Should I read "The Game" or "Models"

[Skills]

I don’t like the first part of models. He says neediness is the problem, which I agree with, but says the solution is vulnerability. That doesn’t make sense to me and is even contradicted when he recounts his ex gfs orbiter who he said was vulnerable about his feelings for her multiple times and he uses her rejection of him as a example of neediness.

i just love how you butcher the context... re read the book (i posted a youtube resume but it was shit)..

 

[Brassfaced_Jim]

The Game is a great book if you read between the lines, there is a lot of useful practical stuff in there, but you have to pull on the strings and go deeper down the rabbit holes he mentions.

Models is okay, mostly I appreciated that book because he admits that pickup is a numbers game even when you get really good you'll still have to play the numbers... you'll have better success ratios but take more action = get more results.

Read them both.

I’m going back to reread TG and brush up on MM again atm

So just curious ~
What strings /rabbit holes did you go further into from what Strauss mentioned in the book.

I did go deep (too much so) into everything he mentioned, first go round, but in hindsight not sure I needed to. That’s why I am curious what areas of exploration were specifically beneficial for you . Cheers Jim

 

[Karea Ricardus D.]

That's a good question... I think all the hypnosis and NLP stuff isn't necessary... although I would say it can be useful, I wouldn't make it a high priority until a lot of other stuff is in place already.

I think the word-for-word pickups that are in the book verbatim (Paris Hilton, Britney Spears, the Platinum Blondes, etc.) are worth taking a closer look at and really analyzing.

For every sentence, ask yourself: why does he say this? There is so much tech packed into these little examples. Transitions, observations, cold reads, frames, compliance building, and the obvious microcalibration stuff...

That's off the top of my head... I remember reading it again almost 20 years later and going like wow... this is so much deeper than it looks to the uninitiated at first glance... every sentence is very deliberate.

 

[CharmingPsychopath]

so, Is it possible of NLP based game is scam. Like it depends on the girl to keep thinking of you and she would have thought of you even if you have not used anchors. Eg girl A will think of you with anchors or without it and girl B won't think of you with anchors or without.

I think that's...complicated. Evoking emotions by speech is absolutely possible and can work incredibly well. On the other hand, I would say Speed Seduction simply didn't teach what it promised to teach. The material was simply too weird, without enough effort to make it socially adjusted.

As for "The Game" and "The Models"....

1. I HATE "The Models". I find it to be a stupid, irritating book and I get the impression that the author really wasn't getting laid much or not with high quality women. I think it's a trap for naive, weak minded "good guys" - who want to hear that "manipulation doesn't work, honesty works, good honest guys like you are the real winners". Bullshit - lying and manipulation, if done right, work better than honesty. And I've found that guys who have a high level of success with women are almost always "bad people" (liars, exploiters) according to the moral standards, world view of the "good guys". (Me included - I've lied to women a lot with good results and I've "exploited" girls according to moral standards of the "good guys".)

I think "The Models" is a stupid book for stupid people - it's popularity being not a sign of quality, but sign of it matching widespread stupidity. Same like with let's say Red Pill - which is popular not because it's good, but because many people are stupid and misguided enough to believe in it.

2. I think "The Game" is largely a scam designed for marketing and promoting Mystery as some kind of "genius of seduction". The books portrays Katya as a "9.5"... To me she's a 6, 7 at best. I understand preferences can vary, but really, I think describing her as some kind of super hot woman is outright dishonest.

I got laid with models and celebrities, women who were waaaay more attractive than Katya. And maybe it's a cultural difference (I'm from Poland, also with experience in other European countries), but I don't think that Negs work and I don't think the whole "you have to neg the hottest women" doctrine presented in "The Game" is valid. My experience is that the hottest women react to the same things other women do - they have higher standards, sure, but otherwise they're normal women.

Based on my experience with hottest women, I think that to some degree Mystery is a fake. Because what he's saying doesn't match what I've actually experienced with very hot women. And looking at the fact that The Game portrays Katya as "9.5"... I really think there's dishonesty involved.

Katya, aside being only a 6, max 7 in my eyes (when wearing full makeup, on other photos), is a immigrant from Russia or Ukraine and she was later arrested for burglary (https://nopdnews.com/post/september-2016/9-6-16-two-arrested-on-multiple-residential-burgla/).

In other words, she seems to be a girl from the bottom part of the society - a poor girl with criminal tendencies. Clearly not any kind of high value, "elite" woman. And probably she's a mess mentally, emotionally.

I suspect Mystery's real target and "menu" were not any real kind of high value, "elite" women, but instead low value "sluts" like Katya. Women with low class, primitive mentality - and I think that's how the whole "you have to neg the hottest women" was created. Not based on dealing with high quality women, but based on dealing with primitive low class girls like Katya.

I think the "you have to neg the hottest women" is dishonest and harmful to people who treat Mystery seriously. I think the truth is much closer to "if you want to get laid with low class, emotionally unhealthy sluts, you should play on their low self esteem and their need for validation". And it's about dealing with stupid, disturbed chicks with a low class mentality, not about how attractive they are.

I know a guy who met Mystery and he says Mystery does have skills, but he's far from the seduction master many people think him to be. He says Mystery impresses other guys from PUA community by opening and entertaining girls, but his ability to actually get laid is faaaaaaar worse. And according to him, Mystery not any kind of "master" when it comes to very attractive women - they may let him entertain them (or not), but going to bed is a different story. He also says Mystery is best with empty headed, preferably drunk chicks in "party mode". Not really a surprise...

According to my friend, Mystery is great at opening large, difficult sets, also mixed ones with men, but as far actual seduction is concerned (actual getting laid, not just opening), he knows dozens of guys who are better than Mystery in being sexually attractive to very hot women (me included).

Both of us, as well as some other people, think Mystery is overated and that he actually did a lot of damage to many people with his theories - especially those about negging and "hottest women need to be negged". We think that "The Game" is a dishonest book, written as a marketing tool, aiming at creating image of Mystery as the "genius seduction master" and by association, also promoting the author. We think "The Game" is actually one giant routine designed to seduce...men from the seduction community. We think that anyone treating it 100% seriously is really getting fucked by Neil & Mystery.

So my opinion is this:

1. I think "The Models" is a book for stupid people.

2. I think "The Game" is a dishonest marketing routine. Just look at how the supposed "9.5" Katya really looks like. Sure, Mystery and Style have some competence, but lower than they pretend to have and how is the reader supposed to distinguish what's real and what's not?

I recommend skipping "The Models" entirely and treating "The Game" as a curioristy, not anything trustworthy.