouldn't I just let you be right? After all, I wasn't there. I'm just drawing on the many, many similar situations I've been in myself. And the many, many interactions I've had with other guys in similar situations both face-2-face and written like this. Except I pushed boundaries, and got rejections (!) and so I learned. I learned how to handle rejection. I learned that they are pretty much meaningless and that you can just start over once you fumbled the first time. Moreover, I learned that the only thing a woman respects, is man willing to reveal to her that he's into her sexually. Which feels hella vulnerable, but a woman respects balls, and that's just how it is. Never excuse your sexual desire, but ofc respect her if she says no, cuz a no is obviously a no.

That pretty much it. The rest is all about how you handle it, the potential rejection, or the potential awkwardness. It's just a potential at this point because it's not even true yet, because you don't know, because you never tried bro. But not knowing is what can kill a man. Moreover, not knowing how you'd handle those potentials. But you can only learn that by trying. And you won't do that with this girl, so that's why I honestly think that you should just give her up. Go meet other women, and make sure you A. get compliance, B. get her alone (isolate if you follow the tribal speak), C, escalate. A: Always. B. Be. C. Closing.

The most important problem here is that you're afraid of losing what you think you have, which is nothing. And face it, you're probably already friend-zoned. But know that it's ok, it happens to the best of us. You think you've got this down, but you really don't. And the only one you can blame is yourself. You have to learn to take it to the next level, but in order to that, you have to learn to deal with rejection.

 

[barneystin]

But I still don’t understand how some guys here were saying that she was practically asking for sex. If she was, I would have taken the chance…

you can’t see it because YOU don’t have the experience yet.

my honest advice:
just leave this girl alone. i know your brain is trying to rationalize this situation into thinking you can learn something from her or use her to test out stuff. For gods sake, you’ve used like 10 gambits on her without even touching, the whole thing is fucked up and i’m surprised she’s still agreeing to see you.

if you don’t want to live with the thought of “what if”, next time you hang out with her, plan to invite her to your place, escalate smoothly and try to close the deal. if you can’t commit to that (which i don’t believe you will), forget it, cut her out of your life and spare yourself the headache

 

[OldGuy]

@Trailblazed, women are attracted to men who attract other women (pre-selection) so they think it works with men. She feels that showing you other men sleep with her will make you want to sleep with her. I learned women do this from experience.

 

[mirror]

@Trailblazed, women are attracted to men who attract other women (pre-selection) so they think it works with men. She feels that showing you other men sleep with her will make you want to sleep with her. I learned women do this from experience.

It can also be an easy way to show that she is sexually open and that you could give it a try, since it lowers the bar a bit. can help you feel less nervous or more into seeing her as a sexual being.

 

[TrailBlazer]

Well of course you haven't. You haven't even touched her! You haven't even tried to escalate. Have you even put a hand on her knee - even held hands with her? If not, then let's not even discuss sex at this point. It's just a fantasy.

Well yes! I have touched her! Every meeting I try to move things forward a bit. 3 months ago I introduced hugging and now we hug every time. 5 meetings ago I did the tantric touch routine where we sat and touched knees. Then I showed her the different ways to caress hands and she did the same to me.

The last meeting I showed her a neck caress technique and she was talking about hair pulling so we tried that. I also tried to caress her without an excuse this time.

And it always seems “on”. And remember she told me about how she keeps thinking about me? Or, last meeting she told me she couldn’t focus on the meditation task because of the touch (another technique I was showing). So bro I would say it’s not lost.

I just need to lower my fear of making things happen, it seems. I wrote a post about this now because I lost so many women to this already. Yesterday I had a a date with another woman, again we touched and caressed and everything, but no kissing…

 

[TrailBlazer]

It can also be an easy way to show that she is sexually open and that you could give it a try, since it lowers the bar a bit. can help you feel less nervous or more into seeing her as a sexual being.

I guess it was her response to me telling her a few times that I don't think she’s sexually free at all.

But for me the reality doesn’t lower the bar, quite the opposite! Now I know there are these supposedly amazing alpha guys satisfying her. How can I compete with them? Oh man and I shouldn’t even be thinking like this, I told her I support polygamy and everything, that I’m not jealous, etc…

 

[mirror]

I guess it was her response to me telling her a few times that I don't think she’s sexually free at all.

But for me the reality doesn’t lower the bar, quite the opposite! Now I know there are these supposedly amazing alpha guys satisfying her. How can I compete with them? Oh man and I shouldn’t even be thinking like this, I told her I support polygamy and everything, that I’m not jealous, etc…

Look, you are human. Ofcourse you are thinking about it. We are made to want to be the best, especially if someone we are interested in, we start to compare ourselves. It's hardwired to be wanting to be found attractive by someone we are extremely interested in. If you did not feel that way, she wouldnt be worth your time. That said. Remind yourself, she is telling it to you, because she wants YOU. She is spending time with YOU because she wants you, at least a little bit, if not way more. You wont need to prove yourself, she will do the proving to herself if she wants you. I know some guys that just knew the girl was it for them and let her do whatever, knowing she would end up coming back to.them anyway.

It doesnt matter who the other guys are. This is about you and her. It could be whoever, the pope, the POTUS or the guy nextdoor. It doesnt matter if she feels things with you. Girls can be illogical like that

 

[OldGuy]

Don't be sure the other guys exist! I had a couple of women try to use other lovers to get me lay them that the women refused to have sex with. (Found out much later.)

 

[mababu]

Wtf... She fucking around at festival and doing threesome and you still chasing her? dude wake up. Go find virgin and your problems will gone. Stop chasing whores... If you want to fuck whore go pay her hourly rate. Whore never been and will never will be wife material. She will ruin your life if you will try to get her. Trust me. Chasing whores can be more damaging than alkohol and drugs together. Wake up dude

 

[Ratata]

The last meeting I showed her a neck caress technique and she was talking about hair pulling so we tried that. I also tried to caress her without an excuse this time. (...) it always seems “on”.

You tried to caress her? If it's always on, why haven't you kissed her yet? Sounds to me like she's well and ready for it.

Here's what I'd do. I'd do whatever gambit you've got: especially if she wants to come sit next to you, close to you (i.e. you've already got compliance and you're now in some kind of isolation with her), or accepts any intimacy otherwise, like long full-body hugs, or she wants to go to secret, intimate places and be alone with you. If she's cool with any of that, let alone a tantric knee-feeling routine, then she's ready to be kissed.

Ok, so you like to use gambits... I generally don't use them anymore, but they can be a great crutch if you're nervous or don't quite know what to do.

One of my fav gambits was this one (it's thoroughly field tested and great for beginners): You talk about whatever, then introduce something intimate (preferably when you're already close and a bit intimate already, like after a tantric knee routine). Then when things get a bit juicy, simply ask her straight:

"Well are you a good kisser?"

They usually say "yes, obviously" or brag. But then I'd give her a sideways look and go "I don't know... (look at her as if suspicious, then continue) Girls from (whatever place she's from) are pretty bad kissers to be honest"... Most likely she'll protest, or give you shit. In which case you can simply dismiss her, and go:

"Prove it!"

If she chickens out, pull her closer and call her chicken. "You're a chicken, I knew it," then release her. Most girls go for it by then. And if not, you've still got the power and can just dismiss her as a coward.

This gambit works because it qualifies her, and also dismisses her (serves as a takeaway) if she chickens out.

These days, I don't really use stuff like that. I just tell her stuff like just stopping her mid sentence and go "Omg why are you so cute?" Btw. another gambit I used when I was a bit nervous or didn't think I could make the move, was a cheat like this: Again, if the mood was right, I'd lean closer and go "Whoa what's that perfume you're wearing? Can I smell it?" Then I'd go real close by her ear lobe, and grace it slightly. Then I'd go "Omg what are you doing to me?" And simply start kissing her neck. Slowly. Inching closer and closer to her cheek, and her lips. And then more often than not we'd end up making out. Omg that last one would give me just the hottest makeouts... Just make sure not to become the makeout guy for the night, or you'll bore her.

As always is the case, if she seems uncomfortable, or says no, or whatever, just say "no worries" and take a step back. Change the topic fast. Talk about whatever. Take up a previous thread as if nothing happened. If she complains just say "sorry, I just thought you're so cute, but ... change topic fast" Or "oh you have a boyfriend? What do you know, I have a boyfriend too! You should meet him!!!" Or any old bs interrupt like that. Whatever makes your bump your shoulder and laugh is good. (And if she's not laughing, then you're doing something wrong my friend.)

 

[TrailBlazer]

You tried to caress her? If it's always on, why haven't you kissed her yet? Sounds to me like she's well and ready for it.

Here's what I'd do. I'd do whatever gambit you've got: especially if she wants to come sit next to you, close to you (i.e. you've already got compliance and you're now in some kind of isolation with her), or accepts any intimacy otherwise, like long full-body hugs, or she wants to go to secret, intimate places and be alone with you. If she's cool with any of that, let alone a tantric knee-feeling routine, then she's ready to be kissed.

Ok, so you like to use gambits... I generally don't use them anymore, but they can be a great crutch if you're nervous or don't quite know what to do.

One of my fav gambits was this one (it's thoroughly field tested and great for beginners): You talk about whatever, then introduce something intimate (preferably when you're already close and a bit intimate already, like after a tantric knee routine). Then when things get a bit juicy, simply ask her straight:

"Well are you a good kisser?"

They usually say "yes, obviously" or brag. But then I'd give her a sideways look and go "I don't know... (look at her as if suspicious, then continue) Girls from (whatever place she's from) are pretty bad kissers to be honest"... Most likely she'll protest, or give you shit. In which case you can simply dismiss her, and go:

"Prove it!"

If she chickens out, pull her closer and call her chicken. "You're a chicken, I knew it," then release her. Most girls go for it by then. And if not, you've still got the power and can just dismiss her as a coward.

This gambit works because it qualifies her, and also dismisses her (serves as a takeaway) if she chickens out.

These days, I don't really use stuff like that. I just tell her stuff like just stopping her mid sentence and go "Omg why are you so cute?" Btw. another gambit I used when I was a bit nervous or didn't think I could make the move, was a cheat like this: Again, if the mood was right, I'd lean closer and go "Whoa what's that perfume you're wearing? Can I smell it?" Then I'd go real close by her ear lobe, and grace it slightly. Then I'd go "Omg what are you doing to me?" And simply start kissing her neck. Slowly. Inching closer and closer to her cheek, and her lips. And then more often than not we'd end up making out. Omg that last one would give me just the hottest makeouts... Just make sure not to become the makeout guy for the night, or you'll bore her.

As always is the case, if she seems uncomfortable, or says no, or whatever, just say "no worries" and take a step back. Change the topic fast. Talk about whatever. Take up a previous thread as if nothing happened. If she complains just say "sorry, I just thought you're so cute, but ... change topic fast" Or "oh you have a boyfriend? What do you know, I have a boyfriend too! You should meet him!!!" Or any old bs interrupt like that. Whatever makes your bump your shoulder and laugh is good. (And if she's not laughing, then you're doing something wrong my friend.)

Okay, so armed with this knowledge you shared, I went to our most recent meeting. I chose an intimate bar and had several prepared gambits and routines to finally kiss her.

At one point in our conversation, I asked her what she would do if she could do anything right now. She thought for a bit and then said that she would have sex with someone other than her boyfriend.

So yeah, that was interesting. But the vibe just wasn’t there to do anything with that info.. Or am I really that bad??

I don’t think so because towards the end, I told her I’d like to see how her hair looks braided and she did it quickly for me. So I do have some compliance. Then outside I told her to walk arm in arm. So we did but she refused to take my hand after that.

She kept talking about how she wants to visit one of her male friends. Ugh…

I always feel so un-masculine after our meetings. I just couldn’t find or create the moment to escalate. And now it will probably be another guy who will take her. I hate this.

 

[OldGuy]

You are that bad!

 

[TrailBlazer]

You are that bad!

Bro I was trying my best. When I say the vibe wasn’t there, it really wasn’t. I would have to do something major to shift the vibe myself, and I didn’t know how. I felt powerless. I’ve been in easy seductions before, I’ve even slept with 2 girls like an hour after approaching them in the past. This situation that I’m in is not easy. Or I just lost my skill..

 

[OldGuy]

If I could do anything now, I would have sex with someone who isn't my boyfriend. equals I would have sex with you!

 

[TrailBlazer]

If I could do anything now, I would have sex with someone who isn't my boyfriend. equals I would have sex with you!

Well I goddamn know! I even went to the restrooms a while after to calm down and plan something. But when she says it without any eye contact or emotion behind it, how can I create anything from it? As I said, I’d literally have to create the reality and mood that would allow for any sort of escalation. And I just couldn’t, I was too nervous for it.

And now I will have to listen to her talking about all the new guys she met (she told me she thinks about going on a week long “tantric” trip with a few guys). Fuck my life. And I was called the best seducer in my country like 5 years ago.. I don’t know what to do.